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antifeminism misandry misogyny MRA paul elam threats violence against men/women

Men’s Rights site A Voice for Men offers $1000 “bounty” for personal information on Swedish feminists

A Voice for Men, one of the most influential and popular Men’s Rights websites, is now offering a $1000 “bounty” for anyone able to track down the personal information of several Swedish women involved in a tasteless video advertising a theater production based on Valarie Solanas’ SCUM manifesto. As the anonymous poster calling himself John the Other – the second-in-command at AVfM – put it in a posting yesterday (emphasis in original):

We are asking for the full legal names, home addresses, places of employment, email addresses and contact phone numbers of the women and man who produced and starred in the video described above. We will pay 1000 dollars to any individual who provides and confirms this information, to be paid either directly to themselves or to a charity of their choice.

John explains that this information will be posted on the AVfM-affiliated site Register-Her.com, an “offenders database” that is being used to vilify individual feminists and “Fuck Their Shit Up,” as AVfM head honcho Paul Elam likes to put it. John notes that Regsiter-Her.com also intends to post the “government identification numbers [and] drivers licences” of the women they are able to identify.

John admits plainly that posting such information may put the physical safety of these women at risk from vigilante violence. As he puts it (emphasis mine):

Some individuals may criticize the intent to publish not only names, but also addresses, phone numbers, employers and other personal information – on the grounds that such exposure create a risk of retributive violence against individuals who openly advocate murder based on sex. It is the considered position of the editorial board of AVfM that any such risks are out-weighed by the ongoing hazard to the public of these individuals continuing to operate in anonymity.

The comments posted on the article at AVfM suggest that such “retributive” violence is a real possibility. Indeed, here’s the very first comment (which currently has 17 upvotes from readers of the site):

A commenter called  Xnomolos, in another upvoted comment, adds:

i would love to hunt down these women myself.

JinnBottle responds to this comment by advising “all men to start carrying guns.”

The commenters on AVfM have already uncovered the identities of all of the women involved in the video. The blogger Fidelbogen has been the most active internet detective so far.

There is no question that the video itself is offensive, and designed to provoke. You can see it here; I’m not going to embed it on this site. If you don’t want to watch it: it depicts a young woman shooting a man in the head for no reason. Afterwards the woman and her gleeful, giggling accomplices do a victory dance, then lick the blood from the dead man’s head. A message at the end urges viewers to “Do Your Part.”

Every feminist I know who has seen the video has been appalled by it. I’m appalled by it. It’s hateful, and it’s wrong.

But John the Other, and the other commenters on AVfM, claim that it is more than this: that that the video of the staged murder, intended to provide publicity for a theater production based on Solanas’ notorious SCUM manifesto, is quite literally an open call for the murder of men. As John the Other puts it:

Open advocation of murder cannot be allowed in a civil society, without that society devolving into a culture of brutal violence.

Evidently he has no problem with, or has somehow not noticed, the comments on AVfM fantasizing about shooting and killing the women involved in the video.

Is the video a literal call to murder? Is it, as one AVfM commenter puts it, evidence of a “conspiracy to commit mass murder?” No. Violence and murder have been dramatized in the theater since its beginnings. No one accuses Sophocles of advocating fratricide and incest, though both are dealt with in his play Oedipus Rex. No one accuses Shakespeare of advocating mass murder, though many of his most famous plays have body counts that put many horror films to shame.

Does the tag line at the end of the video – “do your part” – transform the video from a depiction of murder  into an open call for it? No. The “threat,” such as it is, is vague; it’s not aimed at any specific individuals. It might be seen as akin to someone wearing a t-shirt that says “kill ‘em all, let God sort them out” – tasteless and offensive, but not a literal threat.  “Kill ‘Em All” is actually the name of Metallica’s first album. While a lot of people see James Hetfield,  Lars Ulrich et al as pompous idiots, they have not been jailed for conspiracy to commit mass murder. That would be ridiculous.

Someone claiming to have been involved in the SCUM-inspired theatrical production in question has posted several detailed comments on AVfM, explaining that those involved in the production are “not out to get you” and that the video itself was “meant as a viral “wtf?!” to give attention to both the questions that it raises and the play itself.”

By contrast, AVfM is targeting specific individuals, and intends to offer information that would allow anyone intent on doing them harm to quite literally track them to their homes and workplaces. Those fantasizing about killing these woman are not simply making a joke along the lines of “women, can’t live with ‘em; can’t kill ‘em.” They are fantasizing about killing real people, and providing would-be evil-doers maps to their doors.

AVfM is an American site, in English; these specific women live in Sweden. While it is a real possibility, it seems unlikely that anyone reading the site will literally find and murder any of those involved in the SCUM production. At least I hope that this does not come to pass.

I don’t believe that either Paul Elam or John the Other literally wants any feminist to be killed. The real intent behind AVfM’s publishing people’s personal information, it seems clear, is to intimidate feminist writers and activists into shutting up, to make clear that if they post something that offends the internet vigilantes at AVfM they will face the possibility of some deranged individual quite literally showing up at their door intent on doing them harm.

Paul Elam and John the Other claim that they’re not advocating violence. But they are playing a dangerous game here. If some deranged individual, inspired by the hyperbolic anti-feminist rhetoric on AVfM, and armed with information provided by “Register-Her.com,” murders or otherwise harms a feminist blogger or activist or video maker, Elam and his enablers will have blood on their hands. As will those MRAs who continue to publicly support and/or link to AVfM and/or Register-Her.com.

This is not the way a legitimate rights group deals with those who disagree with them. This is what hate groups do.

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CassandraSays
CassandraSays
13 years ago

Which state is going to go MRA, in this scenario?

(We were talking about a gender war before Brandon began shuffling the goalposts around, remember?)

Lauralot
Lauralot
13 years ago

Clearly not. If you did some research, you probably would have figured out that we have laws against seceding. But maybe my expectations are too high.

Bee
Bee
13 years ago

Aw, I’m not special enough for him to fuck up my name.

You’re special! Here, I’ll try my hand at being clever like Brandon: Yeah, you’re not, Laurloads!

Or would it be Lauraparcel?

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
13 years ago

If he was actually witty he’d have called her Lauraless.

kirbywarp
kirbywarp
13 years ago

Ooh ooh ooh, Brandon, do me next, do me next! Trolls never make fun of me anymore… Ever since AWS went away. I miss that guy. 🙁

Holly Pervocracy
13 years ago

MRAs will never go to war, for the same reason they won’t use their real names while outing people and they won’t spend any money or (non-Internet-ranting) effort on their causes.

They’re completely incapable of putting their own asses on the line.

99% of MRAs aren’t going to be part of any war where there’s a chance someone might actually shoot back.

Brandon
Brandon
13 years ago

@Laura: Ya and every government has laws against treason. That didn’t stop the revolutionary war.

kirbywarp
kirbywarp
13 years ago

@Cassandra:

If he was actually witty, he probably wouldn’t be a troll.

Lauralot
Lauralot
13 years ago

I know telling Brandon to learn to spell “yeah” correctly at this point is beating a dead horse, but seriously, learn to fucking spell.

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
13 years ago

If he was at all witty he wouldn’t be the Brandon that we know today at all.

Rutee Katreya
13 years ago

@Sharculese: You raise a good point

I am not writing a research paper.

Oh my god did anyone else picture our resident egotist actually trying this? It would be motherfucking hilarious

Lauralot
Lauralot
13 years ago

If Brandon tried to write a research paper, he’d never progress past the research stage because as soon as a source disagreed with his life experiences, he’d have to track down the author and explain in detail just how wrong s/he is.

Brandon
Brandon
13 years ago

@LauraBush: Ya?

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/ya#English

Interjection

ya

(informal) Yeah, yes.
(informal) Go. (Spoken to horses and cattle.)

Seems englishy to me. I also love that it is used to wrangle in horses and cattle…Femicow? Femises? HAHAHAHA!!!

Lauralot
Lauralot
13 years ago

We’ve been through this, Brandon. It’s still incorrect.

And that was actually worse than your last attempt to mangle my name. Does it ever make you sad that you’re as dull drywall?

Lauralot
Lauralot
13 years ago

Dull as drywall. See, the difference between you and me is that when I’m wrong, I correct it.

Well, that and everything else.

VoiP
VoiP
13 years ago

@Cassandra:

If he was actually witty, he probably wouldn’t be a troll.

Not quite true; you can be a charming, well-read, witty complete asshole. This, however, is not Brandon’t problem.

Brandon
Brandon
13 years ago

@Laura: The feeling is mutual.

VoiP
VoiP
13 years ago

If Brandon tried to write a research paper, he’d never progress past the research stage because as soon as a source disagreed with his life experiences, he’d have to track down the author and explain in detail just how wrong s/he is.

Thanking God he’s not in my class.

Lauralot
Lauralot
13 years ago

Did you seriously just “I know you are but what am I”? Seriously?

If you weren’t so convinced that you’re the center of the universe I might pity you.

Brandon
Brandon
13 years ago

@Laura: Actually, I could figure out what you were saying without the correction. I just didn’t feel the need to be overly petty and pointing out spelling mistakes. Mainly since everyone makes them and I am posting comments, not writing an english paper.

Lauralot
Lauralot
13 years ago

So by your logic, striving for clarity doesn’t matter because you’re not being graded?

That sums up your communication skills in a sad little nutshell.

Brandon
Brandon
13 years ago

@Laura: No, I don’t feel the need going around acting as everyone’s English teacher. Also, the misspelling was minor. So your correction actually didn’t bring anymore clarity to what you were saying.

Renjo
Renjo
13 years ago

@HollyPervocracy:

Um…isn’t that a bit hypocritical when you and millions of other people (including myself) on the internet do the exact same thing online? Some within the MRA have actually used their real names and pictures, but since they don’t have room for a more open base to actually go to “war”, it’s rather unreasonable to mock solely them when everyone else does it. There’s a security hazard behind that for a reason.

Honestly Feminism and MRA’s are just as extreme as one another for their own sexes. I find it odd that both sides are at each other’s throats instead of actually working together to solve human problems, and both sides are guilty of this.

But I guess that’s humanity for ya.

kirbywarp
kirbywarp
13 years ago

@Brandon:

Clarity is how easy it is to grasp the meaning. If you have to fix the spelling mistake in your head, then parse it, it is by definition less clear than if it were spelled correctly. What she didn’t add was more information. 😛

Lauralot
Lauralot
13 years ago

“No, I don’t feel the need going around acting as everyone’s English teacher.”

Thank god, this country doesn’t need any more illiteracy.

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