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Does Manosphere Blogger Vox Day Really Support the Murder and Mutilation of Women?

Most women, it is fair to say, don’t want to be deprived of education; they don’t want to be considered little more than baby-making machines; and they don’t want “independent” women to be maimed or murdered.

But according to the influential manosphere blogger Vox Day, women who object to any of this just don’t know what’s good for them. In one of the most repellant manosphere rants I’ve run across yet, Vox attempts to rebut PZ Myers’ critiques of evolutionary psychology with a series of bizarre and hateful assertions about women, offering his own “scientific” rationales for keeping women down. Is this all somehow satire on his part? He certainly seems sincere.

TRIGGER WARNING for all that follows; Vox explicitly defends the maiming and murder of women.

Vox starts out by arguing that depriving women of education makes solid evolutionary sense:

[E]ducating women is strongly correlated with reducing their disposition and ability to reproduce themselves. Educating them tends to make them evolutionary dead ends. … 40% of German women with college degrees are childless. Does PZ seriously wish to claim that not reproducing is intrinsically beneficial to women?

Instead of being educated, Vox goes on to argue, girls should be married off young so they can start popping out babies:

[R]aising girls with the expectation that their purpose in life is to bear children allows them to pursue marriage at the age of their peak fertility, increase the wage rates of their prospective marital partners, and live in stable, low-crime, homogenous societies that are not demographically dying. It also grants them privileged status, as they alone are able to ensure the continued survival of the society and the species alike. Women are not needed in any profession or occupation except that of child-bearer and child-rearer, and even in the case of the latter, they are only superior, they are not absolutely required.

Next, he defends the practice of throwing acid in the face of “independent” women:

[F]emale independence is strongly correlated with a whole host of social ills. Using the utilitarian metric favored by most atheists, a few acid-burned faces is a small price to pay for lasting marriages, stable families, legitimate children, low levels of debt, strong currencies, affordable housing, homogenous populations, low levels of crime, and demographic stability. If PZ has turned against utilitarianism or the concept of the collective welfare trumping the interests of the individual, I should be fascinated to hear it.

He moves on to honor killings, arguing that they too are good for women, because

female promiscuity and divorce are strongly correlated with a whole host of social ills, from low birth and marriage rates to high levels of illegitimacy.

He offers a similar rationale for female genital mutilation, before launching into this bizarre racist attack on abortion rights:

[F]ar more women are aborted than die as a result of their pregnancies going awry. The very idea that letting a few women die is worse than killing literally millions of unborn women shows that PZ not only isn’t thinking like a scientist, he’s quite clearly not thinking rationally at all. If PZ is going to be intellectually consistent here, then he should be quite willing to support the abortion of all black fetuses, since blacks disproportionately commit murder and 17x more people could be saved by aborting black fetuses than permitting the use of abortion to save the life of a mother. 466 American women die in pregnancy every year whereas 8,012 people died at the hands of black murderers in 2010.

Vox wants “girls” – presumably teenagers — to be married off young and start popping out babies. Yet in his mind female fetuses are “unborn women.”

Despite Vox Day’s repellent ideas about women – and his proud racism – he’s an influential figure in the manosphere, mentioned approvingly and regularly cited by others who present themselves as more moderate voices. It may not be a shock that the reactionary antifeminist blogger Dalrock includes Vox in his blogroll, and cites his work with approval (see here and here for examples). But, astoundingly, he’s also regularly cited approvingly by antifeminist “relationship expert” Susan Walsh of Hooking Up Smart (see here, here, and here). And she has even written at least one guest post on Vox’s “game blog” Alpha Game.

At this point I suppose I shouldn’t be shocked by any of this.  But I still am.

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Howard Bannister
13 years ago

@Aurini:

Hahaha! “Trigger warning” – yet more evidence that women are too weak and emotional to be trusted with the vote.

Ugh! So you’re saying no man ever would be triggered or made to feel awful by the defense of terrorism? All men everywhere are fundamentally okay with a call to commit genocide against black people?

And you say feminists have a low opinion of men? I don’t WANT to know any men who are unaffected by that shit.

Amused
13 years ago

government work doesn’t count

Whoa. So, let’s list some occupations that involve government work:

– the military
– law enforcement
– firefighters
– teachers
– the Coast Guard
– all the doctors and nurses who work at publicly operated hospitals, including VA centers

Yeah, I can see how none of these are productive endeavors because GUBMINT IS EBIL.

I dunno, Farmer John, seems to me YOU are the moocher here.

Argenti Aertheri
Argenti Aertheri
13 years ago

Falconer — I probably was giving them too much credit, considering they also seem to think that atheism causes crime, or something (more like not-Christianity causes crime, but whatever).

Pecunium — “‘it was satire’ (which is the more affected way of saying, “Can’t you take a joke”).” — but satire =/= a joke, Swift knew that. VD is fundamentally failing to reveal anything damning about anyone besides himself, therefore, not satire.

Aurini — how is “how easy it is to defend Islam” in any well relevant to PZ anyways? And deciding PZ’s questions are all about Islam? Add Islamophobia to the list of reasons I think you can go fuck yourself.

I wonder Aurini, does “All men everywhere are fundamentally okay with a call to commit genocide against black people?” include black men? Or are they just not people to you?

Sharculese
13 years ago

Perhaps you could provide some examples of University educated women who A) Make a net contribution to society (if their husbands repay the loans, then they’re a net drain) who are engaged in a productive endeavour – government work doesn’t count, and B) who wind up having children at some point at a replacement rate.

y’know, it’s sad enough when you guys try to engage in these ‘blame women for your failings’ fairytales, but when you can’t do it without adding a bunch of arbitrary rules to your bitterness narrative it is just extra pathetic

Amused
13 years ago

Also, don’t quite get how repaying one’s loans, even with someone else’s funds, represents a “net drain” on society.

Sharculese
13 years ago

‘women are stoopid, therefore shit girls do isnt real work because i is a sooper he-man. waaah waahhh.’

that’s you, aurini. that’s what you sound like. except less articulate.

Argenti Aertheri
Argenti Aertheri
13 years ago

To add to Amused’s list:

– all court employees, from the one’s filing to the judges
– sanitation employees in many places, sewers everywhere I can think of
– public water works employees, ie the people who get the tap water to your faucet
– the entire foster care system (this includes basically everything in an orphan’s life)
– all the various consumer protection agencies, or would you prefer products that kill?
– the FDA, or maybe you’d like mercury as a “cure” for everything again?

Argenti Aertheri
Argenti Aertheri
13 years ago

Oh and the highway system, your roads are also maintained by government employees.

Sharculese
13 years ago

but seriously- women don’t contribute to society, therefore throw acid in their faces. this is the work of a brilliant thinker who should be taken seriously and not have his sharp scissors confiscated.

Quackers
Quackers
13 years ago

isn’t it cute how Vox’s flying monkeys are coming here to defend his honor? lol

Quackers
Quackers
13 years ago

type “like” if you understood that reference xD

Falconer
13 years ago

isn’t it cute how Vox’s flying monkeys are coming here to defend his honor? lol

Hey — I got that joke! [/Avengers]

Quackers
Quackers
13 years ago

@Falconer

haha yes!!! xD

Kendra, the bionic mommy
Kendra, the bionic mommy
13 years ago

For every single woman you find that qualifies to those criteria, I can find 99 who have a useless degree, are employed in government/HR make work, or who just used their degree to meet a husband to mooch off of.

Why is Human Resources useless? They hire people, enroll the employees in health insurance programs, help employees manage their retirement plans, and schedule activities that boost workplace morale, which increases productivity. Men work in HR departments, too. Is it useful when they do it, but a waste when women do it?

I also visited Aurini’s pretentious blog, but had to leave due to boredom. I tried to watch his video of why feminism ruined the Fantastic 4: Rise of the Silver Surfer, but I only made it through two minutes. I’d rather watch Rise of the Silver Surfer ten times in a row than one of Aurini’s videos.

Amused
13 years ago

Argenti Aertheri:

– the entire foster care system (this includes basically everything in an orphan’s life)

They don’t give a shit about orphans. People like Aurini would much prefer if orphans had no social safety net at all, which would allow orphans to be used as slaves. You know, all that social Darwinism bullshit.

katz
13 years ago

I tried to watch his video of why feminism ruined the Fantastic 4: Rise of the Silver Surfer, but I only made it through two minutes. I’d rather watch Rise of the Silver Surfer ten times in a row than one of Aurini’s videos.

And that’s really saying something when it’s Rise of the Silver Surfer you’re talking about. (Or so I hear; never actually seen it.)

Kendra, the bionic mommy
Kendra, the bionic mommy
13 years ago

To spare anyone else of the boredom that will come from visiting Aurini’s blog, I’ll sum it up for you. It’s basically just “Look at me! I’m a smug reactionary, isn’t that interesting!” LOL, as if I’ve never seen a blog like that before.

Quackers
Quackers
13 years ago

@Kendra

Manosphere commentary on movies is hilarious and disturbing. One blogger…(I forget who it was though) predicted Avengers would have rape and a Spearhead article predicted it would be feminized and do badly or both.

Fail on both of those predictions lol.

Sharculese
13 years ago

his video of why feminism ruined the Fantastic 4: Rise of the Silver Surfer

ahahahahahahahah that is like compound levels of sad

Sharculese
13 years ago

As I’ve said before, I don’t buy that a Jewish Conspiracy is controlling the West. Conspiracies have too many moving parts. They require too much control of information. And quite frankly, if there actually were a conspiracy, its behaviour wouldn’t be as Discracefully Stupid as what we’re actually seeing.

WELL THAT EXPLAINS IT.

Tulgey Logger
Tulgey Logger
13 years ago

In which Manboobz can’t fucking understand satire in which Vox mocks the points of PZ Myers by showing us how if one were to do as what PZ Myers actually says, you would come out with doing really fucking terrible things.

Good lord, do none of these idiots actually understand satire?

Apparently they don’t.

Find who he is trying to satirize in this “answer”:

7. Because far more women are aborted than die as a result of their pregnancies going awry. The very idea that letting a few women die is worse than killing literally millions of unborn women shows that PZ not only isn’t thinking like a scientist, he’s quite clearly not thinking rationally at all. If PZ is going to be intellectually consistent here, then he should be quite willing to support the abortion of all black fetuses, since blacks disproportionately commit murder and 17x more people could be saved by aborting black fetuses than permitting the use of abortion to save the life of a mother. 466 American women die in pregnancy every year whereas 8,012 people died at the hands of black murderers in 2010.

Note that you should take this into consideration when making your answer:

http://voxday.blogspot.com/2011/05/inevitable-return-of-racism.html
http://www.wnd.com/2010/05/151689/

He’s just taking his own racism and applying his misunderstanding of utilitarianism to that. Not only is it not satire, as a reductio ad absurdum it doesn’t even land. The only one Vox Day is satirizing is himself, and he doesn’t even realize it.

This is going to sound terribly PI
This is going to sound terribly PI
13 years ago

It was a slow day at the office so I was reacquainting myself with my old friend Jack; he doesn’t talk a lot,but he has a way of lifting my spirits. I was just finishing another slug when the door opens; I tip up the brim of my fedora to see Glass Eye Joe walking in.

“Get a load a this satire” He sez, handing me the local rag.

I glanced over it, and it didn’t take long to see that Joe was off his rocker.

“Joe,” I sneered “I didn’t realize that Jimmy the Blade took yer brain as well as yer eye that fateful night. This here is satire like I’m the Queen of France. Listen close ya dumb palooka, if we assume he is satirizing, who is he satirizing?”

“Well, uh” Joe stammered, sounding like my pop’s old truck when the engine starts to knock.

“Certainly not this Meyers putz!” I interjected. “Just look at question number 5”

5. How does stoning rape victims benefit women?

“Now see here, a more consistent response” I started, but realizing I sounded like an old school marm, I took another slug of whiskey; a man has to keep these things balanced.

“As I was saying, the more consistent response would be along the lines of ‘Rape is just a byproduct of promiscuity see, by further stigmatizing promiscuity, via death penalty for rape victims, the dames’ll be more likely stay in their roles as baby incubators and child raisers.’ However, what does this ‘satirist’ go with?”

I shove the rag back in Joe’s face, and he’s looking as jumpy as a frog in a pogo stick shop.

5. I don’t see how this benefits women in any way. The effect in dramatically reducing the number of false rape accusations would, of course, benefit men, but since there is no reliable penalty for false rape accusations in modern society, reducing it would be of little benefit to them.

“That’s right Joe!” I explode, “He goes with false rape accusations, what does that sound like to you!?”

“M…MRAs?” he stammers

“That’s right” I reassure him, finally having lead the mouse to the cheese, “At best this is a poor satirization of the MRM, but this guy here, he’s just too genuine with his hate.”

Suddenly I, feel a draft across the back of my neck, then POW, cold metal strikes my temple and stars burst over my vision. I have just enough time to realize that Joe set me up before it all goes black.

When I come to, it’s all dark. But I can tell it’s somewhere unfamiliar, there’s something wrong with the air. I can’t put my finger on it, so I put my hand up to my head to assess the damage. Blood. Dammit what mess had Joe tied me into this time. And that’s when I realize what’s wrong with the air.

Candles.

Scented. Fucking. Candles.

Argenti Aertheri
Argenti Aertheri
13 years ago

“You know, all that social Darwinism bullshit.” — shit, that’s why I specifically mentioned orphans, in the hopes that the social Darwinism crowd could manage to see how having your parents die isn’t remotely related to social status >.<

I might have to read this one off his blog though — "To understand Trayvon Martin, you first must understand Charles Manson." — I've read Helter Skelter, and I doubt he has.

Sharculese
13 years ago

In which Manboobz can’t fucking understand satire in which Vox mocks the points of PZ Myers by showing us how if one were to do as what PZ Myers actually says, you would come out with doing really fucking terrible things.

again, we totally get that vox day is making a tenuous, moral panic heavy, slippery slope argument. it’s just that that argument isnt worth taking seriously.

Argenti Aertheri
Argenti Aertheri
13 years ago

Oh gods his point is just that Nixon didn’t call Manson an alleged murderer but said he was a murderer, versus Obama calling Trayvon Martin’s death a tragedy, because that somehow is the same as calling Zimmerman a murderer, that’s it, I’m sure. (MRAs are making me want that on a shirt)

And Zimmerman is the victim, of course >.<

They Myth of Racism is a profitable one, you see, and those Advocates which promise you Cheese for Votes have never had your best interests at heart.

Feminism, Anti-racism, Housing Loans, Gay Rights, Anarcho-Tyranny, the Security State, take your pick – somewhere there’s a flavour of cheese for you, no matter how discerning your palette might be. …

It’s almost enough to make you feel sorry for Charles Manson. If only he’d known how to play the game as well as They..

Yeah, clearly doesn’t know shit about Manson either.

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