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The Myth of Warren Farrell: Farrell on Rape, Part One

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No book has had more influence over the Men’s Rights movement than Warren Farrell’s The Myth of Male Power. Published in 1993, in the heyday of the early 90s antifeminist backlash, it set the agenda for the Men’s Rights movement as it’s developed over the last two decades.  He’s the one who came up with the notions of “male disposability” and the “death professions.” He’s the one who got MRAs fixated on the issue of draft registration.

Indeed, so pervasive has his influence been that if you see an MRA making a dumb argument anywhere on the Internet, the chances are probably more than 50-50 that it originated in the pages of Farrell’s book. Despite its age, and its eccentricity, The Myth of Male Power is still the first book recommended to MRA newbies in the sidebar of the Men’s Rights subreddit, the most active MRA hangout online.

It’s a book that deserves a lot more attention than I have been giving it on this blog. Sure, I’ve written about Farrell’s strange and creepy notions about incest, as set forth in a notorious interview in Penthouse in the 1970s, and about his recent attempts to explain away these views. But I haven’t devoted any blog posts to his most influential work. I intend to rectify that now, with a series of posts on some of Farrell’s chief arguments and assertions.

I will start with several posts on Farrell’s views on rape, which has been the subject of much controversy of late. This part will deal with his general statements on rape and sexuality; another will explore in more detail his views on date rape (did he really describe it as “exciting?”); and still another will look at the vast assortment of things he has inappropriately compared to rape.

Pinning down what Farrell “really believes” about rape – and indeed, about almost anything– is difficult. Farrell’s arguments, such as they are, are slippery and evasive. Instead of setting forth a clear argument about rape, Farrell instead provides us with a series of jumbled metaphors and strange comparisons. Instead of trying to summarize them – many of them defy summary — let’s just go through them one by one.

Farrell supporters will likely suggest that these quotes are taken “out of context,” to which I can only say: Check his book to see for yourself. None of his troubling quotes are any less troubling, or for that matter any clearer, in context, and many don’t have much of a context. Farrell writes in a rambling, free-associational style, and many of the “arguments” he makes in the following quotes seem to come from out of the blue, and are never developed further (though some, as you will see, are referenced again in later quotes).

Page numbers given are from the 1993 hardcover edition of The Myth of Male Power.

All that out of the way, let’s jump right in:

Near the start of his book , Farrell sets the tone for what will come by suggesting that men suffer as much sexual trauma from women’s mixed signals as women do from rape:

Feminism has taught women to sue men for sexual harassment or date rape when men initiate with the wrong person or with the wrong timing; no one has taught men to sue women for sexual trauma for saying “yes,” then “no,” then “yes.” … Men [are] still expected to initiate, but now, if they [do] it badly, they could go to jail. (p. 16)

Here, he elaborates on the notion that rape is a matter of bad timing, of “tak[ing] risks too quickly.”

In the past, both sexes were anxious about sex and pregnancy. Now the pill minimizes her anxiety and condoms increase his. Now the pimple faced boy must still risk rejection while also overcoming his own fear of herpes and AIDS and reassuring her there is nothing to fear. He must still do the sexual risk-taking, but now he can be put in jail if he takes risks too quickly or be called a wimp if he doesn’t take them quickly enough . (p. 168)

Here, Farrell falls back on the old “rape is misunderstanding” canard, and somehow manages to compare sexual activity –- from kissing up to and including rape — to eating a bag of potato chips.

It is also possible for a woman to go back to a man’s room, tell him she doesn’t want to have intercourse, mean it, start kissing, have intercourse, and then wish she hadn’t in the morning. How? Kissing is like eating potato chips. Before we know it, we’ve gone further than we said we would. (p. 311)

Here, he seems to seriously suggest that juries could do a better job judging rape cases if they were sexually aroused.

The problem with every judgment of sexual behavior is that it is made by people who aren’t being stimulated as they are making the judgment. A jury that sees a woman in a sterile courtroom, asks her what she wanted, and then assumes that anything else she did was the responsibility of the man is insulting not only the woman but the power of sex. (p. 312)

And then he returns to the potato chip metaphor.

A man being sued after a woman has more sex than intended is like Lay’s being sued after someone has more potato chips than intended. In brief, date rape can be a crime, a misunderstanding, or buyer’s remorse. (p. 312)

Farrell repeatedly tries to absolve men of sexual wrongdoing by suggesting that they are literally intoxicated by female beauty.

Sexually, of course, the sexes aren’t equal. It is exactly a woman’s greater sexual power that often makes a man so fearful of being rejected by her that he buys himself drinks to reduce his fear. In essence, her sexual power often leads to him drinking; his sexual power rarely leads to her drinking. If anything is evidence of her power over him, it is his being expected to spend his money to buy her drinks without her reciprocating.  …

It is  men – far more than women – whose mental capacities are diminished when they are “under the influence” of a beautiful woman. (p. 320)

But Farrell thinks it’s “sexist” – against men – to put men in jail for “selling sex” to intoxicated women:

As long as society tells men to be the salespersons of sex, it is sexist for society to put only men in jail if they sell well. We don’t put other salespersons in jail for buying clients drinks and successfully transforming a “no” into a “maybe” into a “yes.” If the client makes a choice to drink too much and the “yes” turns out to be a bad decision, it is the client who gets fired, not the salesperson.  (p. 321)

We’ve only just begun to scratch the surface of Warren Farrell’s equally daft and disturbing views on sex and rape. Stay tuned.

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titianblue
titianblue
11 years ago

Only the messiah Pell would say he was not the messiah Pell …

Alex
11 years ago

Derick, you’re Pell. No one else talks that way. Plus you used a bunch of Freudian crap earlier. Immature and mature orgasms, anyone?

Aaliyah
11 years ago

@Tamen

That quotation by Koss is ironic considering that Koss does’t consider a large subset of men’s non-consensual intercourses (vaginal,oral,anal) as rape.

That’s irrelevant. I know that Koss’ survey wasn’t inclusive of most male victims (and in fact, IIRC, she didn’t even include any male victims).

titianblue
titianblue
11 years ago

Damn, major screw-up of scoring out. I was not haling Pell as the messiah.

Amused
11 years ago

Exactly!! You DO agree with me, that it is about EGO, and not so much about Sex…

Correct?

Please answer with a simple Yes or No…

You don’t get to dictate terms to me, nor to depose me. Rape is about dehumanization, wherein sex is used as a weapon. That’s all. Only if you are denying the basic dignity and humanity of women can you say that feminists are making too big a deal of it.

Alex
11 years ago

Anyone have an estimate countdown to pelltdown?

Aaliyah
11 years ago

Rape = Forced Sex

If we remove ‘Forced’ from the equation, what remains is Sex, that is a natural act.

You are disgusting. An act of dehumanization and humiliation can never be regarded as a “natural act” by any decent human being.

freemage
freemage
11 years ago

Derick: Please either learn how to use blockquotes, or stop trying, ‘kay? It just makes your pathetic, mewling, disingenuous shit even harder to read.

I note that you completely ignored that several folks explained why your premise (“rape” = “forced sex”) was completely wrong, and thus any conclusions drawn from it are suspect at best, and most likely hideously flawed. I wonder why that is, you lying piece of shitpuke.

PEMRA: A full bellyflop-fail there, son. You were told to provide citations of a prominent feminist expressing the views you claim are part of feminism. If it’s happening all the time, that should make it easier to find just one, but somehow, you were not up to the task. I suspect that this is neither the first, nor last, time in your life where this is true.

Aaliyah
11 years ago

To clarify, I’m saying that rape is a an act of dehumanization and humiliation. Rape is defined as non-consensual sexual penetration. Nothing more, nothing less.

Aaliyah
11 years ago

As for your point about the “separate” CDC survey, Tamen, I stand corrected.

bahumbugi
bahumbugi
11 years ago

i’m only up to comments from yesterday, but i wanted to say, Maude LL and ophelia, who mentioned abuse, i support you, and this catwoman thing, up to where i have read, is totally bizarre. and has an mra-type slant to the argument and the argument style. but catwoman maybe if you’re being criticize left and right on forums where you consider yourself an insider, you should examine your reasons for posting.

what is a poe? i’ll probably be back later.

Also Derick, LOLz, I give you all teh disdain.

Bee
Bee
11 years ago

Jesus, it’s hard to respond to something so incoherent, but —

What Feminists actually do it, they sensationalize it, precisely because for them it NOT about the sex, it is about their ‘EGO’ that was vanquished.

The entire uproar, pandemonium is because of nothing but EGO.

It’s not about sex, because guess what? Rape isn’t sex! It’s fucking rape.

If we remove ‘Forced’ from the equation, what remains is Sex, that is a natural act.

What about when we remove physical force and replace it with an alternative weapon — say, intoxication, coersion, massively disparate power, etc.? Like, if a rapist chokes his victim and pushes xir on the floor, that’s rape, but if the rapist chooses a kid from the neighborhood that he knows doesn’t get a lot of parental attention and is in trouble a lot, that’s totally just sexy times?

Tamen
Tamen
11 years ago

Alex:

And Tamen, not including being made to penetrate as rape wouldn’t only affect men. It would also affect women who were made to finger or made to use an object.

Since the NISVS 2010 Report actually counted those who have been made to penetrate we can see that that classification predominately affects men (even for lifetime numbers the number of women who had been made to penetrate someone else were not published because the finding had a relative standard error >30% or cell size ≤ 20.)

And yes, the survey unfortunately did not take into account the fact that any responders may be trans people and non-binaries – although since they as far as I can see just did ask the respondents what gender they are I’d assume/hope that trans people who identify as one gender could identify as that gender in the survey. That still leaves out people identifying outside the gender binary though.

Tamen
Tamen
11 years ago

Aaliyah:
I meant that quote was ironic coming from Koss (not that it was ironic that you quoted it):

Female victims are undercounted because they themselves doesn’t label what happened to them as rape although it legally is

vs.

Male victims are undercounted because Mary P Koss doesn’t label what happened to them as rape although it legally is.

Derick
Derick
11 years ago

@ Alex [quote]@Derick, I can’t refute anything so incredibly incoherent. And I still think you’re Pell. If you aren’t, you took lessons from him. [/quote]

You cannot refute it, which means you agree, correct?

I am not Pell! I heard it the first time here itself. I can assure you I am not him. Now can we get back to the issue?

Also, I do not think Consent is the appropriate term here because, the victim could claim that “He/ she was too drunk” for consent or “He/ she was asleep”, and get away with it on grounds of Technicality, and accuse the Perpetrator successfully, even when the Perpetrator did not necessarily Force the Victim.

But let’s for the sake of argument use consent, fair enough?

Now, you DO agree that it is about the Ego and not so much about Sex…correct?

A simple Yes or No, would suffice

titianblue
titianblue
11 years ago

So, Derick, you believe that it’s not rape if you do it to someone when they’re asleep?

titianblue
titianblue
11 years ago

How about in a coma, Derick? Unconscious because you drugged them, Derick? Uncoscious because you bopped them over the head, Derrick? Because someone else bopped them over the head? Where do YOU draw the line, Derick, before you call it RAPE?!

freemage
freemage
11 years ago

Aaliyah: As a complete side-note: I’ve tried to do some poking around for ex-Muslims seeking support. So far, all I’ve found is the CEMB, which is based in Great Britain, but it seems their forums have a fairly international spread (one recent poster in the Introduction forum is apparently from Chicago). So it might be a place where you can get some more informed emotional support (not that we aren’t here for you, but these folks may have more insight to your situation).

http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/

If you do go, you should take care with your identity and personal information–they do have Muslims on the boards, it seems, who argue for a more moderate Islam–which is fine, but it does mean you might encounter someone who would think they were ‘helping’ you by outing you to your father, which obviously could be disastrous. I’ll keep looking around.

Aaliyah
11 years ago

@Tamen: Thanks for clarifying.

@theseventhguest

No worries. In this thread, I haven’t talked about anything that triggers me. So I won’t mind if you bring any of that up. I’m only triggered by thinking about being bullied, sexually/physically assaulted, or murdered by intolerant people. (Just typing that out was hard for me, honestly – but I’m definitely not blaming you as it was me who typed that.)

Anyway, last night I made a mistake of not trimming beforehand, so what you said serves as a reminder. I’ll re-do the shaving and trimming tonight. The leg socks are also a good idea. I happen to have some of those socks lying around in my room. No one will be bothered by me wearing them more often than usual.

Thank you very much for those suggestions. ^_^

Briznecko
Briznecko
11 years ago

Where is your in-depth analysis of The Hangover Pell?

Aaliyah
11 years ago

Also, I do not think Consent is the appropriate term here

Then you aren’t talking about rape.

freemage
freemage
11 years ago

Okay, I think Derick’s due a rape-apologist fuckstein Banhammer, yes? He’s stated fairly clearly that he doesn’t think it’s rape if the victim is not conscious. Odds of him being a socky mcpuppet are also pretty damned high.

Bee
Bee
11 years ago

So Derick is asking whether feminists (or victims?) view rape (or their own rapes?) as about sex or about ego. Several problems here.

1. You’ve set up a false dichotomy.

2. Not all rapes are the same.

3. Not all victims view their rapes the same way.

4. Feminists are not a hivemind.

5. Rape is not sex.

6. A psychic harm is not an imaginary harm.

Tamen
Tamen
11 years ago

Aaliyah:

I know that Koss’ survey wasn’t inclusive of most male victims (and in fact, IIRC, she didn’t even include any male victims).

I haven’t go a copy of the Koss paper as it seem to only be available behind paywalls, but I know Ampersand at Alas, a blog have looked into it in some details in a series of blog posts defending that article from criticism from McElroy and some other people:

http://www.amptoons.com/blog/2004/04/30/wendy-mcelroy-on-koss-seven-mistakes-in-two-sentences/

There were 3,187 women surveyed for the study, not 7,000 women as McElroy claims. (Including men, a total of 6,159 people were in Koss’ sample).

So the sample included men.

augochlorella
augochlorella
11 years ago

Derick, stop talking about rape and tell me where to find that female GaoGaiGar you promised me.

Or just leave. Actually yeah, do that.

Leave.

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