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If Rush Limbaugh could draw cartoons …

Oy, Sorry for more Rush Limbaugh-related crap, but this cartoon, by Gary McCoy, was just too appalling not to post.

I’m not even going to get into the slut-shaming, or that the cartoonist is bizarrely trying to fat-shame someone who is not actually fat, but I would like to point out once again that WE’RE NOT TALKING ABOUT THE GOVERNMENT PROVIDING FREE BIRTH CONTROL (even though that sounds like a nifty idea to me). We’re talking about INSURANCE COMPANIES COVERING BIRTH CONTROL LIKE THEY COVER OTHER MEDICAL EXPENSES. You know about insurance, right? That thing that people PAY FOR THEMSELVES, with THEIR OWN MONEY?

Are Rush and his fans really so ignorant and obtuse that they’ve somehow convinced themselves that this is about the government paying for birth control? Or are they deliberately misrepresenting the issue, knowing that most of their readers/listeners/whatever won’t bother to check the facts?

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Quackers
Quackers
8 years ago

AntZ is lying as usual…or at the very least not citing anything.

Medicare covers prostate screenings: http://www.medicare.gov/(X(1)S(v4ldad454vqx0h555di5bi55))/navigation/manage-your-health/preventive-services/prostate-cancer-screening.aspx

Medicare also covers smoking cessation and there is nothing there about gender: http://www.medicare.gov/(X(1)S(v4ldad454vqx0h555di5bi55))/navigation/manage-your-health/preventive-services/smoking-cessation.aspx

I searched “vasectomy” and “tubal ligation” on the Medicare site and found nothing.

Vasectomies are covered by insurance: http://www.webmd.com/sex/birth-control/vasectomy-14387

So is Viagra: http://www.cbsnews.com/2100-204_162-670833.html

Is this the act? http://housedocs.house.gov/energycommerce/ppacacon.pdf

because I searched for “vasectomy” “tubal” “prostate” and found nothing. AntZ thinks it means its not covered, but my above links, more importantly the one from the medicare website itself proves otherwise.

when I searched for contraception, this is what came up

IN GENERAL.—In this section, the term ‘personal
responsibility education program’ means a program that is
designed to educate adolescents on—
‘‘(i) both abstinence and contraception for the prevention of pregnancy and sexually transmitted infections, including HIV/AIDS, consistent with the requirements of subparagraph (B); and ‘(ii) at least 3 of the adulthood preparation subjects described in subparagraph (C)

There’s nothing it it about women getting birth control and not men because there’s nothing about birth control period. Can you please show us AntZ where you got that?

There is a section on Mammography and Office of Women’s Health…maybe it’s mentioned because of this:

According to Wikipedia:

Women who were able to find insurance on the individual market prior to the ACA were routinely subject to high premiums because of their gender and possible rescission of coverage without refund if they became seriously ill. Yet the increased cost did not equate to more services – only about 13% of insurance plans prior to the ACA included maternity coverage and most preventive services for women covered by insurance plans included some form of cost-sharing[146].

The ACA prohibits insurance companies from charging individual higher premiums based on gender beginning in 2014. Prior to the ACA, being a woman was considered justification for high premiums in most states. Through a process called “gender rating,” thirty-seven states allowed insurance companies to charge women a higher premium, even though higher premiums did not cover gender-specific medical needs such as maternity care[152]. A 25 year-old woman could pay up to an 84% higher premium than a 25 year-old male for identical coverage[153]. In many cases, the premium for a healthy woman was more expensive than the premium for a male smoker of the same age[145]. The ACA mandates that new insurance plans beginning on or after August 1, 2011, include basic preventive care services without cost-sharing[154]. Woman-specific preventive services that will be covered without cost sharing include gestational diabetes screening, well-woman visits, female contraceptives and contraceptive counseling, and breastfeeding support and supplies[155].

PosterformerlyknownasElizabeth

Quackers did a better job than I did. 😀 That is what I get for trying to do this while doing other things.

Quackers
Quackers
8 years ago

for the Medicare links just nightlight everything…it just made a link out of the first half…damn HTML

Also my wiki source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patient_Protection_and_Affordable_Care_Act

Quackers
Quackers
8 years ago

Aww shucks PFKAE…thanks XD

katz
8 years ago

I support Rush. I think the fact that they haven’t been inducted into the Rock and Roll hall of fame is proof of the bias against Canadian bands.

magdelyn
8 years ago

Can one of you explain to me the assumption that health care for women is worse than that for men, when it is men who die years earlier, spend a lot less on healthcare, see the doctor less than women, and are medically worse off on almost health care measure?

Just wondering.

viola
8 years ago

magdelyn, are you honestly arguing that paying more for the same services means you are doing better out of your insurance?

Quackers
Quackers
8 years ago

@Mags

and can you explain how it’s feminists fault for men who don’t go to the doctor? because I’m getting mighty sick and tired at how it’s always implied that just because women overall seem to give more of a shit about their own health than men do overall about their own, and women actually DO something about it, it is somehow our faults when men don’t?

But hey MRAs are right when they say men are disposable…just not in the way they think:

http://www.tgdaily.com/general-sciences-features/52293-new-study-males-might-be-more-disposable-than-females

Shadow
Shadow
8 years ago

spend a lot less on healthcare, see the doctor less than women

This IS an issue, one that I know I suffer from as well, and it does need to be solved. But how do you figure men using health services less, in any way, changes the fact that women’s reproductive health receives less coverage than men’s? How does it change the fact that up till recently all the research done on diseases that affect both genders has been concentrated on male subjects? That men have issues in no way invalidates the problems that women face. I would like to see more campaigns encouraging men to see their doctors (I’ve seen more and more ad campaigns informing people about heart disease symptoms, stroke symptoms and depression symptoms out here in Canada, which is fucking awesome), but I do not expect feminism to work on those problems.

Sharculese
8 years ago

can someone also explain to magdelyn what a non sequitir is and that correlation doesnt equal causation?

PosterformerlyknownasElizabeth

Mags, you are aware that men tend to seek healthcare less than women right?

This, despite having better access to health insurance than women.

Cloudiah
Cloudiah
8 years ago

Obviously, men go to the doctor less than women because of the feminist force shield we’ve put up around doctors’ offices. How did magdelyn find out about that?!?! Now, off to make that force shield stronger, so that NO men can get through! [cue evil laughter]

blitzgal
8 years ago

The other commenters have already covered this, but all of the issues that Mags raises stem from the fact that men do not seek medical attention as consistently as women do — they aren’t barred from access, they choose to not go. My father suffered in silence through a heart attack and didn’t even tell his own family about the issues he was having. The second one killed him. We didn’t even know he’d had a first heart attack until the autopsy results. And that shit right there, where men remain stoic and don’t talk about internal stuff? That’s the poisonous result of the cult of masculinity. And that shit does not come from feminism, that shit comes from the patriarchy.

Quackers
Quackers
8 years ago

I would like to see more campaigns encouraging men to see their doctors (I’ve seen more and more ad campaigns informing people about heart disease symptoms, stroke symptoms and depression symptoms out here in Canada, which is fucking awesome), but I do not expect feminism to work on those problems.

This. x1000. Its something the MRM could work towards and gather much support. If they weren’t so busy being angry assholes on the internet that is.

Carrie
8 years ago

When you think about it, shouldn’t men like these be more in favor for more access to birth control since this would lower the chance of those evil women taking advantage of them? As for those politicians, they usually don’t have more than two kids so either they rarely have sex or use the birth control they despise (especially with their mistresses.)

Pam
Pam
8 years ago

Do you know why they had to do this? No, not because they hate men. The reason is because men, for a very long time, were the only people we did any sort of studies on for heath care. Did you know that women have very different symptoms when it comes to heart attacks? No? That is why we need such a thing. Men are defaulted to at the moment when it comes to health care. They already have access to things that work for them. Women do not.

Only in the MRM is any deviation from the androcentric model in everything a sure sign that we live in a gynocracy.

Men have also been the default in mental health care, as many girls with ADHD and autism spectrum disorders have remained undiagnosed and untreated because they do not fit the androcentric model:

Girls with ADHD: Overlooked, Underdiagnosed, and Underserved

Diagnostic tests for autism may miss many girls

When you think about it, shouldn’t men like these be more in favor for more access to birth control since this would lower the chance of those evil women taking advantage of them?

That’s what a reasonable and rational person might conclude, but since more access to birth control benefits women rather than punishing them, they are not in favour of it.

klopbop
klopbop
8 years ago

I wasn’t sure if there was a “tips” section, but I thought that this post on cartoons might be a good place to post these.

These comics reveal the true nature of feminists. About plans for making all men dead and how to use your feminine wiles to catch yourself a man. Kate Beaton is on to you feminists, it seems.

http://twitpic.com/8sta8l

http://twitpic.com/8st35s

Amnesia
Amnesia
8 years ago

@klopbop

“Oh no! Feminists in the underwear section!”

Love it.

Summer
Summer
8 years ago

Maybe it is worth pointing that (cis) women, on average, go more to the doctor due to pregnancy and maternity issues, for, as far as I know, pregnancy requires quite a lot of medical care?

ithiliana
8 years ago

@Quackers: OOO thanks for the link.

Can we keep around for the next evo psych dude to wander in, and then smack him with it.

PLEASE!

magdelyn
8 years ago

shadow: “… but I do not expect feminism to work on those problems.”

Good. Then I guess we can dispense with the argument that what men need is more feminism to solve their problems. Therefore, you won’t mind there being a men’s rights movement. Since you can’t very well say that feminism is the answer to gender problems, and in the next breath say that feminism has no obligagtion toward 1/2 the worlds population.

magdelyn
8 years ago

@Shadow, can you lease give a citation for the argument that men’s reproducive system get’s more coverage than womens’. That would be awesome. Women use a disproportionate share of healthcare…

Bostonian
8 years ago

How many drugs have been developed specifically for women’s sexual dysfunction?

Oh that would be none.

How many for men?

Cialis, Viagra, and Levitra.

All those meds are currently fully covered by insurance. Even by catholic employers.

Pecunium
8 years ago

eli: He was already famous. What wasn’t learned from his foray into television is the lesson being learned right now… he doesn’t have the audience he claims.

He got that show because he claimed 20 million listeners, per day. His TV show had a run of about 6 weeks. No one made the connection (Nielsen is automated reporting, Arbitron is self-reported).

PosterformerlyknownasElizabeth

Therefore, you won’t mind there being a men’s rights movement.

Of course not…if it helped men. So far all I have seen is “WOMEN SUCK ARGLE BARGLE. ANYTHING THAT DOES NOT HURT WOMEN SHOULD BE STOPPED.”

A men’s rights movement that did not involve spending 99% of the time trying to tear down women would be absolutely lovely.

There are a lot of things that men need help on:

1. not being taught that real men do not complain about their health
2. not being taught that real men do not go to the doctor when they feel sick.
3. not being taught that real men do not reach out for help when they are depressed.
4. prisons actually focusing on prevention of rape of inmates.
5. teaching men that school is just as worthy a goal as whatever is keeping men from going to college
6. actually finding out what is keeping men from going to college.
7. I am sure there are many many others.

But that is not what the MRM wants to do. It wants to hurt women in as many ways as possible.

Pecunium
8 years ago

Buttman: Georgetown, a university. A university which offers BC to it’s employees; whom it pays from the tuition being paid by the students whom it is charging for healthcare services which it is denying them.

So your, “It’s against their morals” is bullshit.

thebewilderness
thebewilderness
8 years ago

A counter argument is unnecessary. You may have all the BC pills your doctor is willing to prescribe for you, or even an IUD, although I am mystified as to where they would put it.
Oh, wait. I have an idea.

magdelyn
8 years ago

@Quakers: “…But hey MRAs are right when they say men are disposable…just not in the way they think…”

Ah. Interesting. Under that senario, it would obviously makes sense to put more resources towards men’s health since. That’s why men get resources…oh, wait, no. Men get less resources and use about 1/3 less healthcare than women.

magdelyn
8 years ago

Of course [I don’t mind a men’s rights movement]…if it helped men.” -PFKE

I hope you don’t mind that the MRM consut or seek approval from feminists about their work.

Pecunium
8 years ago

Antz: <i.Obamacare mandates coverage for women, and not for men, and the response of the manboobz geniuses is “provide a citation showing that insurance companies do not already cover vasectomies.”

Since that’s a patent lie (go ahead, show me the gender limiting language, the part where it says, “This Act only applies to female citizens of the USA”, or equivalent language.

Or, since that isn’t really what you are claiming (is it), but rather that women are being favored over men.

So, go ahead, prove it. The law is available. Show the actual text, not your (questionable) glosses of what it means.

Got it cupcake? Too hard to understand? Concentrate!

You can do it. I know you can.

PosterformerlyknownasElizabeth

I hope you don’t mind that the MRM consut or seek approval from feminists about their work.

The problem with you Mags is you completely and totally ignore the vast amount of hatred the current movement has for women (and oddly enough, in many instances men) in favor of what? Basically saying there should be a Men’s Rights Movement? Most of the posters here agree there should be because there are issues that need addressing. However the current movement spends all of its time in seething hatred towards women. How is that helping men?

magdelyn
8 years ago

During second wave feminism, there was a great deal of hatred. Many of the women celebrated in women’s studies courses were angry. Accusations leveled at men were scurrilous. Much of feminist thought today is based upon negative assumptions about men…men are privileged by patriarchy, they are harassers, wife beaters, rapers.

Men have plenty to be angry about. Just because feminism dismisses men’s anger doesn’t mean their feelings are not legitimate. Their anger will help fuel and grow the MRM.

hellkell
hellkell
8 years ago

Mags, what work? The MRM, in its current form, does nothing but whine on the internet. And what they whine about isn’t about helping men, it’s about hurting women. It’s a bunch of middle-class white dudes who are pants-shittingly scared about any perceived loss of “power.”

PosterformerlyknownasElizabeth

Men have plenty to be angry about.

Angry about what? So far all the anger I have seen has nothing to do with positive ways to help men out but to tear down women because women are too “uppity.”

Just because feminism dismisses men’s anger doesn’t mean their feelings are not legitimate.

You know what is a legitimate anger?

Being angry because a man is raped in prison and no one cares.

You know what is not?

Being angry because women are not stoned to death any more for being raped.

Shadow
Shadow
8 years ago

@Magdelyn

I have no problem with an MRM, I DO have a problem with the current incarnation of it. I’ve come across MRAs from both the States through manboobz, and in India because I myself am South Asian, and I find myself rarely in agreement with their methods, and a lot of their aggrievances. I certainly don’t agree with the “rampant misandry in our society” theory.

I’m not USian, so I don’t have as much knowledge as other posters, but what I have seen makes me think that feminists are right about this issue.

For one, the Viagra coverage vs Pill coverage seems to be spot on.

http://thinkprogress.org/health/2011/08/05/289117/hannity-blasts-insurance-coverage-for-birth-control-defends-viagra-that-is-a-medical-problem/?mobile=nc

I’m guessing that Hannity is right that Viagra coverage is more widespread than pill coverage, since his opponents also say the same thing.

A quick search didn’t give me much useful info about coverage for vasectomies vs tubal litigation, so I’m not going to comment on that (I’m writing a paper right now so I don’t have the time to do more research)

Women DO use more healthcare than men. However, the issue of men SEEKING healthcare less than women, is one that has been covered quite well by many researchers (something that was covered in both my kinesiology classes and my psych classes). Again, a quick search found this study

http://unc.academia.edu/DerrickMatthews/Papers/305681/Masculinity_medical_mistrust_and_preventive_health_services_delays_among_community-dwelling_African_American_men.

That the field of medicine has focused on men as a template is also well documente:, see the recent findings of different symptoms in women for strokes and heart attacks, for example.

Finally, my main issue with the MRM is the lack of citations, and contortion of a lot of the citations that they do have, for most of their claims. That, and the fact that I think a lot of the things that they blame women for is ridiculous, and littered with double standards. If there are articles or authors that you think have legitimate issues that they address then feel free to link.

Moewicus
Moewicus
8 years ago

shadow: “… but I do not expect feminism to work on those problems.”

Good. Then I guess we can dispense with the argument that what men need is more feminism to solve their problems. Therefore, you won’t mind there being a men’s rights movement. Since you can’t very well say that feminism is the answer to gender problems, and in the next breath say that feminism has no obligagtion toward 1/2 the worlds population.

False dichotomy: feminism not solving all problems relating to men does not mean men won’t benefit from more feminism.
Straw man: no one here has a problem with a men’s rights movement per se, the problem is with the misogyny and retrograde values prevalent within the MRM as it exists. See also: No, Seriously, What About Teh Menz? I certainly don’t want such a reactionary and hateful movement representing my interests: they’re more likely to get it wrong than right.
I’m also pretty sure Shadow was not saying “feminism has no obligagtion [sic] towards 1/2 the worlds [sic] population,” but I’ll let Shadow resolve the ambiguities in what “those problems” means.

magdelyn
8 years ago

I hate to tell you this hellkell, the vast VAST majority of men have absolutely no power. Maybe you know a bunch of CEO’s of fortune 500 companies. Maybe you lunch with members of congress. Personally, I don’t know anybody that fits into the elite of this country.

hellkell
hellkell
8 years ago

That’s exactly why I put power in scare quotes, Mags. Instead of doing things to help, they think women are getting all the power. They, like our buddy NWO, think feminism is zero-sum. It ain’t.

hellkell
hellkell
8 years ago

But they DO have privilege, and any threat to that sends the MRM into paroxysms of hate.

Moewicus
Moewicus
8 years ago

Much of feminist thought today is based upon negative assumptions about men…men are privileged by patriarchy, they are harassers, wife beaters, rapers.

lol

1) Men actually are privileged by patriarchy, so yes. I do not find this to be a “negative assumption” about me because I recognize it and because I have sympathy for people whose lives are inhibited by male privilege.
2) Some men are “harrassers, wife beaters, rapers [sic]” and feminism attempts to address gendered violence but that does not mean “much of feminist thought” assumes “men” are such.
The more you try to argue the more embarrassed I get for you, Mags. You have many misconceptions to dispel.

magdelyn
8 years ago

Moewicus, i hope u don’t take offense that i don’t respond to your posts. firstly, i find male feminists to pretty icky most of the time…they remind me of people like hugo schwyzer and mickael kimmel…people who obviously despise men. second…as soon as you argue that all men are privileged by patriarchy, you pretty much lost all credibility. the fact that you don’t deny that much today’s feminist thought is based upon the vilification of men as a whole pretty much sums up why your commentary is both bigoted and, for all intents and purposes, useless.

hellkell
hellkell
8 years ago

Whatever, Mags, stay cozy in your assumptions and misconceptions.

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
8 years ago

At first I was excited to see Mags engaging in an actual argument, but then I realised that all she was going to do was repeat “men aren’t actually privileged” over any over again.

Rutee Katreya
8 years ago

the fact that you don’t deny that much today’s feminist thought is based upon the vilification of men

Are you illiterate?

magdelyn
8 years ago

@Katreya

Yes. Yes I am. I can’t believe your literatism. I am soooooooo offended that you are so bigoted.

Shadow
Shadow
8 years ago

What I meant is that feminism, as a movement, has no obligation to address issues that face men solely. And, while I do agree that a lot of what feminism achieves also ends up benefiting men, I do think that a movement centred around men will be more beneficial when attacking issues that men face. The only obligation that feminism has towards men is the same obligation that any other movement has, namely not to harm others (loss of power over women or privilege over women is obviously not harmful) in their fight for equality.

Obviously many (I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s a majority) individual feminists care about men’s issues, because, as a species, we tend to care about our fellow man.

Rutee Katreya
8 years ago

mickael kimmel…people who obviously despise men.

lol. Thanks for reminding me of your hate on for him, Mags. Now I get to remember an entire sociology department laughing their asses off at you XD

Shadow
Shadow
8 years ago

@mags

Which men are disadvantaged solely by their gender?

Pecunium
8 years ago

I hate men… good to know. I’m sure my co-husband has noticed this. One wonders why he’s not asked for some sort of divorce.

Oh wait, he’s a feminist too… maybe he hates me?

Perhaps it’s just that we both hate sexism, and, “men” aren’t the issue, but rather behaviors are.

magdelyn
8 years ago

@rutee….sociology is a fake discipline…like astrology. I wouldn’t care what those clowns are laughing at…sociology – what a waste of an education.