What’s the difference between a lad mag and a rapist? Aside from one being a magazine and the other a person, albeit an reprehensible one, apparently not very much.
In a study soon to be published in the British Journal of Psychology, researchers at Middlesex University and the University of Surrey showed people quotes about women from British lad mags (FHM, Loaded, Nuts and Zoo) and from convicted rapists. Most survey respondents – men and women both – could not tell the difference between the quotes from the magazines and the quotes from the rapists. And most of the male respondents identified more with the quotes from the rapists than from the lad mags.
Here are some of the quotes the survey respondents were asked to react to. (You can find more at Jezebel.) Can you tell which of these are from rapists or lad mags?
Mascara running down the cheeks means they’ve just been crying, and it was probably your fault . . . but you can cheer up the miserable beauty with a bit of the old in and out.
You’ll find most girls will be reluctant about going to bed with somebody or crawling in the back seat of a car . . . But you can usually seduce them, and they’ll do it willingly.
Some girls walk around in short-shorts . . . showing their body off . . . It just starts a man thinking that if he gets something like that, what can he do with it?
I think girls are like plasticine, if you warm them up you can do anything you want with them.
In case you’re wondering, the correct answers are: Lad mag, Rapist, Rapist, Lad Mag.
Creepy, eh?
Lead researcher Miranda Horvath of Middlesex University explains why she feels this is so troubling:
Rapists try to justify their actions, suggesting that women lead men on, or want sex even when they say no, and there is clearly something wrong when people feel the sort of language used in a lads’ mag could have come from a convicted rapist.
I would say so.
And so, you might wonder, how did the regulars on the Men’s Rights subreddit react this this research? Take a look.
The comment with the most upvotes offered some nice juicy denial:
The comment with the second-highest number of upvotes completely missed the point:
And then there was this hot mess:
In case anyone is wondering, that quote from French is actually a quote from a character in one of her novels. And it’s pretty easy to distinguish it from things posted on Jezebel, because none of the writers on Jezebel ever say anything even remotely like that.
The Men’s Rights subreddit, responding to evidence of rape culture by going “la la la I can’t hear you” since March 2008.
@lj4adotcomdan:
And what do you think about the quote from the news article that I (and someone else) linked to? No cover up or scandal there, just some people in a town reacting to a tragic event.
That would be the stronger indication of a rape culture. The church thing was an example to counter your argument that if something isn’t a majority view, then there is not culture that supports it.
Now Owly is calling withholding sex the same as sexual coercion. In other news, up is down, black is white, cats & dogs cohabitate, etc..
Cassandra: “Actually at this point I’m not sure that you even understand what “culture” means. The Catholic church is a part of our culture, not a totally separate entity, in terms of America. In some countries it’s the majority culture and very influential.”
I understand all that. But there was much backlash by the entirety of our culture as a whole, including by many parishioners within the Catholic church, when it was revealed how far the protection of rapists went within the church. If my stated definition of what a rape culture is is a correct one, then the backlash would stand in opposition to the claim that we live in a rape culture.
He is just mad that rape and domestic abuse are still illegal. He wants it to be legal to beat someone up and rape them.
I’d argue that the only reason that backlash happened was because the victims were little boys. It was partly that society takes sexual abuse of children more seriously than that of adults, and partly homophobia, that led to the general sense of outrage.
@NWO:
Aww, you disappoint me slavey. I thought for sure you’d actually respond to me and justify your accusation of me condoning bad behavior, not just jump into an unrelated-but-equally-misguided-rant-over-some-other-thing…
Here is the proposed change.
Before: “Carnal knowledge of a female forcibly and against her will.” (from 1929)
After: “penetration, no matter how slight, of the vagina or anus with any body part or object, or oral penetration by a sex organ of another person, without the consent of the victim.”
So yeah… consensual sex? Totally not rape. Non-consensual sex? Totally rape. I don’t see why you want to hang yourself on bemoaning this particular change… Especially since it gets rid of the gender-specific language that you so often say you hate.
@Moewicus
No sex for hubby until he buys wifey a new luxury home in the burbs. Women who love too much! Wasn’t that a book written a while back? I think she was a therapist as well.
—————-
@Bostonian
I didn’t know domestic abuse, (I’m assuming you mean women as eternal victims) was legal? When was that exactly?
You almost get the sense that Slavey doesn’t actually read these things, just looks for some key-words and BAM! Instant rant.
kirbywarp: “And what do you think about the quote from the news article that I (and someone else) linked to? No cover up or scandal there, just some people in a town reacting to a tragic event.”
I am disturbed at the hospital worker who said “These boys have to live with this the rest of their lives.”, as if they are the victims.
Does one person making a completely moronic quote mean we live in a rape culture? No.
“That would be the stronger indication of a rape culture. The church thing was an example to counter your argument that if something isn’t a majority view, then there is not culture that supports it.”
There may be sub-cultures (like the heirarchy in the Catholic Church) that can rightly be said to be a rape culture without causing the entire culture as a whole to be a rape culture.
I think Slavey’s brain is permanently set to “look for opportunities to deposit incoherent rant” mode.
@kirbywarp
Tut, tut, oh warped one. The word forcible is removed. No force of any kind is neccesary. A woman can freely consent to sex and can still call it rape. No force is needed.
@lj4adotcomdan:
Just to clarify, and take this as a completely separate point from everything else. You said that there could not be a rape culture, because officers you talked to denounced the one’s actions. I said that you could do the same thing with the catholic church, and in that case it is more obvious that there is a culture of something going on their (you’ve even agreed).
Right, back to the other point. Does one quote make a culture? No. This is something that can really only be proven by statistics or some other collection of data. But mostly everyone on this site will tell you that from stories they hear about and people they talk to, this rape culture is a present and real thing. You’ll have to do some research on your own if you want to be convinced; focus your efforts on the experiences of women who have actually been raped, and their experiences with the justice system.
Oh good. Now statutory rape victims, alcohol-facilitated rape victims, rape victims who don’t have the mental capacity to consent or physical capability to resist, and rape victims who determined that they didn’t want to be choked, beaten, and raped can be counted in the FBI’s statistical charts too.
You’re the stupid man, milkslave. And no.
<blockquote I mean seriously, if you aren’t forced and consent to sex, but it can still be considered rape. Isn’t all sex rape?
No. That’s scary that your definition of consent is so fucked up, though, milkslave. Very scary. I know you don’t know any women, but please stay away from women.
That’s cute, but no.
@NWOSlave:
“Tut, tut, oh warped one. The word forcible is removed. No force of any kind is neccesary. A woman can freely consent to sex and can still call it rape. No force is needed.”
I… I don’t know how to make this any clearer. Here is the proposed change.
“penetration, no matter how slight, of the vagina or anus with any body part or object, or oral penetration by a sex organ of another person, without the consent of the victim.”
Do I need big flashing lights and a siren too?
@Bee
No force is needed. None. Zero. Zip. Nadda.
In case you’re still confused, NWO, (a very likely possibility), here is an example of how you can be raped without being forced. A woman goes to a party and gets roofied. The man who does so proceeds to have sex with her unconscious body. No force needed, yet still rape. Thus, the presence of force is not the crucial thing, its the presence of consent. Which is exactly what the change makes clear.
Yes, it was a book, and according to its wikipedia page it was criticized by feminists. It even links to a paper by a feminist criticizing it. Maybe you could use some of those wiki-smarts? I hear they make you really stupid and insane though!
Without the CONSENT of the VICTIM. If I coerce you into sex, and don’t “hurt” you, I’ve still raped you. If I drug you, and have sex with you, I’ve raped you. The removal of forcible is a GOOD THING. Now we need to get envelopment in there so more raped men are recognized. This is a good thing, NWO.
If I say, sleep with me, or I’ll kill you, but don’t actually injure you, I’ve raped you. Yes? No? Why is this a bad thing for it to be recognized as such?
Where is the free consent?
NWO, you’re an idiot. If you bothered to read what you posted, the definition is being changed to reflect what police departments ALREADY USE. This is not an example of The Gynocracy at work.
As to the woman you linked to, you know damn well no one here condones that behavior, you dishonest thing you.
Do not debate with a rape advocate, it is meaningless. He is just pissed that raping kids will get him put in jail.
@zhinxy:
It’s like pointing to a picture of a cat, asking slave what the picture is of, and him gladly responding “turnip!” This may be a bit pointless…
@kirbywarp
And in addition to what you’ve quoted is, no force is neccesary.
A few examples of theft.
1) Stealing from a person.
2) Stealing from a persons home.
3) Stealing from a persons bank account.
A few examples of rape
1) Forced sex.
2) Sex with an unconcious woman.
3) Unforced consensual sex.
No force is needed, it’s that simple.
@NWO:
How is unforced consensual sex an example of rape?
NWO, theft =/= rape. You’ve had this explained to you at great length.
Right. I got that, as indicated by what I wrote in my comment to you. Let me know if you need help understanding the concept of consent, now, okay?