One widespread belief of the manosphere crowd is that “Western women” – that is, white women in developed countries – are a bunch of stuck-up, demanding, divorce-initiating feminism-infected harridans. So the proper course of action for the almost-all-white dudes of the manosphere is to seek a woman with darker skin and a (supposedly) more pliable nature. Even better: beleaguered white dudes should move to one of the countries where these feminism-free gals live, because when you bring them to the United States they too have a tendency to become infected with evil feminism and to become as stuck-up and evil as their lighter-skinned sisters.
This belief isn’t universal amongst manospehreians by any stretch of the imagination. White nationalist manosphreians (like those who populate the blog In Mala Fide) get testy when their women are considered inferior to non-whites; others think that all women are equally evil. Still others think that moving to a whole other country is too much of a hassle. Rarely do you find a manospherian willing to state the obvious: that the “white women suck” mantra is as offensive to non-white women as it is to white women.
Over on The Spearhead, one commenter has taken the “white women suck” mantra to its logical extreme, arguing that these evil women need to be quite literally bred out of existence.
Let’s take a look at walking in hell’s argument:
If one thinks about it, the misandry and divorce problem are problems that occur in countries where the women are light-skinned–mostly Northern Hemisphere Western Contries, and where the governments are atheist or were atheist.
Problem countries are Sweden, Germany, Czech Republic, Poland, Russia, United States, France, Britain, Ireland, Canada, Austrailia, New Zealand, etc. In short–the West. Light skinned women are by nature more dominant and controlling. If you combine that with a culture that encourages bad behavior, you as a man are doomed.
So far, this is standard-issue western-women-suck-ism. But then Hell starts talking about genes.
So the misandry problem is problem of genetics and culture. We can see the genetic differences in the United States. Asian Women divorce their husbands at a much lower rate then the other racial groups. The exception in America is the American Black Women (But isn’t she exceptional, after all)? I mean native African Women have very little resemblance to American Black Women).
Ironically, it’s fairly typical for the white-women-suck crowd to hate black women even more; in this case the only non-typical thing about Hell’s screed is that he’s willing to cut African women some slack.
Now Hell sets forth his basic thesis:
My point is this: I maintain the best wife for a white man is someone darker skinned then he is. I maintain that the best culture for the white man and his wife is a man-friendly culture. For example, a white man and Mexican woman living in Mexico; a white man and Thai Woman living in Thailand; a white man and a Morracan Woman, living in Morraco; a white man and Turkish Woman, living in Turkey. This strategy neutralizes the light-skinned genes, and at the same time neutralizes the cultural influences.
Note: If you plan to move to Morocco to escape the tyranny of white women, you should probably learn to spell the name of the country correctly first.
Naturally, Hell can’t bring himself to suggest that white men should marry black women. And he thinks that even black men should give African-American women a pass:
For a black man, possibly the best plan is to emigrate to Africa in order to have a family. I had a friend who did this. Most African divorce laws keep the man firmly in charge with sole custody automatically going to the man.
While some Western-women-hating manospherians have something of a fetish for Eastern European women, Hell warns his fellow men to avoid these sneaky deceitful harridans as well:
Whatever you do, never bring an Eastern European, Russian, or Ukrainian Girl to the Unites States.
But it isn’t only the Eastern European women who are spoiled by the evil feminism of the west.
In fact don’t bring any woman to the United States. Remember: even the healthiest fish becomes sick when the lake is poisoned. Some fish will become sicker than others depending on their genetic makeup. For example, that nice girl you brought over from Asia might not divorce you when she comes to the USA, but she is likely to become a much different (difficult and unpredictable) person.
So who is the best man for the white woman living in the West? Quite simply, no man; or another woman. Very few men in the West will be able to satify Western White Women.
And this, naturally, leads to what what we might call Hell’s Final Solution to the problem:
These women need to be bred out of existence.
We as men can speed the extinction of Western White Women by encouraging them to pursue the single life or to pursue another woman as a spouse (lesbianism). We can do this actively and passively. Actively by outright encouragement, and passively by never giving a Western Woman access to our sperm, money, or time.
Despite its, er, problematic content, Hell’s comment managed to draw 21 upvotes from fellow Spearheaders, more than twice the number of downvotes it received.
I eagerly await A Voice for Men’s campaign to uncover and expose the identities of Hell and his upvoters – as well as against The Spearhead itself for providing a safe harbor for such thinking. I mean, AVfM literally offered a $1000 award for the personal information of a feminist who made similarly troubling remarks about men, and a separate $1000 reward for the identities of those involved in a theatrical production about a feminist who wrote a famous manifesto about the evils of men. Surely the A Voice for Men crowd will be equally offended by these remarks from their comrades on The Spearhead.
Here on Man Boobz we content ourselves with highlighting bad ideas, not harassing or threatening or exposing the personal information of those who promulgate them. The “war of ideas” isn’t an actual war. The bad ideas we highlight here are as silly as they are reprehensible; they will ultimately vanish from the world on their own — though hopefully our mockery of them will help to speed that process a little bit.
EDITED TO ADD: Thanks to scarlettpipistrelle for pointing me to this lovely comment.
Why do you care if these men want to date women from other cultures? Are you jealous or just racist? Control freaks maybe? Get a life. Pretty soon you people will stand behind a law that controls are social lives… oh wait what about IMBRA? Lol
@DYOR
I live in South Korea and see many American men date Korean women (not as many in the reverse, but this is a military base and there are far more men than women, and far more single men than single women). I don’t have a problem with it at all, because they are dating eachother as equal human beings, and because the American men are not looking for a subservient delicate Asian Bride. (which if they were, South Korea is a poor place to look except for maybe immigrants from other south Asian countries).
I don’t think anyone has said anything about laws controlling cross culture dating so no need to throw that strawman out there. This is about treating women from other cultures like full human beings and not a commodity that can be found, purchased, trapped, or otherwise acquired. And not because laws say so, but because it is the decent thing to do.
DYOR — I for one could care less who these guys date, I do, however, get my racism radar on high alert when I see entire countries being lumped into one stereotype — the “submissive Asian” is racist, going “oh boy is that racist” isn’t racist >.<
The commenter being mocked lumped all of Africa together and then made broad generalizations about an entire continent.
And the vast majority of comments have been going “that’s not how genetics work!” anyways…so pointing out how science works is racist now?
IMBRA isn’t about social lives but fucking human trafficking, I’m soooo sorry that stopping human trafficking might interfere with your plans for a foreign bride…oh wait, no I’m not.
*the “submissive Asian” stereotype is racism — that wasn’t intended to comment on anyone in particular (whether submissive and/or Asian or not)
ABNOY: Hah, no wonder why I almost never see sexual relationships, either intimate or casual, between non-Western and English-speaking men and Western and English-speaking women, especially in the men’s home countries: Perma-Friendzoned!
Or you are just too dense to notice. Try spending time in NYC, or SF, or LA.
You might also try London.
As to English… that leaves out most of Europe; which the OP quoted was lambasting, so try Munich, or Oslo, or Paris, or Marseilles.
In other words, you are living in wilfull ignorance, and think we ought to listen to you; which means it’s also wilfull arrogance.
Historically (as in the entirety of human history), there are really only two things the average human woman anywhere has really cared about when it comes to seeking a man as a sexual partner: the size of his wallet and the size of his body (specifically the organs involved in sex e.g. genitalia, tongue, fingers).
And publically stupid. Historically there is no such thing as the “wallet and cock” criteria.
If you actually looked at “beauty” standards you would find that what is sexually attractive in penes is quite variable. Greece and Rome thought a large pecker was repulsive.
Then again, binary views of sexuality are fairly recent ideas, so your foolish misunderstanding of how things work is slightly more understandable.
More of that wilfull ignorance.
It’s really frustrating, foreign men come to my country in the Orient
Dude, you need to keep the story straight…. you are either living where you can see (and thus evaluate) all these non-Western speakers of English failing to get the White Women, or you are in someplace in, “The Orient” watching all the MRA schnooks stealing “your wimmenz”.
Try to pretend to have some self-respect.
DYOR: Why do you care if these men want to date women from other cultures? Are you jealous or just racist? Control freaks maybe? Get a life. Pretty soon you people will stand behind a law that controls are social lives… oh wait what about IMBRA? Lol
Says a man who thinks women being given equal rights is a grave injustice.
A dude who thinks that making them second class citizens is a “civil rights issue”.
Says a guy supporting another guy who is whingeing about how we need to control whom white women marry, so that all the other women on the planet can be relegated to second class citizens.
It’s the last that explains why we care. It’s not who they want to marry, it’s what they want to do to half the human race.
Oy. J.T. Ready. Posterboy for the Patriot Movement; until he goes off on a shooting spree (because his girlfriend, with whom he had a child he called, “half-ugly” because his girlfriend wasn’t white… the cognitive dissonance must have been hard, that or the compartmentalisation powerful), and suddenly he’s not really a Minuteman.
That, or it was a conspiracy to kill him because he was “too effective”.
Yeah right. The problem is there are a lot of guys like him in “The Movement” and admitting that J.T. Ready committed murders because he was too weak to accept rejection makes the rest of them look suspect.
Maybe there’s a reason they don’t want the spotlight of public attention turned on them.
w00t, my mother will reconsider on Sheriff Joe…that’s a start..apparently catching her before her drive to work was good timing to get her to actually ponder what I said.
“Greece and Rome thought a large pecker was repulsive.” — yeah, I suspect the MRAs who think it’s all about penis size have never been on the receiving end of a large penis…it’s a physics problem.
Pecunium — my mother seems to be actually reconsidering my point that domestic violence turned murder-suicide is not rare, whereas her “theory” sounded more like a bad movie. Having lived with her for 2 decades, the cognitive dissonance some people are capable of is absolutely amazing. (I mean, I can’t convince her why treating the mentally ill as assumed violent is terrible, she’s barely got the sense to realize that saying all mentally ill people should just be locked up forever would include me)
And yes, this all makes family dinners just a damned joy.
Argenti: The Romans, in particular, were mocking of large penes. Not a question of being on the receiving end,but of how ugly they were; disporpotionate, malformed.
They would go to crucifixions and make comments. Praising the smaller, more attractive ones, and adding insults to the already horrific torture that was public execution in Rome.
DYOR, I’m really not concerned about who these guys marry. It won’t be me. Also, women are women wherever you might choose to travel, which frequently means that the women will know their own minds. In societies where a woman might be expected to defer to her husband, its common for her family to go to great lengths to try to make a good match. The values and beliefs and personalities of the couple are given great considersation.
In short, finding a wife might not be as easy as they think if their intention is to treat her like dirt. And just like everywhere in the world some parents are truly concerned about the well being of their daughters and others are not.
I’m starting to think nothing in Rome didn’t relate to penises in some sense (no plural of the word penis ever looks right…)
Could I then argue that the fall of Rome was its obsession with the male anatomy? MRAs, you’re driving us the way of Rome!
…How does anyone praise a body part of someone being publicly executed? Insults make sense in the just world “they aren’t like us” sense, but compliments?!
And having actually read stormfront — they were all “he’d never do that!” — you’ve got “the problem” right, and I need brain bleach after that. Yeah, sorry if this isn’t really coherent, I’m still trying to put my brain back in my skull, it’s spinning around on the floor someplace still.
There you go Ms P… always about Team Vagina. Typical woman.
Hahaha! And MRA’s aren’t all about Team Penis? Pot… Meet kettle!
DYOR… There you go again, always dodging the question.
The “Team” comment is revealing, and sad. It rarely makes for a happy life to see the world as one big PvP game, where the other side is always the enemy and you can’t even communicate with them except by pantomime.
@pillowinhell, let’s also not forget that in patriarchal cultures, men are expected to provide for their wives financially, and therefore a potential husband’s wealth and earning capacity are of great interest to potential brides and their families. MRAs seem to have trouble reconciling the Good Old Days of the Patriarch with the idea that men are supposed to be meal tickets and protectors, even thought that’s exactly what men were and are expected to be in such societies. They’re tantruming because they want to have it both ways.
-mythago – NOTHING is more bizarre to me than when they start going on about how old patriarchal culture “restrained women’s hypergamy.” Yeah, old patriarchs were always trying to make sure their daughters didn’t marry up!
“let’s also not forget that in patriarchal cultures, men are expected to provide for their wives financially, and therefore a potential husband’s wealth and earning capacity are of great interest to potential brides and their families.”
So much so that that’s where the concept of hypergamy actually comes from — for a completely dependent woman => mother it was advantageous to marry a man who could provide for the kids, and the more he could provide, the better. The way they go on about hypergamy you’d think they’d want women independent and thus able to marry whomever they like, whether he’s a millionaire or a starving artist.
(sorry for the hetero-normative assumptions, I’m not sure how to theorize on MRA-land without them)
and I was ninja’ed 🙂
Oh honestly…will someone give these idiots a book on basic genetics? I’m really having difficulty here figuring out how anyone who studied up to year ten could make such a stupid, ignorant arguement.
genetics, psychology, history, ANTHROPOLOGY, FOR FUCKS SAKES….
Really, it’s hard to know where to start…
Mythago that’s the part that has me laughing the most! MRA’s don’t get that they will be expected to provide, and it will likely be a good deal more than they thought! Of the working Asian women I’ve met, they thoroughly expect to be working twelve and sixteen hour days, unless family duties dictate they need to be home. Sometimes their mother provides childcare and housekeeeping, other times its the husband. And if the women are putting in those hours, the men had best be doing the same! Its not all about buying her the newest dresses, its about providing and contributing to the whole family, his and hers. In Muslim families, women who are more traditional stay at home. In the Koran, it states numerous times that its the duty of the husband to provide generously for his wifes comfort, and hers to provide generously to his. So the men must work hard. I’ve met tradional Muslim men who routinely put in sixty hour work weeks to do so. And again, its not just his wife and kids he”s providing for, but the entire family, plus activities that benefit the community at large. And they must protect their families as best they can. So its not like here, the expectations of men are much much higher.
They could start with humanity. Kant’s Moral Imperatives look better the more I look at the MRM.
Kant?!? To be fair, I haven’t read him, just heard my best friend rant about his morals, namely the one about lying *always* being wrong (when, say, lying to abusive parents? morally acceptable by both of us)
On topic, maybe start them with a primer course in Mendelian genetics? That should be simple enough for them.
Lest it get lost, this is how one does a Mother’s Day Post if one is a decent human being.
Tomatoes from Stonekettle Station