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Redditors shocked — shocked! — to find racism in the White Rights subreddit

A group of totally not racist white people who just happen to love riding ferris wheels dressed in white robes.

So the other day, whilst poking around on Reddit, I took a look at one of its more charming subreddits: r/whiterights – a subreddit full of racists who spend a good deal of their time (as dedicated racists do these days) to pretending that they’re not really racists, just good-hearted folks really really concerned about the plight of white people facing “minority oppression.”

Amidst an assortment of posts complaining about evil brown immigrants, “Jewish Power,” and the internal politics of neo-Nazi organizations, I noticed a posting from our old friend JeremiahGuy — the latest Reddit handle of the dude once known as Things Are Bad, an MRA so obnoxious he’s been banned from r/mensights and A Voice for Men.

Jeremiah links to a post on MGTOWforums –- another familiar name! — lamenting the fact that a black “fattie” has just been chosen as Homecoming Queen at the University of Mississippi – that is, the famously racist, formerly segregated school known as Ole Miss.

The discussion over at MGTOWforums lives up (lives down?) to that site’s usual abysmal standards, with the regulars bashing not only the new Homecoming Queen, but also the first runner-up, a (white) woman whom the regulars have decided is “haggard.” As one commenter puts it:

Either the school is housed in radioactive isotopes causing deformation and them being the “Two best” beaties..Or they have that whole “Oh don’t worry you ARE beautiful!!” crowd surrounding them.

Honestly though since she is the “FIRST” African American winner shes probably a token winner like obama.

Either you vote for her or you are a racist kind of thing.. Or as I said before the thing I call “Oh don’t worry you are pretty!” White lie which is also part pity.

Jesus though. Either choice!! I had seen prettier faces on roadkill.

There’s a lot more where that came from in the MGTOWforums thread.

But I actually found myself more intrigued by the discussion over on r/whiterights, where some of the commenters expressed dismay that the folks on r/whiterights were being so obviously racist. No, really. To wit:

Elsewhere in the thread, another commenter expresses a similar concern:

These comments are some of the Reddit-est comments I’ve read in a long time.

I think there are two possibilities here. Either Paxmagister and Schuuugg are

1) Standard issue racist “white nationalists” worried that too-obvious racism will hurt their movement, or

2) Two people so entitled and narcissistic that they honestly believe that white people like themselves really do face oppression at the hands of minorities, yet who also honestly believe that they themselves aren’t racist, and have somehow failed to notice up until this point that they’re posting in a subreddit  run by and full of neo-Nazis.

I think it’s door number two.

The parallel with “Men’s Rights” is fairly obvious here. The Men’s Rights subreddit is overflowing with guys who honestly don’t see themselves as misogynists — but who also regularly write and upvote stuff like the following, from a thread on “Why feminists shouldn’t complain about PUA: They created them [sic] by destroying the previous dating model.”

This is just one example of the casual misogyny that flourishes there, and not even a particularly egregious one. Obviously, as regular readers here know all too well, there are plenty more examples where that came from.

It’s kind of amazing how easy it is for bigots to convince themselves that they’re not bigots.

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James
James
8 years ago

You know what’s funny about the “dating model” complaint? The modern concept of dating didn’t solidify until the 1950s, with the increased independence of teenagers via the automobile and accelerated post-war urbanization/suburbaniztion. So it was only about 40 years old before the beginnings of radical third wave feminism (which is, I presume, most MRAs’ primary image of contemporary feminism). The “previous dating model” is about as old as the baby boomers. Hardly an august institution.

Rowan
Rowan
8 years ago

Isn’t r/whiterights mostly just about fishing, cooking, badminton and stamps?

lowquacks
lowquacks
8 years ago

@James

It’s very important to remember that for (particularly American) conservatives: “how things always were before liberals/feminists/whatever ruined everything” = “an exaggerated version of how things were for suburban whites in the 1950’s, possibly as cribbed from Leave it to Beaver”

nerdypants
nerdypants
8 years ago

In another thread Schuuug identifies as a woman, 33 years old, and spends lots of time on those fashion-advice type threads and other friendly and mundane things. Is there a way to list how often someone comments in a particular subreddit? She might just be a newcomer, which would explain the cluelessness.

hellkell
hellkell
8 years ago

I’m sure these idiots are serious when they wonder why there’s no White History Month.

hellkell
hellkell
8 years ago

I’m curious to know exactly what problems they think white people as a group are facing. I mean besides loss of privilege and scary brown people breeding.

whataboutthemoonz
8 years ago

conservatives: “how things always were before liberals/feminists/whatever ruined everything” = “an exaggerated version of how things were for suburban whites in the 1950′s, possibly as cribbed from Leave it to Beaver”

Quoted For Truth.

This is why it’s s funny when MRAs come here and start talking shit about the good old days. They come up against a wall of historians, anthropologists, sociologists, etc. who know a thing or two. It amuses me terribly.

nerdypants
nerdypants
8 years ago

you would think that even the name of the subreddit would clue her in

Heh, yeah, you’d think. Though if one is particularly clueless, I suppose “white rights” could suggest something good, like “Hey, I like rights! I like white people! I must like white rights!” I’ve met some people who did something similar regarding immigrants in Australia. I never did figure out if they were just very bad at understanding context, or very good at being disingenuous.

In Schuuug’s defence, her comments in other threads suggest she’s a generally sincere person, and it seems hanging out on r/whiterights is already helping her understand the context. Yay internet.

Denise
Denise
8 years ago

Wait a minute, did they all forget that homecoming queen is not a beauty contest, but a popularity contest?

Oh right, since a woman’s only feature of note is her beauty, they are pretty much the same thing.

The Kittehs' Unpaid Help
The Kittehs' Unpaid Help
8 years ago

James – the dating model has changed back and forth. Going out with lots of people was the model that emerged in the 1920s, and the ‘going steady’ model of the 1950s was seen as weak and wimpy and not trying by the parents of those teens – the ones who’d been doing the dating in the 1920s. My source for this: History Today magazine, but don’t ask me which issue, I read it in the 1990s; it stuck in the memory because it was so unlike the image I’d had.

I don’t seem to recall that the whole Sexual Liberation thing was exactly rejected by men in the 1960s – on the contrary, as far as I have read it was far more for their benefit than for women’s, and the PUAs seem to be the dregs from that particular barrel.

mildlymagnificent
mildlymagnificent
8 years ago

kitteh There are a whole lot of minefields for the unwary in this dating – going steady – social conventions field. My mum told me about my father making a huge faux pas one evening. They’d gone out to one of those cabaret style things with a group from work – and it became significant that the olds (mid-thirties at the time) were a decade or so older than the rest of the group. Dad did the ‘gentlemanly’ thing. As each dance was announced, he’d ask one of the other women at their table for that dance. And was making sure that he would have danced with every one of them by the end of the evening.

Mum noticed that there were a few ‘looks’ and mutters exchanged between others at the table. So she eventually told him that she thought these ‘young’ people were not used to the idea of anyone dancing with partners other than the one they’d come with. Poor man! One of the great loves of his life was ballroom dancing. He thought these people were peculiar – like one of his friends who, everyone knew, was very possessive and always made sure he and his wife were the first ones on the floor for every dance, just so that no-one ever got the chance to ask her. That was regarded as very borderline social behaviour.

Dancing with everyone in a social group was the way ‘things were done’. As anyone watching a ‘sophisticated’ film from the forties and fifties should have worked out!

scarlettpipistrelle
8 years ago

My grandmother, born 1905, used to lament the way kids in the 50s and 60s tended to pair off and go off alone. She would tell me about the group dating activities they had when she was a girl. People weren’t expected to pair off so fast then.

The Kittehs' Unpaid Help
The Kittehs' Unpaid Help
8 years ago

mildlymagnificent – your poor dad! That’s a very good illustration of the sort of changed attitudes, isn’t it?

It also illustrates the point about how silly the whole conservative notion is, of everything being exactly the same for all of history (ie. anywhere civilised was essentially a Norman Rockwell scene in fancy dress) until it All Went Wrong in the 1960s.

Magpie
Magpie
8 years ago

What, so young people don’t socialise in mixed groups any more?

MKlein
MKlein
8 years ago

“I don’t think white pride means being a racist.”

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/10/104357/2038397-loki_facepalm.jpg

xardoz
8 years ago

a subreddit full of racists who spend a good deal of their time (as dedicated racists do these days) to pretending that they’re not really racists

Switch “racists” to “sexists” and this is also a good description of /mensrights. 😉

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
8 years ago

The minute you see “I’m not an X, but” you know that what’s about to follow is going to prove that the person actually is an X.

Magpie
Magpie
8 years ago

Oh yeah, met a lot of racist-butts.

The Kittehs' Unpaid Help
The Kittehs' Unpaid Help
8 years ago

“Racist-butts”, I like it!

I don’t know which is worse, the “I’m not, but” or the out-and-out racists or sexists. My sister and BiL are out-and-proud racists. 🙁

Diogenes The Cynic
Diogenes The Cynic
8 years ago

I’ll admit that stormfront is a guilty pleasure of mine.

I honestly believe a few of the posters there are legit trolls that can’t get called out because the normal stuff in there is so crazy. Between the hocus-pocus science, racial theory, pro-eugenics, obsession with Jews, etc it has to be the single most unintentionally funny place on the internet.

As to dating, I’ll say I prefer the matchmaking model. Been engaged twice that way.

dualityheart
dualityheart
8 years ago

So basically, what is meant by “white” here? Because for me, being a human being worthy of respect is not a shade of skin. And, hey, intersectionality! Privilege vectors overlap and change based on where you are and how others perceive you. Sure, in default society, appearing white, het, cis male confers a high level of privilege, but there is no freaking red carpet that gets rolled out for Showing Up White. I think that is the fundamental misunderstanding of generally non racist douchebags when they first become aware of privilege. They think of privilege as some kind of gift instead of a lack of discrimination and Stuff One Must Think Of while in basic everyday life. So they become indignant and upset thinking that they are perceived as being that bratty kid who gets everything on a silvver platter. But really, I think they are just missing the entire point….which is where many of them cross the line from clueless entitlement to outright hate speech.

aworldanonymous
8 years ago

Upon reading all of the comments, I have realized that I have nothing that I can add to the conversation except maybe in response to historians, anthropologists, and sociologists, being that I’m possibly switching to a double major in journalism/anthropology and creative writing. I want to write Sci-Fi on the side of something that actually gets me a job.

Sir Feldon
Sir Feldon
8 years ago

“Racist-butt”. I can say that this doesn’t make you look good to those who are on the fence.

Tulgey Logger
Tulgey Logger
8 years ago

“Racist-butt”. I can say that this doesn’t make you look good to those who are on the fence.

I think we can do without the people who are “on the fence” about the whole racism thing.

The Kittehs' Unpaid Help
The Kittehs' Unpaid Help
8 years ago

Ditto, Tulgey.

Sir Feldon – do you realise what you just said? That you’re undecided about whether to be a racist or not? That people saying MEAN THINGS about racists might just make you side with the poor put-upon racists after all?

And cut the concern-trolling and tone-trolling. “Oh you shouldn’t be so nasty to those poor racists/misogynists! You have to be NICE!”

Yeah, bullshit.

pecunium
8 years ago

Naïf: And how many times have you been married?

pecunium
8 years ago

I belong to a historical dancing community. I make a point that I only dance with my date once per set of dances. In part this is because there aren’t as many men as women. It’s also because it’s more historically accurate.

And it’s more fun.

(Varpole take note, this is an aspect of my sexuality)

Polliwog
8 years ago

Back when I was physically able to dance, I used to go to contradances (which are super fun – I miss them 🙁 ), and the prevailing expectation at most of them is that, if you come with a date (most people don’t), you can dance with your date for most or all of the waltzes, since waltzes are kind of intimate, but for all the other dances, people generally try to have a new partner every time. Anyone who tried to latch on to the same partner over and over outside of waltzes would be perceived as kind of strange, especially since over the course of a single dance, you’ll generally end up dancing at least as much, if not more, with people who are not your starting partner, so trying to keep the same person is pretty pointless, anyway.

The Kittehs' Unpaid Help
The Kittehs' Unpaid Help
8 years ago

Dancing as male sexuality! Oh, the horror!

Hey, does this mean Mr Darcy is suddenly not a Real Man, even if he did go around Firthing all the time?

pecunium
8 years ago

Kitteh’s: Dancing with lots of women, as male sexuality. Waltzes even (the last dance of the evening is traditionally a waltz, and a very pretty one; that’s always reserved for my date).

The Kittehs' Unpaid Help
The Kittehs' Unpaid Help
8 years ago

The MRM version of dancing with lots of women would probablyl mean dancing with lots of women who didn’t want to dance. Because real men.

I love the dance in the Netherfield Ball scene in the Ehle/Firth version of P&P. It’s like a duel set to music. Wish they’d had the orchestral version of it on the CD instead of just the piano.

My dancing, alas, never got beyond the “cavorting best done in private” variety. Now the legs are giving out it’s more like “jiggling best done in private”. Though watching Mr Kitteh do a bit of a turn is more fun anyway. 😉

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
8 years ago

Dancing the PUA way – “kino escalate” by pulling a woman onto the dancefloor, and then insult her dancing prowess until her self-esteem is so low that she feels like she has to fuck you in order to redeem herself in your eyes.

lowquacks
lowquacks
8 years ago

MGTOW dancing: Take your partner by the hand. Tell her you don’t want to dance with her. Stick around and continue telling her this for at least an hour.

The Kittehs' Unpaid Help
The Kittehs' Unpaid Help
8 years ago

CassandraSays and lowquacks – ROFL to both!

This could be a whole new venture – the MRM Book of Dancing.

lowquacks
lowquacks
8 years ago

Or a text on the complexities of sexist dudes objecting to very sexualised dancing done by Kids These Days while some possibly genuine criticisms of the environments said dancing come from exist.

I’d call it The Protestan’ Twerk Ethic, by ‘Quacks Weber.

Dvärghundspossen
8 years ago

I was thinking the other day about how racist goal posts also vary from place to place… I live in Stockholm now, but grew up way out in the countryside in Sweden, and it was a TOTALLY white place. NO other colours. A colleague I work with now grew up in another small town a few miles from my village (although we didn’t meet until we started working at the same place in Stockholm). His father is from Greece, so he has naturally black hair. And he was bullied for his hair colour by racists at his school. You’d think that racists would be happy to live at a place where there’s no brown-skinned people, but then they’ll just focus on hair colour instead and whether that’s “too dark” or not.

I remember I saw some American talk show once where there was this guy from Ku Klux Klan who defended their ideology… and my first thought was “What’s that guy doing in the KKK? He’s got black hair!”. It really looked like it would be his natural colour too, he had black eyebrows as well and dark brown eyes. I was so used to thinking of naturally black hair as something that disqualifies you in the eyes of racists, but I guess that since Americans on average have a bit more pigment than Swedes, the racist goal post allows for a bit more pigmentation there.

talacaris
talacaris
8 years ago

yes, sitting on a fence might hurt the butt.

MorkaisChosen
MorkaisChosen
8 years ago

Dvärghundspossen: I think it’s a thing to do with the Other. Sounds to me like the vast majority of Swedes are blond-haired and so on, while there’s a lot more variation in the US or UK, and so dark hair just isn’t as noticable or Other.

RubyHypatia
RubyHypatia
8 years ago

As much as I love our culture, there are things about it I hate. Wanting to constantly put physical beauty on display is one of them, and then judging people harshly for not living up to a certain standard. As for Righties being racists, too many are. Some still believe de-segregation was wrong. Unbelievable!

thenatfantastic
8 years ago

But blue jeans are TEH AWESOMEST and prove you’re better than everyone else, amirite Ruby?

talacaris
talacaris
8 years ago

Or prove that you’re human?

hellkell
hellkell
8 years ago

Ruby, I thought Western culture was the bestest ever, according to you.

Dvärghundspossen
8 years ago

@Morkaischosen: Probably. Brown hair is common here, but very dark brown is rare, and almost no Swede has black hair unless you have a parent of more southern nationality, like my colleague. So it stands out.

Anything that stands out, people might pick on.

MorkaisChosen
MorkaisChosen
8 years ago

As much as I love our culture, there are things about it I hate. The fact that some people seem to think it’s OK for people in prison to commit crimes like rape is one of them.

(Sorry, but it’d’ve been a shame to waste that opportunity.)

prince of dorkness
prince of dorkness
8 years ago

@Dvärghundspossen
Reminds me of my schooldays (Finland, 1970’s). A Jewish girl with straight black hair was quite exotic and different. Not a target of racism, AFAIK, but very distinctive.

dualityheart
dualityheart
8 years ago

When my best friends and I were in the third grade, we first encountered WWII history and the whole Hitler Aryian Race thing. So we came up with a game called “who would Hitler kill?” And we came to the conclusion that my friend K would be safe with her blue eyes and blond hair, that we could dye my friend S’s hair blond since she had blue eyes, and that me being both dark haired and hazel eyed would be sent quickly to the gas chambers. So predictably, we spent the reat of the day’s recesses playing “hide Nanasha from the SS so she wont be burned up.”

The joys of childhood- realizing that if a structure is in place and you are powerless to change it, the only thing you can do is confirm until you can escape!

Amnesia
Amnesia
8 years ago

“Racist-butt”. I can say that this doesn’t make you look good to those who are on the fence.

Here at manboobz, we’re against kissing racist ass. If you don’t like it, you can leave.

thebionicmommy
thebionicmommy
8 years ago

Two people so entitled and narcissistic that they honestly believe that white people like themselves really do face oppression at the hands of minorities, yet who also honestly believe that they themselves aren’t racists…

I think the two people you are describing are named Glenn Beck and Ann Coulter.