All those jobs going overseas? Blame it on the ladies. At least according to MRA blogger The Fifth Horseman – the guy behind The Misandry Bubble, a bizarre apocalyptic manifesto that took the manosphere by storm last year. In a heavily upvoted comment on The Spearhead, TFH explains:
Not many people realize that outsourcing happens mostly due to feminism.
Feminists impose all sorts of costs on businesses in the US, who are forced to employ women despite the low productivity of these female employees.
Since an office is not allowed to have too many men, the next best answer is to move the entire department to India or China, where Western feminists can no longer harass it.
Since Western women cost more than what Western men produce, outsourcing is inevitable, as a means to avoid feminism.
The blogger behind the Pro-Male/Anti-Feminist Technology blog was impressed enough with this argument that he featured it in a post of his own, adding
Plenty of people have tried to run the numbers on the offshoring of jobs, but they can never figure out where the savings are supposed to be. Business would only offshore jobs if it made financial sense, and running the numbers indicates that it doesn’t make financial sense because any savings gets eaten up by the costs of offshoring. That is the case until you include the costs of feminism in the analysis. When someone runs the numbers on offshoring, they don’t include things like the costs of the false sexual harassment industry, affirmative action, and pure makework jobs for women in their analysis. As soon as feminism is included, offshoring makes perfect financial sense for business. …
If you want jobs to come back to the US (and elsewhere), then you have to eliminate feminism.
Yeah, that’s gotta be it.
*”you can always quit” in the first line. I iama bbad atw typming.
@Holly
The difference is that assault and battery clearly infringes on the rights of the target, where I’m not so sure about sexual harassment. Certainly the ‘slap on the ass’ kind of violations do (and would also fall under battery), but beyond that, we don’t have a right not to be offended. If someone winks at me on the street, I can’t call the police and have them arrested. At certain organizations you could (theoretically) get someone fired for winking at someone else. And, if an employer didn’t have this policy, they might face a lawsuit, even though they aren’t the ones doing the winking.
@Crumbelievable
Would it help if I added a parenthetical, “But, I still would be an asshole”?
@zhinxy
Yup. That’s exactly my point. Not only would I be an asshole for allowing sexual harassment in my workplace, I would also be very stupid and excluding all sorts of critical talent (of all genders… I for one would leave a shop that had widespread sexual harassment, even if I wasn’t the target). I just don’t feel comfortable making it something you can sue the employer for when the employer themselves is not responsible for the harassment.
Would you argue that there is currently a more-or-less truly free market in labor? What IS your understanding of laissez-faire and civil rights or the labor movement? Please elaborate, because if you’re gonna be on a high free market horse, this is a jousting zone.
I would say that there are all sorts of market abstractions in the US. The fear of EEO lawsuits prevents employers from firing employees in a lot of circumstances, which also makes them reluctant to hire. Beyond that, structural unemployment exists, and job training is effectively an externalities that companies foist onto the government (one that I happen to agree with, but a violation of laissez-faire principles nevertheless). Beyond that, I’m not entirely sure what you are asking.
@Bagelsan
Well then… By that standard I would put some of the blame for the higher proportion of men working in low-skill, high-risk fields on feminism. Just look at boy’s educational attainment.
I don’t want to say the name aloud in case it summons him, but this guy should be friends with the guy whose name starts with “B” and ends with “randon.” They could swap stories and grainy illegal videos with each other. 😀
we do however, have a right to work free from demeaning, sexualized comments about our performance. its a right that’s created by the legislature and the courts, but it’s still more of a right than anything youve put forward, so…
Since when has feminism encouraged men (especially, exclusively men) to work in high-risk fields? Are you saying that boys who otherwise would have ended up in academia or something are now taking jobs as coal miners because slightly more girls than boys currently attend college?
Is the argument here that a “slap on the ass” harms someone in a way that is different than demeaning language or harassment? I don’t think that someone is usually physically harmed by an ass-slap, but that usually they object because they are offended, so how is that slap an infringement on rights in a way that verbal harassment would not be? In both cases the issue isn’t that they are physically injured.
“it should be obvious that your argument is nonsense because as soon as you start harassing someone, youre not behaving peaceably, youre behaving aggressively.
Bingo, and even wacky libertarian ethics seem to have a thing with aggression.. like it’s the foundation of our supposed system or something… ”
Also, meant to give you this as a better first premises paper on natural libertarian anarchist law, though it’s good and topical for nwo and Developers 3 – too, if they can, you know, bother to read things…
The Nature of Law –
http://freenation.org/a/f13l2.html
There’s a riduculous amount of economic coercion and anti-labor practice in the current system that makes “just go find another job” ridiculous, especially from a supposedly free market perspective. If there’s privelege behind an employers ability to hire, and most employers are recieving state subsidies in this market, the sudden chest beating about their rights is not just disengenous, it’s an active self-oppression meme for most workers. The poor bosses do need all the help they can get, though.
developer 3 – See also, Beyond The Boss, Protection from business in a free nation.
http://freenation.org/a/f41l2.html
And this on collective action such as racism and sexism –
http://freenation.org/a/f31l2.html
And on why this is about as far from a free market meritocracy as you can get –
http://www.mutualist.org/id4.html
http://c4ss.org/content/8942
So it’s great, isn’t it! You dont’ have to defend or even TOLERATE any racism or sexism to love free markets and property rights! You’re super happy, right?
I doubt how many lawsuits have actually been brought, much less won, over winking.
But then again, there’s winking and there’s winking. Winking broadly and lasciviously every time you see a person can make them afraid to leave their desk for fear they’re going to have to run into you and get the ol’ “this wink means you’ll always be a sex object to me, darling” every time. And once someone’s demonstrated that they would rather get sexual titillation from you than respect your wishes, fuck, you don’t know what they’re capable of. If a guy winks at me every time I assume he’s biding his time for an ass-grab.
Male privilege means not having to think about things like always making sure that you go up the stairs last.
And living with that kind of concern for your dignity and safety while you’re also trying to do a job and advance your career goes way beyond “offended.”
@zhinxy
” I just don’t feel comfortable making it something you can sue the employer for when the employer themselves is not responsible for the harassment.”
Then say that, instead of coming in on the big high horse and acting like you alone love freedom, and are the brave libertarian.
“But then again, there’s winking and there’s winking. Winking broadly and lasciviously every time you see a person can make them afraid to leave their desk for fear they’re going to have to run into you and get the ol’ “this wink means you’ll always be a sex object to me, darling” every time. And once someone’s demonstrated that they would rather get sexual titillation from you than respect your wishes, fuck, you don’t know what they’re capable of. If a guy winks at me every time I assume he’s biding his time for an ass-grab.
Male privilege means not having to think about things like always making sure that you go up the stairs last.
And living with that kind of concern for your dignity and safety while you’re also trying to do a job and advance your career goes way beyond “offended.” ”
Precisely.
….
And you would argue that continued stalking and harassment of a person you did not work with without any physical contact would be actionable, correct? And perhaps even more so if the person’s livelihood is involved. Sleep with me or I tell your wife X would still be blackmail, correct? But sleep with me or lose your job is… A workplace culture?
This “right not to be offended thing” is a pretty silly hide and seek game.
Do you REALLY think the primary deformer of markets is the equal employment legislation? So wal mart getting all those subsidies, say, allowing it to force out unions is… nothing compared to some sexual harassment law?
Developers^3, how are you helped by increasing the likelihood that you will be sexually harassed, and by extension how is a society helped by increasing that likelihood that the constituent members of that society are sexually harassed?
Okay, level with me here. You don’t really know much about economics or free markets or types of libertarianism a political movements or position. You just kinda absorb a sort of idea that people should be free and the women are getting unfair stuff from the govment and the first amendment matters to you but not the ebil feminists and etc, and if all that would go away everything would be great, right? You can admit it. It’s okay.
i missed this the first time, but if this is what youre worried about, ive got good news for you. anti-harassment law doesnt do this. vicariously liability (that’s the technical term) is carefully structured to avoid doing exactly that. your concern has already been taken care of, fairly well imo, by using a complex but imperfect system based on the principles of agency (people delegating power to act on their behalf to their employees
Not that Developers cares about sexual harassment anyway, let alone on-the-job sexual harassment of people who don’t work in offices, but I thought this article was really interesting. Here’s the (much longer) report it references. Some highlights:
Any comments, Developers? Should they just change who they associate with? If they do, though, you gotta wonder how all that food is gonna get to the grocery stores, huh?
@zhinxy
he quoted heinlein. does that not answer your question?
Yeah, I just always want them to come out and ADMIT it. It would save them so much embarrassment, you know?
In the interest of being fair, we women also sometimes grab asses:
I would totally grab that ass all day.
In Soviet Adorablestan, ass harass YOU!
Apparently that woman is also an ass-kisser.
awwwww
If anyone has a baby donkey + puppy video, I’d be happy to try and work out a joke about asses and bitches, too. XD
I love the way NWO completely ignores all our comments about suffering physically in the work place. Might as well shut your eyes, stick your fingers in your ears and go “La la la la la!”
Joanna: We’re just WOMEN, after all. How are we supposed to know what goes on in our own bodies? Better to rely on MRAs to explain what we should do, how we should do it. and everything else.
Well, in Slavey’s case “there is no such thing as sexual harrassment” is more of a religious belief than anything else. As feminists tend to believe in tolerance, he’s simply upset with us for not allowing him to practise his faith.
(Womenareevilbitchesism)