Men’s Rights Activists have a new hero: a Cleveland bus driver who punched and choked a belligerent female passenger who had apparently refused to pay her fare.
The top post in the Men’s Rights subreddit at the moment, with more than 500 upvotes, links to a petition urging the Greater Cleveland Regional Transit Authority to reinstate the bus driver, Artis Hughes, who was suspended after video of the incident leaked out. (See videos here and here.) According to the petition,
As a bus driver, mr. Hughes was lied to, insulted, threatened and eventually attacked by one of the passagers. He was clearly justified in striking back. Were he to suffer any negative consequences to his employment as a result of defending himself and striking back, this would set a disasterous precedent: he and other employees would legitimately believe that their workplace expects them to put up with harrassment, and that they will lose their jobs if they choose to stand up for themselves. …
As well as being a bus driver, mr. Hughes is a man, and [Shidea N. Lane, the passenger] is a woman. We continue to live in a world in which some people see fit to scold men for fighting back against the women who abuse them. After mr. Hughes struck ms. Lane, a woman could be heard protesting about it, saying “That’s a [censored] female”. Mr. Hughes responded by saying: “I don’t care. You want to be man? I’m going to treat you like a man!” This is a healthy attitude: if men refuse to strike back, fearing that the law will favour their female abusers over them, we create an environment in which women can harrass and victimize men with impunity. Instead, a man’s decision to fight back against a woman should be respected.
It is for these reasons – the fact that the bus driver was the real victim and was justified in hitting back; that he and other bus drivers should not fear the legal consequences of responding to attacks by passagers; and that men in general should not fear the legal consequences of responding to attacks by women – that we urge you to reinstate mr. Artis Hughes following the investigation on the incident, and hope that future policies will safeguard him and other bus drivers from legal assault whenever they respond to a passager’s physical assault.
There are a lot of things wrong with this statement, up to and including the spelling. But perhaps most germane to the discussion at hand is the fact that the various videos of the event circulating on YouTube make very clear that Hughes was not acting in self-defense.
Yes, it’s clear from the videos and the police report on the incident that the passenger was acting obnoxiously. And according to witnesses she struck first, spitting on Hughes, pushing him and apparently punching him in the head. (All I saw in the video was her pushing him.) That would be more than enough to charge her with assault, though Hughes declined to press charges.
But after she allegedly assaulted him, she backed off. When Hughes punched and then choked her, he was not defending himself; he was retaliating, and with disproportionate force – his punch literally knocked her to the floor.
In this case, Hughes’ victim was a woman. But what he did would have been equally wrong had he punched a man with similar force.
This isn’t the first time, by a long shot, that MRAs have defended the idea of responding to violence from women with disproportionate force. A year ago, you may recall, Men’s Rights Redditors and other MRAs jumped to the defense of Rayon McIntosh, the McDonalds employee who responded to an assault by two customers by beating them with a metal rod – and continuing to beat them after he knocked them to the floor. (See video of the incident here; TW for extreme violence.)
And as longtime readers here know, in one now-infamous post Paul Elam of A Voice for Men suggested that it would be proper for men abused by their female partners to
beat the living shit out of them. I don’t mean subdue them, or deliver an open handed pop on the face to get them to settle down. I mean literally to grab them by the hair and smack their face against the wall till the smugness of beating on someone because you know they won’t fight back drains from their nose with a few million red corpuscles.
And then make them clean up the mess.
In the wake of the bus incident, a number of commenters in the Men’s Rights subreddit reacted to Hughes’ assault on the young woman with something close to glee. (Click on any of the yellow comments to see them in context; they’re all from different parts of the thread .)
True, some suggested that the response was disproportionate, but they tended to get a much less enthusiastic response from the regulars than those reveling in the punch:
And MRAs wonder why some people describe their movement, such as it is, as “the abusers lobby.”
Even bouncers aren’t supposed to use disproportionate force, and theoretically they’re supposed to be trained to defuse a situation rather than escalate it. Several bouncers from Crown Casino are on trial for crushing a man to death at present. Fair bet that if it had been a woman, the MRM would be all over this as Poor Menz Losing Their Jobs And Liberty Cos Bitchez.
@ Cassandrasays – you forgot bloggers. They’re constantly having to literally physically fight people off.
I once saw a bouncer throw* a woman down a flight of stairs at Brixton Academy because he thought she was leaving too slowly, so I’m thinking more what people in that job can get away with than what they ideally should be doing.
*By which I mean that he shoved her so hard that she went tumbling down the stairs arse over elbow, not that he pushed her to walk down the stairs more rapidly. It’s pure luck that she was able to get up and limp away with the help of friends rather than requiring immediate medical attention.
Union steward here. Just confirming Bodsy’s statement about these two things not really being connected. Even if the police never press charges, the bus company may well decide that they don’t want to employ someone in a public-facing position who cannot control either his anger or his behavior. What if they leave him on the job, and the next time he attacks and seriously injures someone who was merely verbally abusive to him? Then the company would face legal liability because they left him in a position where it was reasonably foreseeable that he might attack & injure someone else.
Cassandrasays – holy shit. 🙁
Has schtickwit used up his three posts already? Or did he have to go away and look up ‘obtuse’? (If he did, he’s doubtless wondering why I called him a triangle.)
Some Asshole Racist, do you really think bloggers have training? A look at any blog, especially MRA ones, puts the lie to that bullshit.
Seriously, someone said it last night, and I was like, “nah,” but is Some Jag really B__n?
Funny how victim blaming is promoted when it’s a man. She yelled, screamed, spit and attacked, yet she’s the victim and he’s the oppressor. Oh that’s right she stepped back. Do we know she wasn’t going to attack again if he just sat there and took it? Would there be a praticular number of times a man needs to endure being attacked? Two, ten, twelve? If a woman steps back after every attack should a man just shake his head and say, “She’s just letting off a little steam. Oh and please be so kind as to pass me a hanky to clean up the blood pouring out of my face.”
Does anyone here know she wouldn’t have attacked again had he done nothing? When is enough, enough? You people are vile.
It doesn’t sound like B___n to me, not enough about how awesome and above it all he is. Sadly, boring self-centered trolls are a dime a dozen.
Maybe schticky thinks you have to go to Special Blogger School and that’s why he hasn’t taken up the blog David set up for him.
No talk about his sex life yet = probably not B.
Urgh, I’m glad I wasn’t here for B’s heyday if he rabbitted on about his sex life.
Rabbit is a good word for it.
I can understand perhaps not knowing Sherri Shepherd by name (although he knew Joy Behar by name), but who the fuck doesn’t know Whoopi Goldberg by name? LOL.
It was Whoopi Goldberg? She was one of schticky’s “two African American women”?
Feckin’ oath. I’ve never heard of Sherri Shepherd and I can’t call to mind any associations with Joy Behar, but internationally famous actor Whoopi Goldberg?????
Unfeckinbelievable.
If Schticky doesn’t know who Whoopi Goldberg is I’m going to assume that he is Encino Man and has only just woken up, thus having missed the last 25 years worth of movies/TV.
Some guy bored with your schtick: “Check your privilege CassandraSays,”
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH OH GOD they really are a cargo cult, aren’t they?
Yeah. I watched the video he linked to make sure there weren’t fill-in hosts that day, but I knew that Whoopi Goldberg and Sherri Shepherd are two main hosts of The View, and they were present for this conversation.
I could see arguing that Walters is as big a deal as Goldberg, especially if you’re trying to build a persona that’s about pretending to care about journalism, but to name Behar and not Goldberg? Yep, that was pretty telling.
Dammit, that wasn’t meant to be subtle. Pretend that I wrote “HEY STICKY, ONLY IDENTIFYING THE WHITE LADIES IN YOUR STORY MIGHT BE A LITTLE BIT RACIST, OKAY?”.
And also “IF YOU DON’T KNOW WHO WHOOPI GOLDBERG IS, YOU SHOULD WATCH ‘GHOST’ BECAUSE IT’S A PRETTY SWEET MOVIE AS I RECALL.”
Sorry for the shouting guys. Wanted to make sure that I didn’t come off as too subtle this time.
I have to really think poorly of someone to recommend that they watch Ghost.
Schticky, you should totally watch Ghost. On repeat, all day.
@Slavey,
Shouldn’t we wait until Sharon Osbourne weighs in? She is, after all, the final authority on what feminists consider acceptable retaliation.
lol @ schticky attempting to use social justicey language, failing miserably, and then being outright racist. When it comes to tripping over their own feet, these MRA fuckers never disappoint.
Also, are we forgetting that we’re talking about Whoopi “rape-rape” Goldberg? She is not exactly the most enlightened icon of modern feminism, Schticky. Or much at all. I mean, she was hot shit as Guinan, but that was a long time ago in a galaxy far, far away.
Careful, you’ll have Mr Irony Fail saying, “Hahahaha you don’t know the difference between Star Trek and Star Wars!”
And yeah, you’d think a good little MRA like schticky would know and approve of someone who’s been a rape apologist.
So wait, you’re a blogger now, Schtick? Link to your blog, please.