When I posted about WF Price’s viciously transphobic Mothers’ Day post on The Spearhead yesterday, the Spearhead commentariat had not yet weighed in on his post. Well, now they have, and so appallingly that I felt a second post was in order. Here are some of the, er, highlights of the discussion.
Again, a TRIGGER WARNING applies; if anything, these comments are worse than Price’s original post. This hasn’t made them unpopular at The Spearhead; quite the contrary: all the comments quoted below were well received by Spearhead readers, receiving multiple upvotes. A couple of them were even rated “Well-loved.”
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Alcestis Eshtemoa compares trans women, unfavorably, to eunuchs:
Transexuals/Transgenders are part of the LGBTQPPI freak show. Transexual “women” are de-facto mutilated or castrated men, on a much lower level than eunuchs even. Sure a couple of people may be born “inter-sexed” but most (in general) are not born or made that way. There are two sexes and they are complementary.
Instead it’s the delusional cosplay “I’m a woman in a man’s body” (sure and I’m really Napoleon reincarnated or Marilyn Monroe in a hideous, ill-mannered woman’s body). It’s a form of narcissism, the worse kind even, because these people don’t play their parts well. Instead the solipsism is projected elsewhere.
El Bastardo seems to think that feminists are all as transphobic as he is:
I can’t wait for all the liars, whom calling themselves feminists, have to face this genius who cut his own junk off. As soon as he says they are “equal” in motherhood, they are going to have to contain their laughter and scorn. A “Saaaayyy whaaaaattt?” moment. Followed by “Oh, HELL NAH!”
I actually feel for this individual, though the “suffering” is self inflicted. He, or perhaps she or it, has now set himself and his family up for years of delicious pain for his moronic self indulgence.
Truly, the feminists who raised him, for that is the evil and solipsistic individuals his parents (or at least his mother and wife) had to have been. They destroyed who he was, and cheered him on as he jumped into an abyss for which there is no return.
Now his sons have endured a wound they may never be able to articulate, but incubate with pain and confusion their whole lives. For if their father, now having turned and claimed to being a woman, hated his masculinity in such a fashion; what are they left to think?
Keyster also manages to pull off the neat trick of attacking transphobic feminists — well, he assumes all feminists are transphobic — in a comment that is itself transphobic, not to mention massively misogynistic:
Feminists hate transexuals because they “mock” womanhood; pretend to be women, when actually the massive doses of estrogen is what reveals the classic female behavior that sometimes annoys and frustrates men so much.
Also more often than not transexuals abhor masculinity so much that they actually consider themselves lesbians. And lesbians don’t much like (Male to Female) transexuals either. They do seem to do better once this “internal conflict” is resolved, but then create a whole new reality of confusion and complexities around them.
Geographybeefinalisthimself decides to make the issue all about, well, me:
I feel so sorry for this tranny’s sons.
I wonder if Manboobz will consider my pity for this tranny’s sons to be “misogyny.” I think his morbidly obese body will explode just thinking about how to react.
I’d call that transphobia, actually, Mr. geographybeefinalist. I’m not quite sure why you thought I would explode. It’s not exactly shocking to discover that misogynists are bigoted in other ways as well. On The Spearhead multiple bigotry seems to be the default state.
Towgunner delivered up a massive wall-o-text, from which I have extracted the following. (Paragraph breaks added.)
A simple agenda item for the MRA … is to encourage the truth, specifically, men and women are different and there is nothing wrong with that. ….
The reason why we unfortunately here about this is because it fits the feminists narrative and false idea that men and women are interchangeable etc. transsexuals are an important component to that argument because he was once a he now hes a she…look at that kids, as easy as pie. But its not, hormone treatment and multiple evasive surgeries are not some simple “switch” …
Methinks, the whole “I’m a women in a man’s body” meme is a sick distraction from the real truth, which is “No sir or ma’am, the truth is you’re not happy with yourself and the cards you were dealt and you’ve never came to terms with that! ….
The idea of “I’m a man in a women’s body” should be met with, “hey pal, I’d like to be a lot of things myself too, eating ice cream every night and having a full head of hair and washboard abs…but guess what, it’s not the case….deal. This is what happens when emotion trumps reason. psycology today is a joke, the proper treatment is a kick in the pants not some soft spoken, drug dealer who’s likely just as messed up as their patients are.
Brigadon responded to one commenter who challenged the Spearhead regulars on their homophobia (and got massively downvoted for doing so), accusing the commenter of using “shaming language” against those who rightfully resist “homophilia.” Then he called gay men “fags;” compared homosexuality to pedophilia, bestiality, and cannibalism; and suggested that trans women deserve to be ridiculed.
There is a vast difference between being homophobic and having a legitimate understanding of the deleterious effects homophilia has on society.
If you are not into molesting children, are you pedophobic?
If you are not into fucking housepets, are you beastophobic?
Why in the hell is it considered a ‘phobia’ to be disgusted and sickened by something which, in the end, is an incredibly unhealthy habit from both a species and societal standpoint? …Why should we accept cannibalism? why should we accept pederastery? why should we accept homosexuality? why should we accept beastiality? how does that strengthen us as a culture? what does it ADD to the human experience, and what does it take away?
Nice attempt at shaming language, though. technically ‘homophobia’= “fear of those like one’s self”. completely incorrect usage of the word.
Unfortunately, though, fags are afraid to use the real word…
Edinakusesiphobia- fear of sodomy.
Frankly, all things concerned, I consider a fear of getting sodomized to be a very real worry, as opposed to a ‘phobia’. Especially considering that nearly six times as many men in the US get raped as women, and nearly a hundred times as many men get FORCEFULLY raped (sodomized) as women.And, to be completely honest, why should we NOT ridicule men that lop their penises off in order to be failures as both males and females.
In case you’re wondering, this was one of the comments that was rated “Well-loved” by the Spearhead regulars.
There is plenty more awfulness to be found elsewhere in the thread at The Spearhead, as well as some comments that aren’t quite as bad, if you have the stomach to wade through the rest of it to find them.
@Tracy
Sad Cat Diary made me so happy. I haven’t looked at much zefrank stuff, but I liked his TED talk.
Quoted for truth.
David Futrelle
Its sounding more and more like Spearhead is a totally messed up website.
Have the folks at the Spearhead ever thought of joining forces with the American Religious right? I can’t help but wonder. They have so much in common.
Conservative Radio Hosts Parse Feminists: Some are ‘Cute,’ Some are ‘Ugly,’ All are ‘Family-Destroying Whores’
http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/conservative-radio-hosts-parse-feminists-some-are-cute-some-are-ugly-all-are-family-destroyi
Perkins Responds to NIH Grant with Transphobic Rant
http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/perkins-responds-nih-grant-transphobic-rant
Family Research Council Defends Anti-Transgender Workplace Bias
http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/family-research-council-defends-anti-transgender-workplace-bias
I, for one, am extremely concerned about people who cut their penises off. Self-surgery is a bad idea.* Unless you’re at the South Pole during winter and are the surgeon.
And I’m pretty sure that most lesbian trans women aren’t lesbian because they abhor masculinity, but rather because they like women. Just like these haters! Wait… does that mean that they abhor masculinity?
*In Nepenthe’s happy fairy-land, everyone can get the medical treatment they need, when they need it.
@Cassandra: “If you tried to tell an MRA not to portmanteau something he’d probably yell at you for trying to force him to stop drinking. They’re not really known for their linguistic skills.”
Remember, linguistic skills are pseudo-intellectualism!
@Nepenthe: “Unless you’re at the South Pole during winter and are the surgeon.”
Reminds me of that line from Lillyhammer – “I could have been in Hawaii, or Fort Lauderdale, but no, I had to come here where your dick freezes off and you don’t notice for three days!”
Conversation, just this second:
Mum: what is an MRA again?
Me: Men’s Rights Activist. Not that they do any activism.
Mum: I wouldn’t have thought there was any shortage of men’s rights.
QFT, my mum!
I’m running a little guess-that-quote game on twitter, but no one’s got it yet, so I thought I’d bring it here too. Here’s the quote:
“The job of a loving couple is to respect the wisdom of the penis.”
Can you guess who said this?
Some fundy marriage guidance counsellor?
I’m struggling to think it could be one of the usual MRA suspects, since “love” is a concept that makes ’em all squeamish.
One should also respect the wisdom of the toe, for it knows all things.
(In other news, don’t think I’ll be taking life advice from my body parts any time soon.)
A couple of Twitter people guessed the answer: It was Warren Farrell!
It’s actually less awful in context. He has this whole thing about how impotence can be a way that a body communicates uneasiness bla bla bla. But yes he did actually write that sentence and put it in a book and not as a joke.
And yes he apparently has a very narrow notion of what a loving couple consists of. Apparently there always has to be a penis involved. Just one, though!
Oh penis, teach us your ways!
http://images6.fanpop.com/image/photos/32800000/Potoo-animals-32849264-280-280.png
Well, I guess the penis has more brainpower than what’s in the skull of your average MRA, so it kinda makes sense if one or both partners has one …
… which leads me to a strange image of a couple of blokes dressed vaguely like Buddhist monks, sitting cross-legged and gazing worshipfully at each other’s bits.
Say, what happens if the Wise Peens disagree about something?
“One should also respect the wisdom of the toe, for it knows all things.”
Depends which toe. My big toe isn’t so bad, but I’m not consulting with the little one. It hasn’t the sense to stop bashing into the furniture.
I think secret wisdom lies with the earlobe. Of course you need to have long hair or a hat over it for it to be really secret.
Can you imagine if we regendered it, the fit they’d throw?
“Loving couples must always respect the wisdom of the clit. If it’s not standing to attention, stop pestering your wife for sex.”
“Loving couples must always respect the wisdom of the clit. If it’s not standing to attention, stop pestering your wife for sex.”
::dies::
@ Argenti:
The ‘r’ was intentional, as my first name starts with “Bri.”
“He has this whole thing about how impotence can be a way that a body communicates uneasiness bla bla bla.”
Would I be right in guessing he doesn’t have the same respect for women’s bodies? (We already know he has no respect for our minds and words.) Or that impotence = women, ur doin it rong!
Funnily enough my analogy could work! Sometimes lack of interest in sex is a sign of other things that are wrong in a relationship, lack of trust, and so on. Problem is, we already know that he thinks that women who don’t want sex are just mean meanies who need to stop being so mean and give men the sex they deserve.
This is what really pisses me off about Farrell, actually. Sometimes he talks about stuff that really is worth discussing, and that the culture does resists discussing. The fact that the ability to get an erection can be affected by emotional and psychological stuff, and it’s not just about hydraulics, is one of those things. Problem is, when Farrell tries to talk about that stuff his weird attitudes towards women always derail the conversation, so what could have been a promising discussion, and an important subject that isn’t talked about enough, ends up circling back to “women are bitches who don’t give men enough sex”.
I’m gonna leave aside the sickening part (for obvious reasons) and go the puzzling one: why are they so certain that feminists and David in particular are completely transphobe. If there is one thing notable about Manboobz’s comments section – apart from the diversity of trolls – it’s the diversity of people. Let it be political opinions, sexual orientation, men, women, agender people, trans and cis people. If David hate them so much, why do trans people stay here exchanging opinions/cat pictures/life advice/recipes/etc?
Yes! Yes to all that!
That just reminded me of a tangent that’s sort of related – not as important as talking about what affects people now, but it’s an example of narrow thinking on the same subject.
Gah, trying to keep this brief, but in essence it’s the way historians talk as if a man married to a physically attractive woman he had no reason to like or trust is some sort of freak for not wanting to have sex with her. The idea that a man is anything but a rampant sex machine or could be affected by matters of trust, or of personal incompatibility, and that they might just matter more than “attractive female body available” just never seems to occur to them.
It’s … so many missed opportunities to broaden a discussion, such narrow thinking, in both cases. Farrell of course is a screaming misogynist, but the whole stupid, reductionist thinking brought up a shitload of books I’ve read over the years, ones I’ve nearly thrown against the wall on occasion. It’s like people are cardboard cutouts, whether we’re talking history or frauds like Farrell.
/derail rant
Hi Yellaine! 🙂
Hello kitteserf ^^
Farrell’s argument is that the penis’ “softness is a signal that real feelings aren’t being addressed.” Which is one possible reason. Assuming there’s no medical problem, maybe the guy is tired, or is taking presciptions that cause problems with erections (but that are still worth taking), or maybe he’s just, you know, not a spring chicken any more. Who knows.
Instead of telling guys, hey, don’t worry about it, there are plenty of things you can do sexually without an erection that both you and your partner will enjoy, and hey if you do those things without putting weird performance pressure on yourself maybe doing them will give you an erection, he essentially tells them to drag their partners into some sort of male-centered therapy session to find out what “real feelings” are ostensibly making his penis limp.
Did I mention that Farrell is not actually a trained psychologist and that he doesn’t cite any actual research to back any of this up and that basically he’s just playing sex therapist?
Quote FTW.
I’ll give you another quote which comes from an internet friend of mine, a trans man as well as an autist, meaning people often think he’s a strange sort. He said “You don’t have to understand people, it’s enough to respect them”. I think that’s such a great quote.
Like, if I could choose a body from scratch I’d rather have no boobs, bigger shoulders, be taller, more musclular and possibly have a penis as well. Still, I can’t say having the body I do have really BOTHERS me. So I can’t really UNDERSTAND what it’s like to have this really strong feeling that your body is wrong and must be changed. I don’t really UNDERSTAND either this feeling that you’re a certain gender and it’s important with pronouns and stuff. The point is, I don’t HAVE to understand it. I can respect other people without understanding what it’s like to be them. If someone says “adress me with this pronoun” for instance, I can just respect that without having some kind of sympathetic emotional experience where I really feel what it’s like for that person.