The regulars at PUAhate.com – we’ve met them before — are a strange and bitter bunch. Most seem to be self-loathing so-called “incels” who blame their lack of romantic and sexual success on their average or below-average looks. Rejecting the basic premise of the pickup artist crowd – that average guys can transform themselves into suave lotharios by mastering manipulative pickup formulas – the PUAhate regulars tend to be true believers in what they somewhat pretentiously call “looks theory,” the odd and obviously untrue notion that women only date men with “male model” looks.
As one PUAhater put it recently:
PUA makes you think that all your problems are because of your personality/behaviour – i.e. things you can control. So when you keep failing, it means that YOU are fucking up and doing things wrong
the reality is that many of us just lost the genetic lottery. we are ugly, the wrong race, the wrong height etc, and that fucked us up. there is NOTHING we can do about it
So, naturally, the PUAhaters spend a lot of their time jealous of tall, good-looking men for their supposed monopoly on the women of the world — whom they also hate.
But the strange thing is that the PUAhaters pretty much hate everyone else as well. They get angry when guys they consider ugly score “hot chicks.” They get angry when guys who are good-looking but not male models get attention from “really hot girls.” And so on, and so on, and so on.
Indeed, many of the regulars seem to walk around in a perpetual state of rage, angry at each and every man who’s managed to pair up with a woman, not to mention the women as well.
One regular recently described his “day from hell” to his comrades:
To start the day I saw a couple where it was an average White guy with an OBESE Asian girl. They were walking around acting like they were trying to prove shit. LMAO. I wanted to kick the guy in the fucking nuts for dating that landwhale. If you’re going to use the racial advantage, at least date a girl who is under 300lbs. Later I go to the gym and see the same tall guys I usually do. Even if I had a good face, how the fuck do you compete with guys who are fucking 6’4”?
Then at the gym there’s this good looking White guy there talking to this Asian dude about how Asian girls are easy and how they approach him. To make things worse after that these fucking frat douchebags come in with their girlfriends to show off . Then to cap off the day a girl I used to know from freshman year walks right past me without even saying anything. I used to fucking live next door to this bitch and now she doesn’t even say anything and acts like a pretentious cunt. She’s an Indian girl dating a White dude lmao. Days like today make you wonder why you even still try in the first place.
Of course, as I’ve mentioned before, most of those posting on PUAhate don’t actually seem to be ugly by anyone’s standards but their own, at least judging from the pictures of themselves they sometimes post to the site, which reveal them to be mostly average-looking guys, with some of the regulars even quite conventionally handsome.
But evidently they would rather believe that they have “lost the genetic lottery” rather than face a more obvious explanation for why the girls don’t like them: because they’re shallow, self-obsessed assholes who hate themselves and hate women and radiate their bitterness from every pore. (And some are even creepier than this, like this pedophile – sorry, ephebophile – who’s angry at me personally because unlike him I don’t chase after 15-year-olds. Link NSFW.)
The PUAhaters often talk about getting surgeries to “correct” their supposed genetic flaws. They would do far better to spend that money on therapy.
For some drink competition, my Dad made a drink based off of bananas foster. He called it the flaming ass monkey. It consisted of banana liqueur, creme de caramel, and 150 proof rum. It was garnished with a maraschino cherry cut so as to look like a sphincter and then the whole drink was set on fire.
“Not all that much, far as I can tell. But you don’t have to be viewed as a sex object, so I’m still saying it’s better for men.”
So when I was once told that ‘I would definitely get it’ by a gay man that wasn’t being objectified at all? Or when a group of teenage girls giggled as I walked past after one of them said ‘mmm yummy’ while staring at me, that wasn’t objectifying me? Now I wasn’t actually offended by either of these instances, I just felt a little uncomfortable, but its not something that no men ever experience. As you said with rape as well, men can also be victims.
“Ways you don’t notice if you benefit from it: when a man is promoted/hired over a woman while assuming to be more qualified.”
Again its not unreasonable to think this also happens the other way around. Its very hard to prove how much this happens either way.
“On men over represented in prisons, in the US (where I live) a lot of them are in there because they’re black men, not just men. So that’s not so much as patriarchy but racism. :/”
Yes black people are over represented in prisons too. But men are still over represented compared to women, black or not.
“I don’t think the patriarchy benefits men all that much. I just think it’s a heck a lot nicer on straight, cis, men than women.”
This is where I really disagree, I think the system fucks over everyone who doesn’t conform to exactly what is preferred by society.
@cloudiah
Thank you so much for introducing me to the one and only Hutzler 571 Banana Slicer. I’ll name my firstborn after you,
But Cami, are you familiar with Tuscan Whole MIlk? http://www.amazon.com/Tuscan-Whole-Milk-Gallon-128/product-reviews/B00032G1S0/ref=cm_cr_dp_see_all_summary?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1
HI Kitteh,
Yes, I can recall the scene, but not the episode.
Yes, that is the quote. My old grey cells had changed it… bummer.
Thanks Falconer.
You were, it’s just not something you have to deal with as often. Unless we need to actually start explaining how women are objectified. These aren’t ‘things that happen only to women’ they are things that happen more often to women. Count the number of times womens bodies/ implied sex with women is used to sell/ advertise something as with men.
….it’s like you’ve never heard of the glass ceiling. link on it: http://feministdisney.tumblr.com/post/8568399087/chart-of-the-day-depressing-pay-gap-statistic
source it at the bottom.
Part of that’s because men commit more crimes. If you compare the length of sentences between white and black men for the same crimes you’ll see black men get more. Same on # of people in new york who get stopped and frisked by police. I can’t find any quick bookmarks on this, so if anyone else has a source handy that’ be nice.
…so, do you think, or do you not think, the system is worse on trans* people than cis people?
Do you think it is the same to men and women?
Do you think racism isn’t a problem anymore?
Do you think it’s just as hard in the patriarchy to be straight as gay?
because that’s what you made it sound like. idk if it’s what you mean, which is why I’m asking.
Or perhaps you need some audio cables: http://www.amazon.com/AudioQuest-K2-Terminated-Speaker-Cable/dp/B000J36XR2
This new troll’s gonna be tedious. Ha, gonna be? He already is.
Yet another young man who is blind to his privilege, but comes here to wank about how he can’t get a date. There must be a factory somewhere.
Luckily I’ve got some feminism 101 stuff bookmarked (not that I think he’ll read it :/). Sadly I can’t find much of it though 🙁 Curse you, unorganized bookmarks!
New troll? I thought that this personality guy was just the Ross Jeffers guy from earlier, after being unable to prove that he was actually Ross Jeffers.
I was looking at this (using fuckyeahhardfemmes to clear my mind): http://divalocity.tumblr.com/post/45732635074/aladylikeme-so-proud-of-my-friend-bee
And I often think how awesome it would be to *for no particular reason* privilege the opposite group to expected in various types of media. For, say, a year. A tiny amount of models being white, a far smaller amount of movies centering a mostly-male cast.
Obviously this would be impossible, but I feel like social conservatives attempt to tie liberals up in the “we’re not trying to SWAP oppressors, for fuck’s sake” argument; because we’re not. Women “ruling the world” would not stop wars. WTF? But for the majority get a feel for what it’s really like to be a minority, 24/7/52, and fucking suck it up because, because, because.
Even if there was a way to do that with all modern media (haha, ignoring the internet!), it wouldn’t change the discourse that like waves against rock reinforces again and again and again our expectations. But it’s a nice thought.
I have a vague recollection of reading the scene in one of the novels – someone saying something about the Doctor’s big nose, or some such, and the Doctor being a bit miffed about it.
Speaking of old grey brain cells! 😀
Oh look, a man was ONCE told he was yummy by a group of youner girls, and ONCE hit on by a gay man!! Its totally like the bullshit I and other women deal with on a daily basis of being groped, pinched, told explicitly what men thirty years older than us want to do when we are nine, eleven, thirteen, ealuated on our boner inducing ability just because we’re walking down the street to work.
It isn’t just that objectification happens more to women, its heads and tails above what generally happens to men, and far, far more explicit. And its everywhere and its encouraged to treat women In this way.
“A long-shanked knave with a mighty nose.”
From “The Time Warrior”. Just rewatched it the other day
Wouldn’t it be nice if the software could analyze our comments and on recognizing a feminism 101 question or statement just redirect the poster to http://www.feminism101.com/, instead of posting the comment?
*awkward laugh* um, I can kill two birds with one stone here:
How’s patriarchy hurt men?
How rape culture hurts male rape victims?
Some basic premises here: the feminine is lesser, wrong, bad, weak; the masculine is better, correct, good, strong; this is, if you put a tiny bit of thought into it, a false dichotomy, but it’s important for the rest of this. Because the logical next step of this thought is that men who act like women are “doing manhood wrong” or unmasculine, or, gods forbid, girly. Meanwhile women are shamed for being insuffiecently girly — body hair, short hair, etc.
More important, currently, are the ways men are shamed for “not being manly enough”, like, idk, not having a hot enough girlfriend or sex often enough, not having typical manly looks, the “men don’t wear make up” mentioned earlier (high heels, damnit, high heels)
And yes, there’s heaps of misogyny, trans* misogyny, transphobia, and homophobia mixed in there, but it’s not relevant, this will get epically long if I give a full bigotry 101 lesson. Because explaining that all will cause the longest (non-math) comment ever, I’m going to stick with binary gender roles and heterosexual relationships. Sorry guys.
Anyways! The answer to how patriarchy hurts men should be fairly obvious at this point — the thought that you have to be sufficiently manly, and are a failure if you aren’t? Yeah, that’s patriarchal “women are lesser, don’t act like one” at work. And as for male rape victims, it’s assumed that women get raped that being raped is something that happens to women, and only women, so when it happens to a man, he’s seen as weak (or at least fears he will be).
And that’s not touching that plenty of people don’t even think men can be raped, because they’re supposed to be strong enough to prevent it. That women aren’t sexual and aren’t capable of rape (there’s about three levels of fucked in that). And, of course, that if the rapist is male, then the victim must be gay, and homophobia.
@joanimal
yes it would. Didn’t know there was a site for that 😉
Ah HAH! So Looksie Lou was a sockie, just not the one we thought he was. Sad, really. Who gets kicked around, has a hissie fit and gets banned, and then says, “Wow, that was so much fun that I’m gonna make up a new name and go back for more!”
I still think it would be nice to have some fresh trolls.
Thank you Sir Bodsworth Rugglesby III. My elderly grey cells are now less maligned. 😉
@Baroncognito
Maybe I could use yours as a middle name?
@ItsAllAboutPersonalityJKlolololol
I think having more men in prision also has to do with…wait for it…patriarchy!
BTW: http://finallyfeminism101.wordpress.com/2007/10/18/phmt-argument/
Sir Bodsworth, you have saved me from hours of trying to remember where that came from!
“This new troll’s gonna be tedious. Ha, gonna be? He already is.
Yet another young man who is blind to his privilege, but comes here to wank about how he can’t get a date. There must be a factory somewhere.”
Don’t worry, I’ll just leave. Its evident I’m not in the slightest bit welcome to discuss anything here.
Thanks to those who treated me as another human rather than as a male.
ffs, noone was treating you badly because you are a male, but because of your content. (and really? all anyone said was that you seemed like a troll.) I’ve tried to engage with you in good faith, but that line was ridiculous >:/ Nobody owes you answers, and this isn’t a feminist 101 site.
Aw, honey, were we not making it all about you? Trust me, it’s not because you’re a man.
*Flounce*
End scene!