Well,I got carried away there. It’s not literally the whole world. Only a teensy weensy portion of it.
The fellows at A Voice for Men, you see, evidently stung by criticism that they aren’t activists, have begun engaging in real, honest-to-goodness real-world activism, by which I mean that a handful of them, some in Canada and at least one in Australia, have been putting up posters advertising the AVFM website.
In other words, their activism consists of putting up posters for a website whose only activism thus far has consisted of putting up posters for itself.
Well, eventually they’ll get the hang of it, I guess.
In any case, the A Voice for Menners have discovered something about activism: if you do things that are offensive enough, people will be offended. And so they’ve managed to offend some people in Canada and in Australia where their posters have gone up. In Australia, there have even been a couple of news articles written about them! For example, one in Melbourne’s Herald Sun says:
A MAN who is littering the city with posters promoting a website that encourages men to support rapists has declined the opportunity to explain himself.
The website, which the Herald Sun has chosen not to name, is campaigning to get men sitting on juries for rape trials to “vow publicly to vote not guilty, even in the face of overwhelming evidence that the charges are true”. …
The website’s publisher, Paul Elam, told the Herald Sun he was too busy watching the movie Air Force One to be interviewed, but later said by email he stood by the campaign.
Ooh! How very, very alpha of him.
Other articles (see here and here) describe the posters as “hate posters,” because one of them seems to suggest that women provoke domestic violence against themselves. The text of the poster reads “Domestic Violence Women Are Half the Problem.”
In fact, Elam and company are trying to suggest that women instigate half of all domestic violence, and thus are “half the problem,” but they’re so wedded to the easily misunderstood “half the problem” slogan that they somehow cannot seem to get this idea across in poster form. (This idea is itself incorrect, but that’s a whole other kettle of angry dudes.) Elam and company don’t quite seem to understand that an important part of activism is actually conveying your ideas to the general public rather than simply provoking people.
You can’t buy this kind of publicity!
Well, technically, you could, but no one would, because no one would willingly pay money for a publicity campaign that makes them appear to be hateful assholes — and in fact, even a teensy bit more hateful than they actually are.
So, congratulations, I guess?
If anyone wants to help AVFM in its publicity campaign, the super-sarcastic poster below, and a number of other poorly thought out and badly designed posters, can be downloaded from AVFM here by “anyone who wants to print and distribute them.”
Note: THIS IS A REAL AVFM POSTER. I didn’t make it up. See here.
Referring to the posters in the OP, all of which were either 1. victim blaming bullshit or 2. ordinary bullshit.
Alright, but when you’re just using these stats to promote a hate site that has nothing to do with men’s DV services and everything to do with being rape apologists, it kind of takes away from the “awareness” part of the whole deal. Obviously, the last thing someone who actually was sexually assaulted is to go to a website that glorifies rapists.
Also, the whole thesis of the posters, that this is feminism’s fault, is kind of a slap in the face to feminists like me who, unlike MRAs, have actually done things for male victims.
I never said they didn’t. What I said was that the core of the MRM is:
1. Women suck.
2. Abusers should never suffer consequences.
This is why Tom Martin and Thomas Ball are so popular. The fact that they advocate abuse is a feature, not a bug.
@cloudiah
Yeah, sorry about that.
I’m thinking of changing my username to “officially bored of the shtick of some guy bored with your schtick.”
pillowinhell – I am so sorry that happened to you.
Joe – not enough. You claimed that there is a “constant refrain” that wiomen don’t commit DV. As I’m sure our other current Dictionary Derailing 101 troll would tell you, two quotes from this thread (which say nothing remotely like what you’re claiming they’re saying to begin with) does not count as “constant refrain.”
More citations please. It would help if you actually found someone saying what you’re saying we’re saying, but we all know that’ll never happen (since nobody here has ever said it). But please, spend a while digging through other threads looking for statements you can pretend have anything to do with this and then get back to us.
Ugh, no need to apologize — I just thought I was being obtuse!
If it’s not clear:
Making posters advertising men’s crisis lines or help centers = raising awareness of the problem. Men who are in danger can call them or go to them.
Making posters saying that male victims have no recourse, with links to a website where people talk about rape as if it’s just a strange accident, or talk about how rape victims make stuff up = vindictively harming men,
So, those MRA posters are lacking in intersectionality. Here’s one to help them fix that:
http://imgur.com/nP8rS
@Myoo
Incredible.
@Ugh – the posters that were being torn down did not bear that slogan (see video I posted).
Also, I’m not about to argue with your take on the shelter situation in the US, I don’t know if it’s true or not, but I do know that men are seriously under-served in DV shelter places in the UK (see links I posted).
You say that helping men who suffer from DV is no part of the MRM. Well, reading around men’s rights sites it’s been one of the issues that a stood out to me, maybe because as a DV victim myself (at the hands of my psycho dad) it’s personal.
And rather than going to Avfm and arguing with them about the numerous things I disagree with them on* (@hellkell too -) No, I think I’ll put my time and energy into something like Mankind (a charity / helpline that directly helps male victims of DV in the UK) or C.A.L.M. (I need to read up more about this one) or similar. Y’know, actually DOING something, even if it’s just postering / fundraising.
(*I’m not sure I’ve ever posted on Avfm, I have posted on the Spearhead a bit, even though they’re Xtian conservative and I’m very not…).
i want just one mra with a sense of literary style that is not an ad hoc mash up of a teenager’s diary and a particularly enthusiastic nascar commentator. just one. i dont tink thats too much to ask.
Here I am, late to the party.
Pillowinhell, didn’t they just change hate speech laws in Canada? Or at least they were thinking of changing them.
So Joe, what is your opinion on jury nullification of rape trials, “even in the face of overwhelming evidence that the charges are true?”
[quote]i want just one mra with a sense of literary style that is not an ad hoc mash up of a teenager’s diary and a particularly enthusiastic nascar commentator. just one. i dont think thats too much to ask.
[/quote]
The evidence suggests that it is indeed too much to ask for.
Lies my misandrist professors have told me:
Participation is worth 30% of your grade–Misandry!! Men can’t be expected to participate!
Doing your homework every day will help you do better on tests–Misandry! Men’s somethingsomething brains mean that they do better on tests without doing homework! (Probably something about rotating 3D objects in space.)
Do not use computers in class–Misandry!!!! Women are the only ones wasting their time on Facebook! Men are more logical and rational and therefore use computers only for manly, logical things!
When forming the passé composé with être, the past participle must agree in gender and number with the subject–Misandry!!!!!! French is for girls! Men only take French to bang hot French chicks (as long as they shave, amirite), so these girly rules are for girls! GIRRRLS!!
I’m sure there are other misandrist lies my teachers have told me, but I’m just a girl. I guess I forgot.
Agreed. Here is the link of a feminist organization in the UK that is working to address this: http://www.respect.uk.net/
They provide men’s hotlines, shelters, and services. See the difference between that writing hundreds of articles praising a child abuser? That’s the difference between real organizations and the MRM.
Mankind looks like a good organization. See, if the MRM was real, their posters would have a link to websites like that instead of to hate sites.
Yet again, you’ve hit upon a very serious difference between the MRM and real activism
Actually, evidence has shown that instead of doing that, you’re going to come here again and again to argue that we’re wrong to disagree with all the abuser apologists.
@Ugh – So I’m looking at this as an org to help men who are DV vics, that I could do something for:
http://www.mankind.org.uk/
And I just started reading about this:
“…All that men are and can be in the 21st century is lost in marketing crap.
We would like to help you tear up the stereotypes and challenge the norms. We want to make a space for you to be opinionated, funny and outspoken about everything that you are and want to be. We’re not here to preach but to inspire, to ‘reset’ male stereotypes so that we can live our lives without bowing to the expected. Because with suicide the biggest killer of men under 35 in the UK and 3 out of every 4 suicides being male, something is badly wrong. So let’s have some fun finding out what the new rulebook looks like.
We feel that it’s the least that men deserve, so here it is.
All men welcome.
That’s our manifesto and we’d like to know yours…”
http://www.thecalmzone.net/manifesto/
Which sounds like it could be a positive site, too….
Since Some Boring Guy will no longer grace us wilth his presence, I thought I’d summarize his arguments:
It’s not beating if it’s only once!
I’ll deprive the word of its potence.
And the things that I cite
say (oh shit) I’m not right.
I guess I just proved I’m a dunce.
I mean, seriously, you disagree with child abuse. The vast majority of MRAs are holding up a child abuser as their finest example of activism.
This is a sign you should leave a movement.
Sounds great! Now compare that to the endless MRA statements on “manginas” “white knights” feminized men” as well as the many many statements to the effect of “all men want sex.” Not to mention all the policing of masculinity, calling people fat or sissy, etc.
Again, do you see the difference between the MRM and an actual organization?
@Hippodameia
Nice.
http://i1245.photobucket.com/albums/gg595/capnben1/e2352358.gif
@Blitzgal – I just gave my opinion on that. See above.
@Sharculese – Sorry, I save my stylish writing for something other than arguing on blogposts.
@Ugh – Challenge accepted. 🙂
Ugh – that is BRILLIANT!
@Joe so you’re leaving to go raise money or volunteer for Mankind? Because that would be great!
Thanks, Myoo! 🙂