Hey fellas, do you ever find yourself wondering: why are women so terrible? Well, over on the Men’s Rights subreddit, a fella named osaap has a partial answer: because dudes don’t criticize them enough!
So, fellas, the next time you see a woman, tell her she’s a mean, thoughtless, selfish, lazy little bitch, and that you won’t be giving her a “pussy pass” any longer. You’ll be doing your part for real gender equality. Pay it forward, by putting her down.
Judging from the dozens of upvotes osaap’s post got, and the almost-100% positive response it received from commenters there, it sounds like a lot of Reddit’s Men’s Rightsers are on board with this ingenious new form of activism.
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This post is mostly
He’s so right about one detail, and yet sooooooooooooo wrong in his application of that detail. Yes, women are valued primarily by their level of attractiveness, which means that in general, women who do not conform to that standard of attractiveness have no value. And this asshat wants to argue that this is somehow unfair to….men.
So what the hell did he do before this grand revelation? Just cling to the first willing woman?
Lol! Hilarious fail by Futrelle.
Futrelle claims that the poster he is commenting on recommended calling women names.
This would work better if he hadn’t put the actual post in – which doesn’t say anything about calling women names, but suggests that men take personality into account as much as looks before interacting with / dating women*.
Which, duh.
It’s pretty much a no brainer. And is also something that teh feminism has been banging on about for ages….
but hey, if an MRA says it – it must be wrong! Amirite, eh? eh?/sarcasm
Honestly, Futrelle, your entire shtick is to troll MRA / men’s rights postings on the web, and THIS is what you unearth???
*I learned to do this from experience. Instead of jumping into things before I know someone; taking a date or two to get to know them, and choosing not to date e.g. violent, flaky, egotistical or neurotic girls – instead dating fairly stable, somewhat kind, gentle natured girls = winning. 🙂
Wow, Joe, thanks for coming here and setting us straight. I have no idea what we’d do without you.
Gee Joe, your dating advice is just so cutting edge and new! You should stay here and tell us ALLL about it! Because we’ll never figure it out for ourselves!!
Please Joe, tell us more!
ACTUALLY Futrelle didn’t say it had to do with calling women names, but whatever.
hey joe, when you deal with other writers do you whine about people pointing out obvious subtext, or is it only the losers you carry water for?
absolutely no name-calling going on here. my irony detectors are totally not going off right now.
Joe, take a look at the title; “It’s men’s responsibility to hold women up to higher standards.” This is no different from several MRAs on the Internet telling women to “be grateful for the rights WE gave you. Now back to the kitchen, bitches.”
No. Fucking no. Feminists fought for those rights, they didn’t sit around waiting for people to listen to them. These rights were also no one’s to hand out – just as the standards for being who we are and living the way we choose to are not these Redditors’ to dictate. To suggest that they’re not being little more than condescending is disingenuous of you.
Joe, how exactly do you “hold someone to higher standards” without telling them that they are not living up to your standards? Here are the standards he says women (or at least more women than men) don’t live up to:
So to convey to a woman that she isn’t living up to all this is to tell her she’s mean, thoughtless, selfish, lazy, etc. In other words, that she’s terrible.
I suppose the other way to hold women up to these new standards, I suppose, would be to shun all of those women you think are terrible.
joe, i know that you think reading past literal meaning is TOTALLY NOT FAIR AND SOMETHING TO COMPLAIN ABOUT, so i should probably give you a heads up and explain that that last part was sarcasm
The irony if osaap’s post is that it contains a kernel of truth: let’s stop judging women by purely superficial means and place more value on their personalities. Of course they go about ass backwards, and somehow manage to blame women for the fact that some men are so looks driven.
I`ve seen my fair share of misogynistic bullshit from MRAs speweed under the guise of `holding women accountable`. And it inevitably involves lots of name-calling and rape apologia.
@Joe
The Spearhead called, they’re missing a douche.
this is an interesting twist tho. normally we get mras whining about how things are taken out of context. joe here wants to whine about how david included the context.
I think this is interesting! Joe’s interpretation seems to be that the poster meant that you can “hold women to higher standards” by simply not dating them if they’re not kind or thoughtful etc.
The implications of that are that the poster believes women in general would notice and actually care if MRAs refuse to date them, and that this would change their sense of “self entitlement.” We might be kidding ourselves that being ignored by douchebags would be pretty great, but actually we’d all be really sorry and become submissive doormats.
The other implication is that it’s completely normal in MRAland to date people you do not think are kind or thoughtful etc.
Actually, I think the guy could have meant that, and everyone missed his meaning because no one shares the implicit assumption that not being sexually approached by MRAs is a bad thing that would make women sad.
Personally I think the title’s a distraction from the real hilarity, which is that osaap thinks men are magically immune to the same cultural forces as women but are helpless before the villainy of pretty women bcuz dick throbs.
Also I bet you dollars to donuts MRAs are reading it right now thinking “oh, so now Futrelle thinks women who behave badly shouldn’t ever be criticized!” while ignoring the bullshit misogynist assumption that women in general behave badly bcuz dick throbs (completely erasing women who aren’t conventionally attractive).
Not that I think their foolishness could be remedied by our clarity, I just enjoy chortling at the thought that there’s nothing they can’t interpret favorably to themselves.
yeah, tulgely, mras are only now concluding that the the dude they call “dave ‘the knave’ fruit-trelle” thinks women should never be criticized
@ Missy – But I thought I was also supposed to give sex on demand to any random man that whined about how oppressed he is when I don’t give his particular self sex on demand? Because otherwise MISANDRY? I AM SO CONFUSED.
Well, not just that. Also:
-Being willing to raise children totally unassisted–aborting, not-aborting, surrendering custody, or assuming custody as the father desires.
-Cleaning the house and doing the shopping and cooking the meals every day.
-Obviously, not asking men for any of their money or time to help with the above, and definitely not asking for room and board while doing the above.
-Taking only lady-appropriate jobs, and then cheerfully helping the men at their workplaces, while never asking for raises or promotions or any changes in how they’re treated.
-Being giving and gracious with every man who asks them for dates/sex, no matter how he asks.
-Never, ever, ever complaining about their status or treatment, or even seeming to have observed their status or treatment.
See how many things women have failed to do? We really are terrible!
I know, sharkules, but haven’t you noticed how Antsy et al love to treat the latest manboobzic target for their indignation as some grand and atrocious novelty?
Maybe I’m imagining things, but that’s how I’ve grown to think of how they think.
@Cliff Pervocracy
“How do these guys think women pay rent?”
What? You think when a man pays for a womans rent it’s cause they’re buddies? How often do ya think men pay for other men’s rent?
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“How do they think we make friends?”
I dunno, but since we’re told women are so much more social it must come natural.
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“How do they think we raise children?”
We? As in women only? My, my. A bit full of ourselves aren’t, “we.” Women always seem to do so much more. “We,” as in men get told it every day.
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“(That’s a joke, of course. Really, I’m sex-bribing a man into typing this for me.)”
Women using sex and gender for bribery, coercion, deception, profit? Why that’s unheard of. It never happens.
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@pillowinhell
“Yes there are a lot of men who only value women for their looks. It always amazes me though, that when MRAs actually see the real problem or issue they immediately veer off into exactly the wrong solution to the problem.”
So the problem lie’s with men, not with women? Look at how women dress as oppossed to men. Men wear loose fitting T-shirts with sleeves. Women’s shirts are sleeveless, super tight, lotsa cleavage. Pants; mens are again loose fitting, women’s are painted on. Short’s; mens usually go down to the knees or more and are loose fitting. Women’s are way shorter and way tighter. Women’s dresses would make a prostitute from the 60s blush. Make-up, perfume, jewelry, high heels clakity clacking away. Look at me! Look at me!
Wouldn’t the solution be to teach women/girls not to act like animals in heat. Not to use sex and gender as an instrument of coersion, enticement? Of course that would mean women aren’t blameless, and we can’t have that.
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@Pecunium
“never have sex with anyone but, “The Right Man”
As oppossed to fuck lotsa men and leave them?
“don’t tease men by being hot in public”
As oppossed to being loyal and hot for one man?
“take care of the kids, the house”
As oppossed to not doing either?
“be self-supporting”
As oppossed to using sex/gender to skate thru life?
“be able to maintain a decent conversation”
As oppossed to yesterdays thread of saying fuckity, fuck, fuck, fuck?
“never divorce”
As oppossed to getting divorced if you’re bored? Women #1 excuse.
“never complain”
As oppossed to always bitching and being a drama queen?
What are men thinking?
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@karalora
“But does anyone think for one second that these guys would give the time of day to a kind, thoughtful, generous, giving, self-sacrificing, compassionate woman who wasn’t also centerfold material? Because I highly doubt it.”
In order to find out wouldn’t women need to be all those fine qualities? Or is it assumed they already are? Why would you doubt it? How have you already reached that conclusion?
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@AlexB
“they likely have women laughing at their bad jokes, listening to their boring stories and pretending to be interested in their dumbass opinions, smiling and going along with it when they say something shitty and obnoxious”
Men must need to brush up on their entertainment value when engaging women in conversation. And try to keep their dumbass opinions to themselves, as well as being less shitty and obnoxious.
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“allowing them to mansplain stuff the woman knows more about, refraining from criticising them or finding the most tactful possible way to express criticism when there isn’t an alternative, and expressing concern if they’re upset”
Men need to stop mansplaining cause women already know more. Walk on eggshells if you must criticize. Express concern if a woman is upset reguardless of the circumstances.
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Man = bad. Woman = perfect.
My favorite recent comment about my supposed “white knighting” is this one from the spearhead:
http://www.the-spearhead.com/2012/06/01/comment-of-the-week-scented-candles/#comment-152563
Huh. I guess the real explanation couldn’t possibly be that I judge people by what they think and say and do, regardless of gender, and that Andie is someone with terrible ideas who was acting like an asshole in a somewhat comical manner?
Look, David, either women are good, or women are bad. Freakin’ pick one already.
Flip-floppin’ hypocrite, can’t even decide whether he agrees with all women all the time or not.
owlslave, how come you never respond to me anymore. 🙁 is it ’cause i keep calling you a coward?
Wasn’t Welmer “white knighting” with his original article about women over 25? Because if the point wasn’t that Welmer was giving advice out of the goodness of his heart to young women to help prevent them from wasting their entire lives as we all agree that unmarried women over 25 are totally doing, then I don’t know what the point was.