Well, this is … interesting. So JohnTheOther has plopped out another rambling diatribe about evil feminists. This time he accuses them not only of “attacking male sexuality” but also (if I’m reading him correctly) of being a bunch of evil homophobes jealous that some men don’t want to have sex with women. You read this and tell me what you think he’s implying here:
Male sexuality is of course both demonized and treated as a form of predation, but also strictly limited to a narrow set of acceptable expressions. Outside of sexual identities which place men in positions to benefit women as sexual gate-keepers, masculine sexuality is generally condemned.
JTO would love to compare these alleged gay-man-hating feminists to the proudly gay-male-affirming Men’s Rights Movement. There’s just one problem: As even JTO has to force himself to admit, there are more than a few homophobic dudes lurking around in the Men’s Rights movement. As JTO acknowledges:
[T]here is a thread of opinion with a growing currency among some MRAs which rejects the legitimacy of men whose self identity and sexuality is gay or bisexual, or I suppose, transsexual.
JTO doesn’t like this, and says so:
[There] are men (and women) whose sexuality, either chosen or not, doesn’t conform to an acceptable standard – and some within the MRM would demonize them. Gentlemen and ladies – this is nothing short of stupid.
At what point does who an individual finds sexually attractive diminish their value as a human? How is it that a man whose preference doesn’t include vagina becomes less of a man? Conversely, are we going to pretend the sexual preferences of our female colleagues matter in the context of partnership in the fight for the human rights of men and boys?
So: JohnTheOther has explicitly decided to speak up in favor of “the gay agenda.” (Yes, that’s the phrase he used.) And he’s even included lesbians in the deal – something allegedly pro-gay MRAs often have trouble doing – even though he sort of suggests at the end that he’s only willing to accept lesbians who are also MRAs.
But, hey, baby steps, right?
Well, John, if you really want to toss the homophobes out of the Men’s Rights movement, you’re going to have to start with A Voice for Men itself.
If you go to read JTO’s whole post over on AVFM, you’ll see a couple of “featured videos” in the sidebar from longtime AVFM friend and contributor Bernard Chapin. One of them bears the intriguing title “Feminist Professor Gloats Over Lesbian Chic.” The description, presumably written by AVFM head honcho Paul Elam, reads:
Bernard’s on a roll here with this one. And you will be rolling to [sic] as he delivers another thorough fisking, Inferno style.
Watch the video, here or there, or as much of it as you can stand. As you’ll see, it’s basically eight minutes of gratingly “humorous” lesbian bashing from good old Bern – whose preferred term for “lesbian,” incidentally, is “lesbobo.” (Evidently adding an extra “bo” to the old slur “lesbo” is hilarious.)
Chapin has produced more than 1200 videos; this is one of the two that AVFM has chosen to feature.
You want to stand up to homophobia, John? Take down that video. Apologize for hosting it. Apologize for featuring it. Demand that Chapin apologize for it — or kick him to the curb.
Meanwhile, AVFM is helping the guy behind the website Artistry Against Misandry publicize and raise money for an upcoming event; Elam himself says he’s already sent along a hundred dollars. Here are some examples of the sort of “artistry” that’s featured on the site:
This second graphic is not only homophobic but confused: Chaz Bono is a trans man, not a lesbian.
Speaking of transphobia, AAM also hosts several videos by “Creativebrother,” one of which is this not-hot transphobic mess:
John, I suggest you ask your boss at AVFM to get his money back from Artistry Against Misandry. Because, here’s the thing: if you actively support hate like this, people might just get the impression you’re a hate site.
EDITED TO ADD: In the comments, Elam proudly announces his own support of the “gay agenda” as well. Well, with 0.1% of it.
I don’t like most gay activists very much, and I oppose 99.9% of what passes as gay activism, but I don’t think it is very smart to forget that part of the reason they were led astray is because most “normal” men never gave them the dignity of being regarded as a man.
Forget gay marriage, forget bullying, forget AIDS: apparently the only real issue for gay men is evil feminist ladies calling them “fags” for not wanting to have sex with them.
Elam also has a most interesting explanation of homophobia, at least against gay men:
Gay men are bashed, when all is said and done, because they are not of utilitarian value to women, and because they are perceived as not having enough strength to be of utilitarian value to the elites.
Yeah, that’s probably it.
What about homophobia against lesbians? That’s easy: “lesbobos” are just naturally ugly and hilarious.
darksidecat — point noted, and I was a bit wary of using the “but it’s legal!” defense. Idk how else to make homosexuality clearly different from incest, bestiality, or (this is NWO) stat rape — I do not want to debate why he can’t fuck 14 year old girls in other words.
Perhaps “all parties are consenting adults” is the best wording though, even when debating with someone as intentionally hostile as NWO.
Since when do feminists hate gay men?
Owly, darling, I have friends who have all kinds of sexual interests I find disgusting. This hasn’t stopped us from being friends and I don’t call their existence disgusting because of it.
I do find the sex lives of misogynistic homophobic asshats disgusting and repulsive, but you can’t be mad at me for my preferences, man.
it truly is puzzling that gay men arent joining a movement where straight dudes sit around all day discussing what it means to be gay.
“I think it’s interesting that Slavey (and not just him, I’ve seen this elsewhere) can only explain why homosexuality is disgusting by comparing it to random other things that are disgusting.
Because you could use this argument strategy for anything.”
You eat mayonnaise? That’s just like eating your own shit! (does NWO realize that most people into playing with poop use protection, because E. Coli etc? *doubts this*)
No, that doesn’t make sense, but I find mayo particularly revolting, the rest of you are welcome to eat it though (I mean, if you like it that is)
I haven’t been able to eat potato salad without throwing up for years. So for me, the thought of eating poo is like eating potato salad. Not that I’ve tried the former.
Fall in line and call me a bigot, little bolsheviks!
I actually am a little weirded out by the thought that milk is a bodily fluid. I’ve drank a cow’s secretions. Urk.
…And that’s why I think everyone in the milk industry is a child-molesting serial killer.
Fembot: Roosh V is a nasty piece of work. He’s admitted to committing rape, he’s devoted his life to having sex with people he can’t stand, he’s generally just a nasty person.
Meat is disgusting and makes me want to vomit. I can’t understand how you people can eat it. And yet you don’t see me going about saying that carnivores are disgusting.
A girl in my high school would try to get people not to drink milk by saying “you’re just drinking cow pus.”
My reaction: mmm, cow pus.
mayonnaise is way grosser than doo doo, but again, personal preferences
Also gross if you think about it: Cheese. That’s not just a bodily fluid, it’s a bodily fluid that’s gotten so curdled it’s solidified.
(I apologize if I’m making any vegans queasy, or any non-vegans reconsider their life choices. I eat milk and meat and cheese myself, I just doublethink really hard around it. “This isn’t an animal’s muscle tissue. It’s meat from the the meat orchard where they harvest meat trees.”)
If it were seriously a choice between a heavily lactose-y food (like whole milk) or poop, I might just risk the E. Coli — the lactose is guaranteed to cause my lactose intolerant self an unpleasant result, the poop might just be gross.
And I’m going to repeat for NWO’s sake — most people who do sex acts involving poop (or pee for that matter) take precautions not to actually ingest it, because E. Coli (just for starters, Cholera if you have truly crappy luck…no pun intended >.< )
I’ve never met a straight man who spends so much time thinking about gay sex. The the lady doth protest too much, methinks….
(I know that’s the cheapest of cheap shots, but this is the Internet, and trollery is as trollery does.)
Shrimping isn’t that! Shrimping is sucking on toes!
Drinking your semen out of someone’s ass is felching.
Gosh people. Vocabulary.
NWO: If someone says they find the actions of gays repulsive, they’re branded a homophobe.
And if someone finds the actions of christians repulsive they aren’t any worse, to you, than people who hate gays?
Everyone has the right to life, freedom, property and vote.
You don’t really believe this. I say this because you complain that people have voted for things you hate, and you say those votes were therefore invalid.
You think people have the right to nothing much, and they should be happy no one is curb-stomping their head.
Also, straight people perform anal sex and ass play too–there’s nothing uniquely gay about penises in butts or licking cum out of assholes. Not at all.
For someone who hates the very thought of men fucking it is interesting that Slavey has been investigating the specifics in so much detail. Granted that he got the terminology wrong, but this is Slavey – being wrong is what he does.
If something truly grosses me out I tend to go out of my way to avoid it, but maybe I’m just odd that way.
Hell, there’s not even anything uniquely gay about a penis in a boy’s butt, or certain of my straightboy fuckfriends have a little bit of explaining to do.
I see Cliff beat me to the vocab lesson while I was confirming — urban dictionary’s top definition says “any human orifice” btw, so I’d assume that a post blowjob kiss without swallowing/spitting would count too?
its cool, i just got done eating some delicious chicken wings, and now all i want is more chicken wings
CORRECTION:
while i was typing that my brother got home (i’m staying with my parents for a week or so because i had to sublet my apartment earlier than my internship starts) and he’s already eaten, so now i get to eat all the chicken wings.
Argenti: Not nearly as well as Noadi did. (With follow up note about bestiality being illegal)
No, actually, in lots of places it isn’t: lots of places in the USA.
that is snowballing
Pecunium — I blame insomnia, I meant Noadi’s follow up note about bestiality, which does in fact say exactly what you just said, idk where my brain wandered off to.
Sharculese — oh, ok then. It did specifically say vagina or anus though, and if you have semen, and a vagina, odds are in favor of a heterosexual sex act (or trans* person being involved, but odds are smaller there) — NWO’s still wrong to call it a homosexual sex act in other words. Eh, maybe he’s just plain fractally wrong…
I think if it’s a vagina then that can be a “creampie.” But “creampie” might just be letting semen drip out of the vagina; usage varies.
…yeahhh, gay people have no monopoly on messy play.