Pickup gurus write a lot about how to (allegedly) get sex, or how they (allegedly) got sex, but almost nothing about sex itself. It’s pretty clear that a lot of PUAs are more interested in the psychological manipulations and power games inherent in “game,” or in adding another notch to their score, than they are in the actual sex that sometimes results from all their efforts.
It goes without saying that most PUAs have little interest in their partners’ pleasure. In a post with the title It Doesn’t Matter If She Orgasms Or Not, pickup guru Roosh explained that once upon a time,
I used to try to last as long as possible in bed. I wanted to make sure the girl got hers before I got mine, and the reason I did that was because I thought she would be attracted to me more and want to see me again.
But, Roosh being the asshole he is, even this minimal level of consideration – which he extended to his partners for his own selfish reasons – turned out to be too much for him to keep up:
Gradually I just stopped caring, and soon everything I did in bed was for my pleasure only. The only reason I’d delay orgasm is to make mine better, and I pretended I don’t hear her the first time she told me to drill slower or not to go so deep. I did whatever I wanted because I came to value my orgasm as sacred, and her pleasure as second to mine.
Given that sex with him in was likely not such a great treat to begin with, he found that being completely selfish didn’t actually make the girls he was with like him any less.
Girls didn’t want to fuck me more, they didn’t want to fuck me less. Not caring about their sexual pleasure had no effect on repeat calls and repeat sex.
No wonder PUAs are so obsessed with very young women – they’re less likely to have experienced good sex, and more likely to be willing to put up with bad simply because they don’t yet realize how good sex can get.
Back in 2008 when he wrote that post, Roosh’s main sexual worry was coming too quickly; these days it seems he has trouble coming at all. Now, there are plenty of reasons why guys can’t orgasm – health conditions, prescription medicine side effects, everyday anxieties, decreased sensitivity with age, and so on. Guys shouldn’t pressure themselves into coming on demand, or feel bad if they can’t.
But Roosh actually seems to feel good about his inability to orgasm – because he’s learned to use this bit of sexual dysfuction as a handy tool to manipulate his partners further:
Not being able to orgasm is one of the best ways to make a girl feel anxious and insecure. When I’m unable to come, which often happens with condoms (raw dog for life), I simply stop sex and say, “I’m not going to make it.” I can almost see her hamster spinning…
Is he not attracted to me anymore?
Is there something wrong with my vagina?
Should I give him a blowjob even though I don’t want to?
These are not the sorts of questions any straight man who’s not an utter creep wants his partner asking herself.
Roosh continues, gloating that his inability to orgasm
also shapes the power structure of the relationship. She knows that a man who doesn’t orgasm is more likely to stray to get that orgasm. As a result, she tests you less and does more things to win your favor.
Or she finds someone else who’s not a complete asshole, and moves on.
How about the fact that what they’re doing is basically overt psychological manipulation. This shit isn’t like slight emotive manipulation. We’re talking hardcore mindfuckery here, as in the kind of shit practiced by sociopaths to work their way up the ranks of society. What they’re doing is amoral and frankly wrong.
Oh, bullshit they’re not.
Oh by the way Noms, I insult people when they say shit that’s stupid, ignorant and/or offensive. Not when say they don’t like how some words sound.
‘Cause y’know. priorities.
A quote from page one of Heartiste’s blog:
“The way to get around this peculiar female instinct is to follow classic anti-slut defense game strategy. Agree with the girl, without really agreeing with her. That is, verbally assent to her pull back, while physically continuing to push for sex. If you get resistance the whole way, try a freeze-out, where you calmly and without a trace of spite, simply turn your back and occupy yourself with some other interest, like a video game or a book.”
THIS IS LITERALLY HOW-TO-RAPE ADVICE.
Why am I not surprised.
Unfortunately, Om Nom, I only speak Latin, Greek, and English.
My boyfriend who speaks six languages, although he does not speak ancient Egyptian, would like to add that in German it would be “In die Angelegenheiten des Neigunges, es gibt nicht Streit” and in all languages it is good advice.
Oh, and apparently in French it’s “en les affaires du goût, il n’y a pas de différend.”
“In zaken van gading, geen twistgesprek.” Dutch!
@thebewilderness
I know this is off topic, but how did things turn out with that guy who was trying to discredit you by referencing a comment he saw on a radfem blog?
I think it’s important to bear in mind, for the sake of context, that Noms spent, oh… about two days, I think? arguing that women are objectively more attractive than men.
@ozy
In french it would be more along the lines of “avec les affaires du gout, il manque la dispute.” I’m a bit rusty with my french, but that’s a bit more gramatically correct.
So as I said, guy has a hard time accepting that aesthetic preferences are subjective.
“Fi al-Mawdduw’aat al-taqdiiliyyaat, lasnahu hunaaka jidaali.” Arabic! He would like to point out that he got out his dictionary for that one AND transliterated it to the Roman alphabet, so MSN had better be suitably grateful.
Aworld: My boyfriend says that he sees how avec would fit, that makes sense actually. 😛
Ma français ce n’est pas trés bon.
Oh, do we need Latin history? *cracks knuckles*
First, the earliest I can find the phrase — De Gustibus Non Est Disputandum: Dramma Giocoso Per Musica Da Rappresentarsi In Monaco Di Baviera. Vötter. 1759.
Appears to be a Bavarian publisher, in 1759. Bavaria was a state of the Holy Roman Empire at that point. Ergo, Latin.
And that format? De gustibus non est disputandum? That isn’t classical Latin, that’s late Latin — as in, Latin of the Holy Roman Empire. So yeah, take it up with the pope?
What’s rapey about PUA? How about LMR?
And why are y’all talking in French? That’d be the “Latin based language” that makes my head hurt (it isn’t Latin)
“Panties” always sounds to me like it ought to describe something pink, frilly, and belonging to a six-year-old girl. I prefer “underwear” or “underpants” for what I wear.
Also, speaking of words we hate: “pussy” as a term for female genitalia. I have never been able to find it anything but completely goofy-sounding and unsexy. (Sadly, my partner loooooves that word, so, because I love him, I use it in sexy situations, but I still sort of sigh internally every single time.)
Je ne sais pas?
Lol, well at least you’re using French I can google, that works I guess.
I’m not too fond of “pussy” myself. (Man, could that ever be taken out of context.) But I struggle to find a better alternative.
Dracula — be coy, revive quaint.
That would be right charming of me, wouldn’t it?
“MSN: Wank. Masturbate. Jerk off. Rub my genitalia in a pleasurable fashion until I orgasm. WHATEVER.”
Polish the pearl 🙂
“That would be right charming of me, wouldn’t it?”
Verily.