Well, here’s a new twist. We all know, from reading the endless tirades on the subject scattered all over the manosphere, that women are evil, selfish and ungrateful creatures whose primary goal in life is to leech off of men and make them miserable.
In a recent post titled Playing Career Woman, manosphere blogger Dalrock takes on some of the most evil and selfish ladies of the whole lot of them: upper middle class ladies who insist on going to college and getting jobs, then later leave the workforce to raise their children.
You might think that these ladies would deserve some props from traditional-minded manosphere dudes for supporting themselves instead of leeching off of men during their twenties, then settling into a more traditional housewifely role once they have children.
Oh, but you don’t realize just how evil and disruptive and oppressive their phony careers are to the men of the world. After all, these aren’t women who need to work to support themselves. No, according to Dalrock, these are “women who use their education and career as a way to check off the box to prove their feminist credentials before settling down into an entirely traditional role.”
According to Escoffier, a commenter on Dalrock’s site whom he quotes with approval, in the good old pre-feminist days:
Women who pursued careers (apart from traditional female roles such as teaching … ) were considered at best sort of harmlessly odd … but we know that family life is superior and more important.
Then came feminism:
Now it’s “You MUST do this for own sake, not to do it is to not realize your potential.” …
The way the [upper middle class] has “solved” this problem is to send girls to college, let them launch their careers–whether in soggy girly stuff like PR or crunchy stuff like business and law–and then they marry late (~30), have kids a few years later and drop out of working at least until the kids are grown.
This answers a couple of needs, not least the need for two incomes to accumulate assets so that the couple can eventually buy into a UMC school district.
Oh, but these women aren’t really earning money because they need it to, you know, pay bills and shit:
[T]he real importance of this solution is to her psyche. Getting the education and career are a way of telegraphing “I am a complete person, not some drone like June Cleaver. I am just as smart and capable as any man. In my altruistic concern for my children, I choose not to use my talent in the marketplace but to devote myself to them.” In other words, she needs that education and early career to mark her as better than a mere housewife, even though she will eventually choose to become a housewife.
According to Dalrock, such women are far more evil than the feminist women who get jobs and stick with them. (Emphasis added.)
Men and women who work hard to support themselves understand that they are in it for the duration. There is a determined realism to them. … These aren’t the women we are talking about. The women Escoffier described see having a career as a badge of status to be collected on their way to their ultimate goal of stay at home housewife. They aren’t really career women, they are playing career woman much the way that Marie Antoinette played peasant and Zoolander’s character played coal miner.
In the comments, someone calling himself Carnivore explains just how unfair this all is to the poor innocent working men of the world:
When men get a degree or go through a vocational program and then land a job, they’ve normally got 40+ years to contribute to increasing the wealth of society. Women “playing” career damage society:
1. They displace men for positions in college or vocational school.
2. Upon landing a job, they displace other men for the job position.
3. The increase in the labor pool drives down wages (supply & demand).
4. While in the labor pool, women are less effective and less productive than men.
5. Because they are in the labor pool and cannot compete with men, women support labor laws to enforce “equality” which burden businesses and can cause men to get fired due to some infringement or just to meet quotas.
6. When they leave the labor pool after becoming bored, there is now a hole than can be difficult to fill because the men who would normally fill it have been displaced for all the reasons above.
Carnivore places part of the blame on the feminism-infected parents who taught these women the wrong things:
Women do NOT know what they want. They have to be guided. Most parents have so bought into feminism that they don’t see any other way. It’s a riot – or sad – talking to parents when they go into all the detail about choosing a college, going on campus visits, making sure she gets into the best school, etc., etc. You would think these parents would spend their time and energy on prepping their daughters for the most important life decision – choosing a man for marriage, how to make a husband happy and how to raise healthy children.
The commenter called Ray takes it one step further:
i was in the workplaces during feminism 1.0, and it had nothing to do with fairness, equity, egalitarianism, or any other positive attribute
in fact, it was a slaughter, resulting in the vast disenfranchisement and destruction of millions of american men — there were dozens of ways men could be hassled, RIFd, and forced from employment, and they were (all to chants of Equality and Empowerment)
this resulted in the massive unemployment of the very men needed to create, invent, and revitalize the culture. and to be fathers to sons . …
no female should be employed, or educated, if it means a qualified male must be excluded
Women, stop leeching off men by paying your own way!
NOTE: This post contains SARCASM.
If I may direct your attention back to the OP and away from The Brandon Show, it’s the first time I’ve seen careers divided into “crunchy” and “soggy.” Those are not the first two adjectives I would have applied to most occupations.
You know, at a certain point, Brandon, I think in most relationships (certainly most that have progressed to the stage of having kids), the money is less “my money” or “zir money” and more “our money.” It’s just too headachey to keep track of who pays for what.
Also, if you make $100,000 a year and your partner makes $10,000 a year, do you still split the expenses 50/50? o.O
Katz: Careers– more like cereal than one would initially assume!
@katz
I’ll be frank, amusements like The Brandon Show are the main reason I read comments.
As for “crunchy,” and “soggy,” I like them. Shows creativity.
[email protected]:
True, it makes me wonder if the words friendship, love and loyalty are part of his vocabulary at all. It all seems to be an entirely pecuniary transaction to him. Not that I’m convinced that Ashley actually exists, not least because I can’t see any reasonable woman agreeing to such an arrangement. It’s just too big a risk to her health and well-being, to say nothing of that of the child. Shit happens and if you can’t rely on your long term partner who can you rely on?
I hope (if she exists) that she leaves him for someone who’ll treat her like a human being, rather than a sex doll.
I am amuse that PR is soggy and business is crunchy, when they are both equally academic (i.e. not at all).
On a somewhat less sarcastic note — is it just me who sees the notion of a linear uninterrupted “career path” where one expects to progress systematically up some sort of ladder of closely-related positions at best a risky thing to count on, and possibly a state that is merely hypothetical?
I mean, I know a person who is working full-time as an engineer and is also a well-known professional athlete, a person who worked for ten years in firmware design and then decided to go manage a leathercraft store (and, later, start his own), and somewhere around three people who did Americorps after college, ended up at Habitat, and stayed on once their term was up to become staff construction supervisors (wholly unrelated to their original degrees). I don’t fully eliminate the possibility that I might be a mime in ten years.
So the plan is, you’re not allowed to reproduce unless you’re wealthy enough to hire a full-time nanny to raise your children for you? I have to admit, that would solve a lot of problems. Playgrounds would be less crowded. I wouldn’t have to wait for a table at the local ice-cream place. And forget about those theaters full of kids talking through my favorite Pixar movies.
Okay, 99 percenters! Stop having kids… NOW!
In all seriousness, I’ve spent the last several years getting my finances in order so I can support a child, but my uterus is going to dry up and fall out before I get to the point of affording a damn nanny. I do plan to continue working, but I’m in a special place in my career where that’s possible; most couples do need one parent to take some time off. I’d like it if that could be the father as often as the mother, but usually somebody has to do it.
CRUNCHY
Business
Law
Economics
Classics
STEM
Possibly languages?
SOGGY
Sociology
Psychology
Literature
History
Gender Studies
Music
Art
Environmental Studies
Not to mention that, even if you’re wealthy enough to afford day care, a nanny or an au pair, you might actually want to, you know, raise your own fucking kid. What’s the point of having a kid if you’re just going to hire someone else to raise it? You might as well become an aunt.
I think institutionalized poly would solve a lot of these quandries. If you have a triad, you can have two incomes AND a stay-at-home parent. Somehow I do not think Brandom will support all couples becoming triads. (Neither would I. Some people are built for monogamy, and more power to them.)
Exactly how is condeming a woman for having lots of sex but not condemning a man for the same thing rooted in biology? you are full of shit.
Consider this:
STDs don’t discriminate between sex
It takes a man and a woman to make a baby
Biology can be reformed to an extent, ie through the pill, condoms and other forms of birth control.
If you’re going to use the paternity fraud excuse, then that’s more reason for men to not sleep around, rather than just telling women they can’t. The less women you sleep with, the less likely you’ll be accused of being some baby’s father.
Like all bigots, you use science to excuse your discrimination. And like all misogynists you just like to shame women’s sexual choices to keep them in line with your standards.
I’m not opposed to that (although again I stress it’s not for everyone), but:
a) I question whether you’re really up for 50% of the midnight diaper changes, the 2 AM feedings, the supermarket temper tantrums and the frantic pediatrician visits. In my experience that kind of thing defaults to the mother even when she’s working just as hard, and it’s not even-stevens when that happens.
I mean . . . where does the child LIVE? Suppose things are as easy as possible; the child still has to sleep somewhere. Unless you’re doing rotating beds–disruptive and difficult for the child, the child’s primary residence either has to be with Brandon or Ash; whoever the kid LIVES WITH will necessarily bear a disproportionate burden.
CRUNCHY
Business
Law
Economics
STEM
Psychology
Sociology
SOGGY
Literature
History
Gender Studies
Music
Art
Environmental Studies
Classics
Anthropology
Assorted “studies”
There, I fixed it!
@Quackers
That wasn’t me.
@theindigolemon
Yep I know. It was Brandon’s response to you.
Brandon hates kids. He apparently never was one.
Brandon thinks there should be jobs that you can do full time and still starve, never mind feed your kids.
Brandon will never get sick or old or injured and have to rely on other people.
Brandon can go and step on a lego.
@Quackers
Oh, sorry.
Soggy careers – those that involve being outside when it’s raining. Gardeners, for example, or people who work on farms. Postal/UPS/FedEx workers who actually make deliveries.
Crunchy careers – Dentist? Or, to be less literal, anything hippie-ish, like working for the Sierra Club.
@theindigolemon
No prob 🙂
Deep sea diving? Surveying wetlands? Pool cleaning? Seal training? QC in a squirt gun factory?
The only crunchy career I can think of is operating a car crusher.
Crunchy – Working for a candy company that uses a lot of nuts in its products.
Soggy – swim coach.
Hey, classics is totally a crunchy career. It’s male-dominated, isn’t it?
Need more descriptions for careers – chewy, perhaps, or sticky 🙂
Ozy, poly families actually sound really practical and awesome to me. I would totally be part of a triad. If it were the right two people.