Today, a fascinating – and infuriating – case study in how Men’s Rights Activists twist reality around in order to fit their peculiar ideology. Obviously, they do this all the time, but it’s hard to find a clearer example of the MRA Reality Distortion field in action than the video I’ve pasted in below from A Voice for Men.
The video features a recording of one of AVFM’s regular commenters calling a domestic violence hotline, pretending to be a man named “Reno” who has been abused by his wife. In reality, Reno is Ian Williams, a puckish Australian who has made himself AVFM’s go-to guy for prank calls; you can find several other prank calls from him on his AVFM contributor page.
Here’s what Williams, who also goes by the pseudonym Dr. F, has to say about the call:
If you’re a man and you are a victim of violence from your partner you may face difficulties finding help. Don’t listen to me, here’s the guy himself who called. His name is Reno.
Reno calls a battered women’s shelter and is denied help.
He is denied help, even though he tells the person on the other end of the phone that he is worried his wife will return with a cricket bat.
That sounds pretty damning, and, in the comments, the regulars at AVFM responded with predictable outrage.
“No concern for a beaten man or a boy that could also be a victim and, only able to help(willing) women,” wrote Raven01. “It makes the hate filled ideology apparent to all.”
“[Go] feminism- the humanitarian justice movement brought to you by the modern KKK!” Perseus added. “Sieg Heil, cunts!”
Not one of them seemed to care that everything Williams says about the phone call is false. “Reno” was offered help many times. He was the one who refused it.
If you listen to the call, here’s what you’ll find:
Williams, pretending to be “Reno,” called a Domestic Violence counseling line, not a battered women’s shelter. He told the counselor he’d been attacked by his wife and that he needed a place to go. The counselor explained to him that he’d called a counseling line and that she personally couldn’t arrange for shelter, but that if he called the men’s help line, they could arrange for him and his 6-year-old son to get free hotel accommodations at a location unknown to his wife. The counselor offered several times to connect him directly to the men’s help line.
Williams also told the counselor that he was thinking of calling the police. She told him she could connect him directly to the police, and would be happy to explain his situation to them and to make sure he reached an officer who specializes in domestic violence.
Ignoring all her offers to assist him in getting shelter and further help, Williams insisted that he wanted to be housed in a battered woman’s shelter instead. The counselor, naturally, was puzzled by this strange insistence on his part, and explained to him again that he could get free shelter at a local hotel for as long as he needed. She again offered to connect him directly to someone who could get him immediate help.
Having refused all of her offers of assistance, Reno abruptly ended the call — to the obvious distress of the counselor, who despite the patent weirdness of his behavior on the call had been patiently trying her best to get “Reno” the help he claimed he needed. (I suspect she sensed that his story was phony, but tried to help anyway in case it was true.)
Listen to the call yourself. It’s utterly surreal. What’s even more surreal is that Williams would make the bald claim that he had been “denied help” — and then put up a recording that clearly reveals that this claim is complete and utter bullshit. And I can’t tell if he’s lying or delusional.
That’s always the question with MRAs, isn’t it?
EDITED TO ADD: A commenter here has prepared a rough transcript of the call. There are a few moments where it was impossible to figure out a word or two, but otherwise this seems to pretty accurately match my memory of the call, which I’ve listened to several times. Let me know if I need to make any corrections.
Recorded message:
Family Violence Counseling Line. Please note for training and quality improvement purposes only, your call may be monitored. If you do not want your call to be monitored, please let the counselor know. If you wish to listen to ? regarding our privacy policy if you are already speaking to a counselor press one now, otherwise hold on the line for next available counselor.
[Ringing sound]
Counselor: Hello, this is *redacted* speaking, how can I help you?
“Reno”: Oh, hello. I um, was speaking to someone a short while ago called Maria,
Counselor: Uh huh…
“Reno”: And, and my name is Reno. And, um…
Counselor: Uh huh…
“Reno”: I was explaining, I was explaining to her that my, my wife, uh, is violent towards me with a cricket bat and other things.
Counselor: Mmhmm…
“Reno”: And, uh, she gave me a phone number to call, and uh…
Counselor: Mmhmm…
“Reno”: I called them and um…
Counselor: A phone number for what?
“Reno”: Uh… Uh, it was to help, it was a, um… Pardon me, it was 1-800-015-188. It was a…
Counselor: I don’t know what that number is, so what is it for?
“Reno”: Uh, it’s a helpli-, it’s a possible, it’s a place where they might be able to tell me where I can get some shelter for the night. But there’s none of the… DV places ? are gonna help me, because I’m a man, you see.
Counselor: Have you called the men’s line? ‘Cause they’re the ones who specialize in, because in Australia unfortunately most of the, um… Services. Well not unfortunately, fortunately though, most of the services are for women, because 95% of domestic violence is perpetrated by men. So that’s why they don’t really have um… They don’t really have… So many refuges for wom-, for men. They do have places where men can go, but they’re normally um, like overnight men’s, um, places, like… Which state are you in?
“Reno”: Victoria.
Counselor: Victoria. I don’t know the ones in Victoria but there’s quite a few, for example, in Sydney um, that provide um, overnight accommodation but they don’t call them refuges as such because um… It’s the different situation only for women ’cause often they’re, well normally they’re fleeing with children. So um, normally the men’s ones aren’t, they’re not called refuges, they’re called like, a men’s hostel or an overnight, um, men’s overnight um, shelter, or they’ll call them different names but they don’t call them refuges. So, um, if you’re looking for men’s refuge that’s probably not in existence, but there are a lot of men’s shelters.
“Reno”: Will they take me and my boy?
Counselor: If you’ve got a child, um, they’ll probably prioritize you, I would say. Um, have you rung men’s line? Because they’re the ones who really have this type of information, um because they specialize in helping men. While general lines, like, we’re a counseling line, so we don’t actually have access to phone numbers for, um, directly for refuges. We can connect you to the refuge line. How old’s your, how old’s your son?
“Reno”: Six.
Counselor: How old?
“Reno”: He’s six.
Counselor: He’s six. And where is he right now?
“Reno”: He’s with me. My wife’s gonna be coming home in about three hours, and she’s gonna, she’s gonna beat me.
Counselor: And he, and your son’s not asleep now?
“Reno”: No, he’s with me now.
Counselor: Why isn’t he in bed at 8.40, 8.48 in the-… Sorry Reno, but why is he awake at this time of night?
“Reno”: Because we’re about to just go somewhere, anywhere, out of the house because we just… We’re terrifed. He, we’re ready to go, so. We, we’re ready to go.
Counselor: Reno, this is really concerning me. Is he listening to you as you’re speaking on the phone?
“Reno”: No.
Counselor: Where is he right now?
“Reno”: He’s got some headphones on. He’s watching…
Counselor: What’s he doing?
“Reno”: He’s watching television now, he can’t hear any talk. I made sure of that.
Counselor: Yeah, I’m really concerned that he’s um, awake at this time of night. Um, the other organization that could most likely help you find accommodation and probably would be your best option would be ? Community Services, because they deal especially with children and families in crisis, and so they would definitely keep you together, they would probably actually put you in, normally they pay for a hotel or motel. A men’s shelter wouldn’t be the appropriate place to go with a child, definitely not. So, um, ? they give you, they have a lot of motels and hotels that they deal with, and put they in those instead of accommodation until they can find you permanent accommodation.
“Reno”: Okay.
Counselor: Like, normally they’d pay for a flat or something instead, they wouldnt, they don’t continue to keep you in a, you know, holding pattern in a hotel. Sometimes they make you stay for, like, two weeks in a hotel.
“Reno”: Mm.
Counselor: That would be a good option for you, wouldn’t it?
“Reno”: Yeah. And they wouldn’t let my wife know that, where I’m living? Staying?
Counselor: No, they wouldn’t do that.
“Reno”: ‘Cause she’s really violent. Really violent.
Counselor: They definitely wouldn’t. Um, they definitely wouldn’t let your wife know where you’re staying. I can help you with the phone call. I can introduce you, explain the situation, and see what they can do for you, if you’d like.
“Reno”: Hmm… Possibly, tha-, thank you. I think I might, actually what I might do is call the police now and then see how it goes in there.
Counselor: But your best option is calling the police and then asking to speak to a domestic violence officer.
“Reno”: Okay.
Counselor: They’re the ones that are the most specialized in this, so they deal with this day in and day out, and that’s probably stationed… Are you in area, in an open area? Are you in Melbourne, or are you in a town, or…?
“Reno”: Uh, I’m in Melbourne.
Counselor: Well, if you’re in Melbourne, most Melbourne police stations will have a domestic violence officer, and they specialize in domestic violence, and um, what you can get is to get a detective to come over, or a domestic violence officer, and say that you’d like to um, that you have um, fear of, um, harm of your wife who’s been abusing you. And what they’ll do is, they might um, even try and get an AVO so that she has to move out of the house and you guys can stay in the house.
“Reno”: Mm.
Counselor: They’ll try probably to do that so that you and the child can stay there. Or um, if you move, they’ll um, it would be, that she can’t actually have legal contact with you.
“Reno”: Yeah… No, we have to actually get away from her, we can’t stay here. So there’s nowh-, there’s no um, women’s shelter I could stay in, we could stay in tonight?
Counselor: Well, women’s, women’s shelter’s don’t take men.
“Reno”: They don’t take men.
Counselor: Why don’t you ring men’s lines? They would be able to tell you where you can go. Why don’t you ring the men’s line? Do you want me to connect you through to the men’s line? They deal with men. Men and women’s shelters are two totally different issues. Why do you want to go [to] a women’s shelter?
“Reno”: I just need somewhere where I can just get away from her, somewhere whe-
Counselor: Yeah, but why wouldn’t you, why wouldn’t you wanna go? Why aren’t you accepting this offer that ? will pay for hotel accommodations for you and your son?
“Reno”: Oh, because I…
Counselor: Why do you…
“Reno: Because I need to get out now.
Counselor: Yeah, but they would organize it now, they’ll probably organize someone to come and get you now. People work 24/7.
“Reno”: Oh, okay. I didn’t know what. Okay.
Counselor: ? Services work 24/7, or do you want me to put you through to your local um, police station and explain it to the domestic violence officer so that I can introduce you and explain your situation and see how they can help you?
“Reno”: No, I’ll, I’ll give them a call myself. Okay, thanks.
Counselor: Are you sure?
“Reno”: Absolutely.
Counselor: I’m happy to do it, Reno. I’m very concerned about your son.
“Reno”: No, that, that’s okay. I, I’ll go now.
FYI, folks, the reason I keep fucking up the quotes and being inconsistent with the way I quote people is that this process of sobering up sometimes makes it hard to focus properly. That’s because my means of sobering up involves blasting loud music into my ears.
@Mine Fujiko
I appreciate it. I actually do live in the Bay Area – San Jose, in particular. I’m at least grateful that the Billy DeFrank LGBT center is awesome here.
oops, I totally derailed. I thought I was in another thread for a minute there…
“What LBT said is sort of what I’m thinking – what about retro men’s shirts? I went through a phase a few years back of buying men’s 1970s shirts (while I could still fit into ‘em, hrrumph). They’re more feminine-looking than most current menswear but still coded male – would that be an acceptable/comfortable compromise for the moment?”
Retro men’s shirts? Not a bad idea if it weren’t for the fact that they are specifically coded masculine despite perhaps looking relatively more femme.
“I’m much more partial to loose/baggy clothes.”
That answers that question! Though getting size choices is going to be tricky at thrift stores anyway (the thing you want is usually too damn small in my experience), a bigger size of shirt might do the trick. I don’t like tight clothes either, unless we’re talking tee-shirts-cum-underwear.
Actually tee shirts are a good way to slide into wearing women’s gear. It’s not so much the cut, if you’re looking for a loose style, as the decoration and possibly the neckline (and men’s tees often enough have V-necks anyway).
I have only been to San Jose twice for a convention. I thought it was a nice city :D. I’m in Sacramento, not too far away. I know my city does not have fancy high-end shops, but we seriously have great thrifting! If I could make my could make my city popular, I would tell more people to come to the costume boutiques 🙂
@Aaliyah
This may not help with the paranoia, but possibly with relative snooping.
One of my great-grandfather’s lesser acts of dickery was snooping through the post. Everybody’s post. One of my great-aunts, fed up with this, sent a letter to herself, and when he went through it it just said “nosy”. He was very embarrassed and never pulled that one again.
You could probably do something similar with a big, inviting package (wrap an old cereal box or bundle of newspaper in packaging).
Aaaliya: are you going for a sort of Jenny Shimizu thing?
“Retro men’s shirts? Not a bad idea if it weren’t for the fact that they are specifically coded masculine despite perhaps looking relatively more femme.”
Ah, my mistake, sorry! I wasn’t sure if you needed to get right out of stuff that’s coded masculine, or would want things that still have a sort of camoflague ambiguity. That sort of kills retro women’s shirts, too – they’re fairly tight cut and the sizes tend to be small, so it wouldn’t be comfortable. (Unless you’re having an 80s moment … noooo, say it isn’t so, do not go to the shoulder pads and Ken Done knitwear, pleeeeeease!)
😉
@ Mine Fujiko
Don’t tell the MRA crowd that kids cost money, it might shatter their world view!
–
My bed is suggesting some sleep by being comfortable, so I’ll do that.
@Aalyiah, I hope you’ll find a solution you’re comfortable with and that things will look up for you soon!
@Kitteh, wrong thread, but too tired, lovely picture!
@LBT wrong thread as well, want to second the compliments on catitude!
As always, my compliments to the hosts and their lovely lovely cyber-home, it’s been a pleasure!
Have a good night/lovely evening/day, depening on where on the world you sneak around!
Good night tomBcat! 😀 Have a happy sleep.
Thank you, TomBcat – niters, sleep well! 🙂
Jenny Shimizu’s style won’t do for me as I want long hair and, while I want to look tomboyish,
I’m basically aiming for femme tomboyish, if that makes any sense.
“Ah, my mistake, sorry! I wasn’t sure if you needed to get right out of stuff that’s coded masculine, or would want things that still have a sort of camoflague ambiguity. That sort of kills retro women’s shirts, too – they’re fairly tight cut and the sizes tend to be small, so it wouldn’t be comfortable. (Unless you’re having an 80s moment … noooo, say it isn’t so, do not go to the shoulder pads and Ken Done knitwear, pleeeeeease!)”
No worries! Ambiguity is important to me, of course, as I don’t want to run into trouble yet I still want to be more femme. I just don’t like the idea of doing that by wearing men’s clothes.
As for finding a solution; I already have that planned out. I’m still training to become a web designer so that I can try to get myself a decent job that will allow me to move out either by myself or with my brother.
@Aaliyah:
In your ideal world, what would your clothing and accessory staples be? That question helps me a lot. Like with me, I like leggings, dresses and vintage jewelry :).
RE: Aaliyah
Are you familiar with the butchmtf tumblr? I think they’ve had clothes up for grabs in the past, so that might be handy for you…
And yeah, I hear you on your family situation. I’m currently living in a closet because I find that preferable to returning to my family. (Hell, I’d find living on the street preferable to returning to my family.)
Aaliyah — idk if it’d suit you style wise, or go over well with your family, but clothing for goth boys is rather girly (like, I think the pants are the same except girly ones are more towards pink). If not, check out hipster fashion — the scarves and whatnot namely.
As for shipping, can you get it sent to a friend’s house? And storage, under the bed maybe? (Ikea makes proper under the bed storage for things like out of season clothing, no reason it couldn’t function for other clothing!)
Aaaliyah, that makes perfect sense, and I like Mine Fujiko’s question. I do know some tomboy femmes, but they do wear makeup. Have you thought of that?
Please tell me to back the eff off if my questions are too much.
Hmmm. ::rubs chin::
Would things like women’s tees or cargo pants or hoodies work? They’d be easy enough to get away with, but not particularly feminine, or at least they don’t look it to me, so I don’t know how much help they’d be.
That sounds nice. I mean, if they look really butch, then I’m not for it, but otherwise I am for it.
I also wanted to try wearing some women’s shirts that look kind of loose and expose much of the shoulders. Like they have big necklines such that you can see the person’s spaghetti strap or something. I’m woefully unfamiliar with fashion terms but please bear with me. Does anyone here know what they’re called?
Boatnecks.
Argenti, the goth style is pretty nice in my view. But I feel like, by wearing those clothes, I’m being some kind of poser. The 15-year-old in me may be too insecure to wear such clothes comfortably – if that makes any sense.
“Aaaliyah, that makes perfect sense, and I like Mine Fujiko’s question. I do know some tomboy femmes, but they do wear makeup. Have you thought of that?”
I want to wear makeup – but mostly to make my beard shadow less obvious. I might try lipstick, but that’s unlikely. Don’t know what else constitutes makeup so that’s all I have to say regarding makeup.
It’s not a tee, but would this sort of boat neck top/sweater/whatever it is be the sort of thing you’d like?
http://imgs.inkfrog.com/pix/ljc2009/686.jpg
This page has advice for how to use makeup to hide a beard shadow:
http://www.cosplay.com/archive/index.php/t-119440.html
“As for shipping, can you get it sent to a friend’s house? And storage, under the bed maybe? (Ikea makes proper under the bed storage for things like out of season clothing, no reason it couldn’t function for other clothing!)”
I hope I’m not sounding like I want to start a pity party by saying this, but the only close IRL friends I have are family members. And where I live, those family members happen to live with me (including my brother, who’s an ally of mine). So I’m afraid your suggestion is out of the question.