So yesterday I quoted some random Spearheader who described women (well, white women in particular) as “complete parasitical whores roaming the landscape spreading VD like Johnny Appleseed and fucking men over.”
One reader wondered if Mr. Appleseed really went about spreading VD. So I did a little research, and it turns out that it is exceedingly unlikely that Mr. Appleseed – who actually was a real person — spread anything other than the magic of apples. And his Swedenborgian beliefs.
Why? Because Mr. Appleseed – real name John Chapman – was what these days we might call a Man Going His Own Way. Seems he didn’t have much truck with the ladies, according to one contemporary account quoted in his Wikipedia entry:
On one occasion Miss PRICE’s mother asked Johnny if he would not be a happier man, if he were settled in a home of his own, and had a family to love him. He opened his eyes very wide–they were remarkably keen, penetrating grey eyes, almost black–and replied that all women were not what they professed to be; that some of them were deceivers; and a man might not marry the amiable woman that he thought he was getting, after all.
So what led poor Mr. Appleseed to these dire thoughts about women? Apparently the underage girl he hoped to some day get with was more into dudes who weren’t him:
Now we had always heard that Johnny had loved once upon a time, and that his lady love had proven false to him. Then he said one time he saw a poor, friendless little girl, who had no one to care for her, and sent her to school, and meant to bring her up to suit himself, and when she was old enough he intended to marry her. He clothed her and watched over her; but when she was fifteen years old, he called to see her once unexpectedly, and found her sitting beside a young man, with her hand in his, listening to his silly twaddle.
That ungrateful little strumpet!
I peeped over at Johnny while he was telling this, and, young as I was, I saw his eyes grow dark as violets, and the pupils enlarge, and his voice rise up in denunciation, while his nostrils dilated and his thin lips worked with emotion. How angry he grew! He thought the girl was basely ungrateful. After that time she was no protegé of his.
But Appleseed, despite giving up on women in the real world, held out hope for the afterlife – explaining to others that he expected to have two spirit wives all his own after he died. Which I guess is the 19th century equivalent of the MGTOWers today who fantasize about the sexy robot ladies who will eventually, it is hoped, make actual human females – with their troubling “thoughts” and “needs” and “desires” of their own – obsolete.
Mr. Appleseed’s quest to remain alone was probably also helped by the fact that – if the illustration I found on Wikipedia is any indication – he looked a bit like Dale Gribble from King of the Hill. Only much, much sloppier, with long hair. Oh, and instead of wearing a baseball cap, he wore “a tin utensil which answered both as a cap and a mush pot.”
So, yeah, a creepy weirdo who hates women — definitely an MGTOWer all the way.
Oh, except that he actually did something with his life — you know, helping spread apple trees to a big portion of the midwest — instead of spending all his time going on about how all women are whores.
I must admit I’m particularly fond of Maledicta.
Here you go.
He also seems to care about animal welfare, while I can’t imagine NWO just hanging out with, say, a cat, and I think if a dog or cat set MRAL off, he’d eviscerate it or something.
I must admit I’m particularly fond of Maledicta.
Same here. I admit this is due in no small part to coffee addiction being something I strongly relate to, but Maledicta’s just awesome in general.
I loved the way the reveal of Maledicta’s gender played out. At first I was going, look, he would have been my dream boy when I was a teenager! And then, oh, OK, he can be my dream girl too, that works.
Maledicta Love!
Meller: Once you’re saying any group of people can be ruined by “overeducation” – it’s pretty hard to argue you’re talking about nature or freedom.
What counts as overeducation?
Is it really so bad for me to be getting a history PHD so I can go out there and do all that Libbertarian Laissez-Faire Lecturin? If I get something on Mises.org, am I an “acceptable mutant?”
Also, forgive me for saying so, but you seem very out of touch with current libertarianism, left, right, center, whatever, except for awareness that Ron Paul is running.
Are you familiar with names such as Radley Balko, Mary Ruwart, Kevin Carson, Wendy McElroy, Sheldon Richman, Stephen Molyneu, Karen DeCoster, Nick Gillespie, Thomas E. Woods, all of whom represent a spectrum of current libertarian politics.
Do you engage with and keep tabs on current issues in the wider libertarian community, or do you primarily discuss your libertarianism with white pride, conspiracy, mra, or traditionalist groups?
If I were to guess, I’d say “over-education” of a woman to Meller would be women learning any thing that can be used outside the home and must be learned to serve the purpose of pleasing a man.
Speaking of androgynous bad-asses, one of my absolute favorite female characters ever (not sure if she counts as a protagonist) has got to be Sir Integra Fairbrook Wingates Hellsing.
@zhinxy
shorter dkm: freedom’s just another word for never trust the jews
Favorite heroines? Most of mine have been mentioned, but Mary Russell from Laurie R King’s Russell-Holmes books springs to mind. Not only an intellectual match for Sherlock Holmes, but she’s a smart ass theologian.
Adding Lisbeth Salander to the growing list of androgynous bad-ass women! She would be the MRA menz’ worst nightmare, if not for being fictional.
Dracula:
Speaking of androgynous bad-asses, one of my absolute favorite female characters ever (not sure if she counts as a protagonist) has got to be Sir Integra Fairbrook Wingates Hellsing.
Well, I would assume so. How are things going with you and the Countess, now that you’re home, btw? Ceres and Pip doing well?
zhinxy: Well, things are pretty quiet these days. Not so many Nazis or warrior priests running about, you know. As for Pip, well, let’s just say he doesn’t get out much. Ceres is fine though.
Snowy:
Yes, I liked Elinor too. Smart, well educated (on her own recognizance, what’s more). I’ve not read Pippi and I really must but I have a huge fondness for Alice. Such a brave, smart, inquisitive little girl!
I agree with you about Scully. Really amazing to begin with but such a let down!
Bagel-San: a lot of those names are unfamiliar to me, so thank you for drawing my attention to them. I must do some hunting! And yes, Granny Weatherwax definitely rock as do Pratchet’s other witches! I’ve not read the Mostrous Regiment and I really must. I loved the Firefly women, and the men were pretty amazing too.
Dracula: definitely Integra! I was quite fond of Victoria as well.
KathleenB: not read those but it definitely looks like I should! Have you read the Wimsey books by Dorothy L. Sayers? Harriet Vane from those is one of my all time favorites. She’s as smart and funny as Wimsy as well as complex and very brave. They were written in the 1930s and Sayer’s feminism is fascinating to read.
Xanthe: how could I forget the amazing Lizbeth Salander? Run for the hills, ye MRAs before she gets her tattoo machine out!
She may have been campy but I always liked Xena.
Nothing wrong with campy.
I wasn’t all that impressed with Ceres until I read the manga, having at that point only seen the first anime series. I thought she grew into a much stronger character throughout the course of the original story. In the anime it seemed like she never really came to terms with who she was.
PosterformerlyknownasElizabeth,
as you might have guessed from my nym (appropriating from one of the Amazons), I’ve a bit of a soft spot for romping over the Greek classical world as Xena and Gabrielle did!
Philippa,
yes, the one-two maneuver with the taser and the tattoo machine was a serious way of harshing the guy’s mellow. And Lisbeth’s handy with mace, fists, and golf clubs too, though there are other strong women characters like Erika Berger or the two female police officers involved, and Blomkvist’s sister Annika (the lawyer) scores major bad-ass points in a completely different way.
Thanks also for mentioning Harriet Vane – it’s been too long since I read any Dorothy L. Sayers.
If you haven’t read any of Kerry Greenwood’s books, her Phryne Fisher mysteries are a long-running series set in Australia, featuring another pistol-packing private detective heroine.
In the fantasy world, Phèdre nó Delaunay, heroine of the first set of Kushiel’s Legacy novels by Jacqueline Carey.
Nancy Drew
Sunny Randall (Robert B. Parker protagonist)
In an odd way the female Navy Pilot from Starship Troopers (Carmen?)
Elizabeth I
Eleanor of Aquitaine
Rosalyn Yallow
Menolly (HarperHall trilogy)
My favorite Old School Mystery Ladies deserve mention, Nora Charles and Miss Marple!
Oh… Lacey Davenport.
Lion in Winter is my favorite movie, with Hepburn my favorite Eleanor.
Daenerys Targaryen – A Song of Ice and Fire/Game of Thrones series
Lady Jessica – Dune.
The Stars My Destination by Alfred Bester is a book both radically forward and shamefully backward in it’s treatment of its female characters, and Olivia Presteign is one of the most fascinating evil females in literature.
Sarah Jane Smith, Donna Noble, Romana 2, River Song/Melody Pond, Amelia Pond-Williams, Leela, – Doctor Who
Nyota Uhura
Susan Calvin
Lucy Kropotnik – The Gallatin Universe
Okay, even just sci fi, this list is gonna get long.
PS – Catwoman is my favorite character in all of fiction and everything ever 😉
even just scifi/fantasy, lest someone point out game of thrones XD
Menolly! I loved those books in my teens.