The daffy, excitable Man Going His Own Way who calls himself MarkyMark may be my favorite manosphere blogger of all. Not only does he bring the lulz himself – who can forget the time he wrote a completely unironic point by point rebuttal of an Onion article? – but he also helps to bring attention to the equally stupefying work of others.
In his latest post, he directs our attention to some observations made by fellow MGTOWer Spock’s Disciple on the Happy Bachelors forum on the subject of pussy and its discontents. “This is good stuff, stuff my boys need to read,” Mark writes. “[Spock’s Disciple], like his hero, applied cold hearted logic when analzying pussy. The Force is STRONG with that one!”
Yes, he actually wrote that. I don’t think it’s a joke. I think he honestly does not know that there is a difference between Star Trek and Star Wars. How that is possible, I do not know.
Anyway, on to the eminently rational Spock’s Disciple, reflecting on the irrational power of the ladybits:
Remember that pussy is a biochemical WMD; wherever it is used, there is mass chaos and destruction. How many wars and conflicts have been fought at the urging and behest of women? More than any honest man would admit to and would be proud of.
Young men are apparently helpless in the face of the punany:
The need for pussy is a very real and built in addiction for men. We are hardwired by nature for sex and procreation. … [T]he sight and sound of pussy blinds younger men and allows them to be controlled by women though their hormones.
The, uh, SOUND of pussy? If I had to pick just two (or three, or four) sensory experiences relating to the vagina that would be generally considered appealing to heterosexual males, I’m not sure “sound” would make the cut.
But eventually even the horniest dudes start to get less horny – and thus less hypnotized by the power of the pussy. The only trouble is that by the time they lose interest in sex most of them are married, and they’re now stuck with the woman whose vagina formerly had them in thrall. It’s a grave injustice.
[W]hen most men pass the age of 30-35, they begin to awaken from this biochemical “dream” and what do they awaken beside? What do married men look forward to the next 30-50 years of their lives? Sleeping with a living corpse, which continues to torture and destroy them day by day? Looking forward to the time when the woman undergoes the process of metamorphosis, into a completely insane mummy (menopause and post menopause)?
This seems a tad alarmist. I mean, if your wife turns into a monster zombie-mummy – as all women apparently do after they hit their mid-thirties – you could always get separate bedrooms.
But Obi-Wan’s Spock’s Disciple has a more radical solution: don’t get into bed with the ladies in the first place!
Pussy is indeed way overrated and if younger men could get a shot of “anti-testosterone” for a few weeks, they could see through the eyes of men who are 40+; without the haze of hormones, you cannot believe how much farther you can see! It’s the difference between seeing the horizon through LA style smog and seeing the horizon from a high mountain in the Rockies.
Pussy is a man’s Achilles heel; once that man realizes this and takes the appropriate steps, he’ll never lose his peace of mind again. To these skeptical young men I say, there is an infinitely vast arena where you can have anything you desire, and can succeed at anything you wish to try for; all you have to do is see women for what they truly are, and become a master of the beast within; once you do that women’s true face will be visible to you, and you’ll never again partake of that foul potion.
It is possible to tame that beast, and indeed it is a certainty that you will learn much from the process of taming it; all it takes is patience and time. Look at your fellow men, your brothers in arms, and look at their almost invisible chains, and wonder at why you would desire such an existence for yourself?
And, hey, if all else fails, MarkyMark adds some advice of his own: pay a visit to Pamela Handerson before going out on the town with one of those vagina-people.
[T]here is one thing that the younger men can do until their sex drives die down permanently: masturbate before going out with a woman. … To put it another way, since the little head had been, shall we say, quieted down, the bigger head could work properly; the bigger head will then allow you to see a woman for who she REALLY is.
If you’re a fan of Spock, and looking for appropriate masturbatory material, might I suggest this?
“So Simon, are you saying that men are inherently prone to rape?”
“Yes, I would say that. It seems plausible if you ever experienced strong sexual desire.”
Simon, speaking as a man who has in fact experienced strong sexual desire, I invite you to go fuck yourself.
I would never insult a mouse. Mice have done nothing bad to me – I even used to rescue them from my cat when he would try to kill them, and set them free outside.
Simon, on the other hand, fully deserves insults, because he’s attempting to justify forcing women into sex.
(He also deserves insults for being stupid and illogical, but the whole justifying rape thing is a bit more important.)
@ Joe – Great minds and all. Apparently you and I were posting about exactly the same thing at the same time.
@Holly Pervocracy “Sexual desire is a lovely thing. Sexual desire coupled with the belief that only partnered sex makes you a Real Man, coupled with a feeling of entitlement that no mere woman has the right to take away your chance at being a Real Man–now that’s a dark dangerous thing. But only that specific combination.”
Holly, I try not to listen to Real Man bullshit (and it’s very hard sometimes not to)…but what if I believed that partnered sex is a necessary condition of fully mature and healthy adulthood for anyone with a normal sex drive?
(I do, BTW. It cost me major points in self-esteem, but I personally see no way out of this belief.)
Simon, on the other hand, fully deserves insults, because he’s attempting to justify forcing women into sex.
He also deserve insults for assuming every other member of his gender is as much of an asshole as he is.
As far as the “sex with someone you dislike versus masturbation”, as a Real Man I can tell you from my experience that I’ve had sex with someone I can’t otherwise stand. It is a soul-sucking proposition, because I started hating myself for letting my urges drag me around on top of not liking her too much.
When I masturbate there’s always at least one person in the room who I love and respect.
“He also deserve insults for assuming every other member of his gender is as much of an asshole as he is.”
Get help Simon!
@Improbable Joe:
“Seems”… yes, seems for you. But that’s not what I said. Don’t burn straw men, that’s ridiculous.
@CassandraSays:
Quote me, where I justify forcing women into sex! Quote me!
My opinion is, to state it clearly as I can: You have every right on earth not to engage in sex if you don’t want it.
@Raoul: “…but what if I believed that partnered sex is a necessary condition of fully mature and healthy adulthood for anyone with a normal sex drive?”
First off, you’d be wrong. Learning to live with not always getting what you want is a necessary condition of fully mature and healthy adulthood for EVERYBODY.
Secondly, if we reword that to a less creepy format of “partnered sex is the preferred condition of fully mature and healthy adulthood for most people with a normal sex drive,” the answer to your question is that you need to make yourself as desirable to potential sexual partners as possible, while being an honorable and decent human being, and hope that it is enough. If it isn’t, that’s a shame and I’m sorry… but no one is required to fulfill the needs of other human beings in the way that your question suggests.
I think life necessitates me having lots of really expensive and neat gadgets, but if I don’t have the money or the ability to convince someone to buy them for me, I don’t have any justification for stealing them. And before someone makes the “stealing food” analogy, the proper analogy would be walking past an apple tree with ripe fruit and free for picking and breaking into a grocery store because you prefer the taste of oranges.
I’m guessing he’s the disciple who betrayed Spock for 30 pieces if naqahdah.
Simon’s convinced that if he gives vague answers that just hint at his belief that some hypothetical person(totally not him) might possibly be forced to do something(not necessarily rape!) unless something or other happens(he completely doesn’t want women be drafted into a sex army to service losers like Simon before they are forced to rape someone!), then no one will know exactly what he’s getting at and he can pretend to be the victim…
… not coincidentally, the same way he’s victimized by women not having sex with him, and gays being gay in public where he can see them.
Quit backpedalling, Simon. The implications of your comments were very clear.
I’m not even being mean when I say: your view of sex is regressive and inaccurate and fucked up and probably makes you miserable, so go see a therapist about that. I’ve literally talked to Catholic nuns who are way more chill and positive about sex than you are.
Sexual desire isn’t all that different from other human desires; we (generally) want to socialize, and be liked, and be entertained, and eat delicious things, and wear comfy and/or attractive clothes, and all the other shit that enriches our lives. The strength of these desires varies between individuals — and some people might have a very hard time abstaining from some of them — but missing out on these things won’t kill you, nor would any of them justify impinging on the rights of another human being.
No one is saying being horny and alone is blissful, any more than being bored or being unpopular or being in the mood for chocolate and having none is, but it’s also not some overwhelming force that mere humans can’t resist. Wanting sex is no more dire a need than wanting friends or wanting to have children, and it doesn’t inevitably lead to unstoppable raping sprees anymore than the latter wants inevitably lead to kidnappings — none of those desires are “dark forces” until people start being selfish and douchey in their quest to fulfill them.
There. It was that bit (among others.) When you say that something is in a person’s inherent nature, you are setting the stage for justifying the expression of that nature.
“Sexual desire isn’t all that different from other human desires; we (generally) want to socialize, and be liked, and be entertained, and eat delicious things, and wear comfy and/or attractive clothes, and all the other shit that enriches our lives. The strength of these desires varies between individuals — and some people might have a very hard time abstaining from some of them — but missing out on these things won’t kill you, nor would any of them justify impinging on the rights of another human being.
”
Ding ding ding! The desire for sex isn’t morally any different from the desire for, say, a person to play tennis with. Everyone is entitled to actively look around for a tennis partner if they want to. If they’d like to place ads on craigslist looking for a tennis partner, that’s just fine. If they see someone in a cafe and think “I’d really like to play tennis with that person” and then attempt to force that person into playing tennis with them, that is not OK.
This stuff is really, truly not that complicated as long as you recognise the basic personhood of other human beings. Wanting sex is not an excuse for disregarding someone else’s personhood. If wanting sex leads you to disregard the wishes of other people, the problem isn’t the urge for sex – the problem is you.
I want to elevate the point someone made a day or two ago wondering why these guys don’t just become politically homosexual, like political lesbians did back during the women’s movement in the 70s.
Women are bitches? Fix it with cock!
Vaginas are nasty? Fix it with cock!
Snubbed by some cunt? Fix it with cock!
http://www.youtube-nocookie.com/v/KUUde_srOYM?version=3&hl=en_US&rel=0
OK, he says he’s not Samuel, but that means there’s two of them out there (that we know of). THAT IS FUCKING SCARY.
Simon, I’ll throw in with those saying seek help. You need it.
@Dracula:
Yes. I didn’t have any sex from age 17 to 21. Then shortly after someones birthday where I met, at least for me, a stunningly beautiful, long-limbed, raven-haired young woman, *fast forward* and then when she was naked, put her arms around me, kissed me etc. etc. yes, that was a really strong desire which I felt then.
The thing is, how strong would this desire be if we multiply it by ten times? Or fifty times? Or a hundred times? At some point, that’s just logical, it might be so strong that it can be difficult to control. That’s the most simple, obvious reasoning possible.
That is kind of a key difference – the Women Going Their Own Way didn’t just talk about it, they actually went. Why can’t these guys do the same?
“DYE – Why? I’m honestly curious.”
Holly,
First of all thanks for asking…
5 reasons.
Taste
Touch
Feel
Smell
Hear
Masturbation is solely sensation on your penis and that’s pretty much it. Being with a woman on the other hand is literally sensational. There’s no comparison really.
And most guys are only “creeped out” if a” creepy” woman touches him , not if a woman they don’t like touches him
As far as bragging rights, they play such a minor role in the preference for real sex over masturbation that it’s not worth mentioning.
@Bagelsan:
And I am always accused to commit the appeal to nature fallacy… *confused* what if some celebrated philosopher writes an essay, in which he laments that humans are prone to war, does he justify war for you?
Surely at that point your gonads would explode from your body, fly around the room, and then rocket through the roof into the stratosphere at which point they would spontaneously combust in a flare of radiant light and sizzling hormones? Rape would naturally be the last thing on your mind, at that point.
…And more to the actual point, why are we theoretically multiplying sexual desires now? It’s theoretically impossible to fall off a log — you progressively halve the distance to the ground, and therefore never reach it, it’s just logical — but in the real world it’s a stupid damn scenario. People don’t hover off of logs, and people don’t get their libidos magically multiplied to unstoppable strength. :p
At some point, that’s just logical, it might be so strong that it can be difficult to control. That’s the most simple, obvious reasoning possible.
What if we just make shit up, and pretend it’s logic? What if we pretend humans suddenly become utterly bereft of reason and the capacity to make responsible decisions, just because they’re male and horny? That’s most simple, logical way to make bullshit arguments seem plausible.
Simon, the violent-conflict-is-a-natural-part-of-human-nature thing is used to justify wars. All the time. People say “humans are always fighting each other… so we gotta hit the other guy before he (inevitably) hits us!” or “…so we’re not evil for starting a war, we’re normal!” or “…so pacifism and peace are unreasonable goals, fuck trying them!” or “…so let’s spend a trillion dollars getting really good at it!”
There’s also the fact that it’s irrelevant how strong someone’s desire for sex is, since no level of desire excuses rape. Once again Simon is weaseling around not quite saying what he wants to say, just hinting at it, and then getting all pouty when people point out the implications of what he’s saying.
Also, for bonus lulz – only men have these overpowering sexual urges! Women’s sexual urges are dainty and ladylike, not overwhemling at all.
I don’t think you understand what a ‘right’ is.
It doesn’t mean you have the moral high ground when you take some action (such as declining sex).
Having a right means you can take a specific action with impunity. That if you decide to do something (such as decline sex), no one will harm you for it.
But you are defending men who lash out at women because women have declined sex with them. In fact, this would imply that you are opposed to the right to decline sex.