Some words of wisdom from TheRedPill subreddit, a lovely little subdivision of Reddit devoted to a sort of mishmash of Men’s Rights and Pickup Artistry. It’s at least as ridiculous as the sum of its parts.
And I can prove that with actual numbers. Well, a single number: 95. That’s the number of net upvotes the comment I took the following quotes from had gotten from the assembled Red Pillers (at least when I last looked at it). Let’s listen in as Whisper enlightens us on a variety of topics:
World History:
[M]en have never had an easy ride unless they were one of the aristocracy. We’ve always been the labouring sex, the risk-taking sex, the disposable sex.
Little known fact: Poor women throughout history have never had to work or suffer at all, having been issued comfy pillows and a lifetime supply of bon-bons at birth from the Invisible Matriarchy.
The Squeaky Vagina Gets the Grease:
[W]hen something unfair happens to a woman, her usual response to point this unfairness out to whoever appears to have power. But men, being less submissive, tend to blame ourselves, ask “What am I doing wrong?”, and try to change either our behaviour or our environment (by going elsewhere).
All that complaining you think you hear from Men’s Rights Activists? Not really complaining. It’s just them wondering what they’ve been doing wrong. Apparently they’re talking in a strange sort of code. When they refer to “feminists” and “bitches” and “sluts” behaving horribly and deserving blame for everything, they are in fact referring to themselves.
On Stabbing:
[W]hen a man sees someone doing better than him, his first impulse is not to stab, but to try to learn.
Good to know! It is generally considered impolite to stab unless someone else attempts to stab you first.
On Advice, Christmas Giving and Bananas in Ears:
[W]omen were certainly willing to give us advice. Oh, boy, were they ever willing to give us advice. Page after page, speech after speech, of what we should and shouldn’t do, who we should and shouldn’t be …
And, of course, when we followed this advice, things got worse.
And gradually we came to realize that when we asked these “new women”, empowered by feminism, what a man should do, they didn’t hear “What should a man’s life be like?”, they heard “What do you want for christmas?”.
This last bit seems a little puzzling. Are you sure these women you’ve been speaking to didn’t have bananas in their ears?
On Daddies, Ponies and Maternity Leave:
We woke up to the fact that women’s lists of what a man should do were the equivalent of a 12 year old girl asking daddy for a pony. She doesn’t worry about whether daddy can actually afford to buy her one …
Every feminist lobbying for paid maternity leave is a submissive asking daddy to care for her. Every “men can stop rape” poster is a woman admitting she cannot protect herself. Every woman complaining that we shouldn’t portray women like that in video games is a woman saying “I can’t make my own video games, please consider my wishes when you make them for both of us”. ….
Feminism was never about female independence. If it were, it would not require men to cooperate or even notice. They wouldn’t need us to give them jobs if they started their own businesses. They wouldn’t need us to give them “equal pay” if they were doing the hiring. They wouldn’t need laws mandating maternity leave and free birth control if they were the ones setting, and paying, employee benefits. They wouldn’t need “no means no” if they were the ones making the sexual advances. They wouldn’t need “men can stop rape” if they took responsibility for defending themselves from psychos.
So all we have to do is stop. Say no. You can have a slightly bigger allowance, but you cannot have a pony.
Did you hear that, ladies? Wanting equal pay, or maternity leave, or simply not to be raped – all those things are exactly like throwing a tantrum for a pony.
Also, apparently only men pay taxes, or work in the video game industry, or really anywhere at all. And no one deserves police protection because that means they’re some sort of wuss.
Who knew?
Thanks, TheRedPill subreddit!
EDITED TO ADD: I just noticed that Deansdale’s Blog, a Manospherian blog that’s previously defended some of the less savory utterances of assorted MRA and PUA celebrities, has reposted Whisper’s comment in its entirety under the headline “A gold nugget from Reddit,” with no sarcasm intended. I’ll agree that it’s some sort of nugget, but it’s neither gold nor chicken. And again, for those critics who think I mae a big deal of comments, well, this is a comment that MRAs and Manospherians are making a big deal of themselves.
Wait, Dick is a shortened form for Richard? I didn’t know that.
Originally, yes, though I don’t know if it’s used that way now or more likely to be given as a kid’s actual name.
Yup, it’s not that people are opposed to the idea of there being advocacy groups for issues affecting men, it’s that the current “men’s rights movement” starts with the flawed assumption that all the problems facing men are due to feminism/modern women/”western” women.
They also complain about feminists “feminizing” men by challenging the way our society defines masculinity, when society’s rigid ideas about masculinity (ie: men always want sex, men are naturally suited for physical aggression/violence, men are unemotional and self reliant and never need help, and so on) are at the root of many of the problems facing men.
If they were honest with themselves (lol yeah right) and actually wanted to help men, then they’d realize that the problem isn’t feminism or modern women, but gender stereotypes.
I’ve always found it odd that “Peggy” is used as a nickname for Margaret. Looking it up just now there’s a whole bunch of other names used as short for Margaret, including Gretchen, Megan, Molly and Pearl. I had no idea.
they also spend a lot of time devoted to telling women that they don’t have problems, or that they are unimportant, never existent, are irrelevant, etc. No, just fucking no. I have no problem with a men’s movement, but women need a movement too, who else will look out for women?
For the years I’ve seen them in action, they spend the most of that time trying to silence women. Even if you don’t call yourself a feminist if you say anything remotely feminist sounding, they try to argue you to death, and really badly too. Its annoying as hell and I fail to see how arguing with feminists helps for example, the man suffering from severe depression and on the brink of suicide. Do they really think he gives a shit that some keyboard warrior showed that feminist what’s what on her blog?
I think I’m gonna go eat a muffin and amuse myself with cartoons or something…don’t feel like thinking about this now. Night all!
“Gretchen” makes sense because “-chen” is a standard German diminutive. Didn’t know Pearl or Molly could be a nickname for Margaret, though.
Polly’s a diminutive of Margaret, too. Come to think of it, Peter Wimsey calls his sister Mary, Polly – don’t know if that’s just him or if it’s an actual diminutive, I’ve never seen it used for Mary before. May’s the only diminutive of Mary I can think of. There’s also Dolly or Dot for Dorothy.
Cool new catvatar, Quackers – niters! 🙂
I grew up with a friend named Elizabeth–apparently, that’s another one with tons of shortened versions–Beth, Betty, Liz, Lizzie, Liza…
Re: Richard/Dick — I’ve known a couple of Richards who’re my age-ish, they all shorted it to Rick or Ricky. Only Dick I’ve known is the narcissist ex’s uncle and he’s more than old enough to retire (65+ in the US)
This guy is claiming oppressed men in history have asked themselves what they are doing wrong, unlike blame-y feminists. But who does he mean? The union movement? The civil rights movement? I’m just imagining a unionist climbing to the podium and saying, “Comrades, there is not a question work conditions are hazardous, wages are low, but we have to ask ouselves one thing – ‘What are we doing wrong?'”
Don’t you love the way he thinks* women haven’t internalised misogyny enough? Like “It’s my fault, I didn’t do this or that” isn’t something women are taught to do all our freaking lives!
*I’m using the word loosely
Blah, I typed out a whole comment and lost it.
@ Freemage: there are loads of shortened versions of Elizabeth. Libby, Liz, Lizzie, Lizbeth Liza, Elly/Ellie, Else/Elsie, Etta, Beth, Bet, Betty, Betsy, Bess, Bessie. List goes on… 🙂
As for this:
Feminism was never about female independence. If it were, it would not require men to cooperate or even notice. They wouldn’t need us to give them jobs if they started their own businesses. They wouldn’t need us to give them “equal pay” if they were doing the hiring. They wouldn’t need laws mandating maternity leave and free birth control if they were the ones setting, and paying, employee benefits. They wouldn’t need “no means no” if they were the ones making the sexual advances. They wouldn’t need “men can stop rape” if they took responsibility for defending themselves from psychos.
So all we have to do is stop. Say no. You can have a slightly bigger allowance, but you cannot have a pony.
So, uh, I thought women ruled the world, right? So how can this be? Aren’t all the men in positions of power having their strings pulled by feminists or something?
@Kittehserf Oh yes.
Just catching up luvvies,
Listened to my ‘Whose Body’ dramatisation last night, one of my favourites. Deals with Peter’s PTSD and everything.
Very O.T. And hope nobody minds me hijacking but thought I’d add this to the most active thread.
If you can, please sign the petition for ‘No more Page Three’ it’s an important feminist thingy 🙂
Links, links, links 🙂
http://www.change.org/en-GB/petitions/dominic-mohan-take-the-bare-boobs-out-of-the-sun-nomorepage3
http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2013/mar/10/anti-page-3-the-sun-campaigner
http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2013/apr/09/girl-guides-sun-page-3
Sorry for hijacking,
Come to think of it, Peter Wimsey calls his sister Mary, Polly – don’t know if that’s just him or if it’s an actual diminutive, I’ve never seen it used for Mary before. May’s the only diminutive of Mary I can think of.
I have heard of Molly as a diminutive for Mary, so maybe that’s where Polly comes from?
Having been in a relationship like Bunter and Whimsey (I was playing Bunter to his Whimsey), the moment in which Bunter is asked to dine with Peter and their host and he demurs, saying he desires life to carry on in it’s usual way.
Whimsey says, “Bunter likes to make sure I know my place”.
The master/body servant relationship is strangely democratic; as the saying goes, “no man is a hero to his valet”.
So all those men wanting government to relinquish those rights they need, they’re just throwing a tantrum? Good to know, reddit.
Something that vexes me. Perhaps people with more real life experience than a 20-something student who still thinks pop up ice creams are awesome (they are, though, totally) can explain this to me:
What’s with the conflation of rugged individualism, the lack of it, and worth? Brz was hinting at something of the same thing with the “Liberals lack physical courage” thing earlier.
Asking for considersations and pointing out ways of reasonable compromise doesn’t scream submissive weakling to me. The “Men can stop rape” isn’t a “Because women can’t”, it’s a realization of the joint nature of the issue and the fact that working together allows a person to accomplish more (That, and the fact that most rapes are, in fact, commited by men who might not be total psychopaths but just doing something stupid and riding on social affirmation).
I can’t really wrap my head around it, and that also means I can’t mock it because instead of being able to sarcastically quip, it just ends up being “What? No one thinks like that!”
I mean… Basic human niceness is not a weak trait? Respecting someone’s wishes isn’t… sublimating your own desires? How does it work?
Ugh not hit MRA. MRA hit Ugh! MRA better person! Ugh suck! <– the thought process
More seriously, they respect physical strength over everything else because they are immature enough to only aspire to the dreams of a 4-year-old. They also conflate “not using physical force” with “not being able to use physical force” — a hilariously misguided assumption that will surely hand them many an asskicking if they actually try venturing away from the safety of their keyboards.
I have no clue, but as my fibromyalgia is getting worse I am hating that line of thought even more.
I wonder if these MRAs hate Smokey the bear for saying only you can prevent forest fires.
This reminds me of something my mom said back when she did karate. She observed that most of the people who had been there a long time didn’t feel the need to prove they could do stuff. Like, most of the higher ranks don’t feel the need to throw you as hard as possible/ not control their techniques very much/ try to win or show off at everything as opposed to lots of the younger, less experienced mostly men*
*misaaaaaandry.
@Fade
If you ever want to ask me anything else, feel free.
sperm jacking —
Every time I see this, I see Ripper from Dr. Strangelove writing
over and over again.
I’m sure it’s been said before, but I’ve thought it often, and wanted to try blockquotes. I have high hopes my blockquote works.
I am super pleased. Thank you to whoever put up that blockquote template ages ago.
@seventh guest
Thank you! I’ll keep that in mind.