Over on The Spearhead, W.F. Price celebrates the harassment directed at Anita Sarkeesian’s Tropes Against Women video project as a sign of a powerful new backlash against the evils of feminism, a backlash he’s proud to be a part of. Dudes being obnoxious to a woman on the internet: Men’s Rights at its finest.
Oh, sure, Price acknowledges, some of the attacks on her were “juvenile” – and thus not as effective as they might otherwise have been — and the controversy did enable Sarkeesian to raise more than $130,000 for her project, but Price even sees this as a victory of sorts:
As for Sarkeesian’s success, we should be happy about it, because I can’t think of a more worthless way to spend over a hundred thousand dollars than in finger-wagging over video games. For one thing, it’s sure to piss even more guys off, and the game industry is very competitive, so her documentary (now expanded to 12 parts!) will likely have zero effect on production and consumption of this form of entertainment. The feminists are simply pissing all the money away, and that’s fine, because this time they’re paying for it themselves.
No question about it: those grapes were definitely sour.
Naturally, the Spearhead regulars were overjoyed by these new signs of, er, progress. Here are some highlights from the discussion that followed; lest I be accused once again of cherry-picking outliers, each and every one of the comments I quote below got literally dozens of net upvotes. This is what these guys really think.
Mojo offers a sort of backlash manifesto:
Feminists will never understand that it is -they- who are the oppressors. They cling to their delusion that they are the ‘underdog’ against the system, even as they control the system.
Revolution requires an enemy class to attack … this is seen as justified when the enemy class controls the system. But feminism is perpetual revolution. So what happens when they gain control over the system? They continue to attack the enemy class, i.e. men, thinking they are striking the next blow against the patriarchy, when what they are doing is more like a pogrom.
Yep, he went there.
Now -they- are the system, they are able and more than willing to intimidate, humiliate, expropriate. It will get indefinitely worse if they have their way. Liberal feminism leads -necessarily- to radical feminism.
Still, we don’t need feminists to ‘understand’ that they are the persecutors (I imagine some of them know this full well and are just misandrist sadists, little Eichmanns). It doesn’t matter what they think or know or understand. What matters is what -we- think, know and understand, and how we are going to act on it.
So … like the swivel-eyed feminist lunatics progressing from attempted assassinations to laying the foundations for institutional and legal abuse … I ask you – what are we going to DO with this knowledge and awareness beyond changing online discourse? …
Thinking like a leftist, though: why not attach ourselves to the GOP in order to subvert its gender politics and radicalize it in the MRA direction? That kind of approach has worked wonders for leftists and their infiltrations into public institutions …
Huh. Reactionary anti-feminists attaching themselves to the Republican Party? No one’s ever thought of that before.
Keyster offers some equally, er, innovative thinking:
Feminism has failed because women as a group adopted the notion of “equality” with men, while stubbornly clinging to their sexual/reproductive power over men. Had feminism truly helped women “realize their greatness”, there’d be far more great women. Instead there’s just more feminists. It’s run it’s course over 3 generations and it’s out of time to prove itself righteous.
The original “male chauvanist pigs” of the early 70′s, were right all along. Women are biologically and chemically ill-equipped to be men. If the Creator had meant women to be more like men, he wouldn’t have given them the ability to bring forth life from their bodies.
Ryu not only embraces the backlash, but seems perfectly fine with the notion that the Men’s Rights movement is a hate movement:
Good. Hatred and anger are power. Whenever you hear someone say “stop the hate”, it is a call to throw down your greatest weapons.
Young Guy purports to speak for all young guys (manginas presumably excepted):
If feminists think men, especially young men, are angry, they don’t know the half of it. As a 26 year-old male, I have seen this society bend over backwards to accommodate women all the time.
The school curriculums are geared toward female success. Schools have countless women’s programs. Female teachers can be as hateful as they want towards male students without facing consequences. People cheer when girls succeed in school, but jeer when boys succeed in school. Even though females have every advantage in the education system, they somehow still have the audacity to complain. They take fluff majors but don’t realize anyone with less than half a brain could pass classes in the humanities and social sciences.
What makes so many MRAs such proud yahoos?.
Oh, and just look at the workplace. Sexual harassment laws give women freedom to dress slutty and still have the nerve to complain when men sneak a peek. If you are a man who has a female co-worker, you have to walk on eggshells everyday or else you can get fired because the twat in the other room got her panties in a bunch over something minor you said. You can be a man who has busted his ass everyday to succeed in your chosen profession, only to see it mean nothing because some woman who was nothing more than an affirmative action hire. If this isn’t bad enough, you get these useless women who are subpar, yet they still never shut up about breaking through the mythical glass-ceiling that they didn’t break and didn’t exist in the first place.
Working men, forever cursed by subpar women.
Also, I have really had enough of women dragging this country down with their dead-weight. Female soldiers, police officers, and firefighters are liabilities. No, all you ladies in these jobs, you aren’t heroes. I am going to go insane if I hear one more female soldier, police officer, or firefighter cry about not getting the respect she thinks she deserves. She doesn’t get respect because she doesn’t deserve respect. The military, law enforcement, and firefighters would be A LOT better off if women stopped lowering the bar to astronomical proportions.
“Lowering the bar to astronomical proportions?” Young Guy here has clearly not yet mastered the fine art of metaphor.
He blabs on a bit longer before wrapping up with:
The backlash is not only real, but it is well-deserved. Apologies won’t erase the damage which has been done. Acting like what happened because of feminism either didn’t happen or was minor is a slap in the face. Saying women have suffered from feminism just as much as men is like spitting in the faces of all the men who have suffered ten lifetimes of pain because of feminism.
Not one, not two, not five, but ten lifetimes of pain? MRAs really are the world’s greatest drama kings.
Andrew S., meanwhile, seems a little confused as to what feminists would like to see happening in the video game industry:
It will be interesting to see if feminists can ruin the gaming industry like they ruin pretty much everything else. There is a lot of money being made off “gamers,” and even guys like me who play the occasional game but aren’t hardcore contribute a lot of money to the industry.
I doubt there are a lot of young guys and men out there who are going to want to play games that involve a bunch of screaming feminists, and where the object of the game is to destroy the “evil patriarchy.” The truth is guys who play games want their female characters to be either hot, large breasted, ass kicking types, or sexy non-feminist types that you save. If the gaming industry changes this dynamic to much due to Feminist/liberal pressure they will destroy a cash cow. And feminism will have yet another “victory.”
Unrestricted and uncriticized access to giant tittied video game ladies: a sacred men’s right!
Kevin evidently speaks for many when he says he wants video games to remain a boys club:
Video games are pretty much the only place that feminism can’t invade unless the principle consumers of them want it. You don’t have to play with girls, or listen to girls, or do other pansy shit. You probably can’t leave a football team and join a different one that has no women, you sure as hell can do that online. Don’t like all the teamwork talk? Play by yourself.
Feminists don’t like video games because; they can’t make them, they can’t force you to buy them or play them even if they did, they couldn’t ruin the experience for you unless you wanted them to.
You can do anything feminists don’t want you to do, and best of all you’re rewarded for it.
Anonymous Age 70 doesn’t even play video games, but he was pleased to learn that you can shoot ladies in them:
Speaking of video games, I am reminded of my son 8 or 10 years ago. I visited him, and he had some kind of shoot-em-up video game. He was partnered with a dearie, and the instant the game started, he always put a bullet in the middle of her forehead. Then, he’d laugh as if it were the funniest thing ever.
I told him he was a sick man, but I was also laughing as if it were the funniest thing ever.
Seriously, he told me he performed better with her dead than needing to be protected.
A great analogy for marriage 2.0, yes?
Women, can’t live them, can’t shoot them in the head. Except in video games!
Criticizing video games is misandry!
And if other men not being masculine, and if people saying that it’s okay to be masculine or not, harms your masculinity… well.
Also, if feminists could mind control the writers of Family Guy, why do you think they left so many rape jokes in?
There’s nothing wrong with masculinity. A man has a right to be as masculine or feminine as he wants. He shouldn’t be punished for that. What I don’t like is MRAs establishing their masculine identity on the backs of women. So many MRAs seem to define their masculinity in relation to how they deal with women. “I fuck a lot of women.” “My wife stays home and takes care of the kids.” “I’m a good provider.” etc. Your masculine identity does not depend on how women relate to you. For a movement titled “Men’s Right,” you sure do seem obsessed with women, what they do, say, even think. Get over it. The fact that a lot of women out there don’t need a man to control their lives is really none of your business.
The “bumbling father, long-suffering mother” trope always said to me: “men should be loved and tolerated no matter what irresponsible nonsense they get up to. It’s women’s job to clean up after them.”
Because the full trope is always “bumbling but beloved father,” and not a lot of bumbling mothers get extended that forgiveness.
Hi, ACLAF! I’m glad you found a wife who’s a good match for you and feel comfortable with yourself. However, I’m confused by your complaints about feminism. Maybe you could answer a few questions for me?
In what ways does feminism discourage men from being “masculin, manly, powerful, strong, smart, fast etc.”? Can you give an example of men being discouraged by feminists from being smart? Fast? Strong?
What does it mean to be “masculine” or “manly”? Is it the same as being powerful, strong, smart and fast?
Are there men who aren’t “masculine” or “manly,” or who aren’t interested in being these things? Are they capable of being good men?
Can women be powerful, strong, smart or fast? If they are these things, are they capable of being good women?
You know, you don’t need to feel personally attacked by anti-rape campaigns unless you yourself have committed rape. Do you feel personally attacked by anti-crime campaigns? Anti-drug-abuse campaigns?
…either a lie, or so disingenuous you may not have noticed that the sun rose this morning.
Did not.
Refusing to listen to arguments, trolling, being full of shit? No, THANK you for comfirming all of my biases.
How is Lisa the female equivalent of Homer? She’s not even an adult! And she is a kid who, despite being very intelligent, has issues eg: she has a very hard time to socialize with other children (and is unhappy often unhappy because of it), she’s often shown as pretentious, etc. And even if she was the perfect girl (she isn’t), she isn’t the star of the show more than the other characters.
And really, you can’t think of any masculine intelligent men in modern media? I’m gonna help you and direct you to the Avengers, which
– is a terrificly awesome movie
– is full of very manly dudes.
Of course, it is only one out of a bazillions example of smart and masculine men in movie and tv shows.
What do you even watch to miss all the full-of-testosterone heroes (with the sexy chicks they deserve) ? Have you played a video game, ever?
Just for fun, let’s list the shows that I currently have episodes of saved on my computer.
Castle: Protagonist is a white man. Presented as a good guy.
House: Protagonist is a white man. Presented as an anti-hero who’s smarter than everyone around him and fundamentally good underneath a thick layer of asshole.
Monk: Protagonist is a white man. Presented as a good guy.
Supernatural: Protagonists are white men. Presented as good guys (not to mention basically the biggest badasses in the universe).
Leverage: Of the five main characters, three are men, of whom two are white. All of them are presented as good guys. One is a good guy whose job is specifically to be very much an action hero who can beat the crap out of everyone.
The Mentalist: Protagonist is a white man. Presented as a mostly-good guy who is smarter than everyone around him.
Mythbusters: Doesn’t have a protagonist per se, since it’s non-fiction, but three of the five stars are white men, and they are certainly presented as likeable and talented.
WHITE MEN ARE SO UNDERREPRESENTED ON TV YOU GUYS.
Also, don’t blame feminism for the reason why masculinty is so often identified with anger, violence, stoic suppression of emotions, and aggression. You can blame the Macho Man Police for that.
Well it didn’t take long for this to get derailed by a possible troll.. 🙁
Hey you guys! Don’t you remember how Superman was always getting degraded for being masculine? Or what about how James Bond was a helpless wimp being outsmarted by his wife all the time? And I’m pretty sure Jack Bauer was a lazy, irresponsible oaf. It almost makes me want to cry, seeing how terribly misrepresented masculinity is in our culture.
How do masculine men handle the degradation??? HOW, I ask you!?!?
FemShep calls bullshit on how feminism in video games will destroy the market.
Adorkable moment here for everyone’s enjoyment, in part to prove these MRA fellahs wrong: you can play video games with girls — and maybe even get a moment of geeky, 21st century intimacy — http://www.geekologie.com/2012/06/01/diablo-gamer-couple.jpg
Now this thread, especially the discussion on everyone’s favorite style of games is making me want to play, but all my stuff is packed up for a move into my new apartment tomorrow.
Yeah, there are absolutely no movies out there featuring strong, handsome macho dudes as the heroes. Oh, except practically every action movie ever.
Serously, have you ever heard of the Bechtel Test? Look it up.
You’re right, though, I “don’t seem to know what it’s like to feel hated, and reviled every time you turn on the television, for your whole life.” Because that’s not what I see when I turn on the TV. Do you have some sort of “man hatred” bundle from your cable provider?
My current tv shows:
Game of thones: full of courageous, masculine, smart (white) men.
The borgias: hard to say who’s ‘good’, Cesario is strong fast, smart, and one of the hero.
How I met your mother: Marshall is pretty masculine, kind, average smart, a good husband and provider.
Doctor who: the doctor is very fast (a lot of running!), though pacifist (but kills a lot), courageous, incredibly intelligent. Jack Harkness, as Ozy said, is also a good example of a strong, intelligent, courageous man. Queer though, so depending on you level of homophobia it might disqualify him.
House: disabled, but apart from that, intelligent, rather masculine and definitely courageous.
Castle: rich, handsome, intelligent, courageous, etc
Firefly: does it really need explaining?
So “emotional” equals “not a man”, huh? Well here’s some emotion for ya: Go fuck yourself.
TV shows on tonight featuring powerful, strong, smart, and/or fast men:
Criminal Minds
Burn Notice
The Middle
Suburgatory
Modern Family
So You Think You Can Dance
America’s Got Talent
Storage Wars (shut up, those guys are awesome)
Pawn Stars
Tanked
Gator Boys
Top Gear
The U.S. Olympic swimming trials (fast men!)
EPSN Baseball
ESPN Classic Boxing
And that’s just one prime-time block! Avoid the “Family Guy” rerun on TBS, and you’re fine.
Don’t know about the rest of you, but I love the idea that feminism is anti-speed.
May I propose a new logo?
p.s. Lurk here for two months, only to flounce in about an hour?
And seriously, I’ve yet to hear a satisfactory explanation as to how the trope of “Comedic male lead never faces any lasting consequences whatsoever for acting like incompetent asshole.” is anti-male.
It’s not just men acting like idiots. It’s men acting like idiots and always getting away with it.
Acronym Troll: Everybody here has debunked your “omg no heroes” on television (grnated, if you look at a lot of the heroic white men, they don’t get married and settle down and raise kids–so maybe you aren’t a MANLY MAN after all, you family guy you).
Gosh, given what you describe here, I cannot imagine why that wonderful woman ever married you. What a CREEPY LOSER you musta been.
She’s always been stridently anti-feminist
First time I’ve ever seen “stridently” used as what seems to be trying to be a compliment.
From: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/strident
So, you really think she’d like you calling her strident?
So, tell me, how many feminists cornered your strident anti-feminist wife and harassed her because of her not being a feminist?
I’ve been a feminist for decades, and I’ve never stridently attacked a woman for marrying, having children, and working in the home (though that doesn’t usually work out so well these days what with the economy).
Why is it necessary for her to be strident? What’s wrong with her life with you that she has to go around stridently being anti-feminist? And what’s wrong with you that you think we give a flying fuck about your life with Strident Anti-Feminist Canadian Housewife (SAFCH)?
I generally only have the tv on in the background because i’m watching stuff on YouTube or playing games (good use of resources there, sorry about destroying the planet 🙁 ), but I usually have it on something like CSI or NCIS (the latter of which is at top of my stuff-that’s-not-sci-fi favourites list), when there’s nothing sci fi-related (like Star Trek) on.
Both arguably have strong/smart, masculine men in charge and involved.
Though if I may activate Feminist Mode for a moment, both still have a good mix of awesome male and female characters. And for a good chunk of time, in the case of NCIS, the director of the organisation was female (and awesome). The current director of NCIS is non-white even! Tis an awesome show.
The wives of the bumbling dads are always shown to be boring nags, too, if they dare ask the dad to be more helpful or responsible. They’re also conventionally good looking. The message shown to straight women is “You have to be hot and you have to put up with an irresponsible partner”. I don’t see how it’s misandry to show an average looking guy married to a supermodel, and he can be silly and fun all the time while she picks up the slack for him.
By the way ACLAF, it’s more than a little ironic that you came here to A) Announce how wonderful it is to freed of the burden of being emotional; and B) Complain about television hurting your feelings.
My radical opinion is that sitcoms have crap gender politics every which way, and that it sucks *both* to be considered a useless, stupid slob and to be expected to take care of a useless, stupid slob.
@ AFLAC or whatever your name is-
You should try practicing being manly with video games! If you choose an MMO it helps to send a lot of pm’s to female players asking if they will suck your dick. While making you a sammich. That one never gets old and women really will think you’re the smartest, dudliest dude ever.
It’s true. Go ahead, give it a try. Let us know how it works out.