As “activists,” Men’s Rights Activists seem to be good at only two things: harassing people, and flooding comment sections of websites with their endlessly repeated half-dozen talking points. On Reddit, for example, the local MRAs have been quite the little imperialists, invading a number of gender-related subreddits (like r/equality and r/egalitarian) and turning them essentially into r/mensrights-lite, which has effectively meant killing them. (The recently started r/masculism – an attempt to do Men’s Rights on Reddit without all the misogyny – doesn’t have a chance.)
Well, now the MRA invaders on Reddit seem to have set their sights on a much bigger target: the TwoXChromosomes subreddit. Yep, they’re trying to turn Reddit’s central hangout for the ladies into a boys club.
2XC– an explicitly female-oriented forum on a site (Reddit) heavily dominated by dudes — has always been a strange place. Though I am myself, obviously, a dude, I used to read it fairly regularly, finding it a welcome respite from all the “sammich” jokes and other idiot misogyny so pervasive elsewhere on Reddit. At the time, 2XC had a (completely unwarranted) reputation amongst the Reddit crowd as an evil place full of feminazi man-haters.
Then something started happening to 2XC. That thing was dudes. And not just any dudes – MRA dudes. Regulars on r/mensrights started linking to threads in 2XC and invading en masse, downvoting anything vaguely feminist and spewing forth their standard litanies of complaint. Some of these invaders decided to stay. And so, these sporadic raiding parties turned into a sort of occupation.
No, 2XC – despite the growing number of MRA residents, including a few female MRAs – has not turned into another r/mensrights. But at times, especially when the discussion turns to some MRA pet issue, the place looks a lot like dude central.
Case in point: this 2XC thread, expertly dissected by NauticalLittleNet in ShitRedditSays. The story: a woman posts a picture of her Halloween costume on Reddit and is bugged by a rude, creepy comment referring to her breasts (something that happens approximately ten zillion times a day on Reddit). So she posts the pic again to 2XC, hoping for sympathy. Instead, she’s treated to a barrage of comments mocking her for her alleged “persecution complex.” As NauticalLittleNet shows, the overwhelming majority of the obnoxious comments (all of which garnered numerous upvotes) were from dudes, many of them MRAs.
Naturally, this sort of thing – which happens pretty regularly on 2XC – has totally changed the dynamic of the subreddit from something that was sort of a haven for Reddit women to just another subreddit overflowing with obnoxious dudery.
As a Redditor called emmster noted recently in r/feminist, some women in 2XC have basically stopped posting anything vaguely feminist for fear of being jumped on by argumentative dudes:
I’ll be getting downvoted to Hell in the comments, but get PMs that are supportive from women who feel too afraid of the judgment and vitriol to jump in. I don’t love knowing there are women afraid to voice their opinions in a space that’s for women.
Honestly, I think the sustained r/MensRights invasion is what’s taking the largest toll. It’s like they can’t stand the idea that women have a space that’s active and popular, and they have to come ruin it.
And it doesn’t help that, as Donna_Juanita noted in the same discussion, some of the 2XC mods have essentially bent over backwards to accommodate the MRA invaders and to clamp down on feminists allegedly causing “drama.”
In ShitRedditSays, emmster offers a broader take on what’s happened to 2XC
Since young men are a majority on the site as a whole, and a pretty hefty number of them haven’t had the “There Are Places I Am Not Necessarily Welcome to Pontificate on My Opinion” realization, the space becomes less of a place for women, and more of a place to talk about women. Which is a pretty big distinction. And a tricky thing to keep from happening without raising the ire of the entitled, ignorant young dude contingent.
As a reddit friend of mine put it, it all started with the “Hey Ladies, What Do You Think of My Dick?” posts. When a bunch of guys started posting questions, trying to “understand women,” which of course is a flawed goal, because women, being people, have a variety of opinions and preferences, and cannot actually be understood as a group. Some of them were actually questioning preferences on penis size, hence the name of the phenomenon.
My hypothesis is that eventually, it will be nothing but men talking to men about what they think about women.
Not that there is a shortage of such spaces on Reddit, or in the world in general.
By the way, that picture above is not actually a picture of 2XC regulars. It’s a picture of the Huutajat Men’s Shouting Choir. Which is a real thing in the world. Here they are in action:
qwert: You’re never going to make the Troll Olympics if you can’t stick the dismount! Keep trying, there are tons of feminist blogs out there for you to flounce out of. Assuming you don’t get the banhammer first, that’s an automatic negative fifty points. Good luck!
@ Snowy
You mean that redact works fine so long as you ignore what it’s actual meaning is and pretend that it means something else. Such a revelation makes me feel somewhat less outraged when the same person calls me a “misogynist”.
@ KathleenB
I’m quite perplexed by this whole “flouncing” lark, perhaps you could explain. What is so amusing to you when I say that I am leaving the discussion and then come back to it?
‘S true. For silicon-based women you’re gonna wanna talk to DKM.
qwert, you already admitted you werent familiar with the word. i know being a whiny, pretentious language policeman is your stock in trade, but maybe stick to subjects where you know what youre talking about.
qwert: Look it up. Google is your friend. Once you figure out what flounce means in terms of internet discussions, we’ll discuss the concept of sticking the landing.
Haha he’s back! Is there a third flounce to look forward to? All right, redact means to revise, or edit. So, looks fine to me.
For a flounce to have any of the desired impact you have to do it with dignity, and commit to it (at least for a day or so, or the remainder of the thread.) Or else you’re basically a small child dragging themselves sulkily upstairs to their room, one stair at a time, reproachfully reminding their parents how they are honest gonna run away from home! And won’t they be sorry and miss them! And no matter how much they beg they won’t come back!
@ Sharculese
VoiP says that I’m (among other things) “not very bright” and suggests that I should read more to improve myself. She then uses a word that I have never heard before. In an attempt to educate myself I look up the meaning of the word, only to find that VoiP has used the word incorrectly. I try to disprove her claim that I’m “not very bright” by pointing out this fact to her and am, in turn, accused of being a “smarmy know it all ” and a “whiny, pretentious language policeman”. It seems that I can’t win either way. Such is life…
No qwert666, you can’t win, ever. Thanks for playing and have a lovely day!
And please, stick the flounce.
Nothing like a flounce to bring out the shaming language, eh Bagelsan! Good thing I’m immune to it!
@Kathleen B
I understand what “flounce” means in this context (to go with sudden determination ). What I don’t understand is how saying “Farewell” constitutes a flounce. Or why you find my “flouncing” quite so amusing.
@Snowy
1. To draw up or frame (a proclamation, for example).
2. To make ready for publication; edit or revise.
You can’t, as far as I’m aware, redact retrospectively. As VoiP is attempting in this instance, trying to redact something she wrote some months ago, after publication.
@ FelixBC
“No qwert666, you can’t win, ever. ”
Win what? Is this a competition? What’s the prize?
Indeed, you would have to have shame at all, for that.
The MRM’s attempts to equate what they refer to as ‘shaming language’ with actual slurs have been so cute. Especially from their slut shaming mass of jackassery. Okay, maybe not so cute.
Or, 1. to put into suitable literary form; revise; edit. see, I can use google too! And wait, so comments on a blog are a publication now?
explaining it in a longer and more boring way isnt going to change the fact that youre trying to lecture someone on the use of a word you admit not knowing how to use.
theres more to usage than is encapsulated in a dictionary’s pages, and knowing how to use one doesnt entitle you to prance around like william butthole yeats.
Qwerty, do you even read your own comments?
Still, flounce fail. Please try again!
Dude, you’re not very bright, but you are tedious.
Language and the words used in it are nuanced and delicate things.
Work on comprehension and context.
qwert: Congratulations on your mastery of teh google. Generally, when someone announces they’re leaving in such a fashion, it is assumed that they do not intend to darken our door again. In order to get full points on a flounce, one must stick the landing and not actually darken our door again. Failure to stick the landing will result in point deductions and general derision.
uh, mras know about context. thats that think where david edits angry rants about why women deserved to be raped to make them look worse than they actually are.
@ Rutee
I’d feel shame if I’d done something to be ashamed of. Ending a post with “Farewell” is not really in this category as far as I can see. I’m not sure how it equates to:
” you’re basically a small child dragging themselves sulkily upstairs to their room, one stair at a time, reproachfully reminding their parents how they are honest gonna run away from home! And won’t they be sorry and miss them! And no matter how much they beg they won’t come back!”
I’d consider that to be shaming language, basically an attempt to make me feel shame by comparing my behaviour to that of a crying, emotional child in order to shut me up. Bagelsan appears quite adept at using such language sadly, for her, it has no effect on me.
@ Snowy
Redact:
“In the study of literature, redaction is a form of editing in which multiple source texts are combined (redacted) and subjected to minor alteration to make them into a single work. Often this is a method of collecting a series of writings on a similar theme and creating a definitive and coherent work. To redact can also mean to select or adapt (as by obscuring or removing sensitive information) from a document prior to publication or release.”
Publication:
1. The act or process of publishing printed matter.
2. An issue of printed material offered for sale or distribution.
3. Communication of information to the public
Ergo, this was not an appropriate use of the word “redact”.
My suggestion…
Retract:
1. To take something back or disavow it.
2. To draw back.
qwert: It struck me that he was using the word “dude” as a substitute for the word “man” and I find this a bit strange when he refers to the women involved as “women”.
He was engaging in rhetorical variety, it’s one of the glories of English; it has a huge set of choices in both denotative, and connotative meaning. one can use the same word in both sarcastic, and sardonic ways; in the same paragraph.
As to redact, I think you missed the idea that VoiP was, in that instance, redacting further comment on your merits, and qualities.
As you said, you are; in some ways, not all that bright, esp. as regards the use of the English language.
I’d consider that to be shaming language
qwert how many words are you going to cop to not understanding in this thread? apparently weve got to ad ‘shaming’ and ‘metaphor’ to the list
@ Pecunium
“He was engaging in rhetorical variety, it’s one of the glories of English; it has a huge set of choices in both denotative, and connotative meaning. one can use the same word in both sarcastic, and sardonic ways; in the same paragraph.”
I’ll admit, you’ve lost me here. Do you mean David is “good dude” the other “dudes” are “bad dudes” aka. assholes?
“That speech I made about improving your life by reading a whole lot and thinking deeply? Redacted.”
Do you think that this (redacting further comment on your merits, and qualities) is what she meant here? Really, Pecunium? Even if this is what she meant, it still makes no sense at all. She would be editing things that she has yet to write, correct? Or are you saying that she meant that all subsequent comments from the point of her original statement have been redacted? This again make little sense to me as she hasn’t actually edited (redacted) anything as far as I can see.
@ Sharculese
In what world is ” you’re basically a small child dragging themselves sulkily upstairs to their room, one stair at a time, reproachfully reminding their parents how they are honest gonna run away from home! And won’t they be sorry and miss them! And no matter how much they beg they won’t come back!” a metaphor for “Farewell dudettes, chicks and dudes!” or “Right, second attempt. Farewell.”?
Yea there are definitely similiarities. The extreme, appeal to emotion way they write, the hyperbole, the persecution complex, the us vs them mentality etc. As bionicmommy mentioned, many of them are right wing extremists and “bawww the poor white hetero men” types. I haven’t seen one article on any MRA site about the recent suicides of young gay men. No surprise there.
What really gets to me though is the so called libertarian MRAs. Because freedom is totally awesome for men, but when it comes to women oh no. Back to your “natural role” as mother and kitchen slave. Hypocritical assholes.
That discussion you mentioned reminded me of the comment section under a picture of a black Spiderman. All these whiny idiots screaming about political correctness run amok and how horrible it is to show a person of color even though POC are I dunno…people and American citizens and deserve fair representation? what a horrible conspiracy!
Troll predicting powers? I can only hope 😀
*bangs head against table*
and then people wonder why those uppity feminist bitches ban people.
There’s answering questions, but then there’s answering questions to people who just DO NOT want to understand. Commenters like that just expect women to bend over backwards and be sweet even though they’re just waltzing into a conversation they know nothing about. And the ladies better be accommodating…I mean, that’s what ladies are supposed to do right? anything less and you’re a bitch. I don’t mind answering questions or engaging in debate, but when the person is making no effort to understand then why waste time?