This seems like a completely reasonable course of action:
Oh, by the way, I know a guy who’s a CEO of a Fortune 500 company, and he can fly and turn invisible.
Not at the same time, though. When he forgets and turns invisible while flying, he plummets to earth.
beshemoth: But don’t rapists and abusers and attackers all wear signs on their foreheads that say BAD PERSON? Just avoid the people with signs on their heads! Jesus, you’d think ladies are stupid or something…
Mispretzely is definitely one of the more pressing concerns of our society. Somebody should start a blog about it (which is, as we all know, the most effective form of activism).
Now I’m a bit confused. I thought all men were Schroedinger’s Rapist, and supposed to always keep in mind that women will generally evaluate all situations by how safe they are? Why is it then so horrible if someone takes the measures necessary to make sure that all people involved feel and are safe? Most of the things on that list seem reasonable to me (no lunch alone with a woman is maybe a bit much, if it’s in a public space) and are, as far as I know, policy for e.g. teacher and (even adult) student interactions in my (European) country.
Joe, I think I answered your concern in my post. We don’t know the full story of why he was charged. The police could have their version, like “he changed his story three times, he was suspicious during the interview, etc” It could also be prejudice for the reasons I mentioned.
One tiny little news article with a title that is supposed to make up our minds and almost no information is THE PROBLEM for us, not necc what happened. We don’t have all the facts.
Someone needs to explain to this dude that women aren’t the only ones who can (rightly or wrongly) accuse men of sexual harassment. Men can also be accused of sexual harassment by . . . brace yourself . . . other men. What is Mr. 800+ Person Company doing to protect himself against false allegations from the other fifty percent of the population? Doesn’t he realize that any one of the male “safety buddies” he drags around with him could turn on him at any time? Obviously, the only solution is for him to never leave his house again.
It’s quite the power to be given the status of eternal victimhood. As an eternal victim you can never be at fault or do any wrong. Why if me and every straight, white male I know pooled our resources together we might be able to afford a pony on it’s last legs, and the time and funds to care for it. Ohhh the oppressive power of the evil, straight, white man!
At the university where both my husband and I work, no male professor would EVER be alone with a female student in his office. This is because male professors often DO harass female students, and all accusations are taken very seriously. The downside is very real – female students DO NOT get the kind of mentoring and help that male students get because of this issue. It is quite common to see male students and professors sitting together in the pub or cafeteria, but a male prof would have to be mad to ever take a female student out for a beer to discuss methodology or theory. Even a hint of impropriety can derail a professor’s career. I admit that even I shy away from anything less than totally public, formal interactions with female students, particularly the ones who come to class half-naked. Wearing club clothes to class is a giant red flag for me. Male students have come to my home for dinners and BBQs but my husband is adamant that no female students are ever invited. If a female student were to say “Oh, I was at Professor X’s house last night,” it would instantly look bad for Professor X. Women are definitely getting shortchanged on their university experience, but the possibility of facing an accusation, while not hugely probable, has such devastating consequences that there is little option but to exclude female students.
beshemoth:
that’s exactly the type of shit I’m talking about! no matter what someone is always going to criticize you. I’m so sorry you had to deal with such callous people 🙁
You just don’t fucking know who your next attacker might be. But they MRAs still get all pissy and interpret that as thinking all men are rapists. You can’t win so I’ve decided to just say fuck it. Personal safety first, if some guy gets the impression I think he’s a rapist or creepy that’s his damn problem. Because should I ever, God forbid, get raped, I’ll just be told I should have been more careful.
@Kilo
The issue is with being a hypocritical dumbass. If this reddit dude wants to take precautions that’s his choice, but he better not turn around and harrass feminists or women for being misandrists and irrational when they themselves take precautions around men they don’t know. The OP being an MRA though, I wouldn’t count on it.
I’m not advocating paranoia, I think it’s silly to refuse to be in a room alone with the opposite sex and always have witnesses around, but hey, people have the right to determine their own level of personal safety as long as it doesn’t infringe on other people’s rights. And no, hurt feelings don’t count.
OK, real-world scenario time – last week, I was walking down the street behind a woman who kept glancing over her shoulder at me.
It was fairly obvious what was going through her mind – it was late at night, there was no-one else around, and I was both male and considerably bigger than her. Obviously, she was in no danger whatever, but she wasn’t to know that.
So what would have been the best way of handling it?
(For the record, I ended up slightly modifying my route home by turning into a side street a block early – it made no difference to the length of my journey, but it effectively took me out of the equation as far as she was concerned).
Those evil “ameriskanks” amiright?
Though in all seriousness I’ve never seen men treated like monsters.
*men in general just treated as monsters
Kilo, I think you need to give some specific examples here. Else it looks like you’re either assuming all of the faculty *isn’t* safe to mentor someone (in which cause they probably shouldn’t be working there period, not “taking precautions”), or thinking that it’s okay women miss out on mentoring opportunities.
@Wetherby
I don’t think you necessarily have to do anything. I’ve had this happen to me as well but I can’t just tell the guy to cross the road or something because everyone has the right to walk on public streets. You just pray the person behind you isn’t a rapist/mugger/killer. Victim blamers should take note of situations like these…notice that there is nothing you can do, if the person behind you is an attacker you’re pretty much screwed (unless you know self defense or something)
I’m just trying to address the the hypocrisy of this subject, and the victim blaming. If you aren’t cautious enough as a woman, if you drink, if you go out with men alone then you should have known better if something happens to you. But then if you express fear or discomfort and even explain the reasons for why a situation is creepy like Rebecca Watson did you’re continuously attacked and labeled a misandrist by MRAs and other angry dudes. This is just another thing MRAs like to take personally just because they see it as proof of misandry when really it has nothing to do with hating men, it just has to do with crime statistics and personal safety. They take it personally because they’re looking to be offended.
Hey Joe? maybe you wanna take up your complaints with all the street harassers, pedophiles, rapists and murders for making women oh so scared of the poor men who just want to heeeelp.
In the meantime my tiniest violin is playing for you.
Wetherby, I think you did all you could. I, for one, hugely appreciate it when guys do things like that – if I’m walking home alone late at night I will check out the people (especially the men) around me, and just the act of a guy crossing the street early, taking a turn early, or calling his friend to have a nice chat makes a big difference to how safe I feel.
You can’t change the fact that some women will be scared of you at night, but dropping back and giving them some space is a nice thing to do. And of course, I AM sorry that good guys get treated suspiciously sometimes (my lovely bf gets it too, and he’s a puddytat), but I’ve been harassed and assaulted by men too often and I just can’t give the benefit of the doubt any more.
Quackers:
And of course one of the problems is that you can’t really interact socially in a situation like this – I personally don’t want anyone to talk to me late at night when I’m trying to get home, and I’m sure that’s not at all unusual. So you just have to read the situation visually and hope that you do the right thing to defuse any possible tension.
And I know how she must have felt – I feel exactly the same way when I’m apparently being followed by one or two other men who are younger and clearly more physically fit. Largely because on the one occasion that I was mugged, I was jumped from behind.
I think that’s about the best option, when it’s available.
The other suggestion I have is to call someone on your cell phone. It makes it clear that you are not focused on the woman in front of you (at least not exclusively). It’s especially good if your conversation makes you sound highly normal and non-threatening (e.g. calling your wife to say, “Hey honey, I’m on my way home, I’m at such-and-such street now, so I’ll be there in 20 minutes. I was just wondering if you wanted me to stop off at Starbucks and grab you a latte, because I’m sort of in a latte mood.”).
Joe:
Now imagine being a woman, and how very rarely you get that feeling while walking around in public…anywhere.
@Wetherby
Once I was walking home at night with my friend (covered head to toe in fabric for all you victim-blamers and slut-shamers out there who might be reading) we were returning from a Halloween party and these two guys standing outside a bar were all “hey ladies” Naturally we ignored them but that chilling feeling you get when you wonder will they or wont they call you bitches for ignoring them, or what if worse comes to worse and they come after you? so yeah, I also do not like being talked to late at night when trying to get home :/ I’m sorry to hear you had to experience getting mugged. Did the asshole who did it get caught by the cops? Reasons like that leave me surprised that more men don’t feel on edge walking at night too, or maybe more do but don’t let on since it goes against the male gender role.
Yes, red-handed the next day in possession of my annual train season ticket (and photo). A few weeks later, I was asked if I’d be prepared to appear as a witness in court, but I never heard anything more about it so I assume he must have pleaded guilty.
As muggings go, it was pretty minor: no weapons were used, and there were no injuries apart from a slight scrape. But it makes me extremely sympathetic towards anyone who feels scared when alone late at night, rightly or wrongly.
good to hear 🙂
That would be the understatement of the week.
In as few words as possible:
Rape is a threat that strikes a substantial minority of women. The majority of those victims ultimately have zero recourse, because acquaintance rape is not really prosecutable, and even if they had recourse it would still not undo the rape. Ultimately, all SChroedinger’s Rapist means is ‘don’t be surprised if women don’t exactly trust you, stranger dude’. IT is not proffered as reason for sex discrimination in the workplace or the shirking of duties required by one’s station (Such as the previous example of a harrassment workshop in a college, wherein men say they will not meet with women).
False accusations affect vanishingly slim proportions of the populace, even men. You are, no joke, more rational to fear random murder sprees from your employees than a false accusation of sexual impropriety. Even if you were the victim of one, it would be vanishingly unlikely for anything serious to occur from it, also.
Yes, but they don’ exist because “ZOMG TEH FALSE ACCUSATIONS”. Preventing fraternization between students and teachers is a bit odd to me, but is still not identical in goal to this cockamamie bullshit.
Not that the OP’s ‘friend’, you know, exists, but hey.
“False accusations affect vanishingly slim proportions of the populace, even men. You are, no joke, more rational to fear random murder sprees from your employees than a false accusation of sexual impropriety. Even if you were the victim of one, it would be vanishingly unlikely for anything serious to occur from it, also. ”
Neither of those statements are true. Read the news aggregrate Community of the Wrongly Accused (click straight through to the original sources) there is a constant shitstorm of false accusations.
The latter statement is especially untrue. Any man falsely accused of rape/pedophilia can expect to have his career destroyed, will be unable to find alternative employment, if married he is much more likely to be divorced, more likely to suicide, will be on the sex offender’s registry for life, and will be at radically increased risk of beating or murder by vigilantes* (and no-one will tell the cops who those vigilantes are cos “‘e killed that pedo, innit. Nice one.”). I’m sure there’s effects of an accusation I missed out.
(*Just off the top of my head in the UK we’ve had fatalities from: a doorstep shooting, and a mob chasing a guy off the top of a multistory car park. The mob who attacked a PEDIATRICIAN’s house fortunately did not succeed in killing anyone. Yes, that’s how stupid and extreme rape/pedo-hysteria is in the UK.)
Oh, I forgot, if a man is actually JAILED on the strength of a false accusation (see all the DNA evidence currently vindicating falsely convicted men recently) he will very probably be raped – for real – in prison. The systemic rape of male prisoners being widely approved of in US society as somehow a legit part of punishment for a crime.