The regulars at PUAhate.com – we’ve met them before — are a strange and bitter bunch. Most seem to be self-loathing so-called “incels” who blame their lack of romantic and sexual success on their average or below-average looks. Rejecting the basic premise of the pickup artist crowd – that average guys can transform themselves into suave lotharios by mastering manipulative pickup formulas – the PUAhate regulars tend to be true believers in what they somewhat pretentiously call “looks theory,” the odd and obviously untrue notion that women only date men with “male model” looks.
As one PUAhater put it recently:
PUA makes you think that all your problems are because of your personality/behaviour – i.e. things you can control. So when you keep failing, it means that YOU are fucking up and doing things wrong
the reality is that many of us just lost the genetic lottery. we are ugly, the wrong race, the wrong height etc, and that fucked us up. there is NOTHING we can do about it
So, naturally, the PUAhaters spend a lot of their time jealous of tall, good-looking men for their supposed monopoly on the women of the world — whom they also hate.
But the strange thing is that the PUAhaters pretty much hate everyone else as well. They get angry when guys they consider ugly score “hot chicks.” They get angry when guys who are good-looking but not male models get attention from “really hot girls.” And so on, and so on, and so on.
Indeed, many of the regulars seem to walk around in a perpetual state of rage, angry at each and every man who’s managed to pair up with a woman, not to mention the women as well.
One regular recently described his “day from hell” to his comrades:
To start the day I saw a couple where it was an average White guy with an OBESE Asian girl. They were walking around acting like they were trying to prove shit. LMAO. I wanted to kick the guy in the fucking nuts for dating that landwhale. If you’re going to use the racial advantage, at least date a girl who is under 300lbs. Later I go to the gym and see the same tall guys I usually do. Even if I had a good face, how the fuck do you compete with guys who are fucking 6’4”?
Then at the gym there’s this good looking White guy there talking to this Asian dude about how Asian girls are easy and how they approach him. To make things worse after that these fucking frat douchebags come in with their girlfriends to show off . Then to cap off the day a girl I used to know from freshman year walks right past me without even saying anything. I used to fucking live next door to this bitch and now she doesn’t even say anything and acts like a pretentious cunt. She’s an Indian girl dating a White dude lmao. Days like today make you wonder why you even still try in the first place.
Of course, as I’ve mentioned before, most of those posting on PUAhate don’t actually seem to be ugly by anyone’s standards but their own, at least judging from the pictures of themselves they sometimes post to the site, which reveal them to be mostly average-looking guys, with some of the regulars even quite conventionally handsome.
But evidently they would rather believe that they have “lost the genetic lottery” rather than face a more obvious explanation for why the girls don’t like them: because they’re shallow, self-obsessed assholes who hate themselves and hate women and radiate their bitterness from every pore. (And some are even creepier than this, like this pedophile – sorry, ephebophile – who’s angry at me personally because unlike him I don’t chase after 15-year-olds. Link NSFW.)
The PUAhaters often talk about getting surgeries to “correct” their supposed genetic flaws. They would do far better to spend that money on therapy.
that’s what I did too 🙂 I actually have a long list of links on white privilege, partly for me (still haven’t read them all) and partly if I need to send them to anyone. But…if any trolls come on with that shpeil, I have links! 😀 /randomish.
“I think that comment was a dig at feminists and you thinking they blamed men for everything… but you also blamed society for men not being able to wear make up… so one would think you’d be able to understand feminists blaming society and the patriarchy for lots of the problems it addresses… It’s not blaming you, dude.”
It could be seen that way, the comment it was a response to was rather sarcastic in the first place though, so I’d say it was hardly uncalled for.
Its when terms like male privilege imply that all males have things easier. In my view anyone who doesn’t conform or wish to be their stereotype in society has it hard. Males who aren’t big, strong, competent and confident are hardly in a privileged position.
“the negative effects of patriarchy are not misandry.
the negative effects of patriarchy are not misandry.
the negative effects of patriarchy are not misandry.
Also, go back up to Argenti Aertheri’s post. She explained well to you. I don’t know where teh suicide thing comes from, but men go to prison more often because women are seen as weak and helpless. Even though it affects men negatively it women too, and like I said, the patriarchy does have negative effects on men, just not as many.”
I need to go back and find the post as I don’t think I read it properly :/
I don’t think, no, I know you didn’t read any of the helpful information you were given. You should go away and read it.
Shiraz: good choice!
@ItsAllAbout Prison, yes. And there are people here who know those statistics better than I do, maybe one of them will engage on that point.
But suicide, no. Men make up about three quarters of the completed suicides (primarily because of the fact that more men tend to choose firearms as their suicide method), however women attempt suicide at about twice the frequency of men, and there’s a sense by researchers who study the issue that those attempts are actually significantly underreported due to the stigma attached to suicide and the relative ease with which an attempted suicide can be ‘misdiagnosed’ by a compliant doctor seeking to spare the feelings of family members. It’s also relatively more difficult to argue that a self inflicted gunshot was an accident, while an overdose of pain or sleep medication, or a home accident can be more easily recast as an attempt at self harm.
Women are also much more likely to experience depression and anxiety that can predispose people to suicide, to the tune of three or four to one.
The WHO tracks a lot of that information worldwide, while the National Institutes of Mental Health and the American Federation for Suicide Prevention publish data on a regular basis tracking such issues.
That said, when we are talking about something so tragic, it’s hard to argue that anyone has it “better” than anyone else, and such thinking actually moves us further away from a meaningful discussion.
…
*ahem*
*attempts to untangle oneself from the ridiculousness of that statement.*
A) It does not matter what your opinion is. It matters what your opinion is if you’re trying to convince me that Darth Bane isn’t a Gary Stu* The trials of women due to sexism is NOT AN OPINION ISSUE.
B)Yes, men who do not conform to society have it hard. You wanna know who else who have it hard when they don’t conform to society? WOMEN. And they have to deal with sexism ONTOP of non conformity stuff.
*I mean, you’d still be wrong, but it’s technically an opinion matter. 😛
Also
You are wrong.
“I don’t know where teh suicide thing comes from, but men go to prison more often because women are seen as weak and helpless.”
You seem really sure about this. Got a citation to back it up?
male privilege doesn’t mean all men have easy lives, though I guess it does mean the last part of that, that men have less shit to deal with than women in terms of patriarchy. It doesn’t mean that because you’re a man you’re always going to get paid more than a woman, it’s just an average. It doesn’t mean that men don’t get objectified, just less often. It doesn’t mean that sex roles aren’t unfair to men, just that they are more unfair to women.
@ Jones
Wow. I’m sorry that happened to you. I hope things are okay for you now.
Oooh, one of the sulk artists has a username ‘it’s all about personality jk lollollol’!! I bet his is just the most winning of personalities. No neediness or entitlement there! Let’s clear this up for you, mr shining personality- it’s all about attraction. Some people have attractive personalities. Other people have attractive abs. More often people have some attractive qualities and some unattractive qualities. And people value those qualities differently. But if you don’t have qualities that people find attractive (or more often the people you are attracted to don’t reciprocate because why should you have sex with a girl you aren’t attracted to amIright) you don’t have sex. This is not a crime against humanity. People have lived long and happy lives without sex. You may be one of those people.
In the game Singularity, you travel to an abandoned Russian island (Kartago-12), and accidentally continue to mess up the space-time continuum, throwing everything into flux. Bits of history repeats itself, you get shunted between 2010 and 1955 erratically, and time itself seems to be breaking apart from its normally linear fashion of increasing entropy.
Spoiler alert, ending.
At the very end, you attempt to go back to the beginning of the game to prevent yourself from causing this entire mess in the first place (Hoping that the paradox thus induced will prevent the world from ending). So you see yourself rescuing a man from a burning building, and take the shot at yourself, that you remember from the prologue someone took at you… and the loop repeats itself. And so you’re stuck.
Reading this thread is sort of like that. It’s groundhog day all over again.
“You feminists know nothing”
“Look, here’s what we know”
“You feminist know nothing!”
“Look, here’s what we know, come on, read it”
“You feminists know nothing!”
“Look, here’s what we… argh!”
“You feminists know nothing”
“Renko! You have to stop yourself from rescuing Demichev, or we’ll never escape the time loop!”
“You feminists know nothing!”
… infinity.
Shiraz: I bet his citation is something like: Assfax, Itsallboutme Publications, 2013.
@jones
Sorry to hear that 🙁 internet hugs if you want them, that sounds horrible.
@gillian
Yeah, I feel strange talking about it. I mean, it’s a bad thing whoever it’s happening to, if/when I use it in arguments I feel…idk kind of sleezy.
@shiraz
you’re right, I don’t have a citation :/ Sorry. I think my brain ended up confusing effects of patriarchy with causes and it all got jarbled up. Don’t know if those go together 😉
Ok, the pain meds seem to be kicking in, because the fact that “Park” and “Clark” up there rhymed suddenly struck me as the funniest thing I’d seen all day…
“Males who aren’t big, strong, competent and confident are hardly in a privileged position.” Well there is a guy who failed to either research or comprehend the meaning of male privilege. You might not feel as privileged as your male counterparts but you still enjoy privilege for being a male. Ugh, off to feminism 101 with you.
Wow, that’s really fucked up. I’m sorry to hear that, and I hope you’re safe now.
Easier does not mean easy. Life’s hard. Some people get the short end of the stick because that’s just how the dice roll. I read a great article once on how being a white, able-bodied cis-gendered straight male was essentially like playing a game on ‘easy’. It’s still possible to lose, but it’s hella easier than playing as, say, a black, disabled trans* lesbian. Wish I still had the link.
Thing is, having privilege isn’t inherently a bad thing. It’s just… a thing. A thing you have to realize you have, so you don’t make an ass out of yourself when talking to people who don’t have that privilege. I, personally have white privilege. And sometimes, I fuck up and say stupid, privilege blind things and get called out on it. That’s when I shut up and learn.
You need to shut up and learn.
And it just keeps getting better and better!
(Which works both as a statement about that phrase as a work of art, and as a statement about the endless roll of WTF that’s come this way today…)
Article was John Scalzi, sci fri writer:
“http://whatever.scalzi.com/2012/05/15/straight-white-male-the-lowest-difficulty-setting-there-is/”
It’s an interesting read.
@Fibinachi
Thank you. Going to actually bookmark it this time.
Take a shower, post explodes again, typical.
Marie — gender neutral pronouns for me please — ze/zir (no worries, I only get pissed about this when it’s either clearly intentional, or then leads to stupid assumptions based on the gender assigned to me…trolls in other words)
pillow in hell — “native Canadian”…tell me you don’t mean First Nations people? Because fuck do they face honest to goodness racism
“that guy in the gym a while back… ugh, I don’t really want to remember it, but does anyone know what I’m talking about?”
Google Pittsburgh LA fitness shooting, I don’t remember his name, and am on mobile and it’s cranky, but I was living in the area at the time.
I think that’s likely, hellkell. 😉
Gillian, your killing me! I hope you feel better, though.
Jones, my sympathies.
I believe this is it. And it is a wonderful article. I’ve shown it to a few of my guy friends to try to get my point across.
And ninja’d.
Jones, get your story out there- if nothing else all this goddamn misogyny driven cyber stalking needs to be publicized.
@Argenti
Is this what you are thinking of:
http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/08/05/pennsylvania.gym.shooting/index.html