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antifeminism cock blockade evil women marriage strike men who should not ever be with women ever MGTOW misandry misogyny MRA MRA paradox precious bodily fluids sex

Baby denial is not just a baby river in Egypt

Screw you lady, no babies for you!

Hey, fellas! Do you hate feminists but also hate doing things? Our good friend over at the Pro-Male/Anti-Feminist Technology blog has an idea for you: strike at the heart of the feminazi matriarchy by “denying marriage and denying children to women.” This, PMAFT (for short) argues, will effectively transfer “the costs of misandry … back on to women.” And all you have to do is: nothing!

Apparently, feminist ladies have an insatiable need to marry and make babies with men who hate them. All you need to do to thwart this evil plan is to not have sex with them. But wait a minute, you say, don’t ladies make the babies themselves, in their bellies? Well, yes they do. But unfortunately for them they also need a little something from you as well. No, not  your money – that comes later. You know that white stuff that comes out of your penis when you masturbate? Ladies actually need that in order to make babies. And you control the supply! Cut them off! Embargo that shit.

Also, if you ever find yourself in a chapel with one of these ladies, and some religious looking dude starts asking you all sorts of questions, do not – I repeat, do not – answer any of them with the phrase “I do.” That’s how they get you.

The great thing about denying ladies your babies is that it also helps you to strike back at your parents – by denying them grandchildren! Ha HA! As PMAFT helpfully explains:

Our parents’ generation had one foot in the old system and one foot in the feminist system.  This meant that many of them have completely avoided the consequences of supporting feminism.  I see this with my own parents who don’t particularly think of themselves as “feminists” but have effectively supported feminism all the same.  They have experienced absolutely no consequences from their support of feminism.  This goes for both my mom and my dad.  …

Most of our parents want grandchildren so denying them grandchildren really forces the cost of misandry back on to them.  This is particularly effective when done by only children or by men who have only brothers.  Even for men who have sisters, this can still be effective if it prevents the “family name” from being passed on.

In your face! No babies for you!

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MGTOW Man
MGTOW Man
9 years ago

First, I have seen numbers lower than that — numbers below replacement level.

Second, many of those births are outside marriage. I have seen numbers over 90% for the black community and the numbers for hispanics and anglos are moving in that direction. I think the Asians have largely avoided that trend for now. The point is that a child birth outside marriage has a large probability of being one the man did not consent to.

Particularly, where I live, a very large portion of the teenage girls get pregnant usually without marriage. Yes, they usually have a second and even third child often each by a different man married to none of them. These young boys are impregnating these young girls largely outside marriage and largely out of youthful stupidity not logical thought.

I agree that women have hormones working in their favor particularly with the youthful and the uneducated. I think that situation has little to say about the fate of educated women who go to college and then get a career and then decide they want a baby. I assume many women on this board fit that description. I think you’ll will find resistance in many men. By the time men are 30 or higher, they are going to be wiser. Actually, I think even some of the smarter teenagers are wising up as they have seen what happened to their fathers, etc.

The “boys” who are fathering most of the children around here young with no education and no assets. These are not the type of men the women here will probably want.

Third, there are a large number of articles that have been written on this topic including articles by women. These articles tend to say that men won’t commit, women are too immature and just want to play with their computers and bass boats, etc. These articles tend to confirm that the MGTOW movement is having an effect.

MGTOW Man
MGTOW Man
9 years ago

Excuse my error, it is men not women who are accused of being immature and just wanting to play with their computers and bass boats. That by the way is the definition of MGTOW — men finding an alternative to occupy their time and energies other than women.

Hengist
Hengist
9 years ago

For your information, I have done laundry for many years and most of the time I don’t even notice it. It takes a few moments here and there and it is done. It is an entirely easy task requiring almost no time or energy.

Now now, don’t you understand that driving to work every morning in heavy traffic is child’s play compared to the grueling task of twisting a dial on a washing machine? Stop oppressing these people with your facts and logic! :p

MGTOW Man
MGTOW Man
9 years ago

OK, guys. I have spent as much time as I can. It has been fun. I am out of here.

Hengist
Hengist
9 years ago

*inb4 FLOUNCE LOL*

kristinmh
kristinmh
9 years ago

2.6/woman comes from the CIA world factbook:

https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/us.html

As for whether babies are born in or outside of marriage is absolutely none of my business and I do not give a shit, and neither should you.

MGTOW Man
MGTOW Man
9 years ago

hd ttp://www.google.com/publicdata/explore?ds=d5bncppjof8f9_&met_y=sp_dyn_tfrt_in&idim=country:USA&dl=en&hl=en&q=fertility+rate+united+states

Well, this source says the fertility rate in the U.S. was 2.05 in 2009. The trend of the graph is clearly down. I think 2.05 may be below replacement level.

When I clicked your link I really didn’t directly get any relevant data. It looked just the cover page of the CIA World Fact Book. I would have to look further for actual data.

As for the births being outside marriage, that is relevant. It shows or at least tends to show that those births were not the result of men making conscious choices. Those births very possibly in many instances were the result of a horny young man doing what horny young men do. That is not the ideal situation for either young men or young women IMHO.

It seems to me that in terms of men making conscious decisions to marry and have families there is real reason to believe that is way down.

I said I was gone but I couldn’t help myself. I am really gone this time.

Again, it has been fun.

MGTOW Man
MGTOW Man
9 years ago
kristinmh
kristinmh
9 years ago

You have to open the tab that says “People and culture” or something like that and scroll down.

I believe 2.05/woman is above replacement, you moron. Women make up 50% of the breeding-age population, do they not? So if each woman has, on average, slightly more than 2 children, the population is replacing itself. Math, do you speak it?

Also bear in mind that the relevant childbearing numbers are per woman LIFETIME. I’m sure fertility did drop in 2009. You know what else happened in 2009? A giant fucking recession! Do you think, maybe, that some of the women who would otherwise have had babies that year might have decided to put it off for a while until the economy recovered? Hell, I seriously considered getting pregnant that year but decided against it. I’m pregnant now, and it looks like the economy is tanking again, so shows what I know.

As for the births being outside marriage, that is relevant. It shows or at least tends to show that those births were not the result of men making conscious choices.

Yeah, and you know this how? The same way you know that a birth rate of 2.05/woman is below replacement? Because no unmarried couple ever decides to have a baby, and no married couple ever has a birth control failure? Sounds like you are making an awful lot of assumptions.

hellkell
hellkell
9 years ago

Aw, shit, another whackjob from Texas. He sounds an awful lot like NWO in some respects.

Amused
Amused
9 years ago

Hengist: It’s not about the amount of work, you stupid nitwit — it’s about what it means, and the appreciation (or lack of it) you get for it. Yes, doing laundry is harder than driving in traffic. “Grueling traffic”, my foot. Now we know who never lifted a finger around the house. The fact that you believe you do laundry by just turning the dial tells me you’ve never done laundry, as well. And also — you ALREADY minimize and trivialize our contributions, and always have, so your threat is ludicrous. Not only do you minimize what women do in the home — you ignore the fact that most women, in addition to doing nearly everything at home, also earn incomes comparable to their husbands and sometimes outearn them. You deny this as if it doesn’t count — and then you tell me that you “can” minimize my contributions? Yeah. Quelle fucking surprise.

Additionally, that whole notion about men like MGTOW “I found alternative ways to expend my energy” troll (or possibly sockpuppet) here supposedly braving “grueling traffic” for an ungrateful woman — let’s put that inane notion to bed right now. You don’t earn money “for the family”. You earn it for yourself. You earn it to pay for a system designed and operated to meet only YOUR needs and YOUR desires, to provide you, and only you, with comforts and pleasures. What is it that you would provide the woman with, besides food and shelter — which she can earn elsewhere with minimum skills and a lot less effort? You don’t bring love (a logical inference to be drawn from your view of a “good” marriage as a terse exchange of goods and services). You don’t bring respect (a logical inference to be drawn from your flippant dismissal of women as “illogical” — a well-known pretext to denying legitimacy to any of one’s wife’s needs, wants or problems). You don’t bring sex ( a logical inference from your view of sex as something that women are obligated to perform and men have a right to being that you are lousy in bed). You don’t bring leisure (since you use your employment as a justification to never ever give your wife a moment’s relaxation). You don’t bring caring (since you expect only to be waited on, and never to wait on your partner). You don’t bring safety or support (a logical inference to be drawn from your idea that the wife would owe you every minute of every day and exist solely for your comfort and pleasure is that you wouldn’t care about your partner being in pain, sick or endangered, except to the extent that it affected your own comfort). And on top of that, you would actually expect your wife to work outside the home as well, possibly support you through economic downturns and graduate schools — and to be okay with you not giving her any credit for it. Yeah, you going your own way is kind of like a person who likes to stick needles into people’s eyes going his own way, because people don’t show him enough appreciation for having had needles stuck in their eyeballs. We are all broken up here. Now fuck off.

Amused
Amused
9 years ago

Hellkell: I propose a new term: TGHOWN. Troll Going His Own Way … Not!!

MGTOW Man
MGTOW Man
9 years ago

I am trying to be civil.

You called me me a moron.

Since you have broken the thin veneer of civility, I am just going to tell the truth.

You are are a stupid bitch.

Some people die before reproducing, dumb bitch.

Thus, you need more than 2 people per female to maintain a population, dumb bitch.

This is explained as follows, dumb bitch:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_fertility_rate

Replacement rates

Graph of Total Fertility Rates vs. GDP per capita of the corresponding country, 2009. Only countries with over 5 million population were plotted to reduce outliers. Sources: CIA World Fact Book
Replacement fertility is the total fertility rate at which newborn girls would have an average of exactly one daughter over their lifetimes. In more familiar terms, women have just enough babies to replace themselves.
If there were no mortality in the female population until the end of the childbearing years (generally taken as 44 or 49, though some exceptions exist) then the replacement level of TFR would be very close to 2.0 (actually slightly higher because of the excess of boy over girl births in human populations). However, the replacement level is also affected by mortality, especially childhood mortality. The replacement fertility rate is roughly 2.1 births per woman for most industrialized countries (2.075 in the UK for example), but ranges from 2.5 to 3.3 in developing countries because of higher mortality rates.[4] Taken globally, the total fertility rate at replacement is 2.33 children per woman. At this rate, global population growth would trend towards zero.

AS you can see the replacement rate for most industrialized countries is 2.1 so 2.05 is below replacement rate, you stinking dumb bitch.

I am sorry, but you need to engage your brain before you call someone a moron, bitch.

Amused
Amused
9 years ago

You have men literally at war being shot at.

So? Three things:

(1) You have women literally at war being shot at.

(2) I see most (not all, but most) wars as unnecessary and fought for reasons that have nothing to do with the interests of women, children or families, and everything to do with the interests of people in power, who are overwhelmingly men.

(3) Are YOU literally at war being shot at? No? Then stop spewing irrelevant bullshit (and also kindly stfu about logic). You don’t get brownie points for the fact that some other person getting shot at somewhere also has a penis.

You have men climbing electrical poles during storms.

First of all, not during storms. Second — it’s a job, not charity. A job these men actually get real honest-to-goodness money, a job that has limited hours, vacations, weekends and hours off. Third — I very much want women to climb those electrical poles with the same salary and benefits as men.

You have men doing construction sometimes in dangerous situations.

You have women teaching in inner city schools sometimes in dangerous situations. You have women working as social workers going into tough neighborhoods, sometimes in dangerous situations. You have women working as nurses, caring for patients who sometimes attack them. And that’s just covering traditionally “female” jobs.

Even most “in door jobs” are far, far more demanding than what you describe. Most these days are not 9 to 5.

None of these jobs, however, are unpaid, round-the-clock, and with a boss who expects an endless array of services and never even provides the courtesy of a reach-around.

MGTOW Man
MGTOW Man
9 years ago

Because, for a man to have real hope of having connection with his children, he needs to marry the mother of the children. That is not much guaranty now but it is whole lot more than none. In fact, he has to be married to the woman to even have much hope of the child being his. It makes no sense at all for a man to seek to reproduce with a woman who is screwing other guys or who has not made at least a purported commitment to him.

Amused
Amused
9 years ago

What’s this preoccupation with reproducing above replacement rate, anyway? Ostensibly so that you have more people to care for the older generation — which characterizes it as a giant pyramid scheme. You can’t have infinite expansion in a finite world, and human beings have reproduced far too much this past half a century, anyway. I would prefer for people to have fewer children, but for society to provide better care and upbringing for the young. I am less worried about reproduction falling below replacement rate than about it rising much higher.

MGTOW Man
MGTOW Man
9 years ago

————–

(2) I see most (not all, but most) wars as unnecessary and fought for reasons that have nothing to do with the interests of women, children or families, and everything to do with the interests of people in power, who are overwhelmingly men.

——————

That is false. The wars now are explained in part by women’s rights and the wars in part are forcing feminism on other cultures. Further, to the extent the wars are motivated by oil or by supposed security, they benefit women to the same extent as men.

Most, importantly, women are just as war like as men when in positions of power. Hillary has been an active participant in war making as was Madeline Albright and many others.

The notion that women are more peaceful than men is just not born out by experience.

Amused
Amused
9 years ago

Because, for a man to have real hope of having connection with his children, he needs to marry the mother of the children.

No — for a man to have a real hope of having connection with his children, he needs to spend time with them, care for them, play with them, take them places, instead of simply shoving them out of the way or lecturing them on occasion. In other words, to do “women’s work” every once in a while.

Beth
9 years ago

In modern day, if women wants a baby they no longer need a mate, they go have injections. Well, technically it still is favor from men; donating their sperm and all but there is no need for all the crap of getting them to knock you off…

Amused
Amused
9 years ago

The notion that women are more peaceful than men is just not born out by experience.

That’s not what I said. I said most wars are fought for power, and most people in power are men. That is a fact. Deal with it.

That is false. The wars now are explained in part by women’s rights and the wars in part are forcing feminism on other cultures.

Oh, you mean how peaceful the world was before feminism? Oh, yeah, wars were practically unknown before 1960. Uhm, actually, no, today’s society is more peaceful than any other in all of recorded history, while countries that don’t respect women’s rights also happen to be medievally violent. And no, this is not a claim that women are more “peaceful” than men — rather, as that article (which I am sure you won’t read) points out, the reduction in violence has to do with a critical mass of people willing to recognize those of different class, gender and race as people, rather than chattel or glorified appliances.

Further, to the extent the wars are motivated by oil or by supposed security, they benefit women to the same extent as men.

A war that’s motivated by corporate profits benefits very few people, but out of those few, most are men.

MGTOW Man
MGTOW Man
9 years ago

(3) Are YOU literally at war being shot at? No? Then stop spewing irrelevant bullshit (and also kindly stfu about logic). You don’t get brownie points for the fact that some other person getting shot at somewhere also has a penis.

——————-

Are you pregnant right now? If not, shut up.

Are you doing laundry right now? If not, shut up.

These statements make about as much sense as your statements — none.

—————-

You have women teaching in inner city schools sometimes in dangerous situations. You have women working as social workers going into tough neighborhoods, sometimes in dangerous situations. You have women working as nurses, caring for patients who sometimes attack them. And that’s just covering traditionally “female” jobs.

————————-

The work place mortality figures for women are trivial compared to men.

The notion that a social worker or teacher has a dangerous job is just false.

————————–

I very much want women to climb those electrical poles with the same salary and benefits as men.

——————————

Nothing is stopping them. The fact is that women don’t want those jobs. The same is true for offshore jobs (which pay very well). You know what a cook on an offshore platform makes very, very good money. Many women of course can cook. Women don’t apply for these jobs because they don’t want to be on an offshore platform. It is a matter of choice. I frankly doubt most women could be electrical one “men” effectively. Just reality.

——————————-

What’s this preoccupation with reproducing above replacement rate, anyway?

———————————

One of you brought it up the fertility rate. Actually, the graph does not show any decline in 2009. Rather, the rate is rather stable for several decades dipping just slightly in 2009. We are just barely below replacement level but again a very large portion of the babies are being raised outside traditional marriage. If you’ll want to argue that single parent families are as good as two parent families, the evidence is against you. I don’t have time.

MGTOW Man
MGTOW Man
9 years ago

No — for a man to have a real hope of having connection with his children, he needs to spend time with them, care for them, play with them, take them places, instead of simply shoving them out of the way or lecturing them on occasion. In other words, to do “women’s work” every once in a while.

——

That is just false. Absent a marriage, the man is relegated to a noncustodial parent in most instances. He has specific defined times and dates. If the woman does not honor his rights, he often has no money to enforce his rights. Even if he does, the courts often don’t enforce his rights. He needs the commitment of the mother to have much hope of being around his child day in and day out, and this is what marriage is (commitment). If he has a child without that commitment, he gets only what the law allows which is just “sometimes” and often not even that. Do some women allow more out of good graces? Sometimes, yes, He can’t count on it. If the woman hooks up with another guy that other guy is likely to be the “father” of his child especially if he doesn’t have the money to enforce his rights.

MGTOW Man
MGTOW Man
9 years ago

Oh, you mean how peaceful the world was before feminism? Oh, yeah, wars were practically unknown before 1960. Uhm, actually, no, today’s society is more peaceful than any other in all of recorded history, while countries that don’t respect women’s rights also happen to be medievally violent. And no, this is not a claim that women are more “peaceful” than men — rather, as that article (which I am sure you won’t read) points out, the reduction in violence has to do with a critical mass of people willing to recognize those of different class, gender and race as people, rather than chattel or glorified appliances.

————————

The world in general is more peaceful. I agree that wars are few and small right now in large parts of the world. Guess who is most war like in the world right now? The United States of America. Women have great influence in the power structure here right now. I would say the most war like country on earth right now is a feminist country. All our recent wars have had great input from women: Hillary, Condoliza Rice, Madeline Albright, and others. Yes, some feminists advocate using war and violence for their purposes (the feminization of the world).

I disagree that men benefit from wars any more than women. I disagree that men benefit from corporations any more than women. Most governments and corporations benefit women most and this is true regardless of the gender of the “President.” For example, with the U.S., women benefit from all kinds of social programs not really available to men.

hellkell
hellkell
9 years ago

Amused: I wish this one would would take off.

This idiot gets nasty when you poke him, although it is kind of refreshing to see the veneer of politesse these fools roll in on crack so fast.

MGTOW, someone here’s a dumb bitch, alright. Wanna guess who?

MGTOW Man
MGTOW Man
9 years ago

What is the most patriarchal part of the world? Say, South America, which is also the most peaceful. Of course the pacific Islands are almost complete peaceful. I think they are patriarchal. I think the middle east which is also patriarchal would be peaceful if it wasn’t for the whole Israel situation. China has been remarkably peaceful for a remarkably long time (yes, I know about its involvement in the Korean war).

What causes war is very complex but it is not true (or at least overly simplistic) to say that men cause war. Men are the prime victims of war (civilian populations most not always were not targeted until relatively recently with so called “strategic” bombing).

Women are almost always more materialistic than men. Most consumer goods are purchased by or for women (or to impress them). To the extent that war is caused by materialism, the finger points at women. MGTOW don’t need large SUVs or houses.

MGTOW Man
MGTOW Man
9 years ago

MGTOW, someone here’s a dumb bitch, alright. Wanna guess who?

———————–

Not me. I am not the one who called someone a moron without doing the slightest bit of thinking or research (it doesn’t take much thought to realize that some people die before reproducing thus to maintain population level somewhat more than 2 per female is needed).

Hengist
Hengist
9 years ago

Hengist: It’s not about the amount of work, you stupid nitwit

I had a bet going with a friend on how long you’d last this time before resorting to personal attacks. Looks like I won 10 bucks. As for the rest, TL;DR.

For someone working so hard in the house, you sure spend a lot of time posting here though. :p

kristinmh
kristinmh
9 years ago

The 0.05, man. The 0.05. Or the 0.6, if you take the CIA World Factbook as accurate. That’s what accounts for people who die before they reproduce. An extra 0.6 will not only cause replacement but actual non-immigration population growth, because nowhere near 0.6% of the population dies before reproductive age anymore.

That’s why I called you a moron. Because you are stupid.

Call me whatever you like, and continue to spew your boring garbage as long as someone is interested in engaging with you. I mean, really, your points appear to be:

– Women suck because they won’t uncomplainingly do 100% of the housework and childcare anymore
– Therefore I will withhold my precious essence from them! And men are already doing so, obviously, because shut up, that’s why!
– Women cause war
– Lucky women, with their being poor enough to get extremely ungenerous welfare!

Do you really think you’re saying something we haven’t heard before? Did you read anything before you showed up to give us the benefit of your wisdom? Do you ever read or learn or listen to anyone else, or do you just drone on and on because you think you having a penis makes you some kind of guru?

MGTOW Man
MGTOW Man
9 years ago

I think the middle east which is also patriarchal would be peaceful if it wasn’t for the whole Israel situation.

—————

Well, of course, the oil there is another factor.

MGTOW Man
MGTOW Man
9 years ago

This is straight from the CIA World Fact Book for the U.S.:

Total fertility rate:

2.06 children born/woman (2011 est.)

I guess you don ‘t know the difference between 2.06 and 2.6. It is a big difference in this context — a huge difference. You are still way, way wrong. I should insult your math.

On second though, I just saw that you called me a moron again. Thus, I will insult your math. Any third grader knows that the position of a decimal point is important, dumb bitch.

Or you dumb, or are you just a liar (misrepresenting facts)?

By the way welfare isn’t ungenerous. I had a friend on welfare. By the time, you took everything into account (public housing, food stamps, medicaid, etc.) I figured she was living at a level of something like $35,000 a year for herself and one child. Not bad around here.

kristinmh
kristinmh
9 years ago

You’re right, I misread the decimal point. Congratulations, it is 2.06. See, I admitted that I was wrong! It wasn’t that hard!

I figured she was living at a level of something like $35,000 a year for herself and one child. Not bad around here.

Did you figure this the same way you figured that children born to unmarried couples is evidence of more men GTOW? By pulling it out of your ass and interpreting it in the light of your own prejudices?

I’m not an expert – or even an American! – but I believe darksidecat knows a lot about the welfare system, how shitty it is, and how hard it is to survive on the benefits you “figure” poor women get. Maybe zie can set you straight.

darksidecat
9 years ago

I have seen numbers over 90% for the black community

He’s been taking classes at the NWO school of statistics!

. These young boys are impregnating these young girls largely outside marriage and largely out of youthful stupidity not logical thought.

So if a boy causes a pregnancy, it is an accident (despite the existence of these things called condoms), but if a girl becomes pregnant, it is a sure sign that she is doing it intentionally and out of malice?

Particularly, where I live, a very large portion of the teenage girls get pregnant usually without marriage.

And? Oh, noes, we aren’t being close enough to hetero patriarchy, whatever shall we do? (worth noting though, unmarried does not automatically equal unpartnered or partnered with someone other than one’s children’s other parent). My issue with unintentional pregnancy is that the parties do not want it, frankly, I don’t give a rats ass if every single baby in the country is born “out of wedlock”. Wait, scratch that as an anti-marriage person, if that were to occur it would make my case in that area easier. The argument that married people do better means very little, when we give them massive legal and social rights that we deny unmarried couples. It is no surprise that couples which receive massive social and government subsidies (more than 1100 federal rights and benefits alone) for being married get advantages from those benefits.

Also, your response to my comments about income class and stay at home mothers is totally nonsensical. Really, it isn’t even close to being on topic with what I said. I can only assume that you either copied the wrong quote into that space and intended to address someone else, or have just floated further away from reality.

Nothing is stopping them. The fact is that women don’t want those jobs. The same is true for offshore jobs (which pay very well).

This is utter nonsense. There is massive discrimination in hiring, and massive on site harassment in most of these jobs.

Say, South America, which is also the most peaceful.

You are really, really unaware of international current events, aren’t you?

civilian populations most not always were not targeted until relatively recently with so called “strategic” bombing

Again, utterly contradictory with reality. Take a look at, say, all of WWII, including allied actions (just the nuclear bombs alone killed hundreds of thousands of civilians). Any quick study of history will show massive targeting of civilian populations historically, including things like selling the entire population of captured cities as slaves.

It appears that MGTOW Man has taken his knowledge directly from NWOs Big Book of Learning.

MGTOW Man
MGTOW Man
9 years ago

I knew her fairly well. She had a nice apartment. It wasn’t real nice like rich nice but there was nothing wrong with it. I valued the apartment at $600 per month (2 bedrooms).

I know she had the best health insurance. You could work for IBM or GE and not have any better. It paid for everything even gas to and from medical appointments. I valued that for her and her kid at $1,000 a month. This may sound high but she had a kid with substantial medical issues — probably not insurable at all except high risk pool. She is younger than me, but I know my insurance even though I am healthy is nearly $500 a month (with high deductible). The insurance she had was very, very valuable.

I know she received food stamps of nearly $400 a month.

This is as far as I remember the numbers. I know the analysis I came up with was fairly detailed and the numbers came out to like $35,000 a year.

I know this sounds strange in view of the whole MGTOW thing but she was the one woman since divorce I actually thought was marriage material. I couldn’t compete with the health insurance she was receiving from the government for her and her kid. No way.

Amused
Amused
9 years ago

Absent a marriage, the man is relegated to a noncustodial parent in most instances.

A man like you relegates himself to the status of a noncustodial parent within marriage. You only start fussing about being a model parent once you get served with divorce papers, and that only because you want to retain control.

Guess who is most war like in the world right now? The United States of America.

I’d say Russia — and it’s very patriarchal. Also, I note how conveniently you omitted tribal warfare.

What is the most patriarchal part of the world? Say, South America, which is also the most peaceful. Of course the pacific Islands are almost complete peaceful. I think they are patriarchal.

I would say Saudi Arabia, where women are beaten, raped and sequestered all the time, people get their body parts lopped off in the public square, etc. Also Iran — where again, we have public hangings and other charming stuff like that. Afghanistan, with their burqas, and women getting beaten in the street if they make any noise or don’t walk behind men. But, oh, no, all that is only happening because of Israel.

China has been remarkably peaceful for a remarkably long time

Is it the same China where baby girls get abandoned to die of exposure? The same China where women are kidnapped and chained to beds because some villages have pretty much depleted their female populations? The same China where people are imprisoned and tortured for their religion or political ideas? Oh, yeah, it’s very peaceful.

What causes war is very complex but it is not true (or at least overly simplistic) to say that men cause war.

I didn’t say men cause war. Seriously, you get offended when we call you stupid?

Men are the prime victims of war (civilian populations most not always were not targeted until relatively recently with so called “strategic” bombing)

This is false. Civilian deaths far outnumbered military deaths in Europe in World War II. Or are you a revisionist, too? In fact, even before World War II, international laws about sparing civilians were enacted in response to the growing practice of either targeting civilians or indiscriminately causing their deaths. Or what, civilian deaths don’t count unless they are intended?

Women are almost always more materialistic than men. Most consumer goods are purchased by or for women (or to impress them). To the extent that war is caused by materialism, the finger points at women. MGTOW don’t need large SUVs or houses.

False. Most people I see driving luxury cars are men. But no, you only indulge in luxuries “to impress” women. How very convenient for you. Men like you are most materialistic of all because you even view women as acquisitions. For shame.

I had a bet going with a friend on how long you’d last this time before resorting to personal attacks. Looks like I won 10 bucks. As for the rest, TL;DR.

Your friend is a moron, and you are a hypocrite. You repeatedly attacked me personally, even before today.

For someone working so hard in the house, you sure spend a lot of time posting here though.

For someone braving the awful Arctic weather and the “grueling” traffic AND doing his own laundry, you sure spend a lot more time posting here though.

Amused
Amused
9 years ago

Are you pregnant right now? If not, shut up.

Are you doing laundry right now? If not, shut up.

These statements make about as much sense as your statements — none.

No, pal, it’s only your statements that make no sense. My statements were addressed to your claim that men deserve women’s complete submission as a reward for something only some men do. I am not the one here claiming that I must be waited on hand in foot because some other woman somewhere is pregnant. THAT would be the equivalent of what you are saying. Most MGTOW’s are chicken hawks who have never served in the military and will never serve, but can’t shut up about all the stuff they deserve because “men” get shot at.

MGTOW Man
MGTOW Man
9 years ago

So if a boy causes a pregnancy, it is an accident (despite the existence of these things called condoms), but if a girl becomes pregnant, it is a sure sign that she is doing it intentionally and out of malice?

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Simply, put, yes, in many instances. I might substitute “selfish interest” for malice but regardless she is not considering the interests of the young boy. Yes, these young girls do want babies in many instances. Yes, it is the “key” to moving out to their own apartment, etc.

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I don’t give a rats ass if every single baby in the country is born “out of wedlock”

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You should. The evidence is massive that babies born without an involved father are more likely to commit crime and be incarcerated, more likely to become addicted to drugs, more likely to not achieve a high school diploma, more likely to be ill (mental and physical), etc.

If your cared about children and the health of this society, you would care about raising children with both mothers and fathers. Marriage is usually the way that happens.

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You are just wrong about massive discrimination against women in employment. Many work places are almost all female (banks, insurance companies, schools). Women with professional degrees in many instances make more than equivalent men. Women do not apply for some high income jobs (e.g. offshore oil platforms) in significant numbers. To the extent women make less, it can be fully explained by life and job choices.

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Again, utterly contradictory with reality. Take a look at, say, all of WWII, including allied actions (just the nuclear bombs alone killed hundreds of thousands of civilians). Any quick study of history will show massive targeting of civilian populations historically, including things like selling the entire population of captured cities as slaves.

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Yes, WWII is “relatively recently” from a historical perspective. Most wars before that point did not involve civilian populations much. Yes, sometimes, cities were killed to the last “man.” But, that was not the norm. Usually, when the population was killed to the last “man” it was literally “men” who were killed. The women usually were not killed, Yes, they may have taken as wives or or prostitutes or raped or whatever but they normally were not killed.

MGTOW Man
MGTOW Man
9 years ago

A man like you relegates himself to the status of a noncustodial parent within marriage. You only start fussing about being a model parent once you get served with divorce papers, and that only because you want to retain control.

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You know what. You know what if you are just going to make up nonsensical untrue insults out of thin air which is of course a common feminist argument tactic, I will fight fire with fire.

You are just saying such stupid things because you have a really small ugly tits. So there. Further, you are a man hating ugly fat bitch who can’t get laid even at a party of drunken sailors. So, there. You sold your children in exchange for crack fix. So, there.

Two can play at the game of just making up insulting nonsense. I bet you don’t even know what a man is because you never had one. You obviously suffer penis envy.

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The United States has engaged in a long list of wars since Russia’s last war.
You have no conception of world events at all.

The United States depending on how you count them is involved in 3 to 6 wars right now (possibly, more).

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The middle east does not do the things you describe all the time. It is news when it happens because it is not that common. We have our own atrocities here, plenty of them.

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My statements were addressed to your claim that men deserve women’s complete submission as a reward for something only some men do.

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I never said anything or suggested anything about “complete submission” — or even partial submission. The notion that women should contribute to a relationship is hardly submission.

That is an argument tactic called the “big lie.”

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Well, American women kill infants all the time (abortion).
I wouldn’t be so harsh on infantacide by the Chinese.
I don’t know how common that is but I don’t think it is that different from late term abortion.

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Actually, where i am from, it is women who drive the largest and nicest vehicles by and large. Women here tend to drive large pickup trucks or large SUVs. The woman is usually driving a nicer car than her husband. That is what I see.

I think a large portion of the time when a man has a really nice vehicle it is a “babe magnet.” If the vehicle did not attract babes, he would not have it

Dracula
Dracula
9 years ago

MGTOW Man, you said this:

No, it will never work 100% but it is working. Marriage rates are way down. Legitimate births are way down. Women are having to do an “oops” in many instances to get pregnant.

I asked you this:

I’m talking numbers here. How many self-identified MGTOWs are there? What is their effect, in concrete, measurable terms, on birth rates?

I ask again, what proof, if any, can you offer that your movement has any impact whatsoever on rates of birth or marriage?

MGTOW Man
MGTOW Man
9 years ago

MGTOW certainly have had an impact on legitimate births. It looks like to me based on the graph referenced above the actual birth rate has been fairly stable for decades.

The fact that I cannot give a specific number of MGTOWs does not mean it isn’t occurring. I observe it in many men including myself. I hear women complaining about it.

In my instance, I had more than my share of children before I went my own way, so I didn’t personally affect the birth rate. In times past, I may have remarried and had more children.

Dracula
Dracula
9 years ago

No numbers then? So you don’t know, you just believe.

MGTOW Man
MGTOW Man
9 years ago

And you can prove right now all your “beliefs” with specific numbers?

You are imposing a standard on my I doubt you impose on yourself.

Dracula
Dracula
9 years ago

Irrelevant. I’m not the one making a factual claim, so doubt away.

Santo Christoforo MD
Santo Christoforo MD
9 years ago

As the blog title clearly says, this, this whole thing is mockery. But like the feminists in general, it is humorless.

Do any of you honestly believe Futrelle is out there “lurking” all the Men’s Movement forums, chatrooms and webpages; culling evidence to support these strawman articles? If you do, then it’s back to Feminist Boot Camp for you.

http://www.soapboxin…-camps-landing/

kristinmh
kristinmh
9 years ago

I thought “MGTOW” stood for “Men Going Their Own Way”, and implied a total avoidance of women. Are you suggesting that a significant number of men are saying “Meh, I’ll fuck you, but I don’t want a relationship, and if you get pregnant you’re on your own”, and this is makes them sort of MGTOW-lites?

Dracula
Dracula
9 years ago

Actually, kristinmh, that’s in part what I was wondering. Because for my part, I’ve no intention to get married or father any children, but shying away from being involved with women is most definitely not part of my life plan.

Pecunium
9 years ago

MGTOW Manmany if not most instances, the guy didn’t consent to the babies.

These were cases in many instances of women having babies from an “oops.”

[Citation needed]

Pecunium
9 years ago

There was a chunk of time, after a really badly ended relationship (It didn’t help that I’d moved 400 miles, and my life was sort of up-ended and then it all went south, in a very big way), that I “Went My Own Way”. I’d say there was about a year when I was just not interested in dating, or any sort of romantic involvement.

Not really interested in sex either.

And that was about it. No need to tell the world how I was getting back at women; because my ex had been a right bastard and treated me badly. Because I wasn’t. How would that work? We are supposed to be sympathetic to them punishing someone who didn’t wrong them, for the wrongs someone else did?

Which why this sort of thing (and the defensive reactions trying to, “explain” why we have to be generous to their nonsense) always amuses me.

Because really, “going your own way” is easy. All you have to do it, do it. No one is stopping you. I know, because I did it. No one was trying to fix me up. A few people asked if I was seeing anyone, and I said I wasn’t, end of story

Rutee Katreya
9 years ago

What is the most patriarchal part of the world? Say, South America, which is also the most peaceful. Of course the pacific Islands are almost complete peaceful. I think they are patriarchal.

Not sure if trolling or just stupid. I don’t have any knowledge about the Pacific Islanders, but South America has ongoing military forces fighting in its own borders, *RIGHT NOW*, and has for decades. They’re *STILL* dealing with drug lords that have actual, honest-to-fucking-god armies. This is your standard for ‘peaceful’? You know what mine is? Maybe, *MAYBE*, Canada.

China has been remarkably peaceful for a long time

You weren’t actually paying attention to it this century, were you? At all? Or ever, for that matter?

Where do I begin?

There was the Boxer Rebellion, the Chinese Civil War, and their military intervention in the Korean war, as well as an invasion of Vietnam in 1979….

Then there’s the fact that historically they’ve had big motherfucking wars. One of the most lethal wars, by sheer death toll, ever, was fought in China; the Taiping Rebellion. And it wasn’t fought under modern warfare principles.

In fact, the Chinese have sole credit to 4 of the top 10 most lethal wars in human history by death toll alone, and 3 of the top 5 most lethal wars by percentage of the total human population exterminated, including the dubious honor of the number 1 spot. Of course, to be fair, throughout human history there have been many Chinas, and they’re really not all the same society, but this is your gold standard for peacefulness? Even the current one is pretty warlike, and the entire region is scared to hell that China might actually militarily act *OUTSIDE* its borders again.

What causes war is very complex but it is not true (or at least overly simplistic) to say that men cause war. Men are the prime victims of war (civilian populations most not always were not targeted until relatively recently with so called “strategic” bombing).

You’ve got a funny habit of switching between relative periods, don’t you? China can only be called ‘peaceful for a long time’ on a Meriken’s time scale, but you can’t really say Total War is a new invention on that scale either, since it got its kickstart in the USian civil war (Bear in mind elements of it have been around for a fairly long time, just not on the same level).

It’s true that you can’t say it’s just men in a serious sense; although men have engineered very nearly every war in history, they also had near exclusive holds on political power, and war is just not nearly as profitable or doable in the modern era. In fact, in a serious sense, I’d go against my peers, if they disagree, and say unequivocally that a gender equal society is not by default a peaceful one. The Nordic raiders had a fairly gender equal society until Christianization, and they were perfectly happy pillaging and killing; men and women both went on the raids, fought, and died.

Women are almost always more materialistic than men. Most consumer goods are purchased by or for women (or to impress them). To the extent that war is caused by materialism, the finger points at women. MGTOW don’t need large SUVs or houses.

Um, SUVs aren’t bought out of ‘materialism’, regardless of who’s doing the buying. They’re bought for ‘safety’ (Air quotes because it isn’t, but that’s another matter). As to houses… dude, not to burst your bubble, but most of the people I’ve heard who most wanted a house, for its own sake, were men. However, I’ve also heard both genders express a desire for it out of a warped desire that it’s the only ‘proper’ way to raise kids. Now, I don’t know which gender, if any, is in fact the most materialistic, but I do know men aren’t some spiritual purity on this count. I’ve seen far too many pissing contests over computer specs, collection sizes, etc, to fall for that shit.

Of course it doesn’t count for anything in the end. I’ve known plenty of sleazebags with girlfriends and genuinely nice people who were alone.

Poke an MRA and ‘Nice Guy’ philosophy always pops out.

True, the way some women go on about being “domestic slaves” you’d think they were working 12-hour days in salt mines while being whipped by overseers. Honestly, if I had to choose between staying at home, popping a load of laundry into the washing machine, cooking lunch while watching TV, and playing with the kids, versus getting up every morning to brave the weather and traffic to go to work, I know which one I’d pick.

Oh really? You sure? You sure you wanna be primary caretaker? Because I *Promise you* there is are women who want kids and don’t want to be the primary caretaker. If you’re that sure you’ll love this trade, go. Go forth, Hengist. But you’ll quickly learn that it’s not nearly as easy as you think.

Really, that you characterize taking care of the kids as just ‘playing’ with them is a large part of why feminists know most men don’t really understand the role at all. You got a warped image of it from the media.

cynickal
cynickal
9 years ago

Just yesterday, I saw a woman at the mall. I could have had her several times. She made that very clear. I didn’t. She had a another guy with her and she introduced him as her finance. I suppose I was supposed to be jealous, but I wasn’t. I felt sorry for him. I gave him “congratulations” and he nervously responded “thanks.” They walked off.

Cool story, Bro!

Just yesterday, I saw a woman at Denny’s. I could have had her several times. She made that very clear. She kept asking me how I was, bringing me food, smiling at me, and making small talk. I didn’t “have her.” She had a another guy with her and she introduced him as her finance. I suppose I was supposed to be jealous, but I wasn’t. I was supposed to feel sorry for him, but I wasn’t. I gave him “congratulations” and he nervously responded “thanks.” They walked off AND I HAD TO PAY HER!!!!
[INTERNET RAGE!!!]