Just a quick update on Eivind Berge: According to this news account, the Norwegian Men’s Rights blogger is considered enough of a threat to police officers that his two-week detention has been extended by four more weeks. According to the prosecutor, the “risk of recurrence of new criminal offenses” makes releasing him dangerous.
See my posts here and here for more on his arrest.
Maybe the Fifty Shades of Grey mentality is “too lazy to read through the slush pile, this will do – people bought Twilight so they’ll buy this shit too, right?’.
That’s what I figured, but I wondered where the hell he got 350 from. Something like 20,000 people a year die from accidental falls, most of which are falls from standing or from a bed or wheelchair.
Maybe he just guessed 350 was a really big number.
At any rate this is all moot because of how hilariously wrong and amoral the logic of “people die for other reasons, so who cares about a mass murder here or there?” is.
Argenti: I think we’re managing to confuse each other here. 😛 The conversation went:
Blah blah blah, stuff about people not considering non-Islamic terrorism terrorism or whatever I posted about (no mention of the actual most common sources of domestic terrorism in the US) – Me
Shade: Yeah. The majority of terrorists in the US are white, male, Conservative, Christian (of a “fundamentalist” stripe). – Pecunium
And then Owly quoted the latter, probably because it hit his “waa people are whining white male Christians again!” button rather than mine that didn’t. Pecunium was directing that paragraph at me, rather than quoting me.
I hope i’m not just misunderstanding your confusion, because then i’d be a giant idiot. 😛
I’ve never read either Twilight or Shades of Grey and I’ve heard enough about them to decide I don’t want to read them, which is kind of funny, because I like erotica and I like paranormal romance, and so I’d be the target demographic.
My theory is that Twilight and Shades of Grey are so popular is because they are the first entry into the genres for people who have never explored them before–since people who read and review erotica/romance aren’t really impressed. It’s like “No, no–here, let me give you some good stuff. Really. You can get your vampire/bdsm fix without having to put up with awful writing.”
Twilight seems to have come along at the right time to snap up the readers who had grown up with Harry Potter, developed a taste for fantasy, and were now discovering their hormones and looking for something else to read. 50 Shades of Grey is literally Twilight fanfic with the names changed. I wasn’t even kidding about that. So naturally the Twilight crowd is going gaga over it.
Done with that list, data is from wiki.
“This section does not include school massacres, workplace killings, hate crimes, or mass murders that took place primarily in a domestic environment, which form their own categories. Cases where the primary motive for the murders was to facilitate or cover up another felony, like robbery, are also not included.”
Note, unknown in the race/gender column may simply mean I can’t be arsed to go digging for the info, also, all assumptions are based on the name, and should be taken with salt.
Sheley, Nicholas Troy, 28; June 23-33, 2008 Sterling, Rock Falls & Galesburg, IL; Festus, MO — white male
Unruh, Howard Barton, 28; Sep. 6, 1949 Camden, NJ — white male
Wong, Jiverly Antares, 41; April 3, 2009 Binghamton, NY — Asian male
Hennard, George Pierre, 35; Oct. 16, 1991 Killeen, TX — unknown male
Huberty, James Oliver, 41; July 18, 1984 San Diego, CA — white male
Pough, James Edward, 42; June 17/18, 1990 Jacksonville, FL — African American male
McLendon, Michael Kenneth, 28; March 10, 2009 Kinston, Samson & Geneva, AL — white male
Starkweather, Charles, 19 & Fugate, Caril Ann, 14; Nov. 30, 1957 & Jan. 21-29, 1958 Lincoln & Bennet, NE & Douglas, WY — white male, unknown female
Phillips, Monroe, 58; March 6, 1915 Brunswick, G — unknown
Smith, Roland J., 51; Dec. 8, 1995 New York City, NY — unknown male
Ratzmann, Terry Michael, 44; March 12, 2005 Brookfield, WI — white male
Collins, Melvin, 38; Nov. 6, 1948 Chester, PA — unknown (assumed male)
Collins, Darnell, 33; June 17–21, 1995 New Jersey & New York City, NY — unknown (assumed male)
Gung Ung Chang; July 18/19, 1898 Melrose, CA — unknown (assumed Asian)
Reynolds, William, 35; April 6, 1902 Tuscumbia, AL — unknown (assumed male)
Akers, Arthur; April 9, 1916 Stuttgart, AR — unknown (assumed male)
Ashbrook, Larry Gene, 47; Sep. 15, 1999 Fort Worth, TX — white male
Everette, Eugene, 32; March 28/29, 1970 New York City, NY — unknown (assumed male)
Jim; March 1, 1889 Okeechobee, FL — unknown (assumed male)
Charles, Robert, 35; July 23–27, 1900 New Orleans, LA — African American male
Ferguson, Colin, 35; Dec. 7, 1993 Garden City, NY — African American male
Marcelino, Julian, 30; Nov. 24, 1932 Seattle, WA — unknown (assumed male)
Loughner, Jared Lee, 22; Jan. 8, 2011 Tucson, AZ — white male
Carlton, Julian, 30; Aug. 15, 1914 Spring Green, WI — unknown male
Pearson, Eric Emanuel, 56; March 16, 1968 Ironwood, MI — unknown (assumed male)
Bonner, William Ray, 25; April 22, 1973 Los Angeles, CA — African American male
Indian Gully; Aug. 1910 Willow Patch, NV — unknown (assumed Native American)
Cruse, William Bryan, 59; April 23, 1987 Palm Bay, FL — unknown (assumed male)
Cooper, Simon; Jan. 1/7, 1897 Magnolia & Lynchburg, SC — unknown (assumed male)
Zamora, Isaac Lee, 28; Sep. 2, 2008 Alger, WA — unknown (assumed male)
Young, Harry Lyman, 27 & Young, Jennings M., 35; Jan. 2, 1932 Brookline, MO — unknown males
Unknown; Sep. 7, 1982 Craig, AK — unknown
Dekraai, Scott Evans, 41; Oct. 12, 2011 Seal Beach, CA — white male
Brown, Carl Robert, 51; Aug. 20, 1982 Miami, FL — white male
Hawkins, Robert A., 19; Dec. 5, 2007 Omaha, NE — white male
Stewart, Robert Kenneth Wayne, 45; March 29, 2009 Carthage, NC — white male
Silka, Michael Alan, 25; April 28 / May 17–19, 1984 Fairbanks & Manley Hot Springs, AK — unknown (assumed male)
Bertucci, Clarence V., 23; July 8, 1945 Salina, UT — white male
Twigg, Gilbert, 30; Aug. 13, 1903 Winfield, KS — unknown (assumed male)
Ferri, Gian Luigi, 55; July 1, 1993 San Francisco, CA — white male
Jones, Walter, 20 & Jones, William, 18; Sep. 28, 1913 Harriston, MS — unknown (assumed male)
Holmes, James Eagan, 24 (alleged); July 20, 2012 Aurora, CO — white male
Unknown; Sep. 17, 1911 Colorado Springs, CO — unknown
Goins, John M., 49; March 18, 1926 Stockton & Galt, CA — unknown (assumed male)
Henry, DeWitt Charles, 26; July 23, 1977 Klamath Falls, OR — unknown (assumed male)
Drake, Lynwood Crumpler, 43; Nov. 7/8, 1992 Morro Bay, Paso Robles & San Miguel, CA — white male
Huff, Kyle Aaron, 28; March 25, 2006 Seattle, WA — white male
Vang, Chai Soua, 36; Nov. 21, 2004 Birchwood, WI — Asian male
Moreno, Eliseo Hernandez, 24; Oct. 11, 1983 College Station & Hempstead, TX — unknown (assumed Hispanic male)
Benoist, Emile Pierre, 20; Aug. 26, 1977 Hackettstown, NJ — unknown (I think Emile is the French male form of Emilie, but I’m not sure on that)
Harris, Will; Nov. 13, 1906 Asheville, NC — unknown (assumed male)
King, Alvin Lee, 45; June 22, 1980 Daingerfield, TX — unknown (assumed male)
Klink, Herman, 40; March 6, 1933 Cleveland, OH — unknown (assumed male)
Stewart, Howard Franklin, 37; Sep. 16 & Sep. 22, 1987 Lebanon, MO & Corsicana, TX — unknown (assumed male)
Moore, Lawrence W., 25; May 7, 1981 Salem, OR — unknown (assumed male)
Decker, Newt, 35; Nov. 15, 1908 Okmulgee, OK — unknown (assumed male)
Mellberg, Dean Allen, 20; June 20, 1994 Fairchild Air Force Base, WA — unknown (assumed male)
Pullen, Joe; Dec. 14, 1923 Drew, MS — unknown (assumed male)
McLeod, Harvey Glenn, 22; May 29, 1972 Raleigh, NC — unknown male
French, Kenneth Junior, 22; Aug. 6, 1993 Fayetteville, NC — unknown (assumed male)
Belachheb, Abdelkrim, 39; June 29, 1984 Dallas, TX — unknown
Peterson, Tyler James, 20; Oct. 7, 2007 Crandon, WI — white male
Hastings, Louis D., 39; March 3, 1983 McCarthy, AK — unknown (assumed male)
Sencion, Eduardo, 32; Sep. 6, 2011 Carson City, NV — Hispanic male
Clark, Michael Andrew, 16; April 25, 1965 Santa Maria, CA — unknown male
Aranda, Bennie Bonifacio, 26; Dec. 28, 1937 Oakland, CA — unknown (assumed male)
Mozingo, Douglas Arthur, 29; Oct. 1, 1982 Sacramento, CA — unknown (assumed male)
Sodini, George A., 48; Aug. 4, 2009 Bridgeville, PA — white male
Attebury, Ira, 64; April 27, 1979 San Antonio, TX — unknown (assumed male)
Popadich, Ronald J., 39; Feb 10-14, 2002 Garfield, NJ & New York City, NY — unknown (assumed male)
Casteel, Luther V., 42; April 14, 2001 Elgin, IL — unknown (assumed male)
Cho Mun Chu, 45; Sep. 6, 1988 New York City, NY — unknown (assumed Asian)
Sears, Charles, 32; June 27 – July 6, 1981 New York City, NY — unknown (assumed male)
Smith, Russell Lee, 28; May 24, 1975 Dayton, OH — African American male
Pearson, Moses, 31; April 25, 1976 Jacksonville, FL & Georgia — unknown (assumed male)
Lambright, Donald Martin, 30; April 5, 1969 Harrisburg, PA — unknown (assumed male)
Harrington, Robert Leonard, 35; June 11, 1982 Detroit, MI — unknown (assumed male)
Koullapis, Louis, 70; Jan. 12, 1965 Gardena, CA — unknown (assumed male)
Pruyn, Kenyon William, 32; Oct. 30, 1976 Mechanicville, NY — unknown (assumed male)
Cribbs, Ulysses L., 32; Nov. 26, 1977 Omaha, NE — unknown (assumed male)
Agas, Venerando, 52; July 10, 1995 New York City, NY — unknown (assumed male)
Pinkston, Charles; Oct. 10, 1927 Birmingham, AL — unknown (assumed male)
Cornell, —; 1863 Austin, NV — unknown
Thrower, Dennie, 34; Oct. 4, 1936 Windsor, NC — unknown (assumed male)
Wade, William S.; Aug. 24, 1909 Monroe, LA — unknown (assumed male)
Cooksey, Wesley, 39; Sep. 5, 1927 Evansville, IN — unknown (assumed male)
Brady, John, 22; Jan. 22 – Feb. 10, 1906 St. Louis, MO — unknown (assumed male)
Reeb, Henry H., 36; April 25, 1940 Burlington, IA — unknown (assumed male)
Wilkins, Nathan Van, 44; July 16/17, 2012 Tuscaloosa, AL — unknown (assumed male)
So, I was really hoping I’d come across at least one unknown with an apparently feminine name, but the closest is Emile and I’m fairly sure that’s the male version of Emilie (either that or a typo). That sums to —
Total — 89
African American male — 5
Asian male — 2
Hispanic male — 1
unknown — 5
unknown (assumed Asian) — 2
unknown (assumed Hispanic male) — 1
unknown (assumed male) — 46 / 47 (Idk where to list Emile, this might be assumed male 46, assumed female 1)
unknown (assumed Native American) — 1
unknown male — 7
white male — 19
unknown female — 1
Ignoring the ones where I’m guessing, that works out to one woman and 34 men; of those 34, 7 were of unknown race, 19 were white, and 8 were not white. Nineteen of 35 (I’m excluding where I had to guess) is 54%
There you have it NWO, just over half of mass murderers, where the race and gender is known, are white men (I counted unknown race as not white for that percentage btw).
Karalora — I have regular M&Ms, but your virtual M&Ms can be whatever kind you like!
Shade — ah, yeah, I was mistaken then, I thought pecunium was quoting you.
Was Owly saying the Colorado shooter was the product of an anti-christian, single-mother home? Wrong, on both counts.
I mean, whatever.
cloudiah — I think he was trying to claim that the CO shooter was an outlier, that most mass murderers are the result of atheism and single mother homes, but yeah, idk. I’m guessing he didn’t think anyone would actually bother going through the list of mass murderers (I’m bored, and kind of enjoy working with tedious data)
As for that claim about 80% of criminals being from single mother households, I can’t find anything because Santorum said something stupid and he’s clogging my search results. Nor can I find anything specific to deaths on flat ground (well, in humans anyways, horse racing is clogging that search) — falls in general rank well over 350 deaths a year, but most of those seem to be from an elevation.
Citations needed here NWO, you made the claim, now prove it.
Suspect’s neighbor: ‘He seemed like a normal kid’ – headline from cloudiah’s link.
Well that didn’t take long. >.<
NWO: Really? Do you have proof of this? A detailed list of all mass murderers for say the last 40 years or so and their stated reason for mass murdering would suffice. I’d like to see how over 50% of mass murders in the US are committed Christian fundies.
Do I have proof?
Yeah, I do. Are you going to listen to it? No. But, for the benefit of those follwing along at home, I will.
Whatever happened to correlation doesn’t equal causation? Suddenly now it does?
What causation have I stated? I was stating a correlation; and a preponderance, as a counter to the idiocy that all terrorists are somehow, “other”.
Here’s a round-up
— July 2008: A gunman named Jim David Adkisson, agitated at how “liberals” are “destroying America,” walks into a Unitarian Church and opens fire, killing two churchgoers and wounding four others.
— October 2008: Two neo-Nazis are arrested in Tennessee in a plot to murder dozens of African-Americans, culminating in the assassination of President Obama.
— December 2008: In Belfast, Maine, police discover the makings of a nuclear “dirty bomb” in the basement of a white supremacist shot dead by his wife. The man, who was independently wealthy, reportedly was agitated about the election of President Obama and was crafting a plan to set off the bomb.
— January 2009: A white supremacist named Keith Luke embarks on a killing rampage in Brockton, Mass., raping and wounding a black woman and killing her sister, then killing a homeless man before being captured by police as he is en route to a Jewish community center.
— February 2009: A Marine named Kody Brittingham is arrested and charged with plotting to assassinate President Obama. Brittingham also collected white-supremacist material.
— April 2009: A white supremacist named Richard Poplawski opens fire on three Pittsburgh police officers who come to his house on a domestic-violence call and kills all three, because he believed President Obama intended to take away the guns of white citizens like himself. Poplawski is currently awaiting trial.
— April 2009: Another gunman in Okaloosa County, Florida, similarly fearful of Obama’s purported gun-grabbing plans, kills two deputies when they come to arrest him in a domestic-violence matter, then is killed himself in a shootout with police.
— May 2009: A “sovereign citizen” named Scott Roeder walks into a church in Topeka, Kansas, and assassinates abortion provider Dr. George Tiller.
— June 2009: James Von Brunn opens fire at the Holocaust Museum, killing a security guard.
— February 2010: An angry tax protester named Joseph Ray Stack flies an airplane into the building housing IRS offices in Austin, Texas. (Media are reluctant to label this one “domestic terrorism” too.)
— March 2010: Seven militiamen from the Hutaree Militia in Michigan and Ohio are arrested and charged with plotting to assassinate local police officers with the intent of sparking a new civil war.
— March 2010: An anti-government extremist named John Patrick Bedell walks into the Pentagon and opens fire, wounding two officers before he is himself shot dead.
— May 2010: A “sovereign citizen” from Georgia is arrested in Tennessee and charged with plotting the violent takeover of a local county courthouse.
— May 2010: A still-unidentified white man walks into a Jacksonville, Fla., mosque and sets it afire, simultaneously setting off a pipe bomb.
— May 2010: Two “sovereign citizens” named Jerry and Joe Kane gun down two police officers who pull them over for a traffic violation, and then wound two more officers in a shootout in which both of them are eventually killed.
— July 2010: An agitated right-winger and convict named Byron Williams loads up on weapons and drives to the Bay Area intent on attacking the offices of the Tides Foundation and the ACLU, but is intercepted by state patrolmen and engages them in a shootout and armed standoff in which two officers and Williams are wounded.
That’s sixteen major incidents in a two-year period — significantly more than we’ve seen over the same timespan from domestic radical Muslims. The BPC’s report enumerates a total of seven incidents in 2009 — two attacks and five serious plots (not to mention four attempts to join terrorist organizations). We’ve had the same number of right-wing extremist-related incidents of domestic terrorism in 2010 so far — and the year isn’t even over yet.
Here are some links about the sodium cyanide bombs I was talking about.
Cyanide Bombers: an update
Sources familiar with the investigation say authorities especially fear that Krar may have manufactured more than one sodium cyanide bomb and sold them. After a traffic stop earlier this year while Krar was traveling through Tennessee, state troopers seized sodium cyanide among other weapons, one government source confirmed.
During the same stop, troopers found notes in Krar’s car.
One of the notes titled “Trip” recommends, “You will need cash, pre-charged phone card, spare gas can and all planning in place.”
Another note titled “Procedure” appears to represent instructions for carrying out some kind of covert operation. It lists code words for cities where meetings can take place at motels. Other codes appear to be warnings about how close police might be to catching the plotters. “Lots of light storms are predicted,” for instance, means “Move fast before they look any harder. We have a limited window remaining.”
The same note goes on to recommend ways to divert pursuers and suggests, “We want all looking in the wrong direction.”
Karr Plead Guilty:
UNITED STATES ATTORNEY’S OFFICE
Eastern District of Texas
PRESS ROOM
November 13, 2003
SMITH COUNTY MAN ADMITS POSSESSING CHEMICAL WEAPONS
(Tyler, Texas) A Tyler resident has admitted to possessing sodium cyanide, and other chemicals for the purpose of creating a dangerous weapon. WILLIAM J. KRAR pleaded guilty this morning to one count of Possessing a Dangerous Chemical Weapon. His co-defendant, JUDITH L. BRUEY, pleaded guilty to an information charging her with Conspiracy to Possess Illegal Weapons.
The Department of Justice, in 2009, released a report (actually done under Bush II) which said the single greatest threat of terrorism was rightwing extremists:
(U//FOUO) DHS/I&A assesses that lone wolves and small terrorist cells embracing violent rightwing extremist ideology are the most dangerous domestic terrorism threat in the United States. Information from law enforcement and nongovernmental organizations indicates lone wolves and small terrorist cells have shown intent—and, in some cases, the capability—to commit violent acts.
— (U//LES) DHS/I&A has concluded that white supremacist lone wolves pose the most significant domestic terrorist threat because of their low profile and autonomy—separate from any formalized group—which hampers warning efforts.
— (U//FOUO) Similarly, recent state and municipal law enforcement reporting has warned of the dangers of rightwing extremists embracing the tactics of “leaderless resistance” and of lone wolves carrying out acts of violence.
— (U//FOUO) Arrests in the past several years of radical militia members in Alabama, Arkansas, and Pennsylvania on firearms, explosives, and other related violations indicates the emergence of small, well-armed extremist groups in some rural areas.
Have you heard of The Order? The Huttaree Militia? Eric Rudolph? Scott Roeder? James Kopp? John Salvi? Reverend Paul Hill? Michael Griffen? All of those people have something in common… they are in jail for terrorist acts, all but the Huttaree militia actually killed people.
Want me to go on? Here’s some bombers, arsonists and attempted murderers, as well as those who make bomb threats and mail false anthrax: Shelley Shanon, Patricia Hughes and Jeremy Dunahoe, Fr. John Earl, Clayton Waagner, Robert Weiler Jr., William Kitchens Jr.
I was actually the target of such terrorism. While I was still in the National Guard a group of right-wing extremists planned to blow up the Armory my unit trained in.
Here is a list of 60 terrorist plots in the US from the McVeigh Bombing, to 2005. Did you see that number, SIXTY (60) as of 2005.
So add that to the 30, or so in 2009/2010. That’s not including the trio that was planning to kill Obama when he was going to be speaking at a stadium (the planned to take an 800+ meter shot with a high-powered rifle).
Here’s a shorter list, which goes up to 2012 Terror from the right
So there you are, a list of people who are right-wing Conservatives, overwhelmingly male, who have been caught engaging in terrorism. Since many of their targets are attacked, or threatened, by people who aren’t caught, we can; with some reasonableness, assume there are more.
Go ahead, show me the longer list of left-wingers, and “islamists” who’ve been arrested in the US for for acts (or plotted) terrorism
Argenti: He was addressing it to me, because I said it. Shade was in there only because NWO is too lazy to not add the irrelevant (to NWO’s comment) addressing of my comment.
Carp: I misposted my reply to NWO.
NWO: Really? Do you have proof of this? A detailed list of all mass murderers for say the last 40 years or so and their stated reason for mass murdering would suffice. I’d like to see how over 50% of mass murders in the US are committed Christian fundies.
Do I have proof?
Yeah, I do. Are you going to listen to it? No. But, for the benefit of those follwing along at home, I will.
Whatever happened to correlation doesn’t equal causation? Suddenly now it does?
What causation have I stated? I was stating a correlation; and a preponderance, as a counter to the idiocy that all terrorists are somehow, “other”.
Here’s a round-up
— July 2008: A gunman named Jim David Adkisson, agitated at how “liberals” are “destroying America,” walks into a Unitarian Church and opens fire, killing two churchgoers and wounding four others.
— October 2008: Two neo-Nazis are arrested in Tennessee in a plot to murder dozens of African-Americans, culminating in the assassination of President Obama.
— December 2008: In Belfast, Maine, police discover the makings of a nuclear “dirty bomb” in the basement of a white supremacist shot dead by his wife. The man, who was independently wealthy, reportedly was agitated about the election of President Obama and was crafting a plan to set off the bomb.
— January 2009: A white supremacist named Keith Luke embarks on a killing rampage in Brockton, Mass., raping and wounding a black woman and killing her sister, then killing a homeless man before being captured by police as he is en route to a Jewish community center.
— February 2009: A Marine named Kody Brittingham is arrested and charged with plotting to assassinate President Obama. Brittingham also collected white-supremacist material.
— April 2009: A white supremacist named Richard Poplawski opens fire on three Pittsburgh police officers who come to his house on a domestic-violence call and kills all three, because he believed President Obama intended to take away the guns of white citizens like himself. Poplawski is currently awaiting trial.
— April 2009: Another gunman in Okaloosa County, Florida, similarly fearful of Obama’s purported gun-grabbing plans, kills two deputies when they come to arrest him in a domestic-violence matter, then is killed himself in a shootout with police.
— May 2009: A “sovereign citizen” named Scott Roeder walks into a church in Topeka, Kansas, and assassinates abortion provider Dr. George Tiller.
— June 2009: James Von Brunn opens fire at the Holocaust Museum, killing a security guard.
— February 2010: An angry tax protester named Joseph Ray Stack flies an airplane into the building housing IRS offices in Austin, Texas. (Media are reluctant to label this one “domestic terrorism” too.)
— March 2010: Seven militiamen from the Hutaree Militia in Michigan and Ohio are arrested and charged with plotting to assassinate local police officers with the intent of sparking a new civil war.
— March 2010: An anti-government extremist named John Patrick Bedell walks into the Pentagon and opens fire, wounding two officers before he is himself shot dead.
— May 2010: A “sovereign citizen” from Georgia is arrested in Tennessee and charged with plotting the violent takeover of a local county courthouse.
— May 2010: A still-unidentified white man walks into a Jacksonville, Fla., mosque and sets it afire, simultaneously setting off a pipe bomb.
— May 2010: Two “sovereign citizens” named Jerry and Joe Kane gun down two police officers who pull them over for a traffic violation, and then wound two more officers in a shootout in which both of them are eventually killed.
— July 2010: An agitated right-winger and convict named Byron Williams loads up on weapons and drives to the Bay Area intent on attacking the offices of the Tides Foundation and the ACLU, but is intercepted by state patrolmen and engages them in a shootout and armed standoff in which two officers and Williams are wounded.
That’s sixteen major incidents in a two-year period — significantly more than we’ve seen over the same timespan from domestic radical Muslims. The BPC’s report enumerates a total of seven incidents in 2009 — two attacks and five serious plots (not to mention four attempts to join terrorist organizations). We’ve had the same number of right-wing extremist-related incidents of domestic terrorism in 2010 so far — and the year isn’t even over yet.
Here are some links about the sodium cyanide bombs I was talking about.
Cyanide Bombers: an update
Sources familiar with the investigation say authorities especially fear that Krar may have manufactured more than one sodium cyanide bomb and sold them. After a traffic stop earlier this year while Krar was traveling through Tennessee, state troopers seized sodium cyanide among other weapons, one government source confirmed.
During the same stop, troopers found notes in Krar’s car.
One of the notes titled “Trip” recommends, “You will need cash, pre-charged phone card, spare gas can and all planning in place.”
Another note titled “Procedure” appears to represent instructions for carrying out some kind of covert operation. It lists code words for cities where meetings can take place at motels. Other codes appear to be warnings about how close police might be to catching the plotters. “Lots of light storms are predicted,” for instance, means “Move fast before they look any harder. We have a limited window remaining.”
The same note goes on to recommend ways to divert pursuers and suggests, “We want all looking in the wrong direction.”
Karr Plead Guilty:
UNITED STATES ATTORNEY’S OFFICE
Eastern District of Texas
PRESS ROOM
November 13, 2003
SMITH COUNTY MAN ADMITS POSSESSING CHEMICAL WEAPONS
(Tyler, Texas) A Tyler resident has admitted to possessing sodium cyanide, and other chemicals for the purpose of creating a dangerous weapon. WILLIAM J. KRAR pleaded guilty this morning to one count of Possessing a Dangerous Chemical Weapon. His co-defendant, JUDITH L. BRUEY, pleaded guilty to an information charging her with Conspiracy to Possess Illegal Weapons.
The Department of Justice, in 2009, released a report (actually done under Bush II) which said the single greatest threat of terrorism was rightwing extremists:
(U//FOUO) DHS/I&A assesses that lone wolves and small terrorist cells embracing violent rightwing extremist ideology are the most dangerous domestic terrorism threat in the United States. Information from law enforcement and nongovernmental organizations indicates lone wolves and small terrorist cells have shown intent—and, in some cases, the capability—to commit violent acts.
— (U//LES) DHS/I&A has concluded that white supremacist lone wolves pose the most significant domestic terrorist threat because of their low profile and autonomy—separate from any formalized group—which hampers warning efforts.
— (U//FOUO) Similarly, recent state and municipal law enforcement reporting has warned of the dangers of rightwing extremists embracing the tactics of “leaderless resistance” and of lone wolves carrying out acts of violence.
— (U//FOUO) Arrests in the past several years of radical militia members in Alabama, Arkansas, and Pennsylvania on firearms, explosives, and other related violations indicates the emergence of small, well-armed extremist groups in some rural areas.
Have you heard of The Order? The Huttaree Militia? Eric Rudolph? Scott Roeder? James Kopp? John Salvi? Reverend Paul Hill? Michael Griffen? All of those people have something in common… they are in jail for terrorist acts, all but the Huttaree militia actually killed people.
Want me to go on? Here’s some bombers, arsonists and attempted murderers, as well as those who make bomb threats and mail false anthrax: Shelley Shanon, Patricia Hughes and Jeremy Dunahoe, Fr. John Earl, Clayton Waagner, Robert Weiler Jr., William Kitchens Jr.
I was actually the target of such terrorism. While I was still in the National Guard a group of right-wing extremists planned to blow up the Armory my unit trained in.
Here is a list of 60 terrorist plots in the US from the McVeigh Bombing, to 2005. Did you see that number, SIXTY (60) as of 2005.
So add that to the 30, or so in 2009/2010. That’s not including the trio that was planning to kill Obama when he was going to be speaking at a stadium (the planned to take an 800+ meter shot with a high-powered rifle).
Here’s a shorter list, which goes up to 2012 Terror from the right
So there you are, a list of people who are right-wing Conservatives, overwhelmingly male, who have been caught engaging in terrorism. Since many of their targets are attacked, or threatened, by people who aren’t caught, we can; with some reasonableness, assume there are more.
Go ahead, show me the longer list of left-wingers, and “islamists” who’ve been arrested in the US for for acts (or plotted) terrorism
Or I didn’t, and got confused with having two of the same tab open, one of which wasn’t refreshed.
Ooops.
@pecunium
Um overwhelminigly Christian fundies? I’m not seeing it. In fact, Christian isn’t even mentioned. Some are so obscure as to no meaning at all, “May 2010: A still-unidentified white man walks into a Jacksonville, Fla., mosque and sets it afire, simultaneously setting off a pipe bomb.”
I didn’t realize, “unidentified white man” = Christian fundie. When I asked for mass murderers I expect a link to something more than a building being damaged. Just to clarify, mass murder means actual murder taking place. And really!!! The SPLC? You’re kidding? Right? The heart and soul of the communist front. I’m sure they seeth in anger at individuals still having the right to own property, freedom and religion. Lol. The SPLC makes stormfront look like a bunch of old ladies at a bridge club. Why not just hand me the communist manifesto? Let’s all kill the burgiousse class and live in our little utopia. Hey, I got baking soda and vinegar, ya know what that means? Terrorist.
Um, pointing out the facts concerning men who commit murder is misandry. You must ignore those figures, and instead lambast women because a very small percentage of them commit murder too. So, you know, women are bad, or else…misandry!
Just so ya know, the lone wolf as he’s been dubbed is a registered democrat. Damn lefties.
I’ll finish pecunium’s list in a moment, but need to comment on this one —
— April 2009: A white supremacist named Richard Poplawski opens fire on three Pittsburgh police officers who come to his house on a domestic-violence call and kills all three, because he believed President Obama intended to take away the guns of white citizens like himself. Poplawski is currently awaiting trial.
That was such a clusterfuck…I’ll be amazed if they can find a jury within the city, everyone here considers him worse than guilty (he’s widely known as “that cop killer” here). That DV call though? His mother was the one who placed the call (and then it all went to shit and the city went into mourning and I really do doubt they can find an impartial jury…or judge for that matter). It all went to shit in a matter of seconds too btw, so fast actually that I’m pretty sure we’ve changed how the police respond to DV calls as a result of him.
“He was addressing it to me, because I said it. Shade was in there only because NWO is too lazy to not add the irrelevant (to NWO’s comment) addressing of my comment.”
Shade already clarified that bit of confusion, but yeah, I missed that, my mistake.
And Poplawski was tried and I missed it apparently (this is what I get for ignoring local laws I suppose) — he’s appealing a lethal injection.
local news, not local laws…*sigh* that case just short circuits my brain or something — the first officer to respond did the standard approach and door knock, and then took a bullet to the head, that’s a special level of fucked up.
@Argenti Aertheri
“Done with that list,”
Now if you take that list which seems to go back to 1915, and add up everyone, you’d come up with being about 100X as like that you’ll die from walking on flat level ground. Your odds of dying from walking on flat level ground are about 430,000 to 1 on any given year. Which means your odds of dying from a mass murder attack are about 43,000,000 to 1 on any given year. The odds of dying in a mass murder attack are far less than almost anything at all.
Do you get the point? We have the FBI, CIA, agencies you’ve never heard of, the patriot act, NDAA, the military tromping all over the world, missles firing into so many countries and the daily pravda telling us how we killed 100s of bad terrorists with each attack in a foreign land. 100s of billions spent every year to protect us from terrorism. Yet I’m far, far more likely to die from wasp stings or walking on flat level ground. Do you see the absurdity?
That list goes back to 1889 actually, but nonetheless, you need to cite that claim about “flat level ground” — preferably from a source that either excludes, or explains, how many of those deaths are the result of medical causes that just happened to occur on “flat level ground”.
In any case, wtf does either the OP about Berge, or the CO shooting, have to do with the bullshit that is the war on terror? And how do any of those thing relate to deaths on “flat level ground”? (And btw, my risk on flat level ground is probably 0, there really isn’t much of that around here XD )
“Why not just hand me the communist manifesto?”
If we did, would you actually read it?
NWO: When you asked for mass murderers you were trying to stack the deck, and exclude most terrorists, who don’t actually kill large groups of people.
As I said, you won’t really read the list, just dismiss it out of hand.
The statement I made wasn’t, “most mass murderers are white, male, and some stripe of fundie”, but “most terrorists in the USA are such”.
And I supported it. Care to provide a countering list of terrorists who aren’t?
Dishonest, that’s you.
pecunium — my list was mass murderers, so both claims would be correct (both mass murderers, and terrorists, are largely white men, and for the ones where religion was mentioned, every last one on my list was a christian)
@pecunium
This is what you said..,. The majority of terrorists in the US are white, male, Conservative, Christian (of a “fundamentalist” stripe).”
Is the majority of terrorist activity, committed by Christian fundies? Further, the SLPC would be thrilled to take everyone’s property, and every right they have as well as toss every Christian into the collusuem for saturday night lion feedings. Why not cruise over to radfem while you’re at and see what they think of Christians.
The SPLC is possibly the best funded communist center in the country. Goals of communism are to destroy the family, Christianity and give all power to the State. The SPLC is the most is so far left even for manboobers.