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$MONEY$ antifeminism bronies douchebaggery misogyny MRA reddit

Men’s Rights Bronies, Part 2: The Piggening

Oy vey.

Hot on the heels of my recent discovery of Men’s Rights Bronies, a new controversy about My Little Pony has erupted in the Men’s Rights subreddit. Though, to be honest, I might have provoked most of the actual controversy there by wading into the muck and pointing out a few facts.

The discussion centers around a rather obtuse post by Kathleen Richter on the Ms. Blog from two years ago accusing the show’s creators of racism and homophobia, among other things. The post couldn’t be more wrong about everything, and, unsurprisingly, was torn apart by commenters on the site – and by Lauren Faust, then the show’s “creative steward” and executive producer, who was given the opportunity to write a rebuttal on the Ms. Blog.

So why are the dudes on the Men’s Rights subreddit getting worked up by this dead controversy today? Because an MRA who calls himself ThePigman – we took a look at one of his terrible, terrible comic strips here – decided to post Richter’s original post (but not Faust’s rebuttal) to r/mensrights under the title “My Little Pony FIM attacked by nuts at Ms Magazine Blog. NOT, repeat, NOT a satire.”

Perhaps inadvisedly, I posted a comment pointing out that the Richter’s blog post had not exactly been well-received.  And this happened. (Click on the pic for a full-sized version.)

The whole discussion is rather surreal. Some highlights.

ThePigman responding to a rather straightforward and factual comment of mine with:

You are a disgusting animal. Go and talk to someone else, just having you on the same planet makes me want to puke.

Ullere repeatedly misrepresenting my recent post on Men’s Rights Bronies.

The dude who regularly posts on r/mensrights as “Manzboobz” makes an appearance.

And this barely coherent little masterpiece of sarcasm from our old friend Eoghan (who posts on r/mensrights as Sigil1):

As someone who speaks fluent Eoghan, let me translate: he is suggesting that the women discussing the issue of MLP on the Ms. Blog are all a bunch of layabouts living off of their hard-working husbands. He’s also making a snide reference to feminism as being an “astro-turf” movement (rather than a true grassroots movement) because, in his mind, feminism is all a big plot created and funded by the CIA and the evil elitists who run the world.

Eoghan aside, this whole episode suggests how difficult it is for a feminist to have any kind of discussion with MRAs even on the Men’s Rights subreddit, probably the most moderate MRA forum out there. (Several other people posted references to Faust’s rebuttal, but weren’t downvoted, because they aren’t the dreaded, more-evil-than-evil-itself “manboobz.”)

A couple of days ago, one poster to r/mr asked “Why are there not more feminists here” debating the issues with MRAs. Here’s your answer.

EDITED TO ADD:  ThePigman has responded to this and my previous Brony post in his typically calm and reasonable manner on his blog. By which I mean he spewed forth a bunch of angry nonsense.

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Lauren
8 years ago

Interesting… I just did a whole post about MLP. I wish it was as feminist as it wants to be, but I have some big problems with it. I really don’t get the Bronies thing, but I am fascinated by this phenomenon. As always, reddit entertains…

Cliff Pervocracy
8 years ago

I wonder how many MRAs think you, personally, are funded by the CIA.

Cliff Pervocracy
8 years ago

I also wonder how much of a feminist you need to be to get CIA funding. Do you need to actually be working in government advancing the Feminist Agenda? How about being a lobbyist? Would a feminist writer count? How about a feminist blogger? *wink wink* Would you need a certain readership to qualify for a CIA stipend?

Or is it enough to merely be a feminist? Like, if I give Uncle Joe a hard time at the dinner table because he says women should just be mothers instead of going to college, is that worth a bonus from the CIA? If I vote with women’s rights in mind, can I at least get five bucks for lunch? What exactly are the standards here?

…Do people like Eoghan think about these things?

hellkell
hellkell
8 years ago

Leave it Ullere to completely miss a point.

Nice to see the reddit mods still won’t take down your impersonator.

TheNatFantastic
8 years ago

I like the idea that feminists just sit around all day getting furious as hell at cartoons, but not giving a shit about ‘important’ issues. Because, as we know, people can’t be concerned with more than one issue at a time. In fact, I was just thinking about how shitty the Where The Wild Things Are film looked (Maurice Sendak just died 🙁 ), and now I don’t care about ending FGM any more. Trufax.

Cliff Pervocracy
8 years ago

They’re pretty much spelling out “it’s okay to cherrypick feminists for one silly quote from months ago, but MRAs must be judged only by our most reasonable and moderate members,” too.

clairedammit
clairedammit
8 years ago

BUT A WOMAN WROTE SOMETHING STUPID ONCE

Nate
8 years ago

I know it’s low-hanging fruit, but the dissonance of someone who chooses to refer to himself as The Pigman calling someone else a “disgusting animal” is pretty darn lulzy.

Anthony Zarat
8 years ago

The same thing happens to me if I don’t get eough sleep, and try to write something coherent.

Lady Zombie
Lady Zombie
8 years ago

No, it’s just because you’re a shitwit.

hellkell
hellkell
8 years ago

Whatever Zarat. That’s probably another lie.

Cliff Pervocracy
8 years ago

AntZ just implied that he sometimes is coherent.

Maybe he hasn’t gotten proper sleep in years?

Snowy
Snowy
8 years ago

The same thing happens to me if I don’t get eough sleep, and try to write something coherent.

Finally an explanation for everything Antz has ever said!

Lady Zombie
Lady Zombie
8 years ago

No no, y’all! He’s a victim of institutionalized misandry! He has to stay up all night designing his FOREIGN BRIDE’S VR replacement whilst mapping out the great divide. That’s what makes him incoherent donchaknow!

Hershele Ostropoler
8 years ago

AntZ, how long has it been since you’ve slept? Eighteen months or so?

Viscaria
Viscaria
8 years ago

Yesterday I cared about rape culture. Today, I care about cake.

Viscaria
Viscaria
8 years ago

There is only 1 active care unit in my brain at any time.

Cliff Pervocracy
8 years ago

I’m making a grocery list right now, so clearly I don’t care about domestic violence.

ronalon42
8 years ago

I don’t get why MRAs would like MLP. The only real reoccuring male character is the baby dragon Spike who has unrequited crush on Rarity and is used as manual labor/ scribe/ letter deliverer by the ponies who often forget to include him in friend -oriented activities.

It is really so far beyond mind boggling I have to conclude that they truly are living in an alternate reality.

So I am still confused, are they agreeing with the show, or with the critique of the show, or is it just the idea of women disagreeing that they like? I haven’t been around long enough to decipher it all.

cloudiah
8 years ago

Antz, talk to a therapist yet? Seriously. Do it.

Cliff Pervocracy
8 years ago

I’m never quite sure what Spike’s relationship with Twilight Sparkle is. Is he her employee? Student? Friend? Coworker? Pet?

cloudiah
8 years ago

Confession: I have never seen MLP, so I have no context with which to interpret this remark from the reddit thread. Help?

(Secret sidebar: Mr. Cake is one of my favorite characters, from an MRA perspective, but even he is not immune to the subtle problems – S2E13, wherein the Cakes have twins, Mr. Cake makes some stuttering, nervous remarks about how he’s distantly related to a unicorn and a pegasus, so it’s OK that his twins are one of each while both of the Cakes are regular earth ponies. It’s interesting how the show is insinuating that Mrs. Cake cheated on Mr. Cake, and he seems to know it and stays with Mrs. Cake anyway. I wonder if, in the MLP-FIM matriarchy, their divorce laws are in any way similar to ours…)

Source.

Wha?

Argenti Aertheri
Argenti Aertheri
8 years ago

cloudiah I’ve seen one episode, so I can’t explain, but I love this line from that link — “ignoring the racial aspect, because they’re friggin’ multicolored ponies, people” — so MRAs can handle that part but are worried about divorce laws in pony world? o.O?

Also — “If I vote with women’s rights in mind, can I at least get five bucks for lunch?” — or at least bus fare to the poll and back?

Cliff Pervocracy
8 years ago

I don’t think the show is insinuating that Mrs. Cake cheated on Mr. Cake. I think the show is insinuating “even regular horsies can have magical baby horsies, how magical,” because for God’s sake it’s a show about talking ponies learning the value of friendship. They are not going to throw in a subplot about pony sexual infidelity and pony divorce law.

Kyrie
Kyrie
8 years ago

Right now, there are three different tought in my brain:
– you must work. Write this thing.
– go to sleep. Sleep is soft, sleep is nice, I know you wanna sleep, just close your eyes for a second and it will be much better
– internet is awesome. look at this article. And this funny thing. And this cute one. Manboobz!

There is clearly no room for caring about DV. Maybe tomorrow.

Shaenon
8 years ago

My favorite part is the MRA who complains that feminists are wasting their time on “My Little Pony” instead the real problems in the world– and then the example he gives is the false rape accusation epidemic.

Dude, unicorns are more real than that.

cloudiah
8 years ago

I’m waiting for their to be a post about a spermburgling insinuation in season 1…

Especially since they were talking about how The Simpsons probably endorses their arguments about false rape accusations. Sigh. I thought Second Wave feminists controlled the Mainstream Media, or whatever boring troll was talking about last night?

Shaenon
8 years ago

Okay, as a giant nerd I have seen the episode with the Cake babies. Mr. and Mrs. Cake are both Earth Ponies (i.e., regular horses), but their twins are a unicorn and a pegasus. One of the characters asks how this is possible, and Mr. Cake replies that he and his wife have distant unicorn and pegasus forebears. He is not “stuttering” or “nervous,” and it’s obviously just a setup for Pinkie Pie babysitting the twins and having to deal with their magic powers.

The idea that a children’s cartoon would have plotlines about adultery is, of course, completely bizarre. How would that work anyway? Would Mrs. Cake have had a threesome with a unicorn and a pegasus and gotten simultaneously pregnant by both? Why am I devoting thought to this?

I’d think MRAs would be more upset that the episode shows Mr. Cake changing diapers and burping the babies alongside his wife. What a pongina.

Shaenon
8 years ago

Geez, if people want to see a stupid My Little Pony fan argument, just Google “Derpy.”

ostara321
ostara321
8 years ago

The idea that a children’s cartoon would have plotlines about adultery is, of course, completely bizarre. How would that work anyway? Would Mrs. Cake have had a threesome with a unicorn and a pegasus and gotten simultaneously pregnant by both? Why am I devoting thought to this?

Next up on the MRA outrage blogroll, Pony Whores Riding the Alpha Pony Cock Carousel.

ostara321
ostara321
8 years ago

My favorite part is the MRA who complains that feminists are wasting their time on “My Little Pony” instead the real problems in the world– and then the example he gives is the false rape accusation epidemic.

Dude, unicorns are more real than that.

For realzies. I tend to have a general problem with the “focus on REAL problems” meme that goes around because funnily enough, the issues that tend to have more adverse effects for marginalized folks tend to rarely ever qualify as “REAL problems”. But his example is just absurd. Like, at least put something in there like “THE ECONOMY” rather than an MRA urban legend. That way at least you only look like a jackass instead of a dumbass AND a jackass.

Course, we are talking horses here, so I guess it follows that people will show their asses (ba dum cha!). Sorry, couldn’t resist 😛

ABNOY
ABNOY
8 years ago

“I don’t get why MRAs would like MLP. ”

It’s not an MRA thing, it’s a guy thing, ahem(Rule34)ahem(Furry)ahem i.e. ‘I watch MLP:FIM for the (wink-wink nudge-nudge) plot’ meme

cloudiah
8 years ago

Someone over on reddit/mr called someone else a neigh-sayer. I know they’re our SWORN ENEMIES FOREVER but I laughed a little.

katz
8 years ago

As I heard it, fan lore states that “ass” is the worst swear word in Equestria because it’s a racial slur.

Cliff Pervocracy
8 years ago

So hey, why are MRAs talking about an article about a show about ponies when there are real problems in the world?

(I don’t actually care about that. But it strikes me funny how the “what about real problems” argument is automatically hypocritical.)

Falconer
Falconer
8 years ago

I just had an D: moment when it occurred to me that the cutie-marks on each of the ponies are probably descended in a vague sort of way from branding marks.

Branding marks identify the pony as someone’s property and go on the rump.

Cutie marks identify the pony as an individual and go on the rump.

If you ignore the vast difference between the two, there’s, like, hardly any difference between the two!

OMG why isn’t anyone attacking Lauren Faust about this??!!??eleven

ostara321
ostara321
8 years ago

As I heard it, fan lore states that “ass” is the worst swear word in Equestria because it’s a racial slur.

Aww, I was just horsing around.

@cloudiah, sometimes assholes are funny. I often wish that weren’t the case, because then the asshole comedians out there who are only funny a fraction of the time and what they like to call “edgy” (read: propping up the kyriarchy) the rest of the time wouldn’t be getting paid ridiculous amounts of money for saying stupid shit like “those LADIES and their SHOPPING! Amirite gents?”

pillowinhell
8 years ago

Why aren’t there more feminists? One reason, even on feminist only sites we get plenty of MRA feedback. Because the male point of view is everywhere so its hardly necessary to consult about what men want. And…as FC has noted and set up specific threads for, there’s often a lot of hostility towards femninists or feminist thinking. I really don’t look forward to wading through a shitstorm of insults whilst trying to make a point. And while I’ve met MRAs capable of debating in a civil manner and in good faith, the viewpoints are so vastly different that you’re not going to change anyones mind. Unless I’m looking for a debate or wish to clarify some thinking or I want the other side of an issue there’s little point to speaking. I mean, if we were really trying to work up a plan to work together, there would be a point. Otherwise, all that happens is viewpoints become more entrenched.

BlackBloc
BlackBloc
8 years ago

AntZ might like to know there’s already a VR wife made to his specifications called the Tenga Flip Air. Sure, it has no personality and will not cuddle you, but that doesn’t seem to be part of the client’s requirements.

pillowinhell
8 years ago

David? How the hell do you manage to decipher Eoghan?

ostara321
ostara321
8 years ago

So hey, why are MRAs talking about an article about a show about ponies when there are real problems in the world?

(I don’t actually care about that. But it strikes me funny how the “what about real problems” argument is automatically hypocritical.)

Yeah, I noticed that too. I mean, most of “the REAL problems” arguments are, because that often comes pretty close to Oppression Olympics which I tend to think requires a complete lack of self-awareness, but this one is even more obvious.

“OMG FEMINISTS AND THEIR PONIES!!!11!” “BUT GUYS DID YOU SEE THESE PONIES!!1?/!?”

They practically parody themselves.

xardoz
8 years ago

No one seems to have mentioned the last part of Sigil’s baffling post — how are ponies a WMD in the war on women??

Which side is using this WMD? Are the CIA feminists using it to pacify and acclimate feminized males to the matriarchy? Or are western “herbivores” rebelliously using the horses as surrogate VR wives until this whole dumb feminism thing blows over?
The world may never know.

Jar
Jar
8 years ago

So I guess that MRA bronies don’t realize that Lauren Fasut, the (former) executive producer of the show is a feminist who used the show to create quality entertainment for girls and show that there are many different ways to be a girl?
I don’t understand how an MRA could enjoy MLP.

ozymandias42
8 years ago

I interpreted the Mr. Cake/Mrs. Cake thing as Mrs. Cake actually cheating on Mr. Cake. It struck me as a one-off joke aimed at the older fanbase– basically a Parental(/Brony) Bonus.

Kyrie
Kyrie
8 years ago

But ozy, as shaennon said:

The idea that a children’s cartoon would have plotlines about adultery is, of course, completely bizarre. How would that work anyway? Would Mrs. Cake have had a threesome with a unicorn and a pegasus and gotten simultaneously pregnant by both?

How does it works, has she slept with a pegasus-unicorn? Except for the princesses, it’s unheard of! And the explanation they gave is plausible.

marc2020
marc2020
8 years ago

“I interpreted the Mr. Cake/Mrs. Cake thing as Mrs. Cake actually cheating on Mr. Cake. It struck me as a one-off joke aimed at the older fanbase– basically a Parental(/Brony) Bonus.”

Wow seriously… Thats kind of dark of you if you don’t mind me saying.

ozymandias42
8 years ago

What made me read it as a joke was that Mr. Cake said “we have X distant relative who is a unicorn and Y distant relative who’s a pegasus… that makes sense, right?” The joke being that he’s in denial…

marc2020
marc2020
8 years ago

Well ok I guess that sort of makes sence if you put it that way but I agree with Kyrie. Maybe genetics work diffrently in pony land or something.

ozymandias42
8 years ago

Even if I’m reading the joke right I think it’s a one-off subtexty thing, meant to make the people who get it say “heh” and not meant to be, like, an Ultimate Statement about Gender Roles in Ponyville. If nothing else, Mr. Cake and Mrs. Cake seem to be a happy couple who really love each other.

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