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antifeminism misandry misogyny MRA paul elam threats violence against men/women

Men’s Rights site A Voice for Men offers $1000 “bounty” for personal information on Swedish feminists

A Voice for Men, one of the most influential and popular Men’s Rights websites, is now offering a $1000 “bounty” for anyone able to track down the personal information of several Swedish women involved in a tasteless video advertising a theater production based on Valarie Solanas’ SCUM manifesto. As the anonymous poster calling himself John the Other – the second-in-command at AVfM – put it in a posting yesterday (emphasis in original):

We are asking for the full legal names, home addresses, places of employment, email addresses and contact phone numbers of the women and man who produced and starred in the video described above. We will pay 1000 dollars to any individual who provides and confirms this information, to be paid either directly to themselves or to a charity of their choice.

John explains that this information will be posted on the AVfM-affiliated site Register-Her.com, an “offenders database” that is being used to vilify individual feminists and “Fuck Their Shit Up,” as AVfM head honcho Paul Elam likes to put it. John notes that Regsiter-Her.com also intends to post the “government identification numbers [and] drivers licences” of the women they are able to identify.

John admits plainly that posting such information may put the physical safety of these women at risk from vigilante violence. As he puts it (emphasis mine):

Some individuals may criticize the intent to publish not only names, but also addresses, phone numbers, employers and other personal information – on the grounds that such exposure create a risk of retributive violence against individuals who openly advocate murder based on sex. It is the considered position of the editorial board of AVfM that any such risks are out-weighed by the ongoing hazard to the public of these individuals continuing to operate in anonymity.

The comments posted on the article at AVfM suggest that such “retributive” violence is a real possibility. Indeed, here’s the very first comment (which currently has 17 upvotes from readers of the site):

A commenter called  Xnomolos, in another upvoted comment, adds:

i would love to hunt down these women myself.

JinnBottle responds to this comment by advising “all men to start carrying guns.”

The commenters on AVfM have already uncovered the identities of all of the women involved in the video. The blogger Fidelbogen has been the most active internet detective so far.

There is no question that the video itself is offensive, and designed to provoke. You can see it here; I’m not going to embed it on this site. If you don’t want to watch it: it depicts a young woman shooting a man in the head for no reason. Afterwards the woman and her gleeful, giggling accomplices do a victory dance, then lick the blood from the dead man’s head. A message at the end urges viewers to “Do Your Part.”

Every feminist I know who has seen the video has been appalled by it. I’m appalled by it. It’s hateful, and it’s wrong.

But John the Other, and the other commenters on AVfM, claim that it is more than this: that that the video of the staged murder, intended to provide publicity for a theater production based on Solanas’ notorious SCUM manifesto, is quite literally an open call for the murder of men. As John the Other puts it:

Open advocation of murder cannot be allowed in a civil society, without that society devolving into a culture of brutal violence.

Evidently he has no problem with, or has somehow not noticed, the comments on AVfM fantasizing about shooting and killing the women involved in the video.

Is the video a literal call to murder? Is it, as one AVfM commenter puts it, evidence of a “conspiracy to commit mass murder?” No. Violence and murder have been dramatized in the theater since its beginnings. No one accuses Sophocles of advocating fratricide and incest, though both are dealt with in his play Oedipus Rex. No one accuses Shakespeare of advocating mass murder, though many of his most famous plays have body counts that put many horror films to shame.

Does the tag line at the end of the video – “do your part” – transform the video from a depiction of murder  into an open call for it? No. The “threat,” such as it is, is vague; it’s not aimed at any specific individuals. It might be seen as akin to someone wearing a t-shirt that says “kill ‘em all, let God sort them out” – tasteless and offensive, but not a literal threat.  “Kill ‘Em All” is actually the name of Metallica’s first album. While a lot of people see James Hetfield,  Lars Ulrich et al as pompous idiots, they have not been jailed for conspiracy to commit mass murder. That would be ridiculous.

Someone claiming to have been involved in the SCUM-inspired theatrical production in question has posted several detailed comments on AVfM, explaining that those involved in the production are “not out to get you” and that the video itself was “meant as a viral “wtf?!” to give attention to both the questions that it raises and the play itself.”

By contrast, AVfM is targeting specific individuals, and intends to offer information that would allow anyone intent on doing them harm to quite literally track them to their homes and workplaces. Those fantasizing about killing these woman are not simply making a joke along the lines of “women, can’t live with ‘em; can’t kill ‘em.” They are fantasizing about killing real people, and providing would-be evil-doers maps to their doors.

AVfM is an American site, in English; these specific women live in Sweden. While it is a real possibility, it seems unlikely that anyone reading the site will literally find and murder any of those involved in the SCUM production. At least I hope that this does not come to pass.

I don’t believe that either Paul Elam or John the Other literally wants any feminist to be killed. The real intent behind AVfM’s publishing people’s personal information, it seems clear, is to intimidate feminist writers and activists into shutting up, to make clear that if they post something that offends the internet vigilantes at AVfM they will face the possibility of some deranged individual quite literally showing up at their door intent on doing them harm.

Paul Elam and John the Other claim that they’re not advocating violence. But they are playing a dangerous game here. If some deranged individual, inspired by the hyperbolic anti-feminist rhetoric on AVfM, and armed with information provided by “Register-Her.com,” murders or otherwise harms a feminist blogger or activist or video maker, Elam and his enablers will have blood on their hands. As will those MRAs who continue to publicly support and/or link to AVfM and/or Register-Her.com.

This is not the way a legitimate rights group deals with those who disagree with them. This is what hate groups do.

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Sharculese
Sharculese
13 years ago

@rutee

anti-vaxxers?

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
13 years ago

Today I hang my atheist head in shame as I admit that sometimes our people can be every bit as ignorant and stupid as the worst fundamentalist of any religion.

On behalf of atheists as a whole – we do apologise for Brandon. Really, we’re very sorry.

PosterformerlyknownasElizabeth

@Elizabeth: No…have you ever considered…I don’t know….you are wrong. GASP!!!

Actually I could be wrong-your father could be an ethical attorney who is also apparently unprofessional enough to bring his child to court.

Or as I said, highly probable that you are a liar. Again, I work in a court-have for five years. I know that self represented litigants are given something of a pass for bringing their kids to court, but the attorneys? Never.

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
13 years ago

“Cassandra, I’m laying siege to you RIGHT NOW. That OK?”

Only if you arrange to have pizza and/or hot and sour soup delivered at least twice a day.

Brandon
Brandon
13 years ago

@Sharculese: Nevermind…keep talking. I find you mildly amusing.

@hellkell: Ok…a “mentally deficient notion of god”.

hellkell
hellkell
13 years ago

No need to, Cassandra, he said he’s agnostic. Which is great having someone who thinks they know everything subscribe to the theory or not knowing.

Sharculese
Sharculese
13 years ago

He’s technically a millenial, right? He certainly sounds like the negative stereotype of one.

thats the thing about brandon is hes chuggin along doing his too cool for school thing and youre like ‘oh teenagers’ and then all of a sudden you remember hes almost thirty

hellkell
hellkell
13 years ago

Cassandra, pizza and soup it is. I’ll get the marauders right on that.

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
13 years ago

If I’d sounded like Brandon in my late twenties I really would have been hanging my head in shame.

hellkell
hellkell
13 years ago

Yeah, 30 is way past the sell-by to be this obnoxiously self-centered.

Brandon
Brandon
13 years ago

@Elizabeth: Ya, and any parent that had to bring their child to work because they had no other option is unprofessional. Okay there slick!

Sharculese
Sharculese
13 years ago

Nevermind…keep talking. I find you mildly amusing.

that’s a great point, but on the other hand I am agnostic so I don’t give one rats ass about Jesus or the retarded notion of god.

Brandon
Brandon
13 years ago

@Cassandra: I am 30, have a loving girlfriend, no debt, volunteer at a food pantry and have a decent job that supports me just fine.

*raises head in pride*

hellkell
hellkell
13 years ago

Say it loud, he’s dumb and he’s proud!

Jesus, another episode of The Deep Thoughts of Brandon.

Brandon
Brandon
13 years ago

@hellkell: So feminists think I am dumb…I can live with that.

PosterformerlyknownasElizabeth

@Elizabeth: Ya, and any parent that had to bring their child to work because they had no other option is unprofessional. Okay there slick!

Yes Brandon, it is unprofessional to bring your child to court if you are an attorney. A SRL can get away with it because judges tend to be more forgiving of breaches of courtroom etiquette for them but not for attorneys who know better even if the attorney has a very good reason (like their nanny quit because she or he had to deal with you for longer then five minutes.)

hellkell
hellkell
13 years ago

Brandon, somehow I doubt it’s just the feminists. And you say feminist like it’s such a dirty, dirty word.

Sharculese
Sharculese
13 years ago

a white dude with a father in a position of power lives a cushy life where he never has to confront his total lack of self-awareness?

theres a word for that, but if i use it brandon will start screaming about feminist indoctrination and why cant we be more accommodating to the selfish man-children of the world

Brandon
Brandon
13 years ago

@Elizabeth: A nanny? HAHAHAHA, Yes…I also had a personal chef and a chauffeur. HAHAHAHA

oh god, the laughter is just too much.

hellkell
hellkell
13 years ago

Sharculese: does that word start with a “P?”

Sharculese
Sharculese
13 years ago

@hellkell

it might. i cant be more specific because it might make brandon uncomfortable.

Sharculese
Sharculese
13 years ago

side note: seriously, i am stunned that anybody not name kardashian is still bragging about their daddy being a lawyer at age thirty

Brandon
Brandon
13 years ago

@hellkell: 1) feminist is a dirty word. 2) Ya, only knee jerk feminists call me dumb.

@sharculese: 1) I went to public school 2) I lived a middle class life 3) I never had a nanny or any thing cushy 4) I have been homeless

oh ya…5) My father has a middle class income because he choose to represent low income people (he is mainly a court appointed lawyer) instead of working for a big firm representing corporations and the rich and wealthy.

My life, while not miserable has been anything but cushy.

Bee
Bee
13 years ago

Not like this is the most important thing in the world, but this annoys me. Where Brandon started:

@hellkell: My father is an attorney, so when I was younger…I was around judges all the time. 😉

Where Brandon is now, after PFKAE pressed him on it:

@Elizabeth: Ya, and any parent that had to bring their child to work because they had no other option is unprofessional. Okay there slick!

So, it appears that “all the time” = an unscheduled, unavoidable emergency. Or Brandon’s not good at lying. Carry on, then.

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
13 years ago

“@Cassandra: I am 30, have a loving girlfriend, no debt, volunteer at a food pantry and have a decent job that supports me just fine.

*raises head in pride*”

Everyone else snickers.

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