Oh, Reddit. Just when I thought I was out… they pull me back in.
So a couple of days ago Reddit had another one of its regular “confess something awful” mega-threads. This time, the OP asked “what is the one illegal, immoral, criminal, or disgusting thing you’ve always wanted to do or try?”
So, aside from the obvious choices (murder, taking a police officer’s gun) what is one terrible desire that a Redditor could confess that would garner more than a hundred upvotes?
Did your answer involve pedophilia – sorry, ebebophilia? Well, congratulations. You are of course correct:
I would have also accepted “smash everything in a Pottery Barn“ and “fuck a female horse.”
Naturally, Reddit being Reddit, someone helpfully offered the would-be child rapist advice on places it would be legal for him to fulfill his desires. And got a dozen upvotes for it.
Did you also guess that some brave Redditor would try to talk the would-be child abuser out of it – and hundreds of upvotes for it? No? Amazingly (for Reddit), someone did – though in true Reddit fashion they did so not because it’s wrong to prey on the young, but because 14-year-olds are annoying.
For many even more horrible confessions that didn’t get quite many upvotes, go here and sort by “controversial.”
Oh, but you say it’s not fair to pick on Redditors in a “confess awful things” thread?
Redditors don’t need a special occasion to celebrate pedophilia.
Thanks again to ShitRedditSays for pointing me to all this awfulness.
scarlettpipistrelle: One need not try to make ephebophiliacs guilty by association. Being predatory of weaker people is damning enough on it’s own.
And I’d say that trying to paint them all as violently atavistic is helpful to them, in general, since most of them aren’t of that stripe, and so can say, “I’m not like that, I just like someone who is at the start of their sexual maturity”.
Then again, I don’t think 14 counts a ephebophilia. I think it’s pedophilic. and most pedophiles aren’t a Warren Jeffs either.
Oh no. NWO has discovered our secret plan. Our rule is now compromised. We must find a new tactic of deceit.
Or we could ask the CIA to kidnap NWO. I’m pretty sure I’ve heard we control them.
Why ask the CIA? One of us should just go into the street and shout that he assaulted us. The police will be chopping down his door in seconds.
He’ll go to prison forever AND have to pay us all one BILLION dollars each in vaginamoney.
make sure to accuse him of calling you mean names a.k.a. sexual harassment
Or using logic, which is domestic violence.
For most, the demarc between pedophilia and ephebophilia is that the target is in the early stages of puberty in the later. Not that this makes it better. My personal impression was that it is a disorder of impulse control. Sexuality is by its very nature exploratory, and people have all sorts of feelings, impulses, and random thoughts. It’s what we think it’s ok to act upon that makes all the difference.
Oops, I meant ebebophila. Can’t type too gud after working all day supporting myself, which MGTOWs think I can’t/won’t do.
And the OP said they wanted a 14 year old, in the abstract. Not a specific 14 year old, but a generic one.
Unless you are trying to argue that the issue of desire is purely based on the “early stages of puberty.” that’s a child.
Even if you are, that’s still not a great defintion.
And, that doesn’t change my complaint, that of you comparing a pedophile (Warren Jeffs, there was a 9 year old he took to be a bride), and a murderer to generic ephebophiles.
Personally, I do see a difference between the two, and it has to do with the later stages of puberty, when the target of their affections looks, almost, like an adult; but lacks the emotional growth to exhibit truly adult behaviors.
So, for me, someone who is more than about 17 who is interested in 14 year-olds is being problematic. Someone who is more than 20 is a pedophile.
The marriages that nailed Jeffs involved a 12 and a 14 year old, if I remember correctly. The audio sex tape of the group scene was decisive. Warren Jeffs also showed attraction to age-appropriate women: his favorite wife and friend was Naomi, who was not a minor. The whole deal of recreated modern patriarchal societies in our time is a strange ball of wax. Polygamy and the notion that puberty as God’s sign of readiness for marriage (which you would have heard expressed in abundance in the comment sections of the Salt Lake Tribune in the months after the YFZ ranch bust) tend to also encourage the notion of ranking patriarchs calling dibs on young girls, which brings in their peculiar practice of “Placement Marriage.” And, there’s a whole weird history to that. But I digress.
The youngest wife of Tom Green, who joined the family at 14 stated in a televised interview that she had no desires except to marry and start bearing children. Perhaps that was true in her case, but as an ideal model for female sexuality, it leaves out a lot. Like higher education.
According to some accounts, one event that spurred the violence at the Clutter home in Kansas was Dick’s increasing attention towards the teenage Nancy Clutter and Perry’s reaction to it. Again, there’s impulse control going haywire.
I maintain that it’s perfectly ok to think and/or feel all sorts of things. But to deliberately truncate a girl’s ascent to adulthood by encumbering her with the responsibilities of an adult sexual relationship is at best, questionable.
In my experience there is pretty much 3 categories of pedophile/ephebophile people (I think it’s kind of silly to differentiate between those two things because first of all there seems to be a lot of overlap and second the only times I’ve ever really seen those words used is in some kind of weird hierarchy argument where the ephebophiles are claiming to be better than pedophiles and therefore totally ok or something) also really any kind of desire that would cause harm like for animals or to rape or murder people or whatever
1. people who act on their fantasies by assaulting actual children/animals/people/whatever
2. people who refrain only because they’re afraid of being caught/lack the opportunity
3. people who understand that it’s morally wrong to do something like that and/or have no desire to actually live out those fantasies
Category 1 and 2 are the same in that they’re both morally horrible, and category 2 and 3 are the same in terms of the same end result of no one being hurt. But to conflate all of them as the same and say that everyone who has whatever desire is the same as this random war criminal/murderer/whatever is stupid. That’s like saying oh Valerie Solanas was an attempted murderer therefore all feminists are in good company.
Actually, desire for sex with 14-year olds is Hebephilia. (roughly elementary school/pre-school – pedophilia, middle school-hebephilia, high school-ephebophilia)
And you’re being too dramatic, (presumably vanilla) heterosexual sex — not RAPE RAPE, mind you– between an older male and a 14-year old teenager is not the end of the world or the downfall of civilization (except maybe for people with your draconian Victorian sexuality), considering that it was perfectly LEGAL until fairly recently in Canada (i.e. turn of the 21st century) and even in some of your own U.S. states and is even today still legal in many countries in Europe (“advanced” countries even, Spain is hardly backwards is it?) and Asia (of course, Japan), right next door in Mexico and Latin America. where it’s considered part of the traditional culture (it features frequently in Jose Garcia Marquez’s famous novels, for instance).
@ABNOY,
Oh, fuck off. Anyone who uses phrases like “rape rape” and equates “I can’t stick my peen in an adolescent” with a “draconian Victorian sexuality” is undoubtedly a shithead.
ABNOY: And you’re being too dramatic, (presumably vanilla) heterosexual sex — not RAPE RAPE, mind you– between an older male and a 14-year old teenager is not the end of the world or the downfall of civilization (except maybe for people with your draconian Victorian sexuality), considering that it was perfectly LEGAL until fairly recently in Canada (i.e. turn of the 21st century) and even in some of your own U.S. states and is even today still legal in many countries in Europe (“advanced” countries even, Spain is hardly backwards is it?) and Asia (of course, Japan), right next door in Mexico and Latin America. where it’s considered part of the traditional culture (it features frequently in Jose Garcia Marquez’s famous novels, for instance).
Ah… an appeal to authority, and some “Prude Shaming”, as well as, “those exotic people do it, so it’s ok”.
It was legal to rape one’s wife until recently. It was socially acceptable it the South (and some of the North) to lynch blacks; as recently as the 1930s people were quite open about it… there were souvenir postcards, and photographs. It was so prevalent that people complained when the post office started to enforce the law agaist sending such postcards.
Being “advanced” in some ways doesn’t preclude being, “backwards” in others. The US maintained chattel slavery for quite some time after the rest of the, “civilised” world had outlawed it. S. Africa maintained Apartied into the present era: and Maggie Thatcher tried to keep Britain in a role which supported it.
As to, “Victorian Morality”, heh. It was quite the flap in Britain when some tried to make the age of consent as high as 16. It wasn’t fair, you see, to keep men from fucking 12 year olds. It wasn’t until 1875 that the age of consent was raised: to 13. In 1885 it was raised again, to 16.
It wasn’t until 2003 that paying anyone under the age of 18 for sex.
So being against fucking children, and adolescents isn’t a “Victorian” attitude. Given that I’ll bet you have no real idea how the Victorians viewed sex, I think we can safely dissimiss it as a cheap attempt at making us feel we aren’t “enlightened” because we are “repressing” a “natural urge”. Taking a shit is a natural urge too, but we also think it has a proper venue; and we teach our children not to do it on the living room carpet.
And “RAPE RAPE”? Really? Rape is sex without consent. The victim’s age is immaterial to that. So to are the sex, the relational status, the sobriety. If person doesn’t consent, it’s rape.
Statutory rape, is different, and consent isn’t (usually) an issue.
So it’s RAPE RAPE too.
It wasn’t until 2003 that paying anyone under the age of 18 for sex. was illegal. Until then you could have sex, for money, with a 16 year old.
a grown-ass man having sex with a child is straight-up plain old rape, no qualifiers necessary
okay, so i know ggm’s full name technically has a jose in it, but still…
also, when your go to source is fiction, you are not on strong ground, buddy
scarlettpipistrelle: Warren Jeffs also showed attraction to age-appropriate women:
Which means he wasn’t a fixated pedophile, it doesn’t mean sex with 14 year olds isn’t pedophilic.
That’s it. I officially now consider anyone who uses “hebephilia” in an “yeah, but” sentence is a pedophile. Just stop beating around the (14 year old) bush.
And just for you, ABNOYing, “ephebophilia” too.
“Luckily, feminists have been rewriting history for decades as womens oppression. All those millenia of not be afforded the privilege of dying in thankless jobs which women couldn’t perform equally. The poor dears.”
but of course it’s a much more wonderful privilege to die in thankless birthing of children.
I was a 14 year old girl once, I never had any desire at that time to have sex with much older men. Is what the 14 year old wants ever thought of in this equation with some people? just, ugh!
@Xtra,
Fourteen-year-olds do not have opinions or desires, silly. Fourteen-year-olds have cherries in need of popping.
Okay, I just threw up in my mouth a little from typing that. I’m swearing off sarcasm for at least an hour. I need to go shower and bleach my brain.
@ABNOY (oh boy)…
Yeah, no, it is. There is no kind of rape that’s just kinda rape. It’s all rape. Also, I’m curious: would it count as RAPE RAPE for you if it was queer sex? Kinky sex? Do the genders involved and the acts involved somehow shield it from being rape?
You know what? This is probably true. A single act of raping a child would probably not bring down an entire civilisation. It’s pretty likely to fuck over that child, though. Do we care about her at all, or just “the end of the world”?
Aww, Ducky. Yes, it’s true, we had a horribly messed up and outdated law on the books for a shamefully long time. I’m sure it helped some people prey on children. Doesn’t make it right. And, anecdotally, when I was a young teen the age of consent was still 14. None of the adults I knew thought it was okay when adults would try to manipulate us into having sex with them. We definitely didn’t think it was okay. Legally, yes, fucked up as it is, it was okay. Culturally, I can’t think of anyone who thought it was acceptable. The vast majority of people who made the “but it’s legal!” defense were people who wanted to take advantage of the immaturity of 14 year olds in order to rape them.
I can’t speak of what it was like to be an adult under that law, because they reformed it the year I turned 18. I can say that when the reform happened, the two most common reactions I heard from people were “Good, our age of consent laws were so terrible” and “Jesus, you’re telling me it was legal for adults to have sex with 14 year olds!? What the hell! That’s fucked up.” But I didn’t speak to a cross-section of Canadians about it, just people I personally know.
Viscaria: Oh, that’s not fair! You’re pointing out that the culture was against sex with children; even when it was legal. That will undercut his argument that culture defines what’s right and laws are made by prudes (who are against, “vanilla” sex just because it’s exploiting children).
So cruel, so hard. So vicious, using facts and personal experience like that to point out the immorality of his arguments.
@Pecunium, you know what would be even more cruel and unfair of me to do? Point out that the old age of consent law went into effect in 1890. When Victoria was Queen of Canada.