There’s one kind of person you meet again and again in the manosphere: the man who hates women, but insists that he’s not a misogynist. Some of them will even tell you that you calling them a misogynist is equivalent to a white person calling a black person the n-word. And they seem to even believe this.
You may find yourself wondering: how is it that a person who clearly hates women, who says hateful things about them constantly, who spends all his time reading blogs and message boards devoted to the notion that women are evil bitches — how is it that such a person can come to believe that they aren’t a woman-hater?
Well, you’re in luck, because not that long ago one of these fellows gave us a glimpse into the mysterious inner workings of the mind of the misogynist who thinks he’s not a misogynist.
In a post on the Men’s Rights subreddit he titled “Next time someone calls you a misogynist,” cabin5 unpacked all his weird rationalizations and laid them out for everyone to see.
This is long, but worth reading. It’s very revealing. And also sort of hilarious, both in its total lack of awareness and in its garden-variety ignorance and stupidity.
Uh, dude, one part of the definition of “hatred” is “extreme aversion.” Which is also one definition of, you guessed it, repulsion. If you’re repulsedby women — or at least by “the modern, confrontational, American toxic female” — it’s safe to say that yes, indeed, you hate women, or at least the vast majority of the women that you meet on an everyday basis here in the US. Also, if you post in the Men’s Rights subreddit, and regularly use phrases like “the modern, confrontational, American toxic female,” it’s pretty much like having the words “I hate women” tattooed on your forehead.
Elsewhere in the thread he offers further insights into these terrible American “females.”
Western women tend to be butch & mannish- you would have to be practically homosexual to be attracted to one. I’m not homosexual. And they’re like crappy zerox copies of men without any of the positive qualities. …
Possibly the most repulsive things would be their complete unaccountability & the fact that on average, they’re venerally diseased whores who’ve had 57 cocks in them by the age of 25. Would you want your child coming out of that vagina? It’s nauseating.
Dude, I don’t want your child coming out of any vagina. Also, it’s “xerox.”
These are all the thoughts of a grown ass man — who claims to have a daughter over the age of 18 — who honestly thinks he’s somehow not a misogynist.
The less English they speak the better, am I right, guys? Right? Just chatter on, pretty Consuela! Salsa mexicana tostatada!
But no, I’m sure he means that he’s learning or knows Spanish himself and he wants to show his ‘Latino’ friend how much he likes and respects her and wants her to feel completely comfortable expressing herself in her native tongue, so as not to be underestimated or misunderstood in broken English.
There’s just so much love for half of humanity in his writing. It’s bringing tears to my eyes.
I’m repulsed by people who kill kittens for fun but I don’t hate them….totally different.
I wish someone would explain what it is American/Western women supposedly do (and non-American/non-Western women don’t do) that makes them (us?) so “butch” and “mannish.” I personally am rather unfeminine, but when I’m out and about, most of the women I see are wearing makeup and jewelry and have carefully styled hair.
Heh. He loves Latina women. Oh Cabin5, let’s go out. I’m sure you’ll love my spicy-yet-submissive Latina charms.
*hurk*
Dude, you fucking HATE women. And not just American women. ALL WOMEN. You want a “partner” (and that’s so not the word to use in this instance) who is literally unable to verbally communicate with you. YOU HATE WOMEN.
I would seriously like to know what they consider to be misogynistic. They always say “Not all of us are misogynists!” but then can’t even name anyone they think is misogynistic. Because apparently even Paul “Rape Victims Deserve It” Elam doesn’t count
Also, notice that one sentence where he uses the words “men” and then “females” in the same breath.
But… We Latin American women are American, too!
(It’s not the point, I know, but I hust hate when people refer to the US as America.)
Crumbelievable: Of course it’s not misogyny to say women deserve to be raped. Sex is what they’re for. If they don’t understand that, then it’s practically a public service to show them how little their consent matters. Everyone will be happier for it in the long run.
I really do think that a lot of misogynists think like that. They have such contempt for anyone unlike them that they don’t really think we deserve rights at all. And that’s how they can claim not to hate us: they can imagine something that looks like a woman that they don’t hate, and they think that counts. What they hate is our personhood.
just*
This whole thing leaves me speechless…
On a completely different subject, my uncle is a screenwriter and I was talking to him today about what he writes and I asked him whether his scripts pass the Bechdel test at all.
He said that his usually do and that me makes an effort to write interesting female characters who are important to the plot. However what frequently happens is that once his scripts pass out of his hands they are often changed and edited by producers and directors and all to often they end up not passing the test after they’ve been tinkered with.
Which is rather depressing if you think about it. Makes you wonder how many films and TV series have had scenes and dialogue just between women removed and had good well rounded female characters watered down.
Paul Elam doesn’t hate women! He just thinks that narcissistic bi***es who get drinks from men and yet refuse to consent to sex are begging to be raped. How is that misogynistic?
But srsly, it’s always fun watching misogynists try to wriggle and squirm their way out of the charge. The view from the inside is something truly strange and glorious to behold.
Refreshingly, the post doesn’t have many upvotes, and the top comment thread on the post is someone cross-examining cabin5’s views, with cabin5’s posts receiving oodles of downvotes. Of course, the few times I’ve actually tried to call out misogyny on r/mensrights, I’ve met with little success and a lot of pushback, so it’s not exactly becoming a feminist haven any time soon.
@laisa
When my grandmother was a young woman, she and a girlfriend wanted to go to a party at a US naval base, which was “American only”. At the gate, the guard asked if they were American, and she said yes, and he waved them through. After they were a good distance away, they turned around and yelled back “SOUTH AMERICAN!”.
@Nepenthe Your grandmother is my new hero! 😀
@Historophilia
If it makes you feel any better, Johanna Blakley has a TED Talk, “Social Media and the End of Gender,” in which she claims that the since social media challenges demographics as a system for categorizing and “understanding” (laugh) audiences, that might change.
I think she is a little blind to the amount of misogyny that goes into these decisions and how very long that may take to change, but any hope is nice, right?
(If you have Netflix Instant and want to check it out, it is #14 in “For All of Womankind”. Barf to the title of that IMO.)
Latina woman, white guy, best song:
“LatinO women?” Masculine? I don’t know if he means what I’m picturing right now.
Ending a word with a feminine a is misandry.
“they[’ve]… had 57 cocks in them by the age of 25.”
Dude, you would not believe how many hands they’ve shaken by age 25, either, and do you know where those other hands have been? Would you want those skank hands holding your infant manchild?
Hang on, let’s do some math here.
If she waited until she turned 18 to start having sex, then that 57 different sex partners in 7 years, or roughly 8 per year. That’s less than one per month. I’m sure if you told these guys they had to wait six weeks before banging a new woman, they would consider that horrible misandry.
I wonder what scientific method he used to come up with such a precise number? 57 cocks, and none of them his. Really, that’s the problem, amirite?
Asshole.
And, by the by, if you’ve had more than one vagina, does that make you a venerally [sic] diseased whore as well?
Hypocritical asshole.
We survived the apocalypse, I see. Well done, Doctor! You saved the Earth once again.
It’s very simple: unless you’re prepared to sign off on the statement “I hate women” then you don’t hate women. You may display every sign of hating women, but until you publicly agree to those three words you just aren’t a misogynist.
Those are the rules, just accept it.
It’s not a typo. Cabin5 was referring to the diseases brought back by the Soviet Venera probes:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venera
Stupid sexy cosmonauts!
Well, clearly – if it quacks like a duck, moves like a duck, looks like a duck, displays behavior patterns associated with Anatidae, tests positive on DNA tests in relation to genetic composition for duckiness… Well, gentlemen and gentleladies and gentleothers, it’s clearly a potato.
Yep. Unless it specifically tells you: “I am a duck”, it isn’t. Because that’s how these things work.
Just like any woman who, unless she specifically says so (ie: “I am a slut”), is clearly not a slut. And no MRA would ever claim she was.
Right? Right.
Merry Christmas!
I think there is a difference between hate and entitlement, to a certain degree. Person of group A (in this case, men) thinks all people of group B (in this case, women) should be a certain way, and when they don’t behave in this way, they must be defective- a deviation from the norm. So something must have made them this way. It must be feminism, right? So he blames that. I think guys like this really truly believe that women are naturally obedient and would admit their inferiority if it weren’t for that pesky modern equality business. Of course, for all intents and purposes, the results of hate and entitlement are the same. And then there are all the weird sexual issues mixed in there as well.
I also am confused about how American women specifically are the worst again. The only women I have ever met who believed very strongly in deferring to men were American. I have never met a European or South American woman who believed that as strongly. But of course, my experience is limited.
This topic always really bothers me for some reason. I think someone needs to post an animal video!