Over on This is Why MGTOW, the blogger who calls himself Cerberus Alpha (dude, seriously?) attempts to answer the question: Why are men more violent?
Rather than attempting to engage with the extensive scholarly literature on the subject, or even making a token effort to do any research on the subject whatsoever, Mr. Alpha instead spins a few familiar manosphere fairy tales into “evidence” that it’s all the fault of those evil sexy ladies and their evil sexy and/or feminist ways.
Young women train violence and criminality into young men. The thug with the shaved head who communicates in grunts is sexually rewarded. The empathetic bookworm is denied if not publicly humiliated if he approaches a girl. So the bookworm puts down the book, gets contacts and a tattoo, bulks up in the gym, and generally acts like an asshole. (Why would he be nice to women any more?) Suddenly, he finds himself showered in pussy. This is how it works. Women’s sexual desires are dark and pathological, and this encourages men to become violent criminals if they want to get laid.
His evidence for this?
Just look at all the Game blogs out there, which teach men how to mimic the frame of the uncaring, alpha criminal without actually breaking the law.
That’s right. Misogynist dude pontificating about ladies cites as evidence … other misogynist dudes pontificating about ladies. THAT’S SCIENCE!
Oh, but the perfidy of the evil violence-causing ladies gets worse! Because they also force men to commit evil violence by, apparently, telling them to do it in sweet sexy voices:
Women’s own violence is committed via proxy (i.e. they get men to do the difficult work of physical coercion), and thus is incorporated into men’s overall violence. That’s pretty smart of women, in a devious and manipulative sort of way. A woman who has a problem with a man (or just wants to see a guy get beaten up, because that kind of sadism makes her tingle) sidles up to her boyfriend and asks so-sweetly if he will ‘do something’ about that guy who’s bothering her. But when the fun is over and the cops show up because someone is leaving the party in an ambulance, it was all his fault, see. She didn’t do a thing. She’s sugar and spice and all things nice.
I think Mr. Alpha here is confusing real life with the TV show Cheaters.
But wait! We haven’t even gotten to the even eviller evils of … FEMINISM.
Since the 1960s, normal male behavior has been increasingly criminalized while criminal female behavior has been increasingly normalized. This process is known as ‘feminism,’ and includes legal restrictions on politically incorrect speech, redefinitions of ‘harassment,’ and so on. This ground has been covered over and over again in the sphere and we don’t need to retread how feminism makes it illegal simply to exist as a man.
Uh, maybe you do need to go over that once more because, well, here’s the thing, I’m a dude, and I’ve never been arrested for being a man. Or even given a warning. And I’m pretty sure there are literally billions of other men on planet earth in the same situation as I am. Are there warrants out for us all?
The flip side is that crimes like abortion and infanticide, for which women were typically held responsible, have been made legal and normalized by feminists.
Really? Could you remind me again when Congress passed the Actual Live Human Baby Killing Is A-OK With Us Act, because I’m pretty sure infanticide isn’t legal or “normalized” in the US or anywhere on this planet. And in the US, at least, abortion rights (not to mention abortion providers) are under pretty much constant attack.
Mr. Alpha also suggests that male violence is just a sort of side effect of men being such hard workers and deep thinkers and shit:
Men commit more crime because men do more of anything, that is apart from self-obsessed complaining. This is the Y-chromosome explanation that radfems are so fond of, except they miss out the part that if there’s no Jack the Ripper then there’s no Einstein either, and it’s kind of hard to be a career grrl if men haven’t invented corporations and desks yet. Men are proactive as women are reactive, which in laymen’s terms means we get shit done.
Also, mammoths, we hunted them to feed you, etc.
Not content to blame male violence on women, Mr. Alpha ends by suggesting that he won’t really mind if some men — wink, wink — wise up and start directing some of this violence at the ladies who made them all violent in the first place.
The majority of violence committed by men, which is encouraged or outright instructed by women, as described above, is committed against other men. Thus for the most part, it can be described as female violence against men, delivered via proxy. …
If, however, these machinations happen to backfire, and a man who has been trained into criminal violence turns on his trainers, who am I to care?
Gosh, men in the “sphere” sure do love to fantasize about ladies getting beaten up by men, don’t they?
Dude, please, go your own fucking way already. The farther you go, the better.
OMG, Brz got a Well Done!!
Everybody gets a high five! Brz finally gets the adulation and love he so desperately needs! Hey, Brz, Black Fedora thinks you’re okay!
Brz, the guy who says Tom “Renounce Prostitution in all forms” Martin is indistinguishable from feminists thinks you’re all right! Truly, you have succeeded in life.
@Brz
Do you have to work hard to be this wrong or does it come naturally?
If someone is “playing tough” in order to attract girls, the problem is on that someone, not the girls;
Really? I guess all that bullying I got in high school from other guys for being a weird, socially awkward kid never happened;
Huh, again, I guess I just imagined the guys who called me gay and harassed me.
Oh, I’m sorry, I didn’t grow up in a “ghetto”, so obviously none of that applies to me. And everybody knows that the police never goes after “ghetto kids” (seriously, you’re not fooling anyone) who aren’t doing anything wrong, why that’s just unthinkable.
@ detached.
Actually the world is as simple or as complex as we wish it to be. We always believe that we are special and that somehow we do not fit into the usual pattern. This makes life appear complicated because we are the exception to every rule! However this is only our ego speaking.
We then look back upon our life- that seemed so exceptional- and find that it has been fairly typical. We can see the commonalities in other people but not ourselves..
None of us as different as we believe.
@ M Dubz
It is true that many women grow out of the love of jerks- but feminism actually continues with it. One way to understand feminism is the continuation of unhealthy adolescent behavior into middle age. This is why feminism engages in ‘nice guy shaming’ and prefers Islamist groups over the military- what is a GI after all but the ultimate Nice Guy who is there to protect her yet again?
Feminists occasionally make token criticism of the Taliban but work tirelessly to tie one hand of the military behind its back as it does so. The Taliban are at least ‘real men’ in the eyes of the feminists while the GI is a castrated beta male.
Black Fedora,
I hope you didn’t hurt your butt too much with all the facts you just pulled out of it.
@thread — Just got back from a CrossFit session, and am feeling the urge to rob a bank. Who wants a split?
@Bob Goblin, Can I drive the getaway car?
@Dude Who GIves a Nice Hat a Bad Name (DWGNHBM), Your entire statement assumes facts not in evidence.
Nope. The complexity of the world has nothing to do with your own perspective. It is objectively more complex than you wish it was. Sorry.
Well, I’m already very likely going to end up somewhere constrained with all these imaginary drugs. I’m in.
————
@Black Fedora
Actually, the world is far more complex than the simple mechanical model we often determine it to be. We always believe that we are special, that we do not fit the usual pattern and that we, in our omniscience, can percieve the patterns others do not. Ours is the ability to see the Matrix for what it truly is. And that makes life so simple for us, because the imaginary worlds we create instead of reality must be simple… else maintaining them is too much effort by far.
Looking back on our life, which, perhaps by the standards set ourselves long ago, seems less exceptional we often find that what we thought was the simple acts of other people carried resonant, compelling reasons for we never considered in our myopic perspective.
The map is not the landscape, as they say.
The feminist who argue that should serve a front line role in combat zones, be able to fully join the general infantry, stand side by side with other people to protect them… She’s doing that because she believes that the abilities she can bring are as good as those of others. She is doing it because, when told, “Sit still and I’ll protect you!” her first impulse has always been to reply with “Get down, you’re in my way!”.
Others would call that “crippling the military to feed her own ego”. Maybe even “Desperate for some excitement that her life doesn’t get her!”. Could be “Only doing it to impress the grrrrlll power movement, the darling”.
Simple answers often doesn’t correlate entirely to the truth.
You’ve built your life on a simple lie. “Femininists are out to get me”. From that core assumption, you’ve drawn your entire world. Suddenly everything, to you, is simple.
They’re out to get you, so they’ll shame nice guys. They’re out to get you, so they like the Taliban. They’re to get you, so they’ll try to trick men. They’re out to get you, so you should live a life of a lavender marriage because otherwise, you’re suspect.
Your life is a myopic cesspool of fear, bitterness and anxiety. Your joy and empathy has been crippled by your inability to let go of imaginary slights. You hole up in your metaphysical castle because you hope, at the end of the day, it’ll protect you from the shadows in your head.
I don’t write this to be unkind. I’m not a psycho-analyst, and I don’t know you, but everything you write here, everything you say, even your modus operandi, stated, for being here boils down to “Understanding the feminists mindset”.
And everyone knows you’re pulling that from the old “Knowing is half the battle”.
But… Fedora? Look at your life. Look at the thing its become. Holding on to all this hatred and fear isn’t good for you. From your blog:
You don’t have principles to protect, you have hatred to rage with.
You don’t have morals to uphold, you have malice wield against the world.
You don’t have desires to sate, you have anxieties to satisfy.
You don’t have a castle to build. You have a prison to construct around your soul.
Faced the possibility that “they’re out to get you”, you don’t choose to fight, to argue honestly, to have a standpoint. You choose to hide away.
You choose lavender marriages, lies and deceit crumps of respectability – because apparently, you don’t know how to get respectability or what it is, but you understand that you must have it.
You have decided that single men are suspect, so instead of altering that perception, you choose to hide with a lesbian to remove the stigma you branded yourself on your own mind.
You would rather censors every thought you have, every impulse you get, every notion in your head than reveal one tiny ounce of weakness that someone might use against you.
I’m sorry for you. I don’t think that’s a good way to live a life. I hope you are happy with what you do, I hope you enjoy yourself, but I can’t imagine it.
What you should do, if you have the time, is to watch Network. A movie, from 1976.
“
“.
Don’t you see? Your rage is fabricated by others, to exploit. Your fears are a creation of your own head, full of terrors of all those bad things the Others will do to you once they discover your weak spot.
Let it go.
Your life has value.
But you won’t find it here, raging against feminists that don’t exist and building castles that are really piss, lies, paper and misery.
Because, well, you get two choices. You can do what you’re doing, and once you have your perfect castle of ice, assets hidden, living with a woman who is a lesbian with a fake ring around your finger, working a job under an assumed named and with a second pass port to bail out at the slightest bit of trouble… Will you be free?
Or read some Kahil Gibran.
(On Freedom)
Just…
Dude. Let it go.
Haha are you a 17 y/o white suburban boy? Or a middle aged white suburban man?
OR A WIZARD???
Okay, BlackBloc, the man in the black hat (seriously, he says he’s the man in the black hat? Is there no self awareness there?) claims the book you enjoyed is a PUA classic.
Obviously, since he’s an obvious troll with no redeeming qualities and you’re a long-time poster with a track record of helpful comments, this is a totally credible assertion.
So we’re gonna have a kangaroo court here now, and if you fail to convince us that this book is non-manipulative, then GOD HELP YOU, it’s time for punishment by the Feminist Hivemind. I think you know what that entails.
Just stand by while I get some kangaroos ready.
What? A kangaroo court without kangaroos? Figurative kangaroos? Where did this turn of phrase come from, anyway?
Oh no, you’re on to me. Even though I’m in my 30s, today I intend to copy someone’s algebra homework, puff on a cigarette behind my cousin’s barn, and annoy my parents by playing Nirvana too loudly in my room. This is what feminism is all about, and I would have gotten away with it, too, if it weren’t for you meddling MRA’s.
Where are all these straw feminists who love the Taliban? Because I’m pretty sure that feminist criticism of the Taliban is sincere and not token criticism. Also, how can you say that US feminists hate US GI’s when some GI’s are feminists themselves? Do they hate themselves?
Dude Who GIves a Nice Hat a Bad Name (DWGNHBM)*,
The strawfeminists in your head appear to be on fire. Perhaps you should remedy that?
*Great name cloudiah!
thebionicmommy, Oh admit it, you’ve been scribbling “I <3 the Taliban" all over your notebooks too.
Fibinachi, this:
and this:
Reminds me of this:
Well, the puppet put everything far more eloquently than I ever could.
*blushes* Hey, stop peaking at my Lisa Frank notebook!
Dude, get your talking points straight. According to the OP, all violence is committed under the instruction of women. This obviously would include all wars and all military endeavors.
What the fuuuuck?
I know I’m operating on about 1.5 hours of sleep after a red-eye flight from O’Hare to Dublin, but I can still see holes in his argument that are big enough to fit a Hummer through them.
Ye Gods, somebody hath removed the common sense glands from that person.
I’m talking about the article by David, though.
(Why is sleep? I don’t know.)
I come late to the thread as usual :/
@lightcastle
I’d love to read that as well! Please, let us know about it.
@Nekora
Another point: I was a nerd and a geek in high school (the past tense on this sentence is amusing hahaha). The nerd guys would always talk how the girls didn’t want them and the same old blah blah. But they never notice that some of us were actually interested in them! The nerdy girls! Did they want the nerdy girls back then? No! We were “great friends”! ¬¬” I believe that possibly happens in other parts of the world too. (I’m not from the U.S)
But we matured and things were completely different. As you mentioned, this mentality in the manosphere sounds very high school to me as well.
@M Dubz @Aaliyah @lightcastle
I think get that from Serano’s article. I will have to read it again taking what you both have said. What I read was that the fact that certain girls prefer “assholes” is a social construction, not a “natural immutable” condition in women. She also says that this is not observed in certain circles, as hers with more “alternative” people. But I will need to go back to that.
I’m also not 100% into that, but I found that interesting as I haven’t seen this discussion in articles often. However, I interpreted it more like lightcastle did. And as CassandraSays mentioned, I also believe the niceguys/asshole dichotomy exists in man’s brain.
I will go back to the article tough. Sadly, it will take a while for me to read and re-think it. And I’m slow…. so probably not on this thread >__<
@many
I saw the articles about Beatriz today. I was appalled by these news! It’s so horrendous in so many levels….
I meant “I didn’t get that from Serano’s article”. Jeez… that was a terrible typing thing I did…
I can’t stop going back and staring at that line. I mean, seriously. SERIOUSLY. Either he really believes all crime and imprisonment is controlled by the powerful conspiracy, or he’s saying something about rape. I think it’s the former, but his level of blather means I can’t quite discount the latter.
Either way, I need a shower.
Brz: Take your typical nerdy boy who happens to live in a place which is almost entirely structured by and around the drug business, where the local models of masculinity are tough guys who do illegal things that will certainly send them to jail soon, where the hottest girls of the neighborhood hang out with the toughest guys, where the desirability of a guy depends on his ability to do illegal things that will probably send him to jail.
Funny, I grew up in just such a neighborhood.
This is not what I observed. It’s as if you don’t know what you are talking about. Then again, this is you pretending to either an intimate knowledge of the US inner city, or arguing that 1: French poverty is 1a built like this and 1b, French “ghettos” (as you have known them” are dispostive in regards to American lifestyle; as affected by American feminism.
2: It’s possible that your ignorance is broader than just the US, and includes the nature of poor neighborhoods in France.
If this boy decide to not play the game, to not play tough in order to attract girls because he prefers preserving his chances to go to university and leave the neighborhood rather than banging girls or simply because he knows that he’s unable to look tough anyway, his problem won’t be the tough guys, they don’t care about other guys as long as they don’t compete with them, it will be the girls, especially if the guy is somewhat handsome : they will punish him for not playing the game, for not trying to impress them, for not daring to look tough for them. They’ll bully him, they’ll say he’s gay, they’ll spread rumors about him, they’ll just harass him as long as he conforms to what they want : a wannabe tough guy who do stupid things to impress the girls which will put him at risk of ending up in jail.
Again, not my experience (though it’s arguable that I am/was handsome; though in some way attractive seems to be indisputable, as I was not entirely bereft of female companionship of an approbative nature in my youth).
See above, points 1, 1a, 1b, and 2. They seem apropos to this paragraph of yours as well.
This is more of the lack of consistent verismilitude which makes you seem less than truly French.
Yup. This definitely happens all the time. Not.
Also, the fact that you think that “tough guys” almost never pick on other guys in such a scenario sufficiently proves that you don’t know what you’re talking about.
Black Chappy: Feminists occasionally make token criticism of the Taliban but work tirelessly to tie one hand of the military behind its back as it does so. The Taliban are at least ‘real men’ in the eyes of the feminists while the GI is a castrated beta male.
dafuq?
Actually the world is as simple or as complex as we wish it to be.
Have you been reading Quantum Mechanics for Dummies again?