Manosphere misogynists like to tell themselves fairy tales about women. Their favorite such tale, repeated endlessly, is one called “The Cock Carousel” – sometimes referred to in expanded form as the “Alpha Asshole Cock Carousel” or the “Bad Boy Cock Carousel.” (Hence that Rooster-riding gal you see in this blog’s header about half the time.)
Despite the different names, the story is always, monotonously, the same: In their late teens and twenties, when they’re at the height of their sexual appeal, women (or at least the overwhelming majority of them) have sex in rapid succession with an assortment of charismatic but unreliable alpha males and “bad boys” who make their vaginas (or just ‘ginas) tingle. Then, sometime in their mid-to-late twenties, these women “hit the wall,” with their so-called sexual market value (or SMV) dropping faster than Facebook’s stock price. As Roissy/Heartiste puts it, in his typically overheated prose:
So sad, so tragic, the inevitable slide into sexual worthlessness that accompanies women, the withering tick tock of the cosmic clock stripping their beauty in flayed bits of soulletting mignons like psychological ling chi. A sadistic thief in the night etching, billowing, draping and sagging a new affront to her most preciously guarded asset.
While many women try to pretend they’ve still “got it,” even at the ripe old age of thirty, they inevitably have to either get off or get thrown off the “cock carousel.” At this point the more savvy women glom onto some convenient “beta male” who, while somewhat lacking in sexual appeal, will at least be a good husband and provider for them – and in many cases the children they’ve had with alpha male seed. Those women who don’t accept the new reality are destined to end up alone and childless, surrounded by cats.
To borrow the phrase South Park used in its episodes about Scientology and Mormonism, this is what manosphere men actually believe. Not only that, but they claim that this fairy tale is based on real science.
So who are these mysterious alpha males that get the women so excited? As one guide to pickup artist (PUA) lingo puts it:
In animal hierarchies, the Alpha Male is the most dominant, and typically the physically strongest member of the group. For example, in wolf packs, the “alpha wolf” is the strongest member of the pack, and is the leader of the group. This position of leadership is often achieved by killing or defeating the previous Alpha Male in combat. Alpha wolves have first access to food as well as mating privileges with the females of the pack.
Social status among human social groups is less rigidly defined than in the animal kingdom, but there are some recognizable parallels. Although people don’t often engage in physical violence to achieve dominance, there are still recognizable leaders in different fields who have wide access to material resources and women.
Because the qualities of the Alpha Male (such as social dominance and leadership) are attractive to women, many PUAs have adopted these ideals as models of emulation. In fact, the term “alpha” has come be shorthand for the qualities of an attractive man, and it is a common refrain among PUAs to be “more alpha” or to “out alpha” competitors.
There’s a certain logic to all this. But unfortunately for the PUAs and other manospherians the notion of the Alpha male is based on bad science. The notion of Alpha dominance, as the definition above notes, came originally from studies of wolf packs. Even if we assume that wolf behavior is somehow a good model upon which to base our understanding of human romance – as manosphere men and evolutionary psychologists tend to do – the science behind the Alpha male wolf has now come completely undone, with many of those who promulgated the theory in the first place decades ago now explicitly repudiating it.
The problem, you see, is that the studies underlying the notion of the alpha male wolf, who aggressively asserts his dominance over beta males in order to rule the pack, were all based on observations of wolves in captivity. In the real world, wolf packs don’t work that way at all. Most wolf packs are basically wolf families, with a breeding pair and their pups. When male pups reach adulthood, they don’t fight their fathers for dominance — they go out and start their own families.
As noted wolf behavior expert L. David Mech, one of those who helped to establish and popularize the notion of the alpha wolf in the first place, explains on his website:
The concept of the alpha wolf is well ingrained in the popular wolf literature at least partly because of my book “The Wolf: Ecology and Behavior of an Endangered Species,” written in 1968, published in 1970, republished in paperback in 1981, and currently still in print, despite my numerous pleas to the publisher to stop publishing it. Although most of the book’s info is still accurate, much is outdated. We have learned more about wolves in the last 40 years then in all of previous history.
One of the outdated pieces of information is the concept of the alpha wolf. “Alpha” implies competing with others and becoming top dog by winning a contest or battle. However, most wolves who lead packs achieved their position simply by mating and producing pups, which then became their pack. In other words they are merely breeders, or parents, and that’s all we call them today, the “breeding male,” “breeding female,” or “male parent,” “female parent,” or the “adult male” or “adult female.” In the rare packs that include more than one breeding animal, the “dominant breeder” can be called that, and any breeding daughter can be called a “subordinate breeder.”
So the dominant male wolves – those whom manosphere dudes would still call the alphas – achieve this position not by being sexy badasses but simply by siring and taking responsibility for pups. To use the terminology in the manner of manosphere dudes, alphas become alphas by acting like betas. That’s right: alphas are betas. (For more of the details, see this paper by Mech; it’s in pdf form.)
Also, they’re wolves and not humans, but that’s a whole other kettle of anthropomorphized fish.
Anand,
I don’t remember anyone inviting you here or asking you to keep coming back. As you’ve been dishonest from the get go, I don’t think you’ll be missed.
No one cares what you think of feminists (or anything, really). Don’t let the door hit you on the way out.
Wait, who called him gay?
I’m actually going to defend the grammar snarking, since I started it. He was complaining about stereotypes about MRAs and I told him that he was acting exactly like an MRA stereotype, including the two-dot ellipsis. So I wasn’t trying to be all “your grammar is bad, therefore your argument is invalid,” I was just pointing out that he was, in fact, conforming exactly to the stereotype he was complaining about.
Pecunium, good point about the land bridge. I don’t remember if Turtledove referenced that specifically. Also, read a rather good paleoarcheology book (I’m thinking “America B.C.”, but not the stupid one), regarding the author’s research into evidence of human settlement submerged offshore along the northwest coast of North America. His theory is that the earliest human arrivals came by boat, along the coast, and the vast majority of the evidence of their presence is now under two hundred feet of very cold seawater.
Gosh, Anand seemed a bit thin-skinned, or am I being harsh?
Katz, he also used two full stops to end a sentence. Is there a special MRA finishing school in which that is taught?
Katz, I don’t think anyone did. The only comment that might imply that kind of thing would be the “go sit on a cactus in a desert of legos” thing at the end of Anarchonists’ second reply…
…and that’s a stretch, because the only way I was able to conclude that was because of the reply:
So, I’m just guessing. Any better guesses?
MRAs seem to have decided that the two dot thing can sub in for any other form of punctuation on an as-needed basis.
Anand, if you’re reading this, I didn’t call you a 13 year old. I essentially called you immature. I said that only 13 year olds (someone who is immature) would think that being rude and insensitive is cool.
Also, if you pride your self on being rude, you should be able to handle it when people aren’t nice to you.
You made a claim that MRAs and feminists are equivalent. You provided no supporting evidence. Your argument got eviscerated because we’ve heard that one many times before and know how to refute it. Now you’re mad because one not particularly clever or original internet comment didn’t cause us to change our feminist ways? Boo hoo.
I noticed that Anand didn’t reply to the people who didn’t insult him either. One might infer he actually has zero evidence to support his claims.
Robert: The book I have which details the subject is Lost World by Tom Koppel. It’s a pretty good study of the present work in the area, coupled to some cultural anthropology about the Haida and Tlingit peoples live there now (and what their creation stories might tell us about how people came to be there).
Well, THAT was a pitiful flounce.
1/10.
Wow. Ummm… what? Who called Anand a gay thirteen year old? And… what?
*Goes back to check*
No… I do not think anyone called you gay. Thirteen years old, true, but to be fair, your argumentation technique does leave a lot to be desired, so I feel they were just trying to be charitable in their assumption. Methinks you’re seeing what you want to see, and what you want to see is a bunch of angry feminists insulting men left and right. That’s the standard reaction of every MRA who sees a feminist. Couple that with the typing style of the average MRA, and it does make your claim of not siding with them more than a little suspicious. So, even if I personally have been patient with you, neutral even (I’ll explain why, in a moment), does not mean that they were wrong in calling you out.
Especially since you make such a big deal about someone supposedly insulting your gender. That’s something MRAs do. I’ve read the whole conversation, and I haven’t felt anyone has insulted my gender (except MRAs and PUAs and trolls who imply all of us men are secretly rapists). When someone says “those asshole men who do X”, I do not assume they say all men are assholes, or that all men do X. I assume they’re talking about the asshole men who do X. That it’s the ‘doing X’ part that makes these men assholes. This is another MRA bullshit “argument”. So, even if you don’t identify as an MRA, you still seem to rely on their talking points a lot.
I know you’re not reading this, Anand, but just in case you still are, I have one more piece of advice to you: Staying neutral does not prove you are better than anyone else. It just shows you are not personally affected by any of the issues you claim to care about. Members of oppressed groups can get emotional about issues that, you know, they actually experience. If you had to live your life not being seen as fully human by those in power, you would feel a little upset, too, when a privileged little shit who thinks he’s above everyone else walks into the room and starts berating them for not being nice enough to people who have admitted to getting sexually aroused by the thought of fucking their shit up..
It’s arrogant, it’s ignorant, and it’s acting like a total jerk. I should know. I’ve been there, and I’m still there regarding a lot of issues.
I’m a straight, white cis man from a middle class background in the western world. I’m able-bodied and highly educated. I have enormous privilege. Guess what? I can afford to stay neutral, because the world is pretty much designed for people like me. I’m the socially mandated default to which everybody else is an exception. I do not have a personal stake in any of the struggles a huge part of the people of the world are going through on a daily basis. I have been blinded by my privilege more times than I can count, and I have rightfully been called out. Here’s the thing: Instead of denying the existence of your privilege*, you acknowledge it. You listen, and you try to understand. You do not dismiss the experience of those who have suffered because you “have never seen any signs of anything like this, and my experience trumps everyone else’s”.
Yes, it hurts to hear these things. I remember the first time I came face to face with my privilege, when I encountered institutionalized social injustice, something that had been going on for a long time and would proceed to go on, that I had been utterly blind to before. I went for literally hours just pacing back and forth, crying and repeating to myself: “I didn’t know. I didn’t know! Why didn’t I see it? Why didn’t I realize? What’s wrong with me?”
I didn’t have a word for it back then, but the answer was: “privilege”. Having privilege does not make you a bad person. You did not choose the body and the background you were born in. However, it does make life easier for you than for somebody who wasn’t as lucky as you, and you need to acknowledge that.
Being a man, I am not affected by institutionalized misogyny. I am not the target for hate groups like the MRM. I am not personally affected by committees making decisions about my right to bodily autonomy. If I’m the victim of violence, people do not say I was asking for it. I do not get objectified and dehumanized by the media. I do not have to work twice as hard to get the acknowledgement I deserve. If I apply for a job, I am not assumed to be quitting after a few years to stay home and raise babies (and presumably eat bonbons, although I could go for some chocolate bonbons right now. Mmm… chocolate). And so on.
Similarly, being white, I’m not affected by institutionalized racism. I may have trouble finding a job sometimes (who hasn’t, under the capitalist system?), but whether I want it or not, whether I choose it or not whether I like it or not, I’m still better off than somebody with a foreign name, foreign skin color and foreign facial features. I’m still considered more trustworthy, more hard-working and more intelligent by those doing the hiring, and therefore I’m more likely to be hired than somebody who has the exact same credentials, but whose race does not by default carry as many positive mental images as mine.
That’s privilege. I have it in spades. However, the difference is whether you acknowledge it and work to make people aware of the fact that privilege is a real thing, or whether you believe some Randian bullshit about all good things happening to you being all your own doing. That you “make your own luck”. That those in a worse position than you are there because they haven’t worked as hard as you have. That the reason the world is pretty much run by white men is proof of the inherent awesomeness of the mighty white man. Instead of, you know, institutional bias.
Huh. That last bit sounds a tad more likely, doesn’t it?
*Yes, you do have privilege as a man, even if you are not white. It’s called intersectionality, look it up. It’s very enlightening.
TL, DR: Neutrality does not imply objectivity, nor does taking sides imply prejudice. The more privilege you have, the more you can afford to stay neutral, as you’re not personally affected by the issue in question.
LOL.
That guy got BURNED.Now i see how MRAs are made.
Really, Goddess? Nice half-baked tone argument.
Alpha males exist and if you women think they dont, then you havent experienced the college dating scene.
I say this because i sleep with a different girl every week. I’ve even slept with one of my college professors. Drunk girls, cougars, sluts are plenty and best part about being a white male with a hot body is you get to pick. I’ve been a introvert till the end of high school and was a virgin at 17 when my friend just felt pity on me and set me up with a girl. I took her out on dates, always stood by her and basically devoted my life to her while giving her personal space. I fell in love with her and she said she loved me too. I took a part time job through high school to raise money for college and decided that we would get married after college. I was basically a ‘beta male’.
Needless to say, she cheated on me with a guy she barely knew. I quit my job and went into mild depression and spend my days contemplating suicide until i became friends with the cool guy from high school. He taught me to drink, smoke and use marijuana all in a few months but more importantly he taught me the “game”.
Now im here in college sleeping with all the girls i can in short time. I just think of all girls as pussies to conquer. I get a lot of sex with occasional clingy girl problems and some broken female hearts from my past endeavors. I thought sex was all i needed.
But deep down, i still want love, a family, a garage, kids and to grow old together and die. I want my forever after, but i learned that thinking that way only leads to heartbreak. I became insecure and so i dump girls before they dump me and cheat on them before they cheat on me.
I basically became someone else. I stopped seeing women as potential partners worthy of love but more as sex objects.
Am i happy?
I dont know, but sex is plenty.
I changed from a virgin introvert to a confident stud.
I basically became an “Alpha male” And i dont regret it.
Um, no. Bigotry is never the fault of the target of that bigotry.
Cool story, bro who totally has a six-pack
Actually, I have. And from what I’ve seen, it relies more on piss-drunkenness and a lack of parental controls than on any artificial biological classifications which have since been disproven by the originators of that theory itself.
Bro, do you even READ? Scroll up to David’s post, and do so now.
So you don’t have anything you want, but just meaningless sex that you’re not even sure you’re happy with? And you think that’s an effective sales pitch why, exactly?
Cool story dude who has a six-pack (at least until the party starts).
Because I totes believe you never really believed the stories you read in Penthouse Letters, until they happened to you.
1) Yes I have, and
2) Why are you only addressing the women here?
A garage? Of all the weird things to put in a list of stuff you’d want in your fantasy life, a garage?
You also changed from likely-decent person to a definitely-crappy one.
In case you were wondering, it’s the fact you “think of all girls as pussies to conquer” and you “stopped seeing women as potential partners worthy of love but more as sex objects” that make you not a decent person.
RE: Asixpack
Alpha males exist and if you women think they dont, then you havent experienced the college dating scene.
Sweetheart, I’m a grown man who’s kinky. I know what I’m talking about.
I say this because i sleep with a different girl every week.
So has my husband, during his wilder years. More, during his brief period as the sacred harlot of a bar. Your point being?
I quit my job and went into mild depression and spend my days contemplating suicide
Uh, dude. You so sure that’s a “mild” depression?
I just think of all girls as pussies to conquer.
I pity you.
Am i happy? I dont know, but sex is plenty.
Yeah, buddy. That’s why you’re gloating to strangers on the Internet about how much sex you have and how you TOTALLY ARE OVER THAT but you secretly wish you had your June Cleaver and a picket fence. You’re totally secure and totally alpha. You bet.
Did I mention I pity you?
BTW, I think my college’s drunken hookup scene was fuelled more by hey, parents aren’t around to object and nobody has to get up early tomorrow, so why not? Drunken hookups are just what a lot of young people do because they’re bored and they can, nothing particularly complicated about it.