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actual activism antifeminism drama grandiosity hypocrisy misogyny MRA MRA paradox oppressed men reddit terrorism

Oh, Men’s Rights subreddit, will you ever learn? (Probably not.)

Sometimes I ask myself: what is it that I really hope to accomplish with this website, aside from entertaining myself and my readers, and exposing misogynist assholes for who they are. There’s a part of me that still hopes that someday, something I write will cause some misogynist and/or Men’s Rightser out there to develop a modicum of self-awareness, look at what they’ve been saying or doing, and say to themselves, “I’m really kind of a tool, aren’t I? Maybe I should stop.”

When the Southern Poverty Law Center report on the Men’s Rights movement came out, I hoped it might have a similar sort of effect. Or that, even if it didn’t persuade any MRAs out there that they were wrong, it might at least convince a few that they were going about things the wrong way. Nope. On the Men’s Rights subreddit, at least, it seems to have sent many of the regulars into an indignant tizzy, and they have doubled down on their peculiar brand of politics-by-whining-online.

Consider this post:

Yes, that’s right. Some Men’s Rights Redditors seem to think that the best way to convince the world that they’re not part of a hate group is to continue to celebrate a self-admitted child abuser who urged men to firebomb courthouses and police stations and kill people.

Then there’s this post, currently the top post on the subreddit:

Wow, if the Men’s Rights subreddit had anything to do with that, that would indeed be a victory. As one regular put it:

Thing is, I read r/mensrights pretty regularly, and I don’t remember any campaign there to protect the rights of fishermen in New Zealand.

Turns out that’s because the campaign, such as it was, consisted of one post some months back, which got all of 11 upvotes at the time. The current post in which r/mensrights congratulates itself for its “victory” has gotten, last I checked, 120 upvotes, more than ten times that. Simplecosine’s self-congratulatory comment in the new thread has gotten 36 upvotes. The comment in the original thread asking r/mensrightsers to send an email to the US Secretary of State’s office got … one upvote. In other words, only a handful of Men’s Rights Redditors even noticed the original post, much less sent along an email.

Reading one of the linked news articles makes clear the real reason the State Department opened an investigation: a six-month long, three-continent wide investigation by Bloomberg Businessweek revealing abuses in the industry.

The Men’s Rights subreddit: Taking Credit for Shit They Didn’t Do Since 2008.

And then there’s this post:

I’ve got nothing to say about this one — it’s basically self-refuting — except that I’m sort of bemused by the notion that the Southern Poverty Law Center is a “semi-women group.” Uh, what is that exactly? A group with some women in it? A group that doesn’t think women are all a bunch of evil bitches? The horror!

Oh, Men’s Rights movement. You’ll never change, will you?

EDITED TO ADD: And speaking of never changing, here’s how one Men’s Rights redditor responded to my comments there suggesting that maybe, just maybe, MRAs should actually denounce and distance themselves from someone calling for terrorism:

Let me just highlight that bit at the end again:

[T]he cost to the establishment to maintain the status quo in regards to divorce, custody, etc. must be made so high that it’s just no longer feasible. If that means instilling abject fear into the hearts of judges, cops and legislators by making them think their careers and/or lives could be forfeit unless they change their attitudes towards men, then so be it.

Trying to instill fear for one’s life in your opponents: that is the very definition of terrorism.

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boomboom
boomboom
8 years ago

wtf is a parachute moderator? And if she said that publicly, why isn’t there a link here?
Over the holidays my childhood gay friend had what was classified as a hate crime in Wisconsin perpetrated against him and he was in the hospital with brain damage. I hope what you’re saying about SRS is not true.

I know that in my small world on another site, some rad fems have it out for gay men because they are so mean and hateful to them, and misogynistic. Yes, some gay men are, but if someone is over on SRS doing that, they should be stopped. That’s misinformation.

Your comment sounds like you’re trying to smear David with this. That is LOL. Incredibly desperate. This blog is above reproach and you know it, Nice try.

Rutee Katreya
8 years ago

I wasn’t aware SRS had mod power over r/lgbt.Why do I sense dishonesty? Oh right, that’s all you’ve ever been XD

LBT
LBT
8 years ago

RE: boomboom

wtf is a parachute moderator?

I assumed it was that thing that makes sure your parachute opens up at the right time.

makomk
makomk
8 years ago

Rutee Katreya: yes they do. The person that posted that comment is an SRS regular, as is the moderator RobotAnna who deleted the complaint about it and banned users for objecting to it. She was selected to become a moderator by another SRS regular (banned now for unrelated reasons) called laurelei together with, I think, one or two other SRS members in order to wage war on the r/LGBT members. I believe the original goal was to put an end to transphobia in r/LGBT but that goal was, ah, not exactly achieved.

boomboom: I’ll see if I can dig up the appropriate links, but there’s piles and piles of this stuff and I think this is in the non-searchable dump of images by one of their ex-moderators.

Crumbelievable
Crumbelievable
8 years ago

I just read through a bunch of that user’s comments and they are pretty absurd. In one LGBT thread, a Redditor says that zie is 18 and zir boyfriend is 15, and Teef calls this person a pedophile.

On a lighter note, she posted in response to an AVFM article, pointing out that calling someone a bitch is incredibly misogynistic, to which our good friend Antzy replied: “Shut up, vile cunt.”

Surprisingly, he received -12 points for this. I wonder if the MRA subreddit is trying to do more self-policing in the wake of that SPLC report.

Rutee Katreya
8 years ago

Dude, let me rephrase:
You have only ever been a dishonest sack of shit here. Why should I at any point believe your representations are honest when this is a thing you have repeatedly failed to be here?

Kyrie
Kyrie
8 years ago

Rogan: It depends what kind of points you’re after. Alpha points? Gorgeous partner gives you points, but being married diminish that. MRAL obsession points? If he could he’d trade place with you, but apart for that he probably wouldn’t care much, because you’re not an elitist bitch spitting on him from your high heels (ie he doesn’t want to sleep with you) Most MRAs, at least those who are not to homophobic, would probably be happy that you took a gorgeous man (ie alpha) out of the dating pool.

That totally gives you happy points, though. And Good-for-you! points too. At least fifty of each.

Edit (not real edit obviously, but the word-press issue delayed my being able to post it):
After having wandered trough your website, I’d guess you would probably not fit in the alpha/beta/omega hierarchy. But nobody does anyway, because it’s doesn’t work when confronted to reality 🙂 And I maintain for MRAL, he mostly fixated on women.

LBT
LBT
8 years ago

RE: Kyrie

Psh. I’m partly asexual. I insta-lose all alpha points.

My guy WAS quite the manwhore in the past, though. And bi, so he was totally alpha till I beta-ed him with my mangina and ensnared him in my sticky masculine web of wiles! The PUAs should be THANKING me for removing his alpha cock from the carousel and having him Go My Way!

And no. I think I completely FAIL that hierarchy in general. *laughs*

–Rogan

Kyrie
Kyrie
8 years ago

makomk:

Don’t worry, even if you’re not achieving something, your friends over at ShitRedditSays are. For example, right now they’re achieving the destruction of the /r/LGBT community through clever techniques such as allowing comments equating gay men with pedophiles whilst deleting comments objecting to this and banning the commenters.

Liar. Or terrible at reading. I’m assuming liar.

I mean its not surprising that gay men aren’t immune from the paedophilia inherent in patriarchy, but its fucking weird to be hit in the face with it like that.

This comment does not, at all, equate paedophilia with homosexuality. What these two lines say is:
– patriarchy foster paedophilia
– gay men are also part of the patriarchy
– therefore some gay men are pedophiles
You can disagree as much as you want with any of these statement, but none of them are what you claim. Why don’t troll never read their own link? Or do they think we wont?
I guess I should precise I’m not defending the comment or srs, just pointing the obvious.

Kyrie
Kyrie
8 years ago

Rogan: You can bi a Chi! Chi are awesome.

LBT
LBT
8 years ago

O_o The hell is a Chi? I immediately imagine that girl robot from Chobits…

–Rogan

Viscaria
Viscaria
8 years ago

And no. I think I completely FAIL that hierarchy in general. *laughs*

As far as I can tell, the alpha/beta/omega/kitten/rock/paper/scissors system assumes only two types of people can be happy: men who are having a great deal of casual sex with women, and men who are in a relationship with a woman that is open for them, but not open for their female partner. Beta males are either unhappy because nobody will sleep with them, or unhappy because they’re saddled with an ugly wife who is using them for money. Women can be slightly better off, since they can be screwing a bunch of alphas and enjoying it, stealing from their beta husbands, or best of all, they can marry an alpha. However, in all of these cases they’re not entirely fulfilled, since the ladies screwing the alphas want to marry them and probably won’t manage to, the ladies stealing from their husbands wish they weren’t too ugly to still be riding the carousel, and the ladies married to the alphas have to put up with their husbands’ endless philandering. Single women, of course, are the most miserable people on Earth, and nobody within the QUILTBAG umbrella even exists (most of the time).

Therefore, I think almost anybody can fail the hierarchy just by being happy in their relationships, or, even better, being happy and single! Or by being something other than cis and straight, because non-cis-straight people are like mythical Yetis to the people who subscribe to this stuff.

makomk
makomk
8 years ago

– patriarchy foster paedophilia
– gay men are also part of the patriarchy
– therefore some gay men are pedophiles

And this paedophilia is magically directed towards a guy above the age of consent rather than young girls through which medium independent of the fact that they’re gay.

katz
8 years ago

LBT, it’s off-topic, but do you prefer being called Rogan?

Kyrie
Kyrie
8 years ago

makomk: Huh… I’ not sure whether I need to improve my English reading or whether your sentence does not make sense, but you lost me. What does “paedophilia [being] magically directed towards [someone]” Do you mean paedophilia accusations? Who do you think is being accused of it? And why are you speaking about young girls when it’s about (male) gay porn? I’m a bit lost.
The only thing I think I got from your post is that you’re not acknowledging that the comment you linked to does not say at all “all gay men are pedophiles” or “most gay men are pedophiles” or “gay men are more likely to be pedophiles” or any variation of it. it would have been so easy to scream “men-haters feminists”, but no, you went with the weird homophobia accusation..

Kyrie
Kyrie
8 years ago

LBT: It’s just my favorite Greek letter. Since it has not yet been claimed by MRAs (the way alpha/beta/omega/zeta have been), it’s what you want.

jumbofisch
8 years ago

So much that when a transsexual like ZinniaJones speaks on YouTube there are people who say pretty ignorant things like “Are you a man or are you a woman? Choose!” or “Kill it with fire!” or “WHAT ARE YOU!?!?”

ummmm last time I check zinnia did not identify as trans but a gay man who crossdresses. (also transsexual is kinda a dated term try “trans” instead)

makomk
makomk
8 years ago

Kyrie: bleh, it’s kind of complicated and involves messy discussion elsewhere, arguments that the patriarchy sexualises young boys because they’re feminine (which is one I can’t say I’ve heard before), and all sorts of unrelated unpleasantness.

jumbofish
8 years ago

The last few months of my life have been utter shit. Don’t make it worse. I really, really don’t want to be sexist. Why else would I even come here! How can you doubt my very pro-feminist opinions from my posts and threads o the forum (the ones that haven’t been locked that is).

XDXDXDXDX ok you have to be trolling just from that

(but blaming us if your life turns shitty? nice. real nice. Smells like a mral to me…)

jumbofisch
8 years ago

Wow I just read the enite thread

that was….enlightening O_o

jumbofish
8 years ago

(one last comment!)
Oh I wanted to leave a message for you boggi just in case you are still reading. I’m still a bit skeptical about your OCD causing you to questioning feminism but I will take back what I said before about it being bullshit. I’m sorry about that, I shouldn’t have assumed about something so personal.

In any case what you were doing right now is not really appropriate. You are putting other’s in charge of your mental well being and its controlling as hell. I hope you realize its not ok to go up to a group of random people and suggest its their responsibility to help you get better.

Maybe you should put off commenting for awhile if its making you upset, if reading helps you clear you mind of it then maybe just read instead of commenting. I’m taking a sort of break myself by not reading the comments because its mentally exhausting me. (I think all the regulars do that every once in awhile)

Also you don’t need to be banned boggi, don’t be so overdramatic!!

Kyrie
Kyrie
8 years ago

@makomk: at each comment you post I understand a bit less what you’re trying to say. Do you still think the comment you linked us is homophobic, in that it equates homosexuality and pedophilia? If so, please explain this for dummies, because the two previous comments brought no light to my understanding of your argument.

I’m trying to understand, so… do you mean that if we had knowledge of this other ‘messy’ discussion we would agree on the homophobia, maybe implied, of the comment? If so, is it necessary? Is it famous, in a way that we would be likely to have heard of it?

Ami Angelwings
8 years ago

So much for MRAL claiming to get help and leave here forever… yet again. -_-

How many times has he cried wolf now?

And when he’s caught this time, he’s going to go back into “give me pity” mode yet again e_e

Can somebody be addicted to trolling?

Kyrie
Kyrie
8 years ago

He’s addicted to attention, which is actually very common…

Joe Max
8 years ago

I’m late to this thread, but I’ve been cruising around some of the MRA sites and I end up always with the same question: What exactly do these men want?

There’s a few concrete demands, like an end to paternity suits and court ordered child support, and elimination of rape shield laws. But for the most part, I don’t understand what the hell they’re looking for. Not even their FAQs or ‘About’ pages come out and say anything definitive. Just a lot of ranting about how unfair the current social systems are toward men.

And they would replace it with… what? I have yet to find a concise “bullet-point action agenda”, much less a coherent description of what their perfect non-baised-against-men society would be like.

Xanthe
Xanthe
8 years ago

Zinnia’s not trans, but he likes fooling people, and even he (she?) can’t make his mind up.

Please note: ZJ re-edited that page this month; he’s obviously okay with an ambiguously gendered phrase that questions his own choice of pronouns, like “Psychotherapy businesses all over the nation are booming since his (her?) YouTube channel gained popularity” being left to stand. Further reading/listening: ZJ’s vlogs on gendered pronouns, and the one last year where he came out again and said he’s a lesbian.

Xanthe
Xanthe
8 years ago

^^ Haha, evidently I cannot read! Emphasis mine:

Most well known for being a gay/genderqueer crossdresser who makes videos about religion and gay rights.

So for some reason I didn’t parse that correctly, and had thought it said “gay/queer crossdresser”. #transfail #epicreadingcomprehensionfail

LBT
LBT
8 years ago

RE: katz

Rogan, please, but I won’t be upset at being referred to as LBT. It’s all good. I try to tag my comments, but sometimes forget.

–Rogan

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