The regulars at PUAhate.com – we’ve met them before — are a strange and bitter bunch. Most seem to be self-loathing so-called “incels” who blame their lack of romantic and sexual success on their average or below-average looks. Rejecting the basic premise of the pickup artist crowd – that average guys can transform themselves into suave lotharios by mastering manipulative pickup formulas – the PUAhate regulars tend to be true believers in what they somewhat pretentiously call “looks theory,” the odd and obviously untrue notion that women only date men with “male model” looks.
As one PUAhater put it recently:
PUA makes you think that all your problems are because of your personality/behaviour – i.e. things you can control. So when you keep failing, it means that YOU are fucking up and doing things wrong
the reality is that many of us just lost the genetic lottery. we are ugly, the wrong race, the wrong height etc, and that fucked us up. there is NOTHING we can do about it
So, naturally, the PUAhaters spend a lot of their time jealous of tall, good-looking men for their supposed monopoly on the women of the world — whom they also hate.
But the strange thing is that the PUAhaters pretty much hate everyone else as well. They get angry when guys they consider ugly score “hot chicks.” They get angry when guys who are good-looking but not male models get attention from “really hot girls.” And so on, and so on, and so on.
Indeed, many of the regulars seem to walk around in a perpetual state of rage, angry at each and every man who’s managed to pair up with a woman, not to mention the women as well.
One regular recently described his “day from hell” to his comrades:
To start the day I saw a couple where it was an average White guy with an OBESE Asian girl. They were walking around acting like they were trying to prove shit. LMAO. I wanted to kick the guy in the fucking nuts for dating that landwhale. If you’re going to use the racial advantage, at least date a girl who is under 300lbs. Later I go to the gym and see the same tall guys I usually do. Even if I had a good face, how the fuck do you compete with guys who are fucking 6’4”?
Then at the gym there’s this good looking White guy there talking to this Asian dude about how Asian girls are easy and how they approach him. To make things worse after that these fucking frat douchebags come in with their girlfriends to show off . Then to cap off the day a girl I used to know from freshman year walks right past me without even saying anything. I used to fucking live next door to this bitch and now she doesn’t even say anything and acts like a pretentious cunt. She’s an Indian girl dating a White dude lmao. Days like today make you wonder why you even still try in the first place.
Of course, as I’ve mentioned before, most of those posting on PUAhate don’t actually seem to be ugly by anyone’s standards but their own, at least judging from the pictures of themselves they sometimes post to the site, which reveal them to be mostly average-looking guys, with some of the regulars even quite conventionally handsome.
But evidently they would rather believe that they have “lost the genetic lottery” rather than face a more obvious explanation for why the girls don’t like them: because they’re shallow, self-obsessed assholes who hate themselves and hate women and radiate their bitterness from every pore. (And some are even creepier than this, like this pedophile – sorry, ephebophile – who’s angry at me personally because unlike him I don’t chase after 15-year-olds. Link NSFW.)
The PUAhaters often talk about getting surgeries to “correct” their supposed genetic flaws. They would do far better to spend that money on therapy.
Hello, I finally got wordpress to work on my phone as my computer isn’t working
. I haven’t read the whole thread yet, but in the topic of bananas, my favorite banana dish is one ingredient ice cream …
@argenti aertheri
So sorry 🙁 You actually have told me gender neutral pronouns before, so it was double my fault. (once for using them, twice for having forgotten)
blah. I’m rambly today. Anyhows sorry, you shouldn’t have to remind me all the time.
Ok, caught up!
The guy on the gym is this — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Collier_Township_shooting
“Its when terms like male privilege imply that all males have things easier. In my view anyone who doesn’t conform or wish to be their stereotype in society has it hard. Males who aren’t big, strong, competent and confident are hardly in a privileged position.”
The comment Marie referenced was towards the top of the last page, and discussed that. After Virgil x2 and Jaro I’m feeling generous on the 101 level stuff, take the answers offered to your implied questions.
Argenti have you read the journal?
http://i.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2009/images/08/05/sodini.pdf
Yes. Yes they are. Even the smallest, weakest, most incompetent and insecure male still benefits from male privilege.
There’s plenty of reading out there for you to find, and it’s really really not in any way difficult to locate. You earn a justified side eye from feminists on sites like this when you come and make statements like the above which demonstrate unambiguously that you’ve not educated yourself on the issue first.
http://www.amptoons.com/blog/the-male-privilege-checklist/
http://finallyfeminism101.wordpress.com/2007/03/11/faq-what-is-male-privilege/
Oh, trigger warning on the above link!
No problem Marie, like I said, it really only bothers me if it’s obviously intentional or trolling!
Melody — I was quoting Fade, but yes, that’s the one.
Jones — fucking fuck, I’m sorry.
@Jones No one deserves that shit and I’m sorry you had to experience it. My sympathies
@Argenti Aertheri
Thank you for looking up that.
*tries to remember why I referenced it*
oh, yeas. My point was… (about the male-privilege doubting troll) male privilege also creates male ENTITLEMENT.
And that case was a fine example of that. I have seen lots of examples of crimes of guys commiting against girls because they believe they are owed something by all girls… but I have never seen a girl commit a crime against guys because she thinks she is owed something by all guys.
Because guys generally are socialized to think that they deserve a chance (in terms of dating, gah, you know that “He’s a nice guy, give him a chance”/”women won’t give me a chance when I approach them and call me creep*) thing. Even in mainstream (Aka, non MRA stuff) comments, I have seen guys whinging on about how girls have unreasonably high standards and are looking for Mr Perfect, yet they also take for granted that they want an unreasonably attractive women to date them/ one who compromises in ways they wouldn’t**
*I always hated MRAs saying creep is a shaming word, because for me, creep is a word people who aren’t very articulate about their boundaries can use to express their boundaries. Like… it’s something I’d have used before I got into feminism to express when guys are bugging me and I can’t exactly identify why… in ways that I now can recognize are boundary crossing.
**Diogenes the WHY DON”T LADIES ALL SHAVE DOWN THERE cynic. Also, all those guys who say “if a girl keeps her last name in marriage, we know who wears the pants in a relationship” when it’s just PERFECT EQUALITY.
… This was kind of stream of consciousness. But I hope I was semi-coherent.
It’s like a video game – having privilige puts you on an easier setting. Even ‘easy’ setting poses a small challenge, just not as much as ‘normal’, ‘hard’, ‘sweet taste of death’, or ‘why do you hate yourself’ mode would do.
oops, also thank you Melody, whose link I didn’t notice. 😛
Totally OT question: anyone here with physical problems do tai chi?
Yes, I’ve been mistaken as First Nations, when I’m not mistaken as Italian. Its understandable really, my great grandmother is *supposedly* First Nation and when I live near areas with a high concentration of First Nations people that tiny bit of genetic heritage seems to get recognized. I’ll take a few tasteless wop jokes over the treatment I get from other white people who live near reservations any day.
I say supposedly, because no one in my family knows which band or even nation my great grandmother came from. It could be because of government policies of stripping native women of their heritage and forcing children into schools that horribly abused them. Or, more likely, “native” heritage is code for our family needs to feel we have every right to be here, or its also code for “someone married a black person and that needs to be hidden”. I don’t know, and never will short of a genetic test. Her history, hell her entire life is lost to the family because hey, she was just a woman living in a very abusive and misogenistic family. I don’t think anyone even knows her name.
This is the rule of thumb I go by: unzip your pants and look at your ass. Is it lilly white? Then don’t claim to be First Nation. Especially if what you know of the culture can fit into a thimble and leave plenty of room to spare.
@kittehs
I don’t do it but am curious and nosy *is curious and nosy*
I’ve gotten recommendations from doctors to do something low stress like yoga, but I don’t want to do that and am nosy nosy nosy if you do not mind plz tell me more 😀
/sorry for all the needy-ness.
I did, for a bit.
Nothing severe though, just recovery after broken bones (And not important, significantly weight bearing and crippling ones). Worked well for that minor issue though, and it was fun. But it was follow up from 8 years of various martial arts, so your mileage may vary significantly. I would recommend it, however. Very gentle and easy.
@augochlorella Thanks for that link, it’s going on my send to everyone I know list, because it’s brilliant. The opening is a really elegant statement of the issue, in a way that I’d observed happening before but never put it so succinctly and clearly.
So, of course, I hate him. But in a good way!
Especially the part about what I am going to refer to as the ‘avoidance fiddle’ from now on!
Ooh! I do not do Tai Chi* I have been thinking about asking my karate instructor if he’d think it’d be a good match for me, though.
*I do karate, but I cannot do it very often due to … physical problems. 😛
Um, so sorry if this wasn’t help, but it has been something I’ve considered doing.
@kittehs
that last comment I made may have come across really wrong…so um, basically if you’d like to share your experience with tai-chi and pain I’d be all ears 😀
I love yoga. It saved my life.
@Fade.
So True, this:
“Because guys generally are socialized to think that they deserve a chance (in terms of dating, gah, you know that “He’s a nice guy, give him a chance”/”women won’t give me a chance when I approach them and call me creep*) thing. Even in mainstream (Aka, non MRA stuff) comments, I have seen guys whinging on about how girls have unreasonably high standards and are looking for Mr Perfect, yet they also take for granted that they want an unreasonably attractive women to date them/ one who compromises in ways they wouldn’t**”
Thanks everyone who’s answered so far!
My psych suggested I do yoga for stress relief the other day. Now I’m not wild about yoga. First, I simply can’t get to classes: I have eleven-hour days as it is and there’s simply nothing near home for the weekends (plus sacrificing chunks of weekend is not attractive). So, it’d be at home with a dvd, and that says Potential To Hurt Self to me. Second, it’s just not an exercise that appeals, partly because breathing exercises do me more harm than good: they end up triggering air hunger or asthma.
I was asking my osteopath about it last night and she mentioned tai chi. Now I’d thought about it ages ago and never pursued it, but I’m reminded that it’s used a lot by people with arthritis, or who are generally not fit, or older people, or people with fibromyalgia (that made me prick up my ears after the recent conversations here). I’m looking for something relaxing and gentle that’s not going to fuck my knee (for which I have to get an MRI done). I also think tai chi has less potential for damage, and being done standing up is more appealing than something I have to do lying down (stuffed if I’m buying an exercise mat, I’ve more than enough junk in my house).
@shiraz
yeah, sorry if that made it sound like I thought yoga was really bad, I just have a thing against it cuz all the doctors keep suggesting it as something I should do when I don’t want to so… yeah, I just don’t like how everyone’s trying to force me into it.
Marie, no, it didn’t come across all wrong at all! I’m perfectly happy to answer questions and I thought it was funny – bonus. 🙂
Melody, just finished it and fuck, I never realized where he worked…I was working for a law firm the next lock over, the other end of the triangle but fuck, too close for comfort…
I will confirm his much of his manifesto — law firm jobs in Pittsburgh are incredibly isolating, too damned tired to do anything besides work, eat, sleep, rinse and repeat. And I was in reception, I had normal enough hours.
@kittehs
well thanks for the info 🙂 Sorry that your knee is bad though 🙁 Hope it feels better soon.
Be warned for complete ignorance about tai chi coming up, this is based only on my knowledge of karate.
But some martial arts katas* do use lots of breathing exercises. Don’t really take this to mean much, since aforementioned ignorance on tai chi, it’s just something to ask about if you go in to talk to someone.