So over on MGTOWforums, the regulars are pondering the age-old question – should these committed women-avoiders deal with their continued desire to stick their penises in the women they’re allegedly avoiding by resorting to prostitutes?
In the midst of a lively discussion on the advantages of “going pro” over trying to pick up a “bar hog,” one regular by the nom de internet Xtc sets forth some thoughts that, for a moment at least, seem to transcend the usual MGTOW crudity and bitterness.
“I don’t think it’s really about sex,” he writes. “I think what a lot of people are looking for is love, respect, and intimacy – which you can’t buy.”
Why, that almost seems like an insight!
Alas, in his very next sentence he spoils the moment by returning to the standard MGTOW narrative of female perfidy:
I think what put me off women altogether was the realisation that you’ll NEVER get [love, respect, and intimacy] for real. It’s sad and sobering, but that’s the way it is.
Thinking that the attention of women validates you as a person collapses once you realise they are attracted to the worst qualities in the worst men.
Thinking that the attention of women equals affection, intimacy, or love – collapses once you realise they will leave you in a second if they sense any weakness or if a BBD [bigger better deal] comes along. Then you’ll realise that the meter was running all the time, whether this was clear at the time or not.
Women are like a bitter medicine that you force yourself to swallow because you believe it is doing you good. Once you realise it’s a quack remedy, and the whole thing is a scam, you’re free to spit it out and never partake again.
That leaves you with sex alone, which is really rather easy to come by.
If women really and truly are “attracted to the worst qualities of the worst men,” why aren’t they lining up at these dudes’ front doors?
My prediction is already in.
Citation needed
Everyone wants to get married….most people assume that a long-term relationship is going to lead to marriage….women are fickle…
My biased assumptions, let me show you them.
@Hippodameia: Or how feminists must shoulder the blame for insisting that women have the right to vote, to an education, to owning their own money, and getting jobs which is why there is such general discontent among PEOPLE as to the woes on the dating scene today?
*puts a fiver down on the *by midnight central standard USA time* tonight* (currently 6:31 here in CSTUSA).
“We’re just critically evaluating the quality of your trolling–which really isn’t up to some of our Legendary Trollz. Troll harder/better, though apparently you’re too late to qualify for Troll of the Year.”
Trolling assumes that I am trying to get a rise out of the posters here or that I am deliberately presenting my arguments in an inflammatory way, or I am not sincere in what I am posting. I sincerely stand behind everything I’ve posted here. I don’t care if it bothers you or not. I don’t care if you agree with it or not. I don’t care if it upsets you or not. What I am doing is not trolling. It is presenting opinions that the overwhelming majority of posters here do not like and agree with. If we were having this conversation on a manosphere messageboard or blog, I would be but one voice in a chorus and yours would be a lone, minority opinion.
(Points up)
But I’m not an MRA, oh no, I just happen to be a voice in their chorus.
(You have to admit that Bob is sometimes almost funny, albeit unintentionally.)
Yeah, you’re not sexist at aaaaaallll. Not ignoring everything that’s been pointed out to you in this thread. Not demeaning women’s experiences of miserable marriages by repeating the “bored” bit. Not making shit up about relationships. Not totally contradicting yourself by saying the relationships exist on women’s terms BUT that those relationships are so bad women are walking out of them.
@CassandraSays – I don’t know anyone who complains about modern dating. My friends are in long-term relationships, but the only one I knew while she was between relationships never translated “I’m a bit sad because don’t know if I’ll ever get into a happy, permanent situation” into “The modern dating scene is terrible!!!”
I’m starting to see this thread as a Mel Brooks musical – dancing goalposts, choirs of MRAs ….
@BobTroll: But we’re having it here.
And we see you as a troll.
So I don’t give a flying fuck what you state your intentions are: you are trolling.
So why don’t you go over to the misogynistic sites where you can get applauds and upvotes for your shit?
I always ask this of our trolls (or most of them, hmmm, have been busy lately): what do you hope to accomplish here?
It’s springtime
For sexism
And the death of marriage
“Just out of interest, does anyone here (other than Bob) actually find that the people they know constantly bemoan the state of modern dating?”
Uh yes, pretty much everybody that is not currently in a relationship or coupled off will probably at some time or another express frustration at the ups and downs in trying to find somebody. Men and women both that are single will express frustration and disappointment from time to time at how many frogs they have to kiss before they find their prince or princess. The first thing to do when you want to find somebody to share your life with is address any and all structural issues within yourself. If I’m unemployed and live with my parents, I shouldn’t expect women to be clamoring to date me. If I’m 80 pounds overweight, I shouldn’t expect women to find me sexy and physically attractive. If I’m not a good listener, empathetic, kind, caring, I shouldn’t be surprised when women don’t want to continue to get to know me. Sometimes you meet somebody and despite the fact that both people are decent, good people, the chemistry just isn’t there and you’re not a good match. Dating can often be frustrating, and it doesn’t make you bitter and hateful to make that observation.
I did say anyone other than Bob…
No, they don’t.
Bob, why the fuck are you here? You can still be a troll, even if you think you’re Spock.
Troll haiku? :O
Bob: what if you run on at length monologing about what you want, regardless of what your audience thinks? Would you date you?
Gods, you’re obtuse. How often must you be told that not everyone is looking for a relationship?
Anyone want to play Spot That Fallacy with Bob’s last comment? I’m still flu-ish.
“But I’m not an MRA, oh no, I just happen to be a voice in their chorus.”
I agree with a lot of what they have to say regarding modern male/female relations. What I find detestable is they are almost like mirror image of strident radical feminists: they hate women, and they would rather complain and whine about how their lives are not what they want it to be instead of taking responsiblity for their happiness and their choices. Somebody that is bitter and hateful repulses other people, whether they are seeking out friendships or romance. You get back what you put out. A man that decides he has nothing better to do that hate all women and blame all women for his failures and shortcomings is basically advertising the fact that has given up on bettering himself and his life.
@Bob: It just amazes me that all of the blame for the declining marriage rate and the increase in single people and the overall dissatisfaction that is increasing when it comes to people’s romantic lives is put entirely at the feet of men,
Where IS this blame put? Who is doing it?
I don’t blame men for any of the above: for one thing, I’m not sure it’s something that should be a focus for blame (I was born in the 1950s, saw the whole traditional marriage, and decided early on it wasn’t for me–women had to work too hard). So I never married, never wanted to (and just to reassure you, never dated anybody). Like a lot of the people I knew in college, I hung out with a group, and we slept with various people as we wished. Some of the people did want to date, and did get married, but I never did.
The reasons for the increasing divorce rate/declining marriage rate (IF it exists–I’m gonna google some stats) is I think tied to a variety of complex cultural causes–including legality of no-fault divorce, greater opportunities for women, increased longevity, economics (my mom, after her divorce, swore she’d never marry again–and didn’t–but a few years ago moved her 91 year old boyfriend into her house). The idea that “not married” means “no romantic relationship” is sort of naive.
So your whole bullshit stuff here comes from you thinking MEN are mistakengly being blamed (by women?), so you’re gonna come lecture a group of (mostly?) women on it.
Yeah, that’s not trolling or mansplaining at all, bucko.
False equivalency square: s they are almost like mirror image of strident radical feminists:
CHECK!
If you can see what hateful misogynistic losers they are, why on earth do you agree with them about relationships between men and women? Their entire premise is that whatever women do, it’s wrong; whether we wait till marriage, have a series of relationships, do paid work, do unpaid work, it doesn’t matter to these men: they will abuse us regardless. You want to do genuine work or express concern for real men’s issues, I’d suggest you move right away from the MRM, which is purely an abusers’ lobby.
http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0005044.html
You really think this historical change can be explained by blaming individuals, as opposed to the scope of cultural changes since then?
You think yammering at people about “shouldering” their fair share of the blame is going to accomplish anything (many of whom, I’d note, are happily married or partnered)?
This conversation would make so much more sense in a context in which people were complaining about the rising divorce rate and all that jazz. Instead, Bob wants to have that conversation with a bunch of people who don’t care if the divorce rate is rising or the marriage rate is dropping.
I know MRAs care very much about that, but since we’re not actually a mirror image of them…
Divorce Rate: It’s not as high as you think!
So, BOb, howze about checking out some data instead of dumping your ASSumptions all over the blog?
CassandraSays: ut since we’re not actually a mirror image of them…
Hmm, if the MIRROR image is a reversal (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirror_image), then that’s actually right: the MRA cares about marriage/divorce rates, and we don’t!
Reversal!
So, BobTroll, why don’t you go through the looking glass back to MRAland where you and the other creepy dudes can commiserate with each other to your heart’s content?