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Men’s Rights Redditors find “ebonics” hilarious

The regulars over on the Men’s Rights Subreddit are currently getting amused and/or outraged by the existence of a book titled “Girl, Get That Child Support,” a guide to help single mothers track down deadbeat dads and get the child support they are owed. A few of them were apparently so overstimulated by the book’s title, and a reference to “Baby Mamas” in the subtitle, that this little conversation ensued:

 

Note the upvotes and the (scarcity of) downvotes. And the complete lack of anyone saying “hey, you’re being racist assholes.”

The Men’s Rights Movement, the “most significant civil rights movement of the 3rd millennium.”

 

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lowquacks
lowquacks
8 years ago

@Shadow

Me neither! Every time I tab away, and that’s a fair amount, it gets all little and I have to ctrl-A ctrl-C my comment and then paste it back in (along with deleting the “website” bit again) each time. Is that what’s happening to you? I’m using the latest Firefox with XP.

Sounds like “uni” might be a Commonwealth (or Commonwealth-minus-Canada) thing, then.

katz
8 years ago

“Uni” is also used in Germany. It seems like a pretty logical abbreviation, even though we don’t use it here (USA).

lowquacks
lowquacks
8 years ago

Also @Shadow: you’re not the first to do this here, there’s no way you would’ve known, and I’m not offended, but I’d rather “lowquacks” always be all-lowercase. Think bell hooks or e.e. cummings.

/pointless internet affectation pedantry

lowquacks
lowquacks
8 years ago

@Katz

Well I never! I didn’t even know Germans used the word “university” (while speaking German; I’m under the impression that a lot of Germans are at very least bilingual).

katz
8 years ago

It’s “Universität” in German, so the same abbreviation works.

lowquacks
lowquacks
8 years ago

Aah. Thanks. I’d been taught “Huchschule” in my two years of German (which I don’t remember at all), but even a cursorary internet-look tells me that that actually means “institution of further/tertiary education” apparently.

Shadow
Shadow
8 years ago

@lowquacks

Will do. My bad, I have a tendency to treat usernames as proper nouns. My comment box resizes whenever I click out of the box.

Re: “uni”

I’ve also heard French-speakers use “uni”, but I don’t know if that’s common in French speaking countries, or if it’s influenced by the English speakers.

I can’t think of an abbreviation used by Canadians. All that comes to mind is either “University” or school.

Polliwog
Polliwog
8 years ago

Ooh, ooh, idea! You know how when we started writing poems for Pelljane, s/he eventually figured out that it was poem-writing time and wrote some too? Let’s do that here! If Ruby doesn’t make any kind of acknowledgement that we’re writing poems, then we’ll know that she doesn’t even look at the shape of the text in the thread, much less the content.

Mysteries for the ages: How did she figure out we were talking about her?

I’ll happily support this plan.

When claiming, “It’s science!” a source
Is quite necessary, of course.
And it simply won’t do
Just to shriek, “But it’s TRUE!”
You’ll just seem like the ass of a horse.

abeegoesbuzz
abeegoesbuzz
8 years ago

Every time I tab away, and that’s a fair amount, it gets all little and I have to ctrl-A ctrl-C my comment and then paste it back in (along with deleting the “website” bit again) each time.

You can also press enter and then delete, and it resizes. It’s still really annoying, but maybe a little less so?

Quackers
Quackers
8 years ago

test

Quackers
Quackers
8 years ago

oh wow…so the text isn’t in bold. That is weird, the fonts on here just changed a day ago but I checked out the theme that Manboobz is using and the fonts are the same, not in bold. So it was my browser that did something O_o

anywho…carry on

ozymandias42
8 years ago

I dunno, I personally think that “idiot who doesn’t know how science works” is a much worse insult than “racist homophobe.” I mean, lots of people do racist and homophobic things and are not bad people (as long as they shape up when called out on it). But being intellectually uncurious and yet convinced you know everything is a problem that, unfortunately, is far less fixable.

lowquacks
lowquacks
8 years ago

I mean, lots of people do racist and homophobic things and are not bad people (as long as they shape up when called out on it). But being intellectually uncurious and yet convinced you know everything is a problem that, unfortunately, is far less fixable.

Not entirely sure the two are different, Ozy.

lowquacks
lowquacks
8 years ago

Also, what was the sea animal you had as an avatar before?

pecunium
pecunium
8 years ago

Shadow: Is there something particularly racist about evo psych?

In theory no. In practice, Hell Yes. The only “models” evo psychers ever seem to use are White Europeans. And everything they “discover” supports the white european cultural model as the end to which evolution shaped us.

pecunium
pecunium
8 years ago

Ruby:Hmmm, whom should I believe, scientists working at prestigeous universities or morons on a web site who call you a racist for not thinking like them?

You should believe whomever convinces you.

But that’s not what you are doing. You aren’t trying to convince people. You are trying to browbeat us into agreeing with you by insulting us. Worse, by insulting our intelligence.

I can play that game. You don’t think like me? Then you must be a racist homophobe. LOL!

No, you can’t play that game. Sroll up (well, back a page). Look at what I said about the first five pages of the only study you actually cited.

Explain to me why my reservations are invalid. Go ahead. If you skip ahead to page seven you could try to point out that only 4 percent of women of the groups they examined said they were interested in casual sex, as opposed to 14 percent of the men.

Then you could try to say that mean the others were all looking for a long term relationship. You could try saying that the use of subjects from two urban areas (San Diego and Boston) shows that in the modern world these are the situations facing men and women.

I’d ask how they corrected for the possibility the men weren’t “strategising” based on the idea that women aren’t interested in casual sex? I’d ask how they controlled for the possibility that people who went to a dating site in 2003 might not be atypical for the society as a whole; and the secondary question of the possibility that the two markets they chose aren’t representative of the US as a whole.

I’d also ask why you think urban americans who use dating sites are such good models for the entire human race.

Which is quite different from you accusing us of being poopyheads because we disagree with you.

pecunium
pecunium
8 years ago

Ruby: I’ve had enough. I’ve been as patient with you as I could. Far more than you deserve.

You are an idiot, and a fool. You don’t understand how science works. You don’t believe in argument. You are an authoritarian, an anti-intellectual and a dolt.

You think that making a pronouncement is the same as being right. That’s why you don’t understand how science works. It’s not a priesthood where they get to make pronouncements from on high that everyone else has to accept. It’s a way of investigating the world. The Mythbusters are doing science. Even when they are wrong, (perhaps esp. when they are wrong) they are doing science. You could learn from them.

Ok, you could learn more from them than, “I reject your reality, and substitute one of my own.”

You don’t believe in argument because you don’t argue. All you do is contradict.

You are an authoritarian because you think that because you said it that means it’s right.

What arrogant twaddle. Are you a scientist? I didn’t think so. Even if you were, so what? That would mean you know how to study things. It would mean you have studied one thing in particular. It wouldn’t mean you are the only source. It wouldn’t mean you could never be wrong.

But you… you thin-skinned, miserably informed, poorly informed, pathetically unable to appreciate how far we have been going to be kind, and (though I am sure you don’t believe it) gentle with you… you can’t be arsed to go so far as meet us halfway.

We’ve watched your videos, read the puff-pieces you’ve linked through and slogged through the study you sent.

You pretend we haven’t. That’s rude. I wouldn’t give a shit that you aren’t persuaded by my arguments; if I thought you had fucking read them.

But you show no sign of that. Instead you insult me, to my face, by insisting that it’s not that I am unpersuaded, but that I don’t like the answers. You are calling me a liar.

I’ll repeat, you are calling me a liar.

Why in the world should I be at all polite to you? You have either refused to read what I write, or you think I’m lying to you?

Dismissal is about all I’m willing to give you at this point. Doggerel is better than you deserve, but that’s that’s ok, because if we were to use us after our deserts none would scape a whipping.

Crawl back under your bridge, and darken my door no more. I would far rather have an NWO, a Meller, a Buttman, an Atnz, even a Brandon; because they are all more honest than you have been.

If you have the sense to leave, and the door should hit you on the way out, please be kind enough to clean the handle. We have to use it too.

Maija
8 years ago

Sounds like “uni” might be a Commonwealth (or Commonwealth-minus-Canada) thing, then.

Actually us Canucks use it too.

pecunium
pecunium
8 years ago

There once was a booby named Ruby
Who might been helped by a dooby
She rant all the night
about who was right
no smarter when done than a nooby

lowquacks
lowquacks
8 years ago

Actually us Canucks use it too.

Apologies, Canadians everywhere. “Uni” is far more widespread than I realized.

pecunium
pecunium
8 years ago
magpie
8 years ago

What a nice booby, pecunium. At first booby looked lonely, but then I saw it’s lizard friend 🙂

Ruby Hypatia
Ruby Hypatia
8 years ago

Making up stupid limerics doesn’t change the fact that scientists at reputable universities did studies that proved me right. And why would evolutionary psychology be any different between the races? It seems kinda racist to imply there would be some difference.

Again, only morons would reject studies done by different countries’ scientists that came to the same conclusion. And insults don’t prove me wrong. Hey, I’ve got an idea, how about showing me scientific studies that prove me wrong? No, I didn’t think so. So please, continue with the insults because they are all you’ve got, while I have science on my side.

Holly Pervocracy
8 years ago

They’re not insults. They’re serious, substantial objections that you parsed as meaniepants insults and didn’t read.

pecunium
pecunium
8 years ago

Ruby refuses the reading
She rather pretend that she leading
But “I said it first,
so you are the worst”
Just show the world her breeding.

pecunium
pecunium
8 years ago

Where are my (‘d)s going?

cloudiah
8 years ago

Pecunium, I see your (quite lovely) booby with lizard and raise you my blue footed booby with a baby and red footed booby draining salt water from its nostrils.

As for Ruby, I am standing by my argument that she is some kind of computer algorithm. No human being could be that consistently obtuse. Right?

Holly Pervocracy
8 years ago

…Okay, the limerick wasn’t all that substantial, but by this point we’re all rather frustrated by the non-interactive nature of your trolling.

…You only realized it was a limerick by the shape of the lines, didn’t you.

Maybe I need to compose a limerick to the effect that science is about the methods and results of your work, not about the fanciness of your title? Maybe then. And after that I’ll try to make a limerick on the theme of “Sociology: it EXISTS.”

QuantumSparkle
QuantumSparkle
8 years ago

Making up stupid limerics doesn’t change the fact that scientists at reputable universities did studies that proved me right.

Then where are the studies? If the studies are not published through the peer review process in a reputable scientific journal, then it isn’t science. Also, I’m a scientist at a reputable university, therefore what I say is true. 😛

Hey, I’ve got an idea, how about showing me scientific studies that prove me wrong?

No, the burden of proof is on the person trying to prove a theory. I don’t have to disprove you if you have no proof.

Academic peer reviewed research articles are the actual standard for science. It is entirely possible for real scientists to say things that are not science. In fact, we do it ALL the time. Because science is not “everything a scientist says”. If Enrico Fermi had said, “eggs are delicious”, that doesn’t make it science! For something to be science, it requires published, reproducible experimental evidence.

You can’t just say, “oh yeah, well Linus Pauling (2 nobel prizes: 1 in chemistry, 1 in peace) ( says vitamin C cures cancer, therefor it’s science!”. No. Science is statements backed up by reproducible experimental evidence. You have to have published experimental evidence before I will believe what you say has any merit as “science”. Right now, it is just an assertion.

Holly Pervocracy
8 years ago

There once was a scientist who had a prestigious title
But his methods involved a tiny sample size of Americans
And he decided being American was genetic
Genetically hardcoded in all humans for certain
This isn’t a limerick but it’s shaped like one so maybe you’ll read it

QuantumSparkle
QuantumSparkle
8 years ago

@Holly: Hahah! Awesome “limeric”
LOL!

pecunium
pecunium
8 years ago

Ruby: You want papers.

Here’s one.

Education, Hypergamy and the “Success Gap” : Elaina Rose
Department of Economics, University of Washington, 2006

It’s by an economist, so it’s at least as relevant as yours. It’s more recent too, so it must be better.

Have a quotation. The most important part is in bold

The success gap for women age 40-44 declined significantly in the 1980’s and 1990’s. In fact, according to some measures, the gap has disappeared. Hypergamy has declined as well.

Got it… A SCIENTIST, says your theory is full of shit.

For follow up I’ll quote a second study she did.

Education and Hypergamy in Marriage Markets: Elaina Rose, March 2004

In fact, there was a significant decline in the “success gap” – the difference in the marriage rates of highly educated women relative to those at the peak of the inverted-U-shaped education-marriage profile. A contemporaneous decline in hypergamy allowed the marriage market to absorb the increased number of educated women.

However, at the bottom of the education distribution, the imbalance was not resolved by a change in marriage matching patterns. The likelihood of marriage for men with less than a high school education declined precipitously. Women’s marriage propensities declined as well, but not nearly as much as men’s. In this range, there was an increase in hypergamy, as less educated women reached higher into the education distribution for their husbands in 2000 than in prior cohorts.

So the conclusion she is drawing is that hpergamy is a function of economic disadvantage.

Not genetics.

So far that’s two papers saying your thesis is bullshit.

But those are both the same researcher. Perhaps she has an ax to grind.

The reversal of the gender gap in education and its impact on union formation: the end of hypergamy: Albert Esteve, Joan Garcia, Iñaki Permanyer,Centre d’Estudis Demogràfics (work in progress)

We use newly integrated
IPUMS census micro-data from 103 samples and taken in 38 countries. Results from multilevel linear regression models show that female educational hypergamy is lower in societies with a lower gender gap in education and that where the gender gap reverses female hypogamy becomes the norm. Thus, if current trends in education are to continue, the pervasiveness of hypergamy will tend to disappear.

Three strikes.

You’re out.

pecunium
pecunium
8 years ago

Fucking blockquotes.

pecunium
pecunium
8 years ago

I’ll try it again.

pecunium
pecunium
8 years ago

Ruby: You want papers.

Here’s one.

Education, Hypergamy and the “Success Gap” : Elaina Rose
Department of Economics, University of Washington, 2006

It’s by an economist, so it’s at least as relevant as yours. It’s more recent too, so it must be better.

Have a quotation. The most important part is in bold

The success gap for women age 40-44 declined significantly in the 1980’s and 1990’s. In fact, according to some measures, the gap has disappeared. Hypergamy has declined as well.

Got it… A SCIENTIST, says your theory is full of shit.

For follow up I’ll quote a second study she did.

Education and Hypergamy in Marriage Markets: Elaina Rose, March 2004

In fact, there was a significant decline in the “success gap” – the difference in the marriage rates of highly educated women relative to those at the peak of the inverted-U-shaped education-marriage profile. A contemporaneous decline in hypergamy allowed the marriage market to absorb the increased number of educated women.

However, at the bottom of the education distribution, the imbalance was not resolved by a change in marriage matching patterns. The likelihood of marriage for men with less than a high school education declined precipitously. Women’s marriage propensities declined as well, but not nearly as much as men’s. In this range, there was an increase in hypergamy, as less educated women reached higher into the education distribution for their husbands in 2000 than in prior cohorts.

So the conclusion she is drawing is that hpergamy is a function of economic disadvantage.

Not genetics.

So far that’s two papers saying your thesis is bullshit.

But those are both the same researcher. Perhaps she has an ax to grind.

The reversal of the gender gap in education and its impact on union formation: the end of hypergamy: Albert Esteve, Joan Garcia, Iñaki Permanyer,Centre d’Estudis Demogràfics (work in progress)

We use newly integrated
IPUMS census micro-data from 103 samples and taken in 38 countries. Results from multilevel linear regression models show that female educational hypergamy is lower in societies with a lower gender gap in education and that where the gender gap reverses female hypogamy becomes the norm. Thus, if current trends in education are to continue, the pervasiveness of hypergamy will tend to disappear.

Three strikes.

You’re out.

pecunium
pecunium
8 years ago

Nope. Dave, feel free to pull the second one, there is nothing new in it.

pecunium
pecunium
8 years ago

Cloudiah: Did you take those booby-pictures?

pecunium
pecunium
8 years ago

Ruby, have some more:

The Marriage Market and Homogamy by Age in Italy: Romina Frabono, National Statistical Office (ISTAT)

Traditionally, the prevailing model of assortative mating has been characterized by the tendency towards educational hypogamy for men and educational hypergamy for women (marriages with, respectively, less and more educated partners than themselves), as well as hypogamy and hypergamy by age and social status. Therefore, the traditional couple is typified by rooted gender asymmetries where women are younger, less educated and of a lower status than their partners.

Gender segregated roles play in favour of a high age gap between partners (Becker, 1981; Kalmijn, 1998), while high human capital encourages more balance between the ages. This is why education generates a shift in the attitudes and individuals become more prone to change and less attached to traditional age differences characterising the couple.

Looks like it’s not true in Italy either.

pecunium
pecunium
8 years ago

The time to collect that was about thirty seconds. What delayed me was reading the papers, and extracting/formatting, the replies.

I could, I suppose, have just done what you did, and said, “Thre is SCIENCE”,and then made you read them, but that’s not what decent people do.

Decent people treat others fairly, and respectfully. They present arguments honestly, and they pay attention to the responses of those with whom they are dealing.

You do none of that.

You are not a decent person.

Which comments are not insults. They are assessments of your person, based on your actions.

The limericks, were the same, though I admit they were insulting in format.

Which was by intent.

pecunium
pecunium
8 years ago

Sonavabitch….

That’s the first time I’ve ever filled the comment bar

Dracula
Dracula
8 years ago

Ruby – A dissertation on your dogged style of discourse, published by a pair of prestigious Pythons:

hellkell
hellkell
8 years ago

Ah, I see Ruby’s one of those “it’s racist to point out racism” pinheads. How surprising.

Viscaria
Viscaria
8 years ago

And why would evolutionary psychology be any different between the races? It seems kinda racist to imply there would be some difference.

Hah, now Ruby has reminded me of an anecdote related to the OP. I once ranted at length to my ex about the attitudes that people hold towards AAE, how they think it’s not proper English, not “grammatical”, evidence of an inability to learn, evidence of stupidity. I talked about how this affects so many aspects of speaker’s lives, and how pointless all the marginalization was. When I ran out of steam, he said: “Yeah okay, i get what you’re saying, but don’t you think it’s a little racist of you to call it African American English? That implies only African American people don’t know how to speak English properly.”

Here’s a hint, Ruby: if pretty much every single ego psych “study” is done on White western people, and you’re saying it would be racist to suggest that maybe other groups of people might have different social structures, you’re implying that having different social structures than White people do would be a bad thing. Which is like saying, White western society is the best kind of society. Which is hugely frickin’ racist.

MollyRen (@MollyRen)
8 years ago

Wait, hypergamy was originally a scientific term, and not something MRAs just made up?

pecunium
pecunium
8 years ago

Molly: Yes. Hypergamy is the use of marriage to improve one’s social position.

It is not, however, a “female” trait. It’s a social function. In societies with a large gap between social classes, members of the disavantaged class find it useful, when they can, to “marry up”.

Since this structual disadvantage is largely borne by women, it tends to be a practice they engage in more often.

But, as the studies show contra Ruby, this isn’t genetic, it’s economic.

Shadow
Shadow
8 years ago

@Maija

Actually us Canucks use it too.

Really?!! You wouldn’t happen to be Toronto side would you? No one else around me seems to use “uni”, they usually use school or the name of the university. The few that have used it have been immigrants. Huh, live and learn.

Shadow
Shadow
8 years ago

BTW, what do you guys use for research? I usually use my uni’s resources, but most of those are behind paywalls.

Viscaria
Viscaria
8 years ago

In my corner of Alberta, and in my limited experience, “I’m going to school” tends to mean I’m on the train at this moment, headed to campus. “I’m going to uni” implies it is habitual, i.e. I am enrolled in University and am taking classes.