Another day, another apologia for male violence from the Men’s Rights crowd. This time the apologist is W. F. Price at The Spearhead, who uses several recent news stories involving violent men as an excuse to attack feminism.
Repeated provocations against men, systematic discrimination against men, and state-sanctioned debt slavery are starting to have the inevitable effect. In a triumph for the feminist movement, men are lashing out violently against women, fulfilling the feminist fantasy of a gender war.
In the old days, everything was (presumably) peachy keen between the sexes. Then along came the feminists, and all hell broke loose. Those “take back the night” marches feminists love so much? They’re just red flags to the bulls – that is, our society’s ample stock of “mentally unstable and out-of-luck men.” You don’t want to make these guys mad!
[W]omen were encouraged to be militant against all males, which can only have unfortunate results, given the hands-down male superiority in combat. …
In other words, the fact that there are violent men out there is why women shouldn’t complain about violent men. Presumably the only marches women should be organizing would be “No, Go Ahead, You Keep the Night” marches. Don’t want to offend those rapists –that’ll just make them even rapier than usual!
According to Price, though, feminists actually like violence against women — because it keeps them in business.
For feminism to exist as a valid movement, there must be violent conflict, so many of the efforts of feminists have sought to provoke just that. … You see, for a feminist to justify her job there must be some degree of brutality against women. … So, if you are a feminist, the hapless women murdered or assaulted by the damaged men feminists have created are necessary sacrifices for advancing the feminist agenda.
So not only do the feminists provoke these “damaged men” – they created them in the first place, by being so feministy.
Wouldn’t this whole provoke-the-men strategy make life more dangerous for feminist women as well? No, because feminists are all rich ladies, and everyone knows that rich ladies are never beaten or raped or murdered:
[W]e all know that feminism has never been about the typical woman who lives a humble life, but rather the ambitious elite who want to have access to the big boys and big money on Capitol Hill and Wall Street. … Disadvantaged women are truly the cannon fodder of feminists.
So what “proof” does Price offer for his claim that men are “lashing out” at women because of feminism? He cites three news stories: one dealing with a woman-hating trucker who’s accused of killing several prostitutes; another involving a man who went on a shooting rampage at a church, killing his wife and wounding two others; and finally, the case of James Ray Palmer, the Arkansas man who shot up the offices of the judge who’d handled his divorce and custody case more than a decade earlier. (I wrote about his case here.)
How do these cases relate to feminism? You’ll have to ask Price, because none of the news stories suggest any connection, and Price doesn’t explain why he thinks there is one. True, the trucker is said to be a misogynist, but misogyny is far more ancient than feminism. Meanwhile, we have no evidence that the church shooter was angry at any women other than his wife.
In the case of Palmer, there may be an indirect connection, if it turns out that he was influenced by the angry, violent rhetoric of the Men’s Rights movement. As I pointed out in my post on Palmer, many in the MRM have made a martyr out of Thomas Ball, who committed suicide on the steps of a courthouse, leaving behind an manifesto that urged men to literally burn down police stations — and courthouses. It is certainly conceivable that Palmer’s courthouse rampage was inspired by this sort of rhetoric.
But to blame feminism for any of this is ass-backwards. Feminism is a response to misogyny, not its cause. To blame feminism for violence against women is a bit like blaming Jews for provoking the Holocaust. (Forgive me, Godwin; it was the clearest analogy.)
Price ends his piece by urging women to, in effect, shut up and fix him a sandwich:
Women’s best bet for security is not in denouncing and fighting men, as feminists would have it, but in cooperating with them and taking on their proper role.
Then he ends with a weird coda suggesting that feminists should be locked up for having the temerity to speak up in the first place:
The United States will once again be a righteous society only when feminists are jailed for interfering with families, and their academic apologists are removed by security from their jobs in taxpayer-funded educational institutions. This would be the most humane course of action to take. Far more humane, in fact, than provoking men and women to physically attack one another, as feminists would have it today so that they can unleash state agents on confused and demoralized families.
I didn’t have the stomach to read all of the comments responding to Price’s argument, such as it is. But here are some highlights – lowlights, really – of the highly upvoted comments I did read.
The ironically named Anti Idiocy seconds Price’s basic argument:
Anger against feminism has been building for years. As the men’s rights movement has gained momentum, feminists and their lackeys have doubled down and become more virulent in their anti-male hatred and propaganda. Women today are becoming more and more nasty on an interpersonal basis, and they are doing so more frequently. A breakpoint will come. It will probably take a catalyst; another severe economic downturn might do it. But it will come. Feminists and their pet femboys will push things until it does.
Wait. If the Men’s Rights movement is, in effect, provoking feminists to get more feministy, then wouldn’t (by Price’s logic) the allegedly increased violence be the fault of the MRAs?
Rod worries that in the case of a real gender war, men might actually lose – all because of those darned “white knights” and their reluctance to beat up the ladies:
I’m afraid that if it ever came down to a real physical war between the sexes, men would unfortunately lose. There are too many men who can’t stand the sight of men harming women, and would immediately step in to save them. Perhaps nature instilled in us a visceral reaction to women’s suffering, making us want to step in and help, and at one time in the history of our species, that reaction was no doubt a salutary thing. Now it just works against us.
Antiphon, meanwhile, blames it all on the Jews. Or, more specifically, the Jewesses, who apparently control the feminist movement in the same way that their husbands control the banks.
Needless to say, this being The Spearhead, Antiphon’s comment has three times as many upvotes as downvotes. Apparently, the only thing worse than a feminist is a Jewish feminist.
I guess my Nazi analogy earlier in this post wasn’t so out of place after all.
shorter brandon (again): why arent we having the conversation i want to have? What About Brandon?
I think Price is right.
Violence against women will diminish strongly after the influence of feminism decreases sharply.
This is the goal of MRAs. To fight against violence against women, through the reversal of feminist policies.
Rapes are much more likely to occur in feminist countries of northern europe than in patriarchal countries of southern europe (like Portugal).
http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:RMesy2hOu_MJ:www.cwasu.org/filedown.asp?file%3DSweden.pdf+sweden+rape+daphne+PDF+attrition&hl=fr&gl=fr&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESgTVMDuyx3dJt1eK6gvigVLKKwLk71sYyGxr49ac3e8fEQtGiPFfJq-JutNw4-IuG6UAHXchOe3eDTaxMSDw69wf4uONifglpfQt5dedWj2AQXxHLTUiBxtHu7CEzoEHFmWP-TT&sig=AHIEtbTUcAnXOfqVp7-cJ8o0IZHyuzc5Jg&pli=1
Also, feminism pushes women to follow their libido and fuck with psychopaths, the result being that more women get battered or killed.
Good men want to help women tame their sexual bestiality, for their own good.
Such as a security guard not intervening as a woman is getting mugged…but they call the cops instead and keep their distance.
That security guard is doing their job correctly, then. They’re instructed not to intervene physically, because of the liability if they open a can of whoop-ass on someone who didn’t deserve it, and the chance they’ll become a second hostage or victim if the mugger turns out to be seriously dangerous.
It’s nothing to do with gender; although it’s not glamorous and sometimes leads to ugly scenarios, it makes more sense for security guards to not be allowed Batman tactics.
Or the stereotypical, “men jumping in front of a bullet for a woman”
How often did that ever happen, seriously?
And shit, is anyone doing the gender math in a moment like that?
“Oh no, a mad gunman! He’s aiming right at… oh. It’s just a woman. Never mind. Phew, I was about to do something hasty.”
Paniorpa, you’re just openly in favor of torturing women.
I don’t think it goes much deeper than that.
Brandon: How often does jumping in front of a bullet for a woman, as an issue, come up for you? o.O
That’s the most parsimonious conclusion. After all, what does the writer complain about? Women not being in their place, off doing unfeminine things like thinking.
Ergo time traveling feminists.
@Bostonian: I look after myself first and foremost, then my family, then my girlfriend, then my friends.
@Holly:I am not really angry. Nature has a strange way of balancing things out. I also don’t think they will ever achieve such a “war”. So I see no reason to get angry at something that is most likely not going to happen.
These guys are just talking. They aren’t harming my family at all. Now if they came to my house and demanded my mother so they can kill her…I would kill them.
Oh, thank God. For a moment there I was worried that this might affect Brandon somehow, but I’m relieved to hear that Brandon is okay.
@OzyMandias42: That is why I prefixed it with “stereotypical”.
The point being was that lots of men are conditioned to value their mothers, wives, girlfriends more than they value themselves.
@Holly: In what way, right now is Price’s article endangering your family? You have a better chance of getting struck by lightning 100 times then this article harming you.
@Panorpia:
Good men want to help women tame their sexual bestiality, for their own good.
I’ve got a quote for that one too! Check it out: “[Woman] is more carnal than a man, as is clear from her many carnal abominations.”
There were plenty of ‘good men’ around in 1486, trying to tame women’s sexual bestiality. It didn’t do much to reduce violence against women, though…
Misogyny. We mock it.
Price’s article is misogynist, so we are mocking it.
“off doing unfeminine things like thinking”
Thinking? It doesn’t show.
Women wouldn’t have to rely so heavily on the work of so many devoted manginas like our most revered host if they were as gifted as men when it comes to producing ideas.
Feminism is the battle between two armies of men for the control of pussies, with women mostly watching with interest from the tribunes, cheerleading their favorite mangina.
Go David! Go Pierre Bourdieu! Go Barack! ♥ ♥ ♥
So someone tell me again how peaceful and reasonable MRAs are again? How all MRA sites are just full of activism on behalf of real needs of actual men?
@Holly: In what way, right now is Price’s article endangering your family? You have a better chance of getting struck by lightning 100 times then this article harming you.
guys i need help. apparently david changed the blogs motto to “misogyny. i discuss the long term effects of it.” but i cant see it so i think my internet might be broken…
Because I have yet to see any MRAs actually working for prison reform, or helping the problem of homeless men or even male victims of rape.
@Holly: Ya I get the point of this site. And the article Price wrote was stupid. But you asked if I was angry about it. There is a difference between playfully mocking something and getting angry at it. Price’s article is dumb but It is nothing really to get infuriated about. It’s one blog in a sea of blogs. And nothing is going to come of his writings.
paniorpa: So you’re a stand up philosopher, eh?
Feminism is the battle between two armies of men for the control of pussies, with women mostly watching with interest from the tribunes, cheerleading their favorite mangina.
if you are going to say insane things could you follow owlslaves lead and say insane things that are funny. look up ‘super-dogs’ and then we can brainstorm ideas.
paniorpa is just a standard issue creepy old man, nothing to see here.
Paniorpa is so far from reality he’s not really worth arguing with, but there might be some value in pointing to him and saying “Dudes, this is the logical outcome of MRA thinking. Do you really want to be buddies with that?”
This isn’t even wrong. It’s just… separate from reality. It’s as worthy of discussion as “Feminism is the consumption of toads for religious purposes.” I mean, duh it’s not; do we even have to talk about this?
Huh. Paniorpa, you’ve given me a whole new outlook on my cultural anthropology classes. Pierre Bourdieu as mangina sex god, fighting for all the vaginas. “Hey baby, I want to put my doxa in your social capital”?
paniorpa: You’re arguing that feminist thought doesn’t have any women contributing to it?
That’s news to Christine de Pizan, Simone de Beauvoir, Virginia Woolf, Doris Lessing, Mary McCarthy, Djuna Barnes, Colette, Betty Friedan, Germaine Greer, Kate Millett, Adrienne Rich, bell hooks, Audre Lorde, Diane di Prima, Sylvia Plath, Anne Sexton, Julia Kristeva, Helene Cixous, Catherine Clement, Andrea Dworkin, Susie Bright, Carol Queen, Pat Califia, Ariel Levy, Camille Paglia, Michelle Tea, Kathleen Hanna, Alison Bechdel, Julia Serano, Inga Muscio, Barbara Ehrenreich, Katha Pollitt, Alice Walker, Lucille Clifton, Jessica Valenti, Amanda Marcotte, Jaclyn Friedman, Kate Harding…
and me.
“two armies of men for the control of pussies” LMAO!!!!