Today, a GUEST POST from Catherine! Thanks, Catherine! And the rest of you, enjoy!
Over on Chateau Heartiste, the (He)artist(e) Formerly Known As Roissy devoted a recent post to the conundrum of handsome men coupled with ugly women. It’s essentially an open thread for the denigration of women who don’t live up to Roissy’s porntastic standards (17 to 20 years old with a BMI of about 18 *and* a D cup, and related WTF?! attributes), as well as ragging on those awful beta manginas who are punching below their weight – or, to quote Heartiste himself, are “polluting the gene pool with pigwoman blood.”
I was participating in a mobile conference which included question and answer periods, and I noticed an odd couple standing to my side. He was youngish and good-looking — most women would agree on his physical attractiveness — and his wife was a snout-nosed, inbred-looking, stringy-haired, big fat pig dressed in sweatshirt and ill-fitting jeans. In other words, the typical American woman. I assumed they were married because I saw their rings and she had her hand on a stroller with an infant tucked away in it.
He’s just getting started.
What abomination is this! I thought. But then the reason became crystal clear after only a few moments watching and listening to them interact.
Speaker: Any questions?
Big Fat Pig: [nudging her hubby with her elbow] Honey, remember…
Handsome Husbandry: [tentatively raising his index and middle finger, and haltingly talking] I have a question… I have a…
So obviously the young good-looking man is totally under the thumb of the big fat evil feminist woman, who has sucked out his brains and reduced him to a quivering lump of hesitation and uncertainty!
As he asked his question, he kept looking over at his wife — in fact, staring at his wife more than the speaker, although he was ostensibly addressing the speaker. One would be forgiven for having the impression that he was seeking constant real-time assurance from his wife that his question was acceptable for public discourse. Nervously shifting from one foot to the other, leaning into his wife, gazing downward when the speaker responded to him, his body language was so beta it was painful to watch. No, it was repulsive to behold, almost as repulsive as the visual effrontery of his wife’s blubbery carcass.
So, sniveling, indecisive beta manginas are repulsive… but not as repulsive as a corpulent woman! Gotcha, Roissy.
After getting in a few more digs at the contemptuous, unsympathetic wife, Roissy sets forth his views on various types of couples. First, the kinds of couples that should be allowed to exist:
Handsome man with beautiful woman
All is right in the world. You infer the man has alpha characteristics to complement his good looks, and he has cashed that in for a hot babe. …
Ugly man with ugly woman
All is right, if depressing, in the world. You infer the ugly man has beta or even omega characteristics, and that an ugly woman was the best he could do. You assume the ugly woman resents him for having to settle, but knows she has no other options. Love between them is less about passion than it is about task delegation and avoidance of suicidal loneliness.
All is well in the world of alpha males with hot babes, but those in ugly people combos need to find some highly diverting hobbies to keep from offing themselves.
Now Roissy turns his attention to two apparent mismatches, and delineates his usual double standards:
Ugly man with beautiful woman
Wow, he is shooting out of his league! But then, thinking on it a bit, you recall that you saw quite a few couples like this mismatched pair during the week. It’s less rare than popularly imagined. You may ask yourself “What does she see in him?”, and from that you infer the ugly man has compensating alpha attributes to snag such a hottie — maybe he’s wealthy, or slick, or funny, or a dominating asshole, or some combination of each. You assume this ugly man has options to be able to choose a beauty for a girlfriend.
Moral: ugly men are permitted to have counter-balancing attributes! Can you guess what is coming next?
Handsome man with ugly woman
Whoa, what is he thinking?! An uncommon sight, (occurrence less frequent than its polar opposite), you presume the handsome man has some debilitating personality flaw — maybe social awkwardness, or shyness, or micropenis — that prevents him from fornicating with his true potential. Unlike the mirror image couple of the ugly man with the beautiful woman, you do not give the ugly woman the benefit of the doubt in assessing why she was able to catch a handsome man. You simply conclude, reasonably, that the handsome man is not the alpha male on the inside that he looks like on the outside, and therefore the ugly woman is not really dating out of her league. There must be something wrong with him, you think.
Women have no value beyond their looks, so the pitiful man dating someone wretchedly below Roissy’s artificial standards must likewise be sub-standard, in some way invisible to us, to have abased himself so humiliatingly.
Having drawn these pictures, Roissy rounds out the post with a sermon on female ugliness, which is to be universally shunned:
There is an instinctive, deeply primitive understanding chugging away behind the prefrontal cortex in every one of us that women sexually respond to a suite of male attractiveness traits, of which looks are only one desirable male quality. It is therefore not inconceivable to most non-brainwashed observers that an ugly man might have other characteristics that appeal to a beautiful woman on his arms, or that a handsome man might be crippled with weakness and self-doubt that constrains his ability to attract no better than a big fat pigwoman.
And we’re back to the disparaging references to pigs. Why, oh why does Roissy hate pork so? (That he detests women is more or less expected.)
In the mismatched couple I witnessed, it was clear that whatever good will or tokens of desire that the handsome man had inspired in his pigwoman were completely squandered by his beta behavior. It was easy to see by her loathsome demeanor that his looks no longer held — if they ever did beyond the first couple of dates — any sway over her feelings for him. But being the big fat pigwoman she is, she knew she could not do better.
And that is why the generational increase in human beauty is a slow, painstaking process, punctuated by tragic reversals to a sloping brow norm (see: Appalachia, Detroit). Handsome betas are polluting the gene pool with pigwoman blood.
What the hell was that? I’ll quote it again: “Handsome betas are polluting the gene pool with pigwoman blood.” Oh, the huge manatee! Shrink in terror from the impending doom to be brought about by porcine-human hybrids!
Naturally such hyperbole is a cue for some predictable misogyny in the comments, such as the following from regular tool Tyrone:
That’s why its good to be older to get a good sense for how a woman will age. There are loads of women who look hot when young but turn into cattle as they age. Mom is usually a good bench mark. If you’d do her Mom, you’re probably safe. Check out how Ginger Lynn looks like nowadays. You’d never recognize her from her porn days.
A view right in line with Roissy’s famed dating value regimen that women lose value once they’re older than, say, 29; and Tyrone follows it up with some white supremacism:
White people won’t survive without more kids. Smart white men need to breed more in our country- with white women.
What, you might ask, about women with great bodies but unappealing faces? One Anonymous coward urges his brethren to go for it :
[O]ne of my biggest regrets was not doing a girl who had the hottest body around but an ugly face. Temporarily of course.
But for fuck’s sake don’t marry them. Right, tenderman100?
Some years ago, before I was married for the first time (twice married, twice divorced) I was banging this babe. Amazing body. Amazing tits. But a kind of a bucktoothed face. When I first met her, I thought, wow what amazing tits…yeah she’s kinda ugly but she’s friendly and I just have to see those tat tas. Well, not only did I see them, we banged for a few months. She was incredible in bed, highly orgasmic, very flexible (did ballet). Haven’t seen her in decades, but if she is a fat cow, I wouldn’t be surprised. Yeah, she was ugly but she pounded like a pro. So it isn’t always what it seems. Then again, I would never have married her.
If not marriage, then what about a long-term relationship? Over again to Tyrone:
A good woman who has reparable shortcomings is still a good option for an LTR. Fugly is a whole different animal.
But if you marry one of them, Tyrone adds, make sure you have a contingency plan!
My wife knows if she ever lets herself go, talks about divorce, whatever that pisses me off enough to leave, I will simply disappear into the night. No arguments or emotions, it will be a complete coup de main. There won’t be anyone around to serve papers to. I’ll be overseas in an undisclosed location screwing LBFMs.
In case you don’t already know, LBFM is short for Little Brown Fucking Machines, a term of art to refer to Asian women (frequently underage) sought out by sex tourists — which should be sufficient to outline Tyrone’s sophisticated moral principles. He continues:
I say this with no emotion or bravado, just let her know its a fact that she must deal with. Marriage is like defense policy, the best defense is a good offense. Strike first, strike to kill. Identify a location and buy yourself some property there, so you have somewhere to go. Move enough money there to live well until you can start a bar or whatever to live. Plan this for a few years in advance if need be. Life is too short to be some stupid broad’s wage slave.
How charming!
Heartiste really has a way of bringing out the best in people!
Yeah, that’s true. JTK had been warning thirty something women of the sexual frustration they will soon endure due to MGTOW, which I find hilariously absurd. Then he started throwing out tired Matrix cliches to describe the MGTOW “movement”. I thought it was funny that the very movie he references shows a man happily having sex with a thirty something woman, breaking the great penis blockade he hopes is going to catch on any minute.
While the Matrix trilogy isn’t feminist, it definitely isn’t MRA either. Trinity, Switch, the Oracle, and Niobe are all female characters that don’t fit the MRA ideal of a passive, submissive woman who believes herself to be inferior to all men. The only female character that fits any MRA tropes is Persephone, who uses her sexuality to manipulate others and betrays her husband in revenge for his infidelity. I really doubt the Wachowski brothers wrote the movies with any MRA ideals in mind. I have no idea why the MRM latched on to the movies.
I agree that these “men” especially hate women of a “certain age” because they are far less likely to be submissive and put up with their crap. Meanwhile, I recently saw an article in the wedding section of a local newspaper, about a recently married couple who are both 61. They first met in kindergarten in 1956, and had always liked each other, but the timing was never right for them. They had lost touch with each other for 30 years, married other people, then were both widowed when they reconnected at a high school reunion a few years ago. It was a beautiful article, and they are an adorable couple. The woman is actually quite pretty, with a terrific figure. I posted the article on an MRA blog. They went apeshit! Not only did they insist she was an ugly old hag who must have “tricked the poor guy” into marrying her, they insisted that I must be a fat, ugly old hag (despite that they had absolutely no idea what I look like. I am a yogini, FYI.) Their hatred of women is truly pathological.
@ 2-D Man:
“They show up and say something colossally stupid and you’re like, “That’s the stupidest thing a person could write.” And then they say something stupider and you’ve got nowhere to go.”
True, but what a time to be alive!! Right before our very eyes the age-old field of stupidity is taking record-breaking strides forward!
Kendra, my take on it is that for the MRM guys, their particular combination of egotism and alienation lends easily lends itself to thinking that they have some kind of special knowledge and can see the world for what it really is… unlike people who aren’t in their in-group.
JTK: STILL not going his own way.
And still spewing the same old/same old.
Hey, if you insist on hanging around here, can you come up with some new schtick?
Wait, JTK still hasn’t actually gone?
Dammit, dude. We can’t miss you if you never go away.
(Not that we will, but you know, in principle.)
Don’t tell the boobz about “Bound”. Because I’m sure they could read it as “eeeevil lesbians are killers!!!1!1!!”
“Because the women the PUAs are after arent the kind that interest me”
So you guys are openly admitting that you really are still interested in women, you’re just trying to force us to change to suit you?
Your movement needs a new name, since you clearly have no intention of going your own way at all. Throwing a tantrum in the hopes of producing a wanted result and going your own way are not the same thing, and you are not a Zen warrior poet.
“I read “site” as something slightly different first time round. Was it just me?”
Nope!
Also there’s something particularly funny about these idiots choosing The Matrix as their theme movie. I mean really, I don’t think “women are evil, shun them!” was the theme that project was going for. How do they explain away Trinity? Given how racist they are, how does Fishburne fit into this? And of all the potential heroes an angry misogynist white supremacist movement could choose, they chose hippy Canadian polite Hawaiian Chinese stoner dude Hacker Jesus?
Well, I am 35. If that makes me a hag by default, I wish these guys could explain why men still keep trying to have sex with me. Despite my wedding ring, relatively conservative attire, and sedate behavior, I get hit on and asked out by fit and handsome men in their twenties, thirties, and forties frequently enough for it to be unremarkable. In fact, younger men seem to be particularly drawn to me. It’s almost as if they are responding to me visually rather than requesting a peek at my driver’s license to determine whether or not I am fuckable. Huh. Can’t figure that one out.
Anyway, as a 35-year-old woman, I have not become any less selective. The unattractive creeps that I rejected at fifteen would still get rejected now, if anyone would let them have an outing from the nursing home. Do these men really lack the self-awareness to realize that beautiful young women DO NOT find them desirable? Certainly, inexperienced girls and women are easier to manipulate and easier to impress, but any of them with the least bit of savvy and self-esteem are still going to reject what is on offer here. At fifteen, I cannot even tell you how many perverted grandpas and middle-aged married men were trying to talk me into secret trysts with them. And, yes, I was a pretty fifteen-year-old girl with a remarkable figure, but that is likely why I have grown up to be a woman that is regarded as more than passingly attractive. Women who are beautiful at 20 tend to be beautiful at 40. Girls who were plain at 18 tend to be plain at 38. And, really, if all kinds of delectably lovely young women were eager to have sex with the misogynist crowd, would they really waste so much time ranting about missing out on the tender ministrations of their crone-like coevals?
And let’s not forget that one of the Wachowski “brothers” is a woman. So, there’s that.
The main reason these guys are obsessed by The Matrix is that it make them feel like nerds and they absolutely need to believe they are nerds.
>>“You get broken free of that part of the femiMatrix which gives females the illusion that they hold the power.”
>>There is no poon, Neo.
WIN.
I did not know that. I will say the Wachowksis or Wachowski siblings from now on.
>>“You get broken free of that part of the femiMatrix which gives females the illusion that they hold the power.”
Also, going by the behavior JTK et all, you’d think that women actually did have that kind of power. Certainly they seem to be unable to actually GTWO no matter how much they claim to wish to do so.
“By the way, Neo from the Matrix had sex with Trinity, and she was in her thirties.”
But I don’t think they ever dated. Because, you know, you can do the one without the other.
They didn’t need to date. Even though they’d only shared about fifty words of (extremely utilitarian) conversation up to that point, a magical old black woman told them they were in love with each other, so they were. Now that’s character development!
My favourite part of the Matrix is in the third movie, where Trinity and Neo fly above the ‘black cloud’ layer and see the sun – meaning that the machines could have avoided the whole ‘let’s trap humans in a virtual dreamworld so we can mine their bodies for energy’ thing by building solar panels on the end of really long poles.
Malcontent, my girlfriends and I are in our 50s and still get hit on, by men of all ages. (Despite that most of us are visibly married.) This flies in the face of everything the MRAs hold dear to their threatened little egos. Furthermore, my mom has friends in their 60s and 70s who have very active, fulfilling social lives and are even getting married. (Not to loser guys, either. Quite the contrary.) When I dared to suggest that women are not necessarily “washed up” after a certain age; that there actually are older men who prefer the company of women who are close to them in age; and even dare to find these women attractive; I was cruelly laughed off the blog. (After being called a ‘fat, ugly old hag,’ ‘delusional’ and a ‘stupid sock puppet.’) This is called “projection” by those in the mental health profession.
And although I actually quite like The Matrix, I often wonder how all the hard-eyed realists who use the ‘red pill/blue pill’ thing as a metaphor for seeing reality as it really is reconcile that with the fact that the rest of the movie is full of magic, prophesy and pseudo-religious bullshit about ‘believing’…
Oh my gosh, how did I not think of that? It’s so obvious. It’s like the entire premise of the movie series was challenged by a scene that lasted less than a minute.
I’m 38 and still get hit on all the time. Sometimes by men who are what these clowns would call “alphas”, actually. Now in terms of the kind of creepy constant harrassment from much older men that I experienced in my teens, that died down considerably as soon as I became visibly an adult (so 20s rather than 30s), but in terms of actual incidences of being asked out? Hasn’t decreased noticably since I turned 30, or even 35.
I can remember random men staring at my Mom’s legs when she was nearly 50, and my Gran acquired a new boyfriend in her 60s, and is often flirted with even today (she’s 73). Curiously enough, it seems like most men tend to go for women about their own age give or take about 5-10 years.
The main reason these guys are obsessed by The Matrix is that it make them feel like nerds and they absolutely need to believe they are nerds.
The Matrix is the ultimate nerd fantasy (and I speak as a fully fledged nerd). It’s a world in which you can learn kung-fu and ballistic combat without having to do any training or shower with other men, and in which women fall in love with you without any effort on your part because the fates told them to.
The Karate Kid is similar, if a little less far-fetched: do a few simple, untaxing tasks that take you nowhere near the intimidating, physically demanding reality of a martial arts class, and before you know it you’re kicking blonde karate jock douchebag ass with a broken tibia. Although at least Ralph Macchio has to actually charm the love interest himself in that one.
> ENDING MOVIE DERAIL
I remember my grandmother taking me out shopping once when I was eighteen and a group of men about her own age calling out to her flirtatiously. They didn’t pay any attention to nubile little me standing beside her.
Funny how mature men tend to seek out mature women. It’s almost as if intelligent adults are more attracted to other intelligent adults with an array of life experience than to inexperienced teenagers. Hmmm…
Well there you go, then. If most people are attracted to those with a similar level of intelligence and life experience, no wonder PUAs are all chasing teenagers.
And now that you mention it, my Gran’s boyfriend, charming man though he was, paid no attention to either me or my cousin in a sexual sense, though we were both very cute teenagers at the time. Odd how an emotionally healthy man in his 60s wouldn’t be all that interested in screwing girls young enough to be his grandkids. Hmm, how to solve this mystery?
It’s no mystery! He was “emotionally healthy,” unlike the PUAs and MRAs. I personally have zero respect for men (or women, for that matter) who chase after those young enough to be their kids or grandkids.
It’s funny how less really older men hit on me now than did when I was 14 or 15. In fact it was like a tap turning off as soon as I hit about 18, as far as that was concerned. Never have I been so happy to have a specific group of people start ignoring me.