Over on the A Voice for Men forums – yes, they have forums – one Man Going His Own Way spells out exactly what he means by His Own Way. Here’s misterbill:
For me, MGTOW has three major components:
1. Refusal to cohabitate with a woman
2. Avoidance of fatherhood like the plague
3. Avoidance of being alone in a room with a strange woman (for fear of false accusations)
These are the core elements, IMO.
I’m not celibate, I get sexual satisfaction from several call-girls that I’ve built good rapport with over a few years. I’ll visit one of these women whenever I feel like it, usually once a month or so.
I have what I would describe as a female companion who others would describe as my girlfriend. We don’t have sex, not because I’m not attracted to her, but because my fear of possibly getting her pregnant petrifies me beyond belief. So we hang out 2 days a week and have very nice times together, going on about 5 years. She understands my beliefs and that we will never live together and that I don’t believe in the myth of love.
So I’m MGHOW, but not without women.
I’m 41 and fairly wealthy. In my 20s and through to of my early 30s ( although I wasn’t a PUA) I studied game theory and in combination with other aspects of my life, I had no trouble getting laid. Then a woman made a false accusation against me (and was further slandered by another), and I began to wake up to the perils of having sex with (and interacting with) strange women. The risks outweighed the benefits, and I turned to going my own way.
I travel on business frequently and the one exception to my rule with being alone with strange women is the easy pickings while traveling. There is a rule amongst many women that if you’re 500 miles away from home, it’s not cheating. I see this a lot with many married women. Gents, her vows mean NOTHING once she gets on a plane without you. Although I wouldn’t allow any of these women into my home, I accept the risk when I’m traveling. And there is always a risk of running into a psycho who is ready to explode.
I don’t really have any jokes here. But I will note that his story doesn’t make a lick of sense; I find it literally unbelievable.
He’s so paranoid about women because of a “false accusation” leveled against him back when he pursued women using “game theory” that he literally refuses to be in the same room with “strange women” – or even interact with them. Yet when he’s traveling he suggests he routinely has sex with “strange” married women. Huh? These women could still get pregnant; these women could still make accusations, false or otherwise, against him. Does he feel safe because he can skip town in a hurry to avoid the possible consequences of his actions?
He’s (allegedly) been involved in a 2-day-a-week relationship, for five years, with a woman he’s sexually attracted to. But he refuses to have sex with her because he’s terrified of getting her pregnant. If he’s that worried about getting her pregnant, and generally wants to “avoid … fatherhood like the plague,” why doesn’t he get a vasectomy? If, after he sleeps with a married woman in a strange city, she gets pregnant with his child, does he simply assume she’ll never be able to track him down?
I’m going to assume that most if not all of what misterbill is saying here is bullshit. But if he does indeed live his life in way that even vaguely resembles how he says he does, it’s a rather sad and strange and paranoid way to live.
You think Paul Elam is a a freak? John The Other? Wow…we agree on something!
Would you mind defending misogyny here for a moment?
Thanks.
Amanda M, nice piece on Mourdock in today’s Slate.
http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor/2012/10/24/richard_mourdock_on_rape_pregnancies_just_another_part_of_god_s_plan.html
It is legit to go after Paul Elam. I don’t read his stuff but I have read one of his articles and even if he is a little odd, he isn’t an aspergery shut in like most of the guys you pick on.
Never heard of John the Other.
Or, we’re people who find misogyny imminently mockable and, thus, enjoy mocking it.
It’s not as cool as stamping your feet like a five-year old trying to get their parents’ attention and saying offensive things because you think it’s cool and edgy.
But, hey, the internet is a big place.
What else would you like me to say in defense of misogyny that I haven’t already said?
@ Otis- One, dude, there is no reason to believe these people are, as you put it, ‘freaks’. Quite a few of the people Dave writes about have prominent positions in the world. Two, being a social outcast does not preclude you from being a bad person who hurts others. I give not two fucks how very hard your life might be, if you hate on women then you don’t get a free pass based on what you think is their loserhood. Lots of people are kind of social outcasts and they are awesome people with great things to contribute. The internet is a wonderful place to read and see what they have to say. And some social outcasts are shitheads. They get called on it.
Aw, he thinks we’re interested in his opinions. Bless his heart.
Otis, misogyny is indefensible. You might want to just enjoy some quiet time for a spell.
Uh, no. We like to mock misogyny. We do not go to their websites and post our comments there, we post our comments here. These folks need never know this blog exists, and never feel the pain a bullying victim feels. (See Rebecca Watson, above.) We don’t harass them in elevators or tweet threats to them. We don’t shove them into lockers or threaten to rape them.
See the difference?
Your comments to Amanda are pretty freaky and weird. So, you’re setting yourself up to be mocked. Good job, and thank you.
Plus Otis, the intent here is to expose and lampoon misogyny, not just mock random people to puff out the chest and one up them. Your whole premise is off.I mean who wants to pick on Scott Adams, the Dilbert guy? He made sexist comments and they were laughed at. It’s for the better of person-kind and clear thinking dontcha know? In other words, not about the dude.
Two, being a social outcast does not preclude you from being a bad person who hurts others.
No it doesn’t. But often social outcasts are the way they are because they are damaged people who have personality disorders. Picking on people like that is like picking on retards. If retards were hating on women, would that justify you going after them cause “retardation is no excuse for misogyny”?
Aw, he thinks we’re interested in his opinions. Bless his heart.
Apparently Frietag does.
One, dude, there is no reason to believe these people are, as you put it, ‘freaks’.
Right, there is no reason to believe middle aged men who spend all there time online spinning paranoid misogynistic fantasies to other misogynistic shut ins are freaks. That is totally normal behavior.
See also previous post re: Senate hopeful Richard Mourdock. We are such terrible bullies for mocking him, are we not?
great. You guys got me on moderation. I hope you’re happy.
Otis if it makes you feel better, I vote that you’re out of moderation simply for not knowing JohnTheOther. That is commendable. You’re the Sara Palin of MRA knowledge, a maverick in these parts. You can tackle bullying because you can see it from your window, or something.
I second to vote Otis out of moderation. He’s at least articulate and honest, and would probably join Boobzers in mocking JtO.
FFS, only Otis could make threats of stalking to another commenter, constantly use hate language and then complain that we ‘got’ him on moderation because WE CAN’T HANDLE THA TRUUUUTH!
Fucking ninny.
Dude, why are you here?
I really don’t care either way whether or not Otis is moderated. I do wish he’d go away, but only because he’s boring the crap out of me.
If the MRM is full of “aspergery freaks”, wouldn’t that imply that social awkwardness and misogyny are correlated?
They’re not, obviously, because we have “aspergery freaks” here who are not misogynists, and the misogyny examples pulled from the MRM mirror real life ideologies from people who are not “apergery freaks”, so….
But hey, for clarity’s sake, perhaps you could phrase all of your comments as logical arguments from now on just for fun?
First of all, I’m not sure this post is going to go through cause I think I’m still on moderation.
FFS, only Otis could make threats of stalking to another commenter, constantly use hate language and then complain that we ‘got’ him on moderation because WE CAN’T HANDLE THA TRUUUUTH!
No, Amanda banned me (over 20 times) cause she and her thin skinned, SWPL readers couldn’t handle the truth. I was banned at Feministing and Jezebel for the same reason. Why I’ve been put on moderation here, I’m not sure, but I will give David credit for allowing opposing viewpoints. It’s probably because even though he is a mangina, he is still a man; whereas female run sites cannot tolerate any dissent.
Dude, why are you here?
To bring you the Truth.
FFS, only Otis could make threats of stalking to another commenter
That Amanda cheats on her beta choad of a boyfriend is well known in the Brooklyn Feminist community. You don’t need to be a stalker to know about that.
Otiose, man, what can I say. It was fun while it lasted, but we both knew that this relationship wasn’t forever. You no longer have the spark that you used to. It may be time to part ways. Don’t worry, it’s not me, it’s you. Very definitely you.
Otis, are you sure you’re not an mra? Because blaming women/feminists for the consequences of your own asshattery is a traditional mra pastime, IIRC.
Nope, nothing stalkery about that. No sir. *whistles and strolls down the lane with hands in pockets*