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Quote of the day: “We’re approaching peak vagina on television, the point of labia saturation.”

Ladies, please! We don't need to see THAT.

Quiz! Who said the following, in reference to the presence of women on television?

Enough, ladies. I get it. You have periods. … [W]e’re approaching peak vagina on television, the point of labia saturation.

Was it?

  1. W.F. Price of The Spearhead
  2. Christopher in Oregon, legendary vagina-hating Man Going His Own Way
  3. Reddit commenter VjayjaysAreIcky69

Trick question! It was actually Two and a Half Men co-creator Lee Aronsohn, complaining to The Hollywood Reporter about the female-centric sticoms that have popped up of late. (There’s plenty to complain about when it comes to shows like Whitney and 2 Broke Girls, but “the main characters have vaginas” ain’t it.)

In a keynote address at the Toronto Screenwriting Conference, Aronsohn also defended his show’s tendency to portray women in a less-than-flattering light:

Screw it. … We’re centering the show on two very damaged men. What makes men damaged? Sorry, it’s women. I never got my heart broken by a man.

So brave, Aronsohn, so brave, standing up to the Matriarchy like that!

On ThinkProgress, Alyssa Rosenberg lays into Aronsohn:

[H]aving to hear that ladies have menstrual cycles, take birth control pills, and enjoy sex is just unbearable, right? Because even though the number of female characters on television tends to hover in the low 40 percent range, we’re just saturated with vaginas, because god forbid stories about men and their ish don’t absolutely dominate the media? Because even though those shows Aronsohn’s complaining about have actually created more writing and directing jobs for men than women, and resulted in some really awful portrayals as a result, we couldn’t possibly let women come to expect that they’ll have access to stories both about them and by them, could we? Because where would that leave poor, suffering, disadvantaged American men?

And then she takes on the entertainment industry in general, for tolerating his troglodyte views:

[T]hat Aronsohn is dumb and woman-fearing enough not just to believe this, to blithely admit he believes it to a major publication tells you everything about how cosseted Hollywood’s disgusting sexists are. You want to know why we get what we get on movie and television screens? …  Because there are, apparently, no consequences in Hollywood for being perfectly open about how much you despise women’s bodies and the contours of women’s lives.

Maude Lebowski, what do you have to say about all this?

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magdelynswallows
8 years ago

I love Charlie Sheen, and the fact that he says “fuck you” (metaphorically) to everybody.

katz
8 years ago

There seems to be an inverse proportion between one’s pretentiousness and one’s intelligence. I’m sure I’m not the only person to realize this.

Dunning-Kruger effect?

Sharculese
Sharculese
8 years ago

I love Charlie Sheen, and the fact that he says “fuck you” (metaphorically) to everybody.

self-absorbed contrarian dimwit loves other self-absorbed contrarian dimwit. film at eleven.

princessbonbon
8 years ago

You are all irrelevant.

Not one of the people I dealt with today thought that.

magdelynswallows
8 years ago

Ah, Sharculese, always a delight hearing from you. You just bring sunshine to teh internets.

Hesster
8 years ago

Don’t watch TV so much these days since I don’t have cable, but I’ve seen vaginas on television. Mostly on documentaries related to sex and reproduction. Somehow I get the feeling that’s not what he meant, though.

It’s not like there haven’t been plenty of female-centric sitcoms in the past. Heck, a lot of them used sex as an occasional element in their plots. Murphy Brown, Designing Women, the Golden Girls… All of which were much better than anything put out by Lee Aronsohn IMHO.

Maya Lovelace
Maya Lovelace
8 years ago

Never have I been more glad to not own a television. Most of Hollywood is such filth, such stupidity for the idiot people.

Holly Pervocracy
8 years ago

Most of Hollywood is such filth, such stupidity for the idiot people.

Good thing you’re smart and special.

Or maybe most people own televisions because it’s a nice low-effort way to relax, it gives them common ground for socializing, and it provides a mildly entertaining background for boring chores.

Sorry, I just get so set off by “television is idiot hypnosis for the idiot masses” superiority complexes. Television is on the whole sexist (see also: racist, classist, etc.), but it isn’t the opiate of the sheeple.

Maya Lovelace
Maya Lovelace
8 years ago

Ah, Sharculese, always a delight hearing from you. You just bring sunshine to teh internets.

And MRAs are absolutely positive and brilliant people, encouraging hope, understanding, and truth wherever they go. They don’t darken the world and divide people with hatred, meanness, bullying, dishonesty, and resentment. They bring us all together, absolve our differences, encourage us to see each other has full human beings and to think critically and to be responsible to each other on this earth because this earth and each other is all we really have.

Don’t they, shitwit?

Maya Lovelace
Maya Lovelace
8 years ago

*as full human beings

magdelynswallows
8 years ago

The only person in this thread demonstrating “hatred, meanness, bullying, dishonesty, and resentment” is you (i mean besides Sharculese).

Maya Lovelace
Maya Lovelace
8 years ago

Oh dear Mags. My snarky comments are nowhere near the daily intellectual diarrhea of MRA favorites such as JohntheOther, Arks, Roissy, Paul Elam, etc. etc.

Tulgey Logger
Tulgey Logger
8 years ago

You are all irrelevant.

Mister Worf, dispatch a subspace message to Admiral Hanson. We have engaged the Borg.

I love Charlie Sheen, and the fact that he says “fuck you” (metaphorically) to everybody.

Yeah, like how he gives the metaphorical finger to his children while he goes off the deep end on drugs, or like how he metaphorically flipped the bird to his wife when he held a knife to her throat and threatened to kill her.

What a rebel!

Christ, what a douchebag that guy is.

indifferentsky
8 years ago

Ah I love the smell of manboobz in the morning, smells like comedy. It’s 3pm here, but my morning, got my coffee…since we’re all bloody sharing. This thread is so funny. Although I did read it while listening to Patrick Stewart yammer on forever… overacting, yap yap yap wank wank wank, we get it Patrick. Your unfunny bleeding labia whore of a mother caused a problem for your father and paid for it. Leaky mangina. We’re at the point of awareness saturation. TMI Patrick, amirite?

—–
I was puzzled with the “we get it” portion of this dood’s failblurb. Because he kind of implied that women controlled when women were on tv, in what capacity and context, etc.

LOL!

So there’s a writers room full of men and a coupla swell gals, they’re all writing. Head writer says in his gruff voice. Ok time for the Vagina to come in, you ladies write that. Or, wait do you think they should come in now? You decide when they come in. Write what they should talk about. And, I thought I would take this opportunity to mention that market research shows that people don’t necessarily want to hear about your periods. So if we can focus on some other vagina related topic, that would be great.

Swell gals: “Oh, sorry, no can do, we need to be as authentic as possible. This is women.. deal with it!” *swell gals high five each other and then in unison, as if their cycles had synced up after spending so much time writing together, give the head writer dood the finger*

So yeah, I didn’t get that “we get it ladies” part AT ALL. It makes no sense. I think this guy was trying to be funny, meaning making absurd commentary. Now he’s screwed because if he comes out saying, oh that was a joke, he’s going to look like a douche because already so many people have decided it was not funny. And he’s supposed to be a comedy writer. Heh, For being a dick and not a vag, he sure did fuck himself.

That comedian tweeting him, I went and checked it out… she is funny. Those are worth the read. 😀

nwoslave
8 years ago

Is this the women are funnier than men thread? No doubt backed up by many personal examples and personal opinions. Hell, I wouldn’t be a bit surprised if there was a “study” that makes it a fact. After all, we’ve got studies proving women are superior at everything.

skiriki
8 years ago

I just want to know where the heck that terrifying tentacle-wtf-picture is from — mostly because it looks like a bad-ass VAGINA MONSTER I could shove into some 3D render…

Dani Alexis
Dani Alexis
8 years ago

Sorry, I just get so set off by “television is idiot hypnosis for the idiot masses” superiority complexes. Television is on the whole sexist (see also: racist, classist, etc.), but it isn’t the opiate of the sheeple.

I’m with Holly here.

I, personally, don’t watch TV and am happy with that. But people who want to think about stuff will think about it whether they watch TV or not, and people who don’t want to think about stuff won’t think about it whether they watch TV or not. It’s not TV that causes lack of curiosity or critical thinking in humans.

Sometimes, humans even think curiously and critically about THINGS THEY WATCH ON TV! Whoa!

MollyRen (@MollyRen)
8 years ago

I just want to know where the heck that terrifying tentacle-wtf-picture is from — mostly because it looks like a bad-ass VAGINA MONSTER I could shove into some 3D render…

What’s even more disturbing to me is that I feel like I’ve seen it before, but I can’t remember WHERE! Maybe it’s from “The Thing”?

Creative Writing Student
Creative Writing Student
8 years ago

It looks like the female-body version of this: http://i42.tinypic.com/9jg21y.jpg

(‘This’ is Mara from SMT, btw. A personal favourite for sheer ‘dafuq’-ness. I cuddleship him with Belphegor.)

Dracula
Dracula
8 years ago

Looks like a Todd McFarlane toy to me.

Falconer
Falconer
8 years ago

Sorry, I just get so set off by “television is idiot hypnosis for the idiot masses” superiority complexes. Television is on the whole sexist (see also: racist, classist, etc.), but it isn’t the opiate of the sheeple.

I like Harlan Ellison’s writing for television, but I don’t like his writing about television because it’s all if you were smart like me you would see how stupid television is. I’m like, dude, you made a living off television, WTF?

I don’t watch a whole lot of television, but I’m pretty sure a whole lot of people put a whole lot of effort into TV shows. Calling shows I don’t like worthless and low-brow seems awfully mean, not to mention a good way of making sure there is never another show like, e.g., Avatar or Doctor Who or whichever show makes you squee.

Falconer
Falconer
8 years ago

@Creative Writing Student:

I see penis. Do you see penis? Am I supposed to see penis?

I thought the SMT games were, like, T at best. Which was one reason why such a shit fit was thrown when Persona 3 was all “we’re going to make you act out teen suicide!”

Holly Pervocracy
8 years ago

There’s also a lot of classism in most anti-TV sentiment, since it generally comes with an subtext (or text) that people should be entertaining themselves in ways that require more money, free time, space, education, or energy at the end of the day.

When you’ve been on your feet for twelve hours, forms of entertainment that “stimulate your mind!” aren’t necessarily what you’re looking for; when you’re cooking and cleaning and chasing the kids around and just want something in the background to keep you less-bored, you can’t very well read a book.

Creative Writing Student
Creative Writing Student
8 years ago

@Falconer

It’s a penis. I want one as a steed.

I don’t know about the US, but in the UK the original P3 was rated 12 (why? I’d have given it a 15, personally, because of creepy-scary and possible triggers). P3: FES was rated 15, and included Mara.

skiriki
8 years ago

Found it! It is from SOTA Toys, and depicts Dagon from Cthulhu Mythos.

Creative Writing Student
Creative Writing Student
8 years ago

Also, P4 was given a 16+, because Kanji is sorta maybe not-heterosexual, Naoto has some gender identity issues, and possibly because of Rise’s dungeon (squelchy technicolour stripper with radar dish head… my brain…)
Nocturne is 12 even though it features Mara as a boss. SMT: Digital Devil Saga was 16+ because of eating sentient beings, I guess?

Falconer
Falconer
8 years ago

I’ve only ever played P3 and P4. I think I got up to the dungeon in P4 that was a gay bathhouse, but my wife got further. Rise’s dungeon was the love hotel, yes?

I can only remember getting to the train in P3. I remember one of the young women led the way climbing a ladder into the train. She stops halfway up and tells the boys not to look up. I thought at first it was because she was wearing a skirt. Then I realized a few minutes later that there must have been something unpleasant on the ceiling of the train ….

Kyrie
Kyrie
8 years ago

I’m pretty sure the monster is 2 different things, a weird animal on top of an octopus.

Google image only find me articles named “how a gay man sees a vagina”.

Oh, wait, here it is:
http://www.sotatoysonline.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=66_68&products_id=197

Dagon – Shadow Over Insmouth
$19.99

Dagon (“Shadow Over Insmouth”) features a translucent skull cap and six arms, including 4 articulated arms.

Through many worlds and many cultures does Dagon’s influence sway. From Sumerian mythology to the Bible, Dagon in one form or another has appeared through time. But to the Deep Ones, it is Dagon the Great Old One to whom they worship for his powers and boon. Written in 1931 and was published in 1936.

Kyrie
Kyrie
8 years ago

ninja’d, obvioulsy.

Creative Writing Student
Creative Writing Student
8 years ago

@Falconer

Rise’s dungeon was the strip club. Yosuke shows himself to be the master of understatement in this video.

My friends and I decided the noises made it tone of the most disturbing things ever.

kiki
kiki
8 years ago

Ah – I knew I recognised a Lovecraft beastie when I saw it. The gibbering blasphemous vagina of Cyclopean angles that should not be!

Viscaria
Viscaria
8 years ago

Google image only find me articles named “how a gay man sees a vagina”.

Okay, this is off-topic, but can someone explain to me where this stereotype of gay men hating or fearing vulvas came from? I do not get it.

thingstoseenyc
8 years ago

…the hell? I thought Dagon was just a really big Deep One.

On the other hand, I think this version is cooler. I was always a little bit disappointed that Lovecraft’s version of an actual ancient water god was a mere giant mook in service to Cthulhu. Actually, this fellow reminds me very much of the version of Dagon that Wizards of the Coast created for their 3.5 supplement Hordes of the Abyss.

darksidecat
8 years ago

Okay, this is off-topic, but can someone explain to me where this stereotype of gay men hating or fearing vulvas came from?

I presume it comes from old “inversion” theories. That gay men don’t want sex with women because they have some sort of man obsession or vagina trauma or some shit like that.

Cis hetero men say horrible hateful things about vulvas all of the time, I haven’t seen more of this from cis gay men than from cis hetero men.

Maya Lovelace
Maya Lovelace
8 years ago

It’s probably just a stupid joke gone out of hand.

Kyrie
Kyrie
8 years ago

Viscaria: for some time I regularly listened to Dan Savage’s podcast, and that’s something that came back a lot. Not so much hate or even fear, but rather he was – probably still is – grossed out by it, and expressed it repeatedly, even though many commenters asked him to stop.
The idea seem to be that it’s objectively gross and off-putting for all men, but straight men will get used to it because they’re horny, while gay men don’t have to.

Now, that’s just one man, and I don’t know how many feel the same way (I rarely discuss genitals with people), but his fame could have contributed.
Just my two cents.

Viscaria
Viscaria
8 years ago

@DSC, that makes sense I guess. I mean, it makes sense that the origins of that idea would be in inversion theories. “Gay dudes are grossed out by vag and that’s why they’re gay!” does not make any sense whatsoever.

Viscaria
Viscaria
8 years ago

@Kyrie: Huh. We do demonize vulvas a lot (thus, the OP) so I guess that makes sense too.

Sometimes I wish people would stop being ridiculous.

Ruby Hypatia
Ruby Hypatia
8 years ago

That picture reminds me of Vagina dentata.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vagina_dentata
LOL!

Wisteria
Wisteria
8 years ago

*sigh* Off topic, but I was just reading a yahoo news story about the shootings in Oakland, California, yesterday. The police have the shooter and the story said that he shot and killed six women and one man and injured three more people, because he “was angry at a female school administrator and students, saying they teased him and “were not treating him respectfully.””

Now I bet the MRAs will be using him as an example of women pushing an innocent man to violence.

The story did say that the female administrator was not injured and it’s not believed that any of his victims were the people who teased him.

hellkell
hellkell
8 years ago

Never have I been more glad to not own a television. Most of Hollywood is such filth, such stupidity for the idiot people.

The pretentious, classist, assholes who usually say this are completely full of shit, and if you put a TV in front of them they will zone out for hours.

I take it you’ve never seen a David Simon production? There are some smart people making some smart TV, but I guess you’ll never know.

Demios
Demios
8 years ago

@Creative Writing Student

The female bodied version of Mara in the SMT series would be Arioch.

princessbonbon
8 years ago

I think to be effectively stupid you have to be really smart. Then again, I still do not get Jackass.

beshemoth
8 years ago

talking of the telly, I rarely watch it but I happened to put it on tonight and lo, Morgan Freeman Explains Wormholes! And it isn’t even my birthday. I need to put it on more often!

Creative Writing Student
Creative Writing Student
8 years ago

@Demios

Ah. I’ve only played P3:FES, P4, SMTIII and Digital Devil Saga, and Arioch doesn’t turn up in any of them.

Polliwog
Polliwog
8 years ago

One of many things that annoys me about anti-TV sentiment, which other people have also articulated to some degree, is the idea that entertainment has to be “smart.” I mean, I’m a pretty smart person. I am a giant literary nerd, I adore classical music, I go to science lectures of the sort aimed more at other scientists than at laypersons whenever possible and find them fascinating – and I also like watching shit blow up, watching hot guys prance around shirtless, and laughing at jokes about poop, because being smart and into fancy-schmancy erudite things doesn’t magically make explosions stop being cool-looking, pretty men stop being pretty, and poop jokes stop appealing to one’s inner ten-year-old. Sometimes I want my entertainment to be something complex and detailed that will make me think deep, philosophical thoughts, and sometimes I just want to watch Dean Winchester make pouty faces and then stab a monster with a sword. And that’s okay!

Ithiliana
8 years ago
Ithiliana
8 years ago

Getting kids into Shakespeare through his dirty jokes (I used this in my intro to lit courses at my university–told them the dirty jokes were explained in the footnotes! they read the footnotes!

http://englishteacherman.wordpress.com/2010/03/12/romeo-and-juliet-a-gateway-drug-for-kids/

Ithiliana
8 years ago

According to this blogger, 700 puns on sex, 400 on genitals

http://talonsbronwyn.edublogs.org/2011/12/06/dirty-jokes-shakespeare/

Ithiliana
8 years ago

Academics: Playing Dirty: Sexuality and Waste in Early Modern Comedy

http://www.upress.umn.edu/book-division/books/playing-dirty