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Roosh: Who needs orgasms, anyway?

Cat is not impressed with your PUA bullshit.

Pickup gurus write a lot about how to (allegedly) get sex, or how they (allegedly) got sex, but almost nothing about sex itself. It’s pretty clear that a lot of PUAs are more interested in the psychological manipulations and power games inherent in “game,” or in adding another notch to their score, than they are in the actual sex that sometimes results from all their efforts.

It goes without saying that most PUAs have little interest in their partners’ pleasure. In a post with the title It Doesn’t Matter If She Orgasms Or Not, pickup guru Roosh explained that once upon a time,

I used to try to last as long as possible in bed. I wanted to make sure the girl got hers before I got mine, and the reason I did that was because I thought she would be attracted to me more and want to see me again.

But, Roosh being the asshole he is, even this minimal level of consideration – which he extended to his partners for his own selfish reasons – turned out to be too much for him to keep up:

Gradually I just stopped caring, and soon everything I did in bed was for my pleasure only. The only reason I’d delay orgasm is to make mine better, and I pretended I don’t hear her the first time she told me to drill slower or not to go so deep. I did whatever I wanted because I came to value my orgasm as sacred, and her pleasure as second to mine.

Given that sex with him in was likely not such a great treat to begin with, he found that being completely selfish didn’t actually make the girls he was with like him any less.

Girls didn’t want to fuck me more, they didn’t want to fuck me less. Not caring about their sexual pleasure had no effect on repeat calls and repeat sex.

No wonder PUAs are so obsessed with very young women – they’re less likely to have experienced good sex, and more likely to be willing to put up with bad simply because they don’t yet realize how good sex can get.

Back in 2008 when he wrote that post, Roosh’s main sexual worry was coming too quickly; these days it seems he has trouble coming at all. Now, there are plenty of reasons why guys can’t orgasm – health conditions, prescription medicine side effects, everyday anxieties, decreased sensitivity with age, and so on. Guys shouldn’t pressure themselves into coming on demand, or feel bad if they can’t.

But Roosh actually seems to feel good about his inability to orgasm – because he’s learned to use this bit of sexual dysfuction as a handy tool to manipulate his partners further:

Not being able to orgasm is one of the best ways to make a girl feel anxious and insecure. When I’m unable to come, which often happens with condoms (raw dog for life), I simply stop sex and say, “I’m not going to make it.” I can almost see her hamster spinning…

Is he not attracted to me anymore?

Is there something wrong with my vagina?

Should I give him a blowjob even though I don’t want to?

These are not the sorts of questions any straight man who’s not an utter creep wants his partner asking herself.

Roosh continues, gloating that his inability to orgasm

also shapes the power structure of the relationship. She knows that a man who doesn’t orgasm is more likely to stray to get that orgasm. As a result, she tests you less and does more things to win your favor.

Or she finds someone else who’s not a complete asshole, and moves on.

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whataboutthemoonz
9 years ago

I knew a guy who thought like that!

Turns out he was a rapist, and I no longer date him.

indifferentsky
9 years ago

“No wonder PUAs are so obsessed with very young women – they’re less likely to have experienced good sex, and more likely to be willing to put up with bad simply because they don’t yet realize how good sex can get.”

Very insightful.

MollyRen (@MollyRen)
9 years ago

I simply stop sex and say, “I’m not going to make it.” I can almost see her hamster spinning…

If someone suddenly stopped and said this to me during sex, my first words would probably be, “Are you going to have a heart attack?” XD

howardbann1ster
howardbann1ster
9 years ago

And…. yep, that’s pre-zactly what I expected them to think.

I didn’t expect the assholes to ADMIT it. Do they really have no idea what they sound like….?

heidihi
heidihi
9 years ago

“I pretended I don’t hear her the first time she told me to drill slower or not to go so deep…”

Does anyone else get a sick rapey creepy vibe off that sentence? I just…blech.

Moose
Moose
9 years ago

From his post: ‘I pretended I don’t hear her the first time she told me to drill slower or not to go so deep’.

Uh, dude, if a girl is telling you to not go so deep, it’s quite possibly because you are HURTING her at that exact moment. Putting your pleasure above someone else’s is one thing, but actually being willing to hurt someone just to have your fun… there are no words.

blitzgal
9 years ago

And yet these same guys BLAME WOMEN for not wanting to have sex with them! It’s so ridiculous. This issue is one of many reasons that many women do not bother with one night stands anyway — it’s not some stupid evo psych bullshit about how we have to devote so much energy to reproduction, blah blah blah. No, it’s because if we’re not gonna come anyway, then what’s the point?

AlexB
AlexB
9 years ago

I’m never clear with these guys how much is true and how much is just them sharing their unpleasant little misogynistic fap fantasies with a gullible and adoring audience. Except in the case of Heartiste where it’s really very clear.

This isn’t as implausible as Heartiste but I don’t see any reason to believe it either. By this guy’s own account of himself he’s manipulative and unscrupulous so is there any reason to credit anything he says? This story seems well-tailored to its audience.

Also, if it’s true, he’s basically admitting he’s a rapist.

Nobinayamu
Nobinayamu
9 years ago

… and I pretended I don’t hear her the first time she told me to drill slower or not to go so deep. I did whatever I wanted because I came to value my orgasm as sacred, and her pleasure as second to mine.

Nice.

For all those guys who think that women change their minds during sex for no good reason: that shit right there? Guys, don’t do that.

It’s one thing not to care if the person you’re having sex with has an orgasm. A selfish, stupid thing to be sure but -hey- more power to you. It’s something entirely different not to care if the person you’re having sex with is experiencing discomfort and/or pain. You don’t want to be “falsely accused”? Communication is incredibly important even and especially during consensual sex.
.
I enjoy mocking misogyny as much as the next person. But I know there are a lot of lurkers on this site; I’m being really serious. Don’t ignore the partner being penetrated if they ask you to slow down, change positions, lighten up, etc.

Catfish
Catfish
9 years ago

“The only reason I’d delay orgasm is to make mine better, and I pretended I don’t hear her the first time she told me to drill slower or not to go so deep. I did whatever I wanted because I came to value my orgasm as sacred, and her pleasure as second to mine.”

Dude, that’s just… wrong. Wrong on so many levels.

Not to mention, nobody likes a selfish lover.

Cliff Pervocracy
9 years ago

I pretended I don’t hear her the first time she told me to drill slower or not to go so deep.

Ow! Fuck!

So, basically, he’s confessing to rape here. I guess you can argue that if the girl put up with it, then technically, but fuck that. She told him to stop hurting her and he kept going–that she didn’t physically throw him off is not consent.

hellkell
hellkell
9 years ago

If it came down to having sex with guys like Roosh or never having sex again, I’d take never having sex again.

Nobinayamu
Nobinayamu
9 years ago

She told him to stop hurting her and he kept going–that she didn’t physically throw him off is not consent.

Presuming, of course, that she could have physically thrown him off of her. Depending on their position and/or disparity in height or weight she may have been unable.

Again, don’t do that shit.

And just to be clear the same rules apply for the partner who is being penetrated. If your partner asks you to stop doing something/moving a certain way/bouncing so hard/what ever knock it off.

hypatia arez (@justhypatia)

“Does anyone else get a sick rapey creepy vibe off that sentence? I just…blech.”

Definitely… icky, disgusting, nasty? Take your pick.

I also don’t know whether to be amused or horrified that he seems just “lasting” is the key to a woman’s pleasure. No wonder he doesn’t notice a difference, he didn’t know how to get women off in the first place.

the twisted spinster
the twisted spinster
9 years ago

Sounds like Roosh is feeling his approaching old age. I predict in the not too distant future he’ll repost this article only with the words “erectile dysfunction” replacing “can’t orgasm.”

AlexB
AlexB
9 years ago

if it came down to having sex with guys like Roosh or never having sex again, I’d take never having sex again.

Yep, celibacy > rape.

ostara321
ostara321
9 years ago

Does anyone else get a sick rapey creepy vibe off that sentence? I just…blech.

YEP. Big time. My first thought was, “guess who else doesn’t give a shit if the other person is having fun or not? Rapists.”

Falconer
Falconer
9 years ago

If PUAs would take all the energy they put into trying to manipulate women into having sex with them, and put it into learning how to have great sex, well then doubtless their roster of sexual partners would drop but their frequency of sexual encounters would increase with that partner or those partners they get into LTRs with.

What’s that, you say? The only thing that matters to Roosh et al. is getting to put another notch on their “got my dick wet” belts? Oh, well, then.

If they can’t be arsed to learn how to be good lovers, it’s just less dating-scene competition for us who have.

Incidentally, Kitty may not be impressed, but she’s making an impression on me …. I may have trouble sleeping tonight.

pecunium
9 years ago

What a douchebag (rooshbag?).

Falconer
Falconer
9 years ago

I’ll just leave this here, with a major trigger warning for body horror:

Cliff Pervocracy
9 years ago

TMI TIME: My boyfriend doesn’t orgasm very often. The first few times, it did set my “hamster spinning,” if that’s what you want to call concern for your partner’s pleasure. Although it was less “oh no, now he won’t like me” and more “oh no, I want him to feel good.”

He explained to me that this is just the way his body works, he’s okay with it, and he gets pleasure without orgasm. We had lots of lovely, unworried sex after that.

…Then again, I’ve never broken up with a guy because he did orgasm, on account of on what planet does that make sense.

Cliff Pervocracy
9 years ago

…I think Roosh just spelled out, in so many words, that he gets more pleasure from playing headgames with women’s self-esteem than he does from having an orgasm.

jesus.

howardbann1ster
howardbann1ster
9 years ago

I mean, seriously. His criteria for whether it’s okay? WHETHER IT GETS HIM MORE CALLBACKS.

“Guys, I tried NOT slapping woman, but even if I don’t slap them they still don’t call me back. So I don’t see the upside, guess I’m gonna keep on slapping them.”

Seriously. That is some fucked-up abuser logic right there.

marc2020
marc2020
9 years ago

Shit leave it to this asshole to make sex sound like the most depressing thing on the face of the Earth.

ithiliana
ithiliana
9 years ago

I have but one thing to say: ICK! What a CREEP!

Falconer
Falconer
9 years ago

TMI TIME: My boyfriend doesn’t orgasm very often.

TMI myself, but sometimes I don’t, and I think it may have to do with how tired I am at the time. If my mind’s not in the game, I think the neurotransmitters may have trouble releasing.

We tried to force it the first few times just by keeping on going, but I always knackered myself first.

whataboutthemoonz
9 years ago

“I pretended I don’t hear her the first time she told me to drill slower or not to go so deep…”

Does anyone else get a sick rapey creepy vibe off that sentence? I just…blech.

Yes, yes I did.

Seriously, though, who refers to sex as drilling? Like, do you WANT me to treat your pee pee like a jackhammer? Because that sounds like no fun. I feel bad for people who have bad sex, but not when they’re terrible.

ostara321
ostara321
9 years ago

No, it’s because if we’re not gonna come anyway, then what’s the point?

Right, exactly. I do think there IS something to the “greater likelihood of having to deal with an unplanned pregnancy” with some women, but certainly not all, and I don’t think it even fucking NEEDS to be an evo psych schtick. Saying that some women may abstain more because, babies, is basically the same as saying some women are more cautious than others, or that some women are more cautious in different ways than others. Which is something that anybody who knows women and has half decent observational skills could tell you.

But mostly I think it’s more that there is a reasonable likelihood that the woman won’t even really enjoy the sex all that much, and possibly will wind up with someone who does whatever the hell he wants, regardless of her consent.

It reminds me of the ROTK movie quote by Gimli:

“Certainty of death? Small chance of success? What are we waiting for? ”

Only I think for a lot of ladies it’s probably more like:

“Certainty of shitty sex? Possibility of getting raped? Uh, I’ll pass.”

thebionicmommy
thebionicmommy
9 years ago

The comment section over there is just as bad. Dchero said

I’ve found that getting her almost there and not letting her get it has a powerful effect on the female phyche that can best be described as a mix of confusion, anger, and love. I’d highly recommend it because of its entertainment value.

Orgasms are in the woman’s head.

and we know what a mess that is.

Possibly, barring your passion for cumming in seven seconds, everything else you do for your pleasure, she will like too, even if it is just due to you showing dominance.

Some idiots disguised as females take a man trying to please them as a sign of weakness, that is another issue.

Shit like this makes me really grateful to not be dating, so that I won’t have run ins with creeps like them.

cloudiah
9 years ago

Why did I go over there to read the whole post? And start to read the comments? WHY???

WordSpinner
WordSpinner
9 years ago

Cliff:

…I think Roosh just spelled out, in so many words, that he gets more pleasure from playing headgames with women’s self-esteem than he does from having an orgasm.

I think you nailed it. That is… disturbing.

Falconer
Falconer
9 years ago

The female “phyche”?

a mix of confusion, anger, and love. I’d highly recommend it because of its entertainment value.

Phuche you.

Cliff Pervocracy
9 years ago

It’s usually more a mix of confusion, anger, and resentful masturbation.

heidihi
heidihi
9 years ago

Regarding blitzgal “if we’re not gonna come anyway, then what’s the point?” and CliffPervocracy & Falconer speaking of their own experiences with sex that does not result in orgasm, i do think it’s worth pointing out that sometimes, sex can be lovely (and thus not pointless) even without orgasm for one or more partners. But i’m guessing that blitzgal was more speaking of ‘if the sex is going to be horrible for myriad reasons such as my partner(s) not caring how it feels for me…”

ithiliana
ithiliana
9 years ago

ICK MORE CREEPAZOIDS!

(And who says a woman who doesn’t orgasm through PIV with dude can’t get herself off all on her own, if she wishes??????????)

pillowinhell
9 years ago

Um..when do Roosh or Heartiste not write out abuser and/or rapist fantasies?

Must take so much bravery to type them out anonymously on the net.

whataboutthemoonz
9 years ago

“(And who says a woman who doesn’t orgasm through PIV with dude can’t get herself off all on her own, if she wishes??????????)”

QFT.

ShadetheDruid
ShadetheDruid
9 years ago

Falconer: It’s ok, I didn’t need to sleep tonight anyway. *Watches the cat very closely* O.O

Seriously though, that was pretty freaky.

daffodilsparkle
9 years ago

It is funny, I feel as though if guys can make a girl orgasm, repeatedly, they feel like a hotshot, they don’t want to know if a girl is faking…. however, if they don’t know, they don’t care. They just want to get off. BUT, what you gotta do is find that guy who wrks passed the finish line if he thinks you did not get all out of it, that he did. Those guys are awesome ! We should clone them!

jennydevildoll
9 years ago

“I used to try to last as long as possible in bed. I wanted to make sure the girl got hers before I got mine, and the reason I did that was because I thought she would be attracted to me more and want to see me again.”

That plan actually works pretty good when the guy is actually good enough in bed to pull it off. So, it didn’t work for him? Ok.

Falconer
Falconer
9 years ago

TEST

TEST

Falconer
Falconer
9 years ago

@Shade: I warned you, you fool! 😛

Cliff Pervocracy
9 years ago

The comments just seem like a “whoever cares least about women wins!” race to the bottom.

“I don’t care if my girlfriend has an orgasm.”
“Oh yeah? Well, I don’t care if my girlfriend even feels anything!”
“You think you’re tough? I don’t care if my girlfriend hates it!”
“Get this, guys: I don’t care if my girlfriend even has sex with me!”

“…Whoa. Too far, man.. Too far.”

Falconer
Falconer
9 years ago

@Cliff … great, now I’m imagining a very perverse filking of the Four Yorkshiremen.

ozymandias42
9 years ago

“Fap” is the ugliest world possible for masturbation. It makes me cringe every time I read it.

Everyone, Roosh V has confirmed that he’s a rapist on his blog.

Falconer
Falconer
9 years ago

Aw, crap, I forgot about the references to corporal punishment/child abuse in that sketch. Sorry, guize.

Falconer
Falconer
9 years ago

@Ozymandias — Huh. Is there a particular reason you don’t like that word? Not saying you can’t not like it, I’ve got no cringe reaction to it at all. Is there a word you’d prefer that maybe we could use instead? Obviously not “clop.”

BlackBloc (@XBlackBlocX)

Those of us who have been corrupted by the Sexy Losers comic strip before we figured out it was a bit problematic can never unlearn ‘fap’ as a term for masturbation, unfortunately. It fits so much with the sound… At least if it involves a penis (I believe the other onomatopea used by the strip was ‘schlick’).

marc2020
marc2020
9 years ago

I kind of like the fact that fap is a gender neutral term for self pleasure any one cap fap can’t they?

blitzgal
9 years ago

I thought “fap” was meant to describe the sound made when a guy masturbates, but yeah, now it’s become more gender neutral

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