More thoughts on the election from the Manosphere. These are from the comments section of Chateau Heartiste, in response to that little manifesto from Mark Minter we talked about the other day, and which Minter also posted at the Chateau.
Here John Salt suggests that “force” works better than voting. And, oh yeah, he’s also as racist as Hitler.
Here Sidewinder offers some “optimism” for the future:
You’ll notice that no one there voices opposition to any of these sentiments.
The Manosphere needs yoga, meditation, some grounding in non-dualistic Vedanta philosophy.
“Er, you know that a lot of what is “horrific” about childbirth currently is the way that it is managed, right? 99% of births take place in hospitals and almost none of the hospitals have policies conductive to satisfying childbirth experiences. ”
Midwifes have their own wings in some European hospitals and is taken very seriously as a profession there. However here in the states we do have Birthing Centers and of course home births, both assisted and unassisted are on the rise.
However in Europe the midwifes have to undergo university or medical school training and get a degree.
If you’re gonna riff on his name, don’t use something that’s not the least bit insulting.
For Goddess’s sake! I clicked on that John Salt link at Heartiste blog and could someone here please explain to me the Manosphere’s fascination with Islam?
Anon on November 7, 2012 at 3:19 pm
Whites must convert to islam.
The fuhrer said it: “if we were mahometans, we would have become the masters of the world”.
***
WTF?!?!?
Sgt. Grumbles, if you’re so perfect, please start your own blog.
I never said I was perfect. I don’t know what you’re talking about.
Sgt. Grumbles, you do correct people a lot and tell themhthey’re not doing things right. I did find your reply to me just now quite annoying, especially since earlier in this thread you explained to me how to avoid the moderation filter after I said I had figured out what the problem was. I’ve seen you do it to other people too.
Maybe it’s just part of your schtick to go with your username, sort of like TYPING THINGS IN ALL CAPS goes with the dammit part of mine, but it’s still annoying.
Skeptifem: As someone who works in medical malpractice defense, I have to take issue with the statement that we have an “epidemic” of “unnecessary cesareans”. I see the opposite: an epidemic of children being born with permanently debilitating brachial plexus injuries and cerebral palsy because so many doctors are under insane pressure NOT to do a cesarean unless it’s a matter of life and death. (And there is a bit of a contradiction here too, as you criticize the use of forceps, but are also critical of cesarean section, which avoids the use of forceps in cases of cephalic disproportion.) I work on many, many truly heart-breaking cases in which it is decided, apparently, that it is better to make a child an invalid than to subject the mother to a “major surgery”, even when it’s what the mother would prefer (although many mothers are also brainwashed into thinking that having a cesarean makes the whole process a failure, and her, a bad mother). In my opinion as a mother, it is a belief of people who are completely detached from reality. If it’s YOUR child, the risk of a (probably easily treatable) infection and the transient pain of a healing incision are NOTHING compared to the lifetime of heartbreak and hardship that results from having a child who is permanently, incurably disabled. So what makes a cesarean “unnecessary”? I think that’s the definition people would need to agree upon before decrying the high rates of medical intervention in child birth.
We live in a very different world than we did 60-80 years ago. It was once almost unthinkable for a woman in her forties to have a child; now it’s commonplace. Today, many more complicated pregnancies are carried to term that would not have been in the past, and that increases the rate of cesareans. IVF is much more common and affordable than it once was, and hence you have more mothers with multiples — who are, for their part, more likely to need a cesarean, at least if they want to have healthy babies. The growth in the rate of birth by cesarean section isn’t necessarily an indication of a problem — I’d submit it’s just the opposite.
I’m also wary of idealizing midwives. Never mind that some of us don’t really understand why it’s necessary to endure many hours of hellish pain when safe, effective pain relief is available, let’s not forget that midwives cherry-pick their patients, while hospitals serve everyone who comes through the door; and when problems arise in midwife-assisted births (and they arise in about 25% of first-time births), the patient is shipped off to a nearby hospital anyway. Note that these problems, which will prompt a midwife to deal her patient off to a hospital, would include failure to progress and cephalic disproportion, both almost certain to necessitate surgery or forcible extraction. With that in mind, comparisons between the morbidity and mortality rates of hospitals and home births aren’t particularly accurate or fair.
Ignore the extra “h” – my cheap laptop has a cursed cursor.
I think the Islam obsession is a collision of their crippling fear of brown people and their desire to oppress women. So when they encounter a culture that’s primarily brown people and has a reputation for oppressing women, they get stuck on it because their brains can’t handle it. It’s like telling an AI “this statement is false.”
Sidewinder’s plan is nothing but a shitty utopian pipe dream. If Paul Ryan can’t bring the tingles, then no one can. You simply cannot Game from a TV screen.
Paul Ryan’s an asshole. Some of us tingle only for non-assholes.
katz, I think that it’s in part because sensible Christianity and sensible Islam resemble each other, as do the radical facets of each. Each is a monotheistic religion that has been misused over the years.
As always, looking into a mirror is the most terrifying thing that these fools can do.
Although Obama was looking pretty rugged in that windbreaker during a recent Your Weekly Address. Coincidence? I think not.
” I think that it’s in part because sensible Christianity and sensible Islam resemble each other, as do the radical facets of each. Each is a monotheistic religion that has been misused over the years.”
The nature of monotheism, as its come out of the middle east and starting with Judaism, is that it does have the concept of religious freedom and when it is confronted with it, does not respect it. That is a core tenent of the teaching. That there is only one god, theirs, and this god must, or at least should, be worshipped by everyone across the globe and those that do not do so but are worshipping other gods are worshipping “false gods”.
A strange concept to say the very least.
” is that it does have the concept of religious freedom”
Correction: “does NOT have….”
Patak’s Mango Pickle: The nature of monotheism, as its come out of the middle east and starting with Judaism, is that it does have the concept of religious freedom and when it is confronted with it, does not respect it.
That, in a word, is bullshit.
The Law, as regards Judaism is, even in the OT, only for Jews. The parables of Jesus show that he doesn’t give a shit what non-Jews/Christians do. Islam has the same principles as well.
The thing about them, which makes them, slightly different to the pan/polytheisms they arose in the midst of, is a lack of tolerance for Apostasy in their own ranks (see Deut. 18).
It’s not intrinsic to the Abrahamic religions.
The notable exception to the general run of tolerance was Rome, which had a state religion to which one had to maintain a public obedience. That was what caused the Christians (in particular, though there were some frictions with Jews they were given liberties) to have the problems they did. They were attacking the divine aid to the state.
When Constantine co-opted Christianity, that same mindset became part of the religion, because it too was drawing on divine assistance.
We know know there is an overlap between MRAs and fundamentalist Christians. Some fundamentalist Christians think that the world will end soon and that it will start in the Middle East, where most of the current residents are Muslim. I wonder if that’s part of where the obsession comes from?
Yeah, Pickle, that’s bullshit. Judaism, Christianity, and Islam are all big religions. You can’t make giant, sweeping statements about what they all do or believe. (Well, you can, but you’ll always be wrong.)
percunium, the people of that region already had religions and gods. then a man got the bright idea they should only worship god to the exclusion of all others. over the following years the people would back slide into their previous traditions of worshipping the other gods and intense shaming (to say the least) would ensue. back and forth like this for sometime until finally the Big Daddy meme stuck. Freud wrote “Moses and Monotheism” wherein he psychoanalysed this dynamic and its available online.
I mean, what? Why? Go on with yo’ bad self and worship all the gods or goddesses you want.
At least Jews don’t seek to convert others, normally at least. But Islam and Christianity are huge on global conversion and One World Religion.
What gives?
This is totally off topic but Katz, was it you I was talking to about hair dyeing the other day? I finally got round to doing mine. It is slightly brighter than I had anticipated, but will hopefully last more than a couple of weeks now.
I will say this though, I was recently pleasantly surprised to find out that Mormons, of all people, contributed HUGE donations to, and also helped to physically build a Hindu mandir in Utah. (The one that holds the huge Holi Festival every spring). Now, if Romney knew about this (or contributed himself) he would have garnered more votes from South Asian Americans and non-South Asian neo-Hindus like the Hari Krishnas and others, had he made it a talking point on his campaign trail.
( i myself didn’t vote before anyone jumps on me here)
Nat, that looks great!
Dude, you’re seriously invoking Freud as an expert on Islam? lol
Pickle:
You. Are. Wrong. That’s what gives. You think some religions are totally out there because you believe stuff about them that is not true. It turns out they are mostly composed of normal people with a wide variety of opinions and attitudes about everything.
And protip: Freud is not a great authority to turn to for, you know, facts.