Today, a fascinating – and infuriating – case study in how Men’s Rights Activists twist reality around in order to fit their peculiar ideology. Obviously, they do this all the time, but it’s hard to find a clearer example of the MRA Reality Distortion field in action than the video I’ve pasted in below from A Voice for Men.
The video features a recording of one of AVFM’s regular commenters calling a domestic violence hotline, pretending to be a man named “Reno” who has been abused by his wife. In reality, Reno is Ian Williams, a puckish Australian who has made himself AVFM’s go-to guy for prank calls; you can find several other prank calls from him on his AVFM contributor page.
Here’s what Williams, who also goes by the pseudonym Dr. F, has to say about the call:
If you’re a man and you are a victim of violence from your partner you may face difficulties finding help. Don’t listen to me, here’s the guy himself who called. His name is Reno.
Reno calls a battered women’s shelter and is denied help.
He is denied help, even though he tells the person on the other end of the phone that he is worried his wife will return with a cricket bat.
That sounds pretty damning, and, in the comments, the regulars at AVFM responded with predictable outrage.
“No concern for a beaten man or a boy that could also be a victim and, only able to help(willing) women,” wrote Raven01. “It makes the hate filled ideology apparent to all.”
“[Go] feminism- the humanitarian justice movement brought to you by the modern KKK!” Perseus added. “Sieg Heil, cunts!”
Not one of them seemed to care that everything Williams says about the phone call is false. “Reno” was offered help many times. He was the one who refused it.
If you listen to the call, here’s what you’ll find:
Williams, pretending to be “Reno,” called a Domestic Violence counseling line, not a battered women’s shelter. He told the counselor he’d been attacked by his wife and that he needed a place to go. The counselor explained to him that he’d called a counseling line and that she personally couldn’t arrange for shelter, but that if he called the men’s help line, they could arrange for him and his 6-year-old son to get free hotel accommodations at a location unknown to his wife. The counselor offered several times to connect him directly to the men’s help line.
Williams also told the counselor that he was thinking of calling the police. She told him she could connect him directly to the police, and would be happy to explain his situation to them and to make sure he reached an officer who specializes in domestic violence.
Ignoring all her offers to assist him in getting shelter and further help, Williams insisted that he wanted to be housed in a battered woman’s shelter instead. The counselor, naturally, was puzzled by this strange insistence on his part, and explained to him again that he could get free shelter at a local hotel for as long as he needed. She again offered to connect him directly to someone who could get him immediate help.
Having refused all of her offers of assistance, Reno abruptly ended the call — to the obvious distress of the counselor, who despite the patent weirdness of his behavior on the call had been patiently trying her best to get “Reno” the help he claimed he needed. (I suspect she sensed that his story was phony, but tried to help anyway in case it was true.)
Listen to the call yourself. It’s utterly surreal. What’s even more surreal is that Williams would make the bald claim that he had been “denied help” — and then put up a recording that clearly reveals that this claim is complete and utter bullshit. And I can’t tell if he’s lying or delusional.
That’s always the question with MRAs, isn’t it?
EDITED TO ADD: A commenter here has prepared a rough transcript of the call. There are a few moments where it was impossible to figure out a word or two, but otherwise this seems to pretty accurately match my memory of the call, which I’ve listened to several times. Let me know if I need to make any corrections.
Recorded message:
Family Violence Counseling Line. Please note for training and quality improvement purposes only, your call may be monitored. If you do not want your call to be monitored, please let the counselor know. If you wish to listen to ? regarding our privacy policy if you are already speaking to a counselor press one now, otherwise hold on the line for next available counselor.
[Ringing sound]
Counselor: Hello, this is *redacted* speaking, how can I help you?
“Reno”: Oh, hello. I um, was speaking to someone a short while ago called Maria,
Counselor: Uh huh…
“Reno”: And, and my name is Reno. And, um…
Counselor: Uh huh…
“Reno”: I was explaining, I was explaining to her that my, my wife, uh, is violent towards me with a cricket bat and other things.
Counselor: Mmhmm…
“Reno”: And, uh, she gave me a phone number to call, and uh…
Counselor: Mmhmm…
“Reno”: I called them and um…
Counselor: A phone number for what?
“Reno”: Uh… Uh, it was to help, it was a, um… Pardon me, it was 1-800-015-188. It was a…
Counselor: I don’t know what that number is, so what is it for?
“Reno”: Uh, it’s a helpli-, it’s a possible, it’s a place where they might be able to tell me where I can get some shelter for the night. But there’s none of the… DV places ? are gonna help me, because I’m a man, you see.
Counselor: Have you called the men’s line? ‘Cause they’re the ones who specialize in, because in Australia unfortunately most of the, um… Services. Well not unfortunately, fortunately though, most of the services are for women, because 95% of domestic violence is perpetrated by men. So that’s why they don’t really have um… They don’t really have… So many refuges for wom-, for men. They do have places where men can go, but they’re normally um, like overnight men’s, um, places, like… Which state are you in?
“Reno”: Victoria.
Counselor: Victoria. I don’t know the ones in Victoria but there’s quite a few, for example, in Sydney um, that provide um, overnight accommodation but they don’t call them refuges as such because um… It’s the different situation only for women ’cause often they’re, well normally they’re fleeing with children. So um, normally the men’s ones aren’t, they’re not called refuges, they’re called like, a men’s hostel or an overnight, um, men’s overnight um, shelter, or they’ll call them different names but they don’t call them refuges. So, um, if you’re looking for men’s refuge that’s probably not in existence, but there are a lot of men’s shelters.
“Reno”: Will they take me and my boy?
Counselor: If you’ve got a child, um, they’ll probably prioritize you, I would say. Um, have you rung men’s line? Because they’re the ones who really have this type of information, um because they specialize in helping men. While general lines, like, we’re a counseling line, so we don’t actually have access to phone numbers for, um, directly for refuges. We can connect you to the refuge line. How old’s your, how old’s your son?
“Reno”: Six.
Counselor: How old?
“Reno”: He’s six.
Counselor: He’s six. And where is he right now?
“Reno”: He’s with me. My wife’s gonna be coming home in about three hours, and she’s gonna, she’s gonna beat me.
Counselor: And he, and your son’s not asleep now?
“Reno”: No, he’s with me now.
Counselor: Why isn’t he in bed at 8.40, 8.48 in the-… Sorry Reno, but why is he awake at this time of night?
“Reno”: Because we’re about to just go somewhere, anywhere, out of the house because we just… We’re terrifed. He, we’re ready to go, so. We, we’re ready to go.
Counselor: Reno, this is really concerning me. Is he listening to you as you’re speaking on the phone?
“Reno”: No.
Counselor: Where is he right now?
“Reno”: He’s got some headphones on. He’s watching…
Counselor: What’s he doing?
“Reno”: He’s watching television now, he can’t hear any talk. I made sure of that.
Counselor: Yeah, I’m really concerned that he’s um, awake at this time of night. Um, the other organization that could most likely help you find accommodation and probably would be your best option would be ? Community Services, because they deal especially with children and families in crisis, and so they would definitely keep you together, they would probably actually put you in, normally they pay for a hotel or motel. A men’s shelter wouldn’t be the appropriate place to go with a child, definitely not. So, um, ? they give you, they have a lot of motels and hotels that they deal with, and put they in those instead of accommodation until they can find you permanent accommodation.
“Reno”: Okay.
Counselor: Like, normally they’d pay for a flat or something instead, they wouldnt, they don’t continue to keep you in a, you know, holding pattern in a hotel. Sometimes they make you stay for, like, two weeks in a hotel.
“Reno”: Mm.
Counselor: That would be a good option for you, wouldn’t it?
“Reno”: Yeah. And they wouldn’t let my wife know that, where I’m living? Staying?
Counselor: No, they wouldn’t do that.
“Reno”: ‘Cause she’s really violent. Really violent.
Counselor: They definitely wouldn’t. Um, they definitely wouldn’t let your wife know where you’re staying. I can help you with the phone call. I can introduce you, explain the situation, and see what they can do for you, if you’d like.
“Reno”: Hmm… Possibly, tha-, thank you. I think I might, actually what I might do is call the police now and then see how it goes in there.
Counselor: But your best option is calling the police and then asking to speak to a domestic violence officer.
“Reno”: Okay.
Counselor: They’re the ones that are the most specialized in this, so they deal with this day in and day out, and that’s probably stationed… Are you in area, in an open area? Are you in Melbourne, or are you in a town, or…?
“Reno”: Uh, I’m in Melbourne.
Counselor: Well, if you’re in Melbourne, most Melbourne police stations will have a domestic violence officer, and they specialize in domestic violence, and um, what you can get is to get a detective to come over, or a domestic violence officer, and say that you’d like to um, that you have um, fear of, um, harm of your wife who’s been abusing you. And what they’ll do is, they might um, even try and get an AVO so that she has to move out of the house and you guys can stay in the house.
“Reno”: Mm.
Counselor: They’ll try probably to do that so that you and the child can stay there. Or um, if you move, they’ll um, it would be, that she can’t actually have legal contact with you.
“Reno”: Yeah… No, we have to actually get away from her, we can’t stay here. So there’s nowh-, there’s no um, women’s shelter I could stay in, we could stay in tonight?
Counselor: Well, women’s, women’s shelter’s don’t take men.
“Reno”: They don’t take men.
Counselor: Why don’t you ring men’s lines? They would be able to tell you where you can go. Why don’t you ring the men’s line? Do you want me to connect you through to the men’s line? They deal with men. Men and women’s shelters are two totally different issues. Why do you want to go [to] a women’s shelter?
“Reno”: I just need somewhere where I can just get away from her, somewhere whe-
Counselor: Yeah, but why wouldn’t you, why wouldn’t you wanna go? Why aren’t you accepting this offer that ? will pay for hotel accommodations for you and your son?
“Reno”: Oh, because I…
Counselor: Why do you…
“Reno: Because I need to get out now.
Counselor: Yeah, but they would organize it now, they’ll probably organize someone to come and get you now. People work 24/7.
“Reno”: Oh, okay. I didn’t know what. Okay.
Counselor: ? Services work 24/7, or do you want me to put you through to your local um, police station and explain it to the domestic violence officer so that I can introduce you and explain your situation and see how they can help you?
“Reno”: No, I’ll, I’ll give them a call myself. Okay, thanks.
Counselor: Are you sure?
“Reno”: Absolutely.
Counselor: I’m happy to do it, Reno. I’m very concerned about your son.
“Reno”: No, that, that’s okay. I, I’ll go now.
David, what do you think of the planned “militant” actions to take place at UofT this week?
@augochlorella
Wow O_O Article guy is truly a shit stain of humanity. Also, with an extreme, extreme case of lack of perspective.
@pillowinhell
ugh. All the jedi hugs to you, if you want.
@AK
Wow O_o I wonder what he expected to happen…
@katz
Wow. Her husband sounds like a real asshat.
@cloudiah
So cute! Cats and rats living together… my life is complete <3
@AK
Ugh. I hate hearing the assholes are so common in meat space. I feel like if anyone told me that I’d laugh in their face and tell them they’re an asshole (I hope. I’m kinda shy irl). Then again, probably don’t have to worry about it, since I’m a lesbian :/
Yeah, double standards >:( Though on a side note, I feel like explosives, while not something I’d tell other people to stop doing, is definitely a job I’d never want to do 😉 Way too scared of any potential disaster.
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzero: WTF are you on about?
zzzzzero thinks this is a Q&A, rather than a blog. But you know what? Interrogating David could be fun.
So…
David, what do you think of the AP’s decision to drop the use of “illegal immigrant” from its style book?
When I started out in my career, my first job was on a telephone DV helpline and working in refuges. You betcha that we had men phoning the line with all sorts of tricks to find the location of the refuges. Sometimes, they asked female relatives and friends to phone up to be taken in to the refuges and would then track their partner down that way.
I’ve never understood why MRAs are so insistent on being housed in a woman’s refuge as proof of equality of treatment with regards to DV. Well, I do have theories but none of them make ANY FUCKING SENSE.
I’m too tired to understand zero. Would it help if I got caffinated? I may leap to more weird conclusions that way.
David, what do you think about Obama’s funding of a research initiative, starting with $100 million in 2014, to invent and refine new technologies to understand the human brain?
I’ll join in the Q&A session!
David, what do you think of conditional probability?*
*I hate math, and don’t worry, I’m not expecting an answer. XD
David, would you rather have hands for feet, or feet for hands?
David, I’ve long suspected that vegan food is not necessarily health food. What do you think of that? David?
Clearly he is not answering me because he is TERRIFIED by the implications of my questions!
David, what do you think of my haircut? I went in for a trim, but I think they cut it too short.
David, can you, perchance, tell me how to get to Sesame Street?
David, would you rather fight one hundred ant-sized Daleks, or one horse-sized package of Camel cigarettes miraculously brought to life?
I am not David, but I would rather have hands for feet! Twice as much grabbing power!
@deezers
Well, I don’t know about David, but I like my hands and my feet right where they are, thankyouverymuch 😉
David, can you tell if I need to shower today? I really think I should, but am also kinda lazy. My hair is in a ponytail, if that makes any difference.
@Marie, yeah, I’m not very comfortable with the explosives myself. Mr. AK doesn’t handle them directly and the risks are fairly low (he’s a safety engineer), but you know…he has a framed photo on his desk of him standing on top of an 800-pound chunk of concrete that landed in the spectator area when a test went wrong. On the other hand, I broke my neck at work.
I’m queer and I was in a LTR with a woman before meeting Mr. AK (not like I left her for him, I didn’t know him when she and I broke up), and the creepy thing is that back then, people treated my job like it was a natural thing for a lesbian (because of course anyone who is in a committed relationship with a same-sex partner is full-on gay) to do. Now it’s this surprising thing for a lot of people, and the only thing that has changed is the gender of my partner. Bit eye-opening, really.
@Fade – Totally with you there – but imagine the cartwheel capabilities if you had four feet?!
@Marie – Yes, I am hoping I will never actually have to make the choice 😉
Wow, AK — I guess I shouldn’t be surprised by your experience, but I am. People are so … weird about this shit.
Cartwheels shall not be missed. I am not a cartwheel person. 😉
Gah, my cold medicine is so frying my brain today. I meant to add after the random sentence about me breaking my neck: “So, you know, only one of us has actually suffered a serious injury at work.” No one except my family and friends at the time really knows about that injury though, so that’s not what’s influencing the “he lets you do it?!” comments.
@AK
You’re jobs both sound dangerous! O_o But as long as you guys like them 😀 I’m just a total wuss in this area XD
And boo on those people (the double-standar-y ones)
David: should I get my shit together or wait until tomorrow?
@cloudiah–I know what you mean. Frankly, it really surprised me too, especially because a lot of the people I’m talking about knew me when I was with my ex-girlfriend, and knew about her. It’s like a double whammy of diminishing queer relationships and old school misogyny. 🙁
zzzero, I was unaware that there were any “militant” actions planned until I saw your comment, and after looking at the statements from the people referred to in the AVFM post on the subject, I’m still not sure what if any “militant” actions are planned. As I’ve said several times before, I didn’t suppport the blockade of the building during the Farrell talk; I think that it was incredibly counterproductive as well as being wrong in principle.
If “militant” means another blockade,I think that’s a very bad idea. If “militant” means showing up in numbers to challenge MRA bullshit, I’m all for it.
The only people talking about “physical confrontation” now are a small group of Maosts. Hopefully the organizers of whatever protest is planned will completely ignore whatever suggestions they have.
But, you know, as someone who is not a student at the University of Toronto, and who lives 700 miles away and in another country to boot, I don’t actually have any say in what the activists there choose to do.
David, why aren’t you answering our questions? Isn’t this a Reddit AMA?