So yesterday I quoted some random Spearheader who described women (well, white women in particular) as “complete parasitical whores roaming the landscape spreading VD like Johnny Appleseed and fucking men over.”
One reader wondered if Mr. Appleseed really went about spreading VD. So I did a little research, and it turns out that it is exceedingly unlikely that Mr. Appleseed – who actually was a real person — spread anything other than the magic of apples. And his Swedenborgian beliefs.
Why? Because Mr. Appleseed – real name John Chapman – was what these days we might call a Man Going His Own Way. Seems he didn’t have much truck with the ladies, according to one contemporary account quoted in his Wikipedia entry:
On one occasion Miss PRICE’s mother asked Johnny if he would not be a happier man, if he were settled in a home of his own, and had a family to love him. He opened his eyes very wide–they were remarkably keen, penetrating grey eyes, almost black–and replied that all women were not what they professed to be; that some of them were deceivers; and a man might not marry the amiable woman that he thought he was getting, after all.
So what led poor Mr. Appleseed to these dire thoughts about women? Apparently the underage girl he hoped to some day get with was more into dudes who weren’t him:
Now we had always heard that Johnny had loved once upon a time, and that his lady love had proven false to him. Then he said one time he saw a poor, friendless little girl, who had no one to care for her, and sent her to school, and meant to bring her up to suit himself, and when she was old enough he intended to marry her. He clothed her and watched over her; but when she was fifteen years old, he called to see her once unexpectedly, and found her sitting beside a young man, with her hand in his, listening to his silly twaddle.
That ungrateful little strumpet!
I peeped over at Johnny while he was telling this, and, young as I was, I saw his eyes grow dark as violets, and the pupils enlarge, and his voice rise up in denunciation, while his nostrils dilated and his thin lips worked with emotion. How angry he grew! He thought the girl was basely ungrateful. After that time she was no protegé of his.
But Appleseed, despite giving up on women in the real world, held out hope for the afterlife – explaining to others that he expected to have two spirit wives all his own after he died. Which I guess is the 19th century equivalent of the MGTOWers today who fantasize about the sexy robot ladies who will eventually, it is hoped, make actual human females – with their troubling “thoughts” and “needs” and “desires” of their own – obsolete.
Mr. Appleseed’s quest to remain alone was probably also helped by the fact that – if the illustration I found on Wikipedia is any indication – he looked a bit like Dale Gribble from King of the Hill. Only much, much sloppier, with long hair. Oh, and instead of wearing a baseball cap, he wore “a tin utensil which answered both as a cap and a mush pot.”
So, yeah, a creepy weirdo who hates women — definitely an MGTOWer all the way.
Oh, except that he actually did something with his life — you know, helping spread apple trees to a big portion of the midwest — instead of spending all his time going on about how all women are whores.
One problem that I am discovering when trying to develop and apply a theory of rights which can safely include women, in a laisssez faire economy and social order, which I (and other libertarians) have given too little thought before, is that women–as a group–seem to lack the rationality, good judgement, and maturity (at least until menopause?) and one is trying to describe–or even advocate–a society for them giving them an equal freedom and personal sovereignty that they are certainly not ready for! Even libertarians acknowledge that children, pets, etc. need some degree of guardianship, and that application of rights appropriate to a fully developed rational entity is NOT appropriate to one whom is not, even though cruelty or neglect may be clearly prohibited.
What if Women are Really Animals: A Scholarly Treatise by Some Weirdo
Ozy: “Seriously. I know some Marxists who are cool people.”
Yeah, and, so? I know some socially conservative and Tea Party supporting folks who are “cool peeps” too. Yet you said you “hate” them.
“Stop insulting them by comparing them to MRAs.”
I’ll compare them to whoever I damn well please. And you can go on “hating” whoever you damn well please too. Its a free cuntry.
“Sexual Marxist”?? Who or what the heck is THAT?? I am NO Marxist, except, with due respect to John Lennon, of the Groucho variety!”
Meller, do you or do you not want to see the redistribution of sexual resources?
DKM: “goofy girlfriends”: Do women have any other kind? I need to know in so that the section on “Women” in your book is accurate.
@No Cuntry 4 Old Men!: You’re calling her out for hating on people when you support the death penalty for rape? Oh-kaaaay… : /
“@No Cuntry 4 Old Men!: You’re calling her out for hating on people when you support the death penalty for rape? Oh-kaaaay… : /”
Not “calling her out”. I originally asked her why she “hated” socons and Tea Baggers. That’s all. I’m curious as to the reasons.
My reasons for death penalty for rape are several. Mind you, not he said/she said, DNA and solid evidence. Without that they can be charged with a lesser “sexual assault” or something and do jail time.
But especially for the rape of children and infants, I am FOR it, without a doubt. Yes, there are demented people out there beyond repair raping infants. Even their own.
DKM unsurprisingly ignores the foolishness young men get up to-and mostly not to impress young women.
Oh no, it is just women who act immaturely and foolishly.
“Oh no, it is just women who act immaturely and foolishly.”
A man (boy) who goes on a date with an internet pickup, attends a tavern, in a shady part of town, has too much to drink, gets himself drunk to the point of disorientation, his “escort” disappears, he staggers out with the first “man” he sees who will “take him home”, he takes him–to HIS home–and,,,it’s showtime!!”
Wait, that didn’t quite work the way I wanted it to…
NC4OM
A bit of wise advice that I have received is NEVER sign a contract, or agree to something that you don’t understand. I don’t understand what “redistribution of sexual resources’ is (are?). Therefore, I am refusing to agree. The answer is no, I don’t want to see the redistribution of sexual resources! IF you come up with further information, I may change my mind, but even your sister manboobzers seem to have a problem with this!
I agreed with youall about something! Hell must be freezing over about this time!
DKM, Mantitzerz are sick of reading “sexual marxism” over and over because I’ve written probably a dozen times today. Nonetheless they understand the concept.
The Manosphere is angry because since Feminism and the Sexual Revolution women are now free to have sex with whomever they choose (provided its mutual consent, of course) and women are NOT choosing to have sex with the men of the online Manosphere, who refer to themselves as “INCELs” or involuntary celibates.
These angry incels feel that there used to be a “societal contract” in which women at or maybe slightly above their own level in looks and social status used to have sex with them, back in the good old days. Now, since the Sexual Revolution, womens’ “hypergamy” has been given free reign and women are now only choosing to have sex with the most attractive men (alphas) leaving the beta and omega high and dry.
These men deem themselves the “pillars of civilization” and hence feel “society owes us, damnit!”. Therefore they wish to formally institute Sexual Marxism:
FROM each according to her ability, TO each according to his need.
Molly Ren–
How come if men and women are supposed to be “equal” in terms of rationality, good judgement, and self-responsibility, how come we here of MY version of this scenario dozens,i if not hundreds, of times more often than we here of your parody there?
Women–without adult supervision–seem to get themselves in these extremely unpleasant,if not dangerous and tragic, situations almost all of the time. Men,on the other hand, except when they are teenagers (EXTREMELY young and stupid), not so often!
Even if such tales discussing “fair damsels in distress” are reported more often by sensationalistic noisemedia for advertising and circulation purposes, there would be an equal number of male dating disasters similarly reported somewhere and sometime, wouldn’t there? That there aren’t answers your point well, doesn’t it?
DKM, we cross posted, see above where I answer you.
I stopped closing my posts with “PEACE AND FREEDOM” when people asked me to.
And this is the point he chooses to actually address.
“How come if men and women are supposed to be “equal” in terms of rationality, good judgement, and self-responsibility, how come we here of MY version of this scenario dozens,i if not hundreds, of times more often than we here of your parody there?”
You think guys don’t get drunk and have gay sex after meeting men on the Internet? You must be new.
(Yes, I am ignoring DKM’s points about male rape. This is because I don’t have the heart to debate the actual problem of male rape with someone who thinks that women are naturally irrational until menopause.)
How come if men and women are supposed to be “equal” in terms of rationality, good judgement, and self-responsibility, how come we here of MY version of this scenario dozens,i if not hundreds, of times more often than we here of your parody there?
because absent any actual argument, you just repeat the same battery of anecdotes and hypotheticals ad naseum.
duh.
There are probably men who want to sexually access the kind of modern women and feminists who prevail on manboobz and similar blogs and websites, but NC4OM, these are certainly a rarity on the Men’sRights advocacy sites that I am familiar with.
Far from seeking more sex from modern women, I get the impression that we men are DISGUSTED with the lot of them. From various reddit blogs cited here, to Spearhead, to the extremely angry ( even disgusting) ‘NOMARRIAGE.com, also recently cited here, most men, especially those who have been done bad by contemporary women, whether or not they are actual feminists, absolutely LOATHE modern women, and would probably be nauseated at the thought of personal intimacy. Maybe there are men out there, who crave feminists and over-educated, opinionated, pushy, narcissitic, bitter,and humorless modern women–there being no accounting for taste–, but they are extremely eccentric, NC4OM, probably comparable to a man who would be aroused by a dead fish. Such oddities are few and far between! Some of my posts express sympathetic understanding of their troubles in that respect, but I certiainly don’t want intimacy with a feminist, and I don’t think that other Men’sRightsers do either! If that is what you mean by “sexual resources”, than NO!! I don’t want any of those sexual resources! I don’t know–or care–why they would, but believe me, most men, if they have the means at all, treat themselves to overseas “mailorder brides”, where they sometimes are still skinned alive (feminism is a worldwide disease) but the drive is still there.
Men being jealous of each other over modern women? To each according to his needs? Somebody is pulling my leg!
“Men being jealous of each other over modern women? To each according to his needs? Somebody is pulling my leg!”
DKM, can you please tell MRAL how he doesn’t actually want a modern woman anyway? I’d make popcorn for that.
but dkm, youre opinionated, pushy, narcissistic, bitter and humorless.
like, youre a dude who spends his free time screaming about women and minorities on the internet. you constantly have to assert yourself, always at great length, and in the angriest terms possible. if you think those qualities are unattractive in a woman, why on earth do you expect anyone to find them attractive in you.
I don’t want to “sexually access” women. I want to have sex with them, not at them.
Also, I love the whole calling men who want to have sex with modern women “eccentric” thing. Fucking hilarious. Go ahead and keep telling yourself you’re the voice of silent majority, Meller. I’m sure it helps you sleep at night.
I am a Marxist, right here (*waves arms*). And Marxism despises class seperations among people, it is a core tenant of Marxism. I mean, it’s not like one of the authors of the Communist Manifesto had an entire influential essay on how gender roles was a capitalist social class oppression…oh, wait, Engels totally did that. That incredibly long anthropology and biology filled piece on the family as a socio-political institution that Frederick fucking Engels himself wrote goes out the window whenever “liberal” feminists want to go all redscare (Origins of the Family, while culturally imperialist in many places, is fascinating both on a theoretical level and as a summary of then current understandings of anthropology and human socio-biology)
Meller’s view of women’s “natural place” looks absolutely nothing like Marx and Engels, and is in direct contradiction to basic tennants of Marxist theory.
It is worth noting that Engels outright names the “traditional” patriarchical family as a form of slavery and servitude of women:
Engels also quotes Marx’s notes around this issue, again, traditional patriarchical gender roles are outright names as slavery:
Marxism named Meller-esque bullshit slavery well over a century ago, please catch up a bit before you start to slander us.
Engels, fyi, also calls out slut shaming:
Really, do your Marxism 101 readings first.
“Far from seeking more sex from modern women, I get the impression that we men are DISGUSTED with the lot of them. From various reddit blogs cited here, to Spearhead, to the extremely angry ( even disgusting) ‘NOMARRIAGE.com”
DKM, and yet, its either nomarriage.com or boycottamericanwomen.com that is advertising for “find Indian wife” website. I’m South Asian and I can tell you without a doubt that site is FAKE! You have to pay via credit card/pay pal JUST TO WRITE the first email to the girl. And I guarantee you those pics on their are FAKE and who’ll you’ll be writing to is an INDIAN DUDE.
No Indian girl of good repute and upbringing would be a mail order bride. They have their marriages arranged to Indian men of equal SES, caste, religion, culture, etc.