What’s the best way forward for the Men’s Rights movement today? About the only thing I’ve been able to conclude from this discussion in the Men’s Rights subreddit is that it will more than likely involve heavy use of the word “cunt.” Men’s Rights redditors sure do love the word “cunt.” (See here for the rest of this particular discussion.)
This next bit follows directly from the above:
Yep, you heard it right:
To be classified as a hate group by such a large organization is the first step to gaining wider recognition.
If that’s the case, Men’s Rights Redditors, why are you so mad at the SPLC? Why aren’t you sending it thank-you notes?
Also, just a point of fact: The SPLC report didn’t actually classify the Men’s Rights subreddit as a hate group. It just pointed out that r/mensrights is full of misogynists. But apparently a lot of Men’s Rights Redditors want to take that whole hate group thing and run with it. You go, boys (and sometimes, oddly, girls)!
Well, to be fair, just because one dude has a love affair with the word “cunt” does not a hate movement make.
“…You go, boys and girls!”
FTFY
I don’t understand what these nasty little boys are getting out of this. I mean, there’s nothing in SLPC that they didn’t actually say, they were direct quotes, so why are they whining and throwing naughty words around for?
RE: magedlyn
Yeah. Does make him a douche though!
Yeah, so they are not paying attention to what the SPLC said, they’re not a hate group. But oh well, I guess an intelligence report on them from an org that documents hate groups…. I guess some people are like, why split hairs, I guess.
“…discussing how men need to be controlled or eradicated?..”
CitationS needed. Plural since this is something that feminists are supposed to be doing. Come on now, there is feminist bloggity all over the web! Let’s go with those links.
Also, let’s look all over feminist web for “Dick”. That word, calling people that. No? It’s apples and oranges? OK let’s down the ante. Offensive statements or promotion of policies that would lend credence to any of their tin foil hat hysteria.
Each mrm blog should be able to do a manboobz sweep of fem blogs and enlighten us with our own stupidity from another angle. But no. None of that. They can wax poetic about feminism all day on those stupid blogs but that’s what it is, literature, fiction to be exact.
This dood here… I’ve never liked the “you can’t tell me what to do argument”. She presented a suggestion. She’s not claiming authority. She’s arguing that the MRM is gutter speak and it’s not a wonder they’re not taken seriously. He had no argument, so he said, “You can’t tell me what to do!” Hate that.
It looks like clockworkgirl was trying to be a voice of reason, and the other MRA’s resorted to using abusive language to shut her up. This is yet another reason the MRM is called the abusers’ lobby.
Way to be credible, guys! Being classified as a hate group is definitely the best way to gain recognition of SOME kind, anyway! (Ahem.) Keep on keepin’ on, you brave souls.
Like it or not, the SPLC classification has seriously stung prominent MRAs. The (relatively) high profile guys like to view themselves and their “movement” as heroic civil rights freedom fighters. Actual civil rights freedom fighters (from an unassailable organisation) have condemned the MRM for what they are: a collection of hate filled bloggers.
I think this is a watershed for the MRM. Things won’t be the same again.
I wish there was a way of noting how many of the visiters to Spearhead, AVfM et al are from rubber-neckers, feminists and anti-MRAs. I would hazard a guess: at least 70%
Maybe they’ll tone down the rhetoric. I just read AVfM’s open letter. The odd thing is, he makes some points that are worth making – men, espectially African American men, are overly represented in the prison population. OK, good point. Did feminism put them there? No. Have anything to do with it? No. So, what’s your point?
You’re right, magdelyn, there are a few women in the MRM. Women like clockworkgirl21, who are called cunt for suggesting calling women cunt is not such a great idea. (with nobody objecting to it, that would probably be white-knighting) Where can I sign up?
Other ‘interesting’ comment, which tell us why they need to call women cunt:
DaNiceguy compared the MRM to the Civil Rights Movement. http://www.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/qxx1w/rmensrights_is_not_the_whole_of_the_mrm/c41lcua#
I wonder how many people of color would object to his appropriation. I’m pretty sure the Civil Rights Movement was about total oppression and not the exaggerations of loss of privilege the MRM complain about.
Now, I will say that some men are affected by the things that also pigeon hole women. Divorce and custody being the primary things that come to mind. But the rest of the things they are fighting for are just boggling to me. And their insistence that calling any woman the c-word (I hate typing that word, sorry!) isn’t hate speech is pretty mind-numbingly stupid to me.
just because one dude has a love affair with the word “cunt” does not a hate movement make
Well, it really depends upon your definition of ‘hate movement.’ If something only qualifies for that label if it’s a bunch of men standing around doing nothing more than chanting “cunt cunt cunt, bitch bitch bitch,” in unison, all the time, then sure: probably this falls short of the mark.
But a ‘hate movement,’ in any meaningful 21st century use of the term, has to include the mainstreaming of hate as a habitual practice. And at /r/mensrights, it’s most certainly not “just one dude.” This kind of vitriol is so commonplace there that it’s not even commented on (other than, that is, with an ‘amen, brother’) unless a radifeminazibitch shows up to menstruate all over their manospheres.
Naming and shaming – IOW labeling a group a “hate movement” – is not a sufficient response to the spread of sexist hate, obviously. It is a necessary one, though, in my judgment. I’ve seen no evidence, as some nice-guy MRAs assert, that this is “blowing off steam” that prevents men from taking physical action. It reinforcement for men who are already at that level of hate, and encouragement for ones who aren’t to get there.
@Timid Atheist: The appropriation of Civil Rights by other groups (including, sadly enough, the white feminists in the 1970s) is never right.
But in the case of the MRM claiming this false equivalency, it also shows how much they do not consider African American men to be part of their movement: it’s white MEN claiming that they are oppressed just like African Americans (men and women), so it excludes by definition black men (who actually are the most likely demographic to end up in prison on false charges not because omgwhtewomen but because racist white police and court systems put them there). See: Project Innocence.
So it’s even MORE ridiculous for the white men who try to speak for “all men” to be claiming they’re like the Civil Rights movement in any way.
@Happy: The odd thing is, he makes some points that are worth making – men, espectially African American men, are overly represented in the prison population. OK, good point.
Yes, I saw that–the question is, how often in the past did he EVER address the extent to which African American men are railroaded into prison?
And don’t forget the very real overlap between the white supremacists and the white MRMs whose usual categorization of black men is “thugs.” Racism is very real in the MRM, and a belated acknowledgement like Elam’s isn’t going to change that.
Here’s a thought, MRA guys. If you acknowledge that feminism has been a success as a social movement, and you want one of your own, you might want to…you know…study it, learn from it, and model yourselves off of it.
Or, if feminism is just too distasteful to you, then study another civil rights movement that has been successful.
The first thing you’ll notice is that you’re doing everything wrong and that’s why you’re now on the SPLC’s radar. Successful social movements don’t center around hating another group(s).
And yes, you do hate women. Not feminism. Women. You claim to hate feminism because why? Oh right. It gives women rights and some power in society. If you didn’t really hate women, then this (feminism) wouldn’t be such a burr in your collective saddles.
You’re doing nothing to change the image of men and how men are perceived. If all men are not [insert negative stereotype here], then you should be…you know…working to change those perceptions. But you’re just reinforcing negative stereotypes of men with your behavior.
Kind of pathetically ironic, no?
@Ithiliana
I have been curious for awhile if there were many men of different races, ethnicities or religions that agree with most MRA doctrine. I wonder if the MRAs even care if they include anyone beyond the white men they have now.
I have to hand it to clockworkgirl21, she actually seems to care about where men fall through the cracks in cases of rape, homelssness, abuse, etc. It’s too bad the MRAs then come along and call her the c-word for asking them to push the extremists out the door.
Futrelle, this is how it is done. Just in case you want to learn:
http://www.avoiceformen.com/feminism/ben-and-jerrys-is-a-radical-hate-group/
I really liked this one:
Are the people that upvote the few sane articles from The Spearhead that make it on the frontpage aware of all the other crap that gets posted there?
Why don’t you post some of these supposed ‘insane’ articles? I’ve been a part of this movement since 2009 and only witnessed mild sexism (mostly by men who’ve been metaphorically raped by feminist-inspired institutions). I’m certainly not saying there aren’t any ‘radical’ blogs out there, but if you actually think they compare to ANY ‘radical feminist’ blogs, I’m going to have to let you know you’re sorely mistaken.
RE: Pecunium (well, Pecunium’s article)
You know what’s actually like being raped? ACTUALLY BEING RAPED.
Seriously, that’s a random ass comparison people like to throw around that just pisses me the fuck off.
RE: Timid Atheist
Well, I can’t talk ethnicity or religion, but I can say as a man who’s not cis that a lot of what they say pisses me off and does absolutely nothing about my rights.
AntZ – Yeah, AVfM had to write that because no actual feminist would.
Keep on hating those imaginary women in your heads, fellas. Have they grown horns yet?
Aww it’s so cute when they try to be funny!
On my way to the train, off to speak at a convention upstate (on surviving the apocalypse, how to do military writing, how to take better pictures, and how to write about horses).
Will be in and out.
Then, next week, off to Paris and Amsterdam for ten days. I’ll hope the MRM has stopped being full of misogynists, politicians stop being misogynists, and everyone gets a pony.
Like that’ll happen.
Antz: If that’s what you think satire looks like… I can see why you are working on VR for everyone… you probably understand that better.
“Dr.” Tara can keep kissing Elam’s ass, but he’ll never really accept her as one of the boys.
Nice try at satire. C-
FUCK YOU!! You know what just passed out of committee and will likely pass the House in Kansas? A bill that exempts a doctor from malpractice suits if he lies to a woman about her health risks during pregnancy. That’s right — if you’re a woman in Kansas, your doctor will be legally allowed to cause direct harm to you by way of injury or death, if he thinks you might get an abortion if he tells you the truth. And there are bills attempting to limit a woman’s access to comprehensive health care in every state of the union. But you complete and utter ASSHOLES keep whining about stupid SHIT like being called creepy or not getting fucked by a supermodel. You can all go fuck yourselves!!
Yeah, calling women c*** is really going to help men in so many ways! Oh wait, it actually does not do anything for men at all, just like the MRM.