From Human Stupidity, an MRA blog rather obsessed with underage girls and the alleged evil of age of consent laws:
[I]f a 15 year old … can decide to have sex with a 16 year old … [h]ow come she cannot have sex with a 35 year old? Age discrimination by law?
Are you worried about manipulation of the tender 15 year old? I have a solution:
what about legalizing sex with underage adolescents, if they first undergo an hour of mandatory counselling and a 2 day cool off period? That should take care of this issue. This would guarantee safety for the 15 year old against being conned or manipulated. More safety that is offered to 21 year old tipsy Friday night party girls who may feel sorry for what they did yesterday
I think he might actually be serious here. Though it’s pretty clear he’d be happy with any excuse to make it legal for 35 year-old men to have sex with 15 year-old girls.
I have a counter-proposal for Human Stupidity: Any adult wishing to have sex with a minor should undergo mandatory counseling until (s)he realizes that it’s a really bad idea. Not sure how that would be enforced, but we could work out the details, I’m sure…
@Blitzgal: While those cases are often handled by local news outlets, the “trend” is often talked about on major national news networks.
@Captain Bathrobe: Really? Are you kidding me. That has to be the lamest attempt to counter a POV. The article links each woman to the news site that reported it. All WND did was compile them unto one page.
The article links to women that have been accused, convicted or have given confessions of sexual misconduct.
If you want a few more links…here you go:
http://www.zimbio.com/The+50+Most+Infamous+Female+Teacher+Sex+Scandals
http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1901762,00.html
@Bostonian: So far there has been two links posted (Jezebel and Shakesville) about that topic. Count those two against the hundreds of posts about the DSK rape trials.
That is a pretty terrible ratio between female teacher rapists/DSK rape trial
To be the equivalent of the MRM, feminists would have to be advocating raping the young boys. You yourself have said you have not seen that sort of advocacy.
Feminist sites are primarily about feminism and women, not men’s issues, or boys issues, so the DSK case, which is recent, and shows many of the problems with the legal system, is written about more, and more recently, than women who abuse boys.
How many MRM sites advocate for the boy victims of rape? I have not seen any at all, yet.
I have seen many self identified MRAs advocate for raping 14 year old girls here in comments, and in posts to several men’s rights sites.
I’m sorry, Brandon, that I cannot link you to hundreds of posts right now, but my time here is limited.
If you’d like to assume the burden of proof, you can feel free to find me a feminist who supports women who sleep with young boys. Go right ahead. Give me the link. I won’t even ask for several hundred.
Brandon, odd-why are you just talking about women who have been convicted? I thought you were claiming feminists were okay with it-please link the ones that are okay with it?
http://shakespearessister.blogspot.com/2009/05/child-rape-hilarious.html
A feminist site regarding Mary Kay LeTourneau.
A quote from the post, which is about Mary Kay LeTourneau-hosted “Hot for Teacher” night, which happened at a nightclub in Seattle
“Um… the fuck? It’s one thing to condone creepy schoolgirl fantasies (see: the poster for this very event, linked here, plus every fetish night in the world); it’s quite another to hold a party for a convicted child rapist who began grooming her victim when he was in the second grade. Would a nightclub have hosted a similar party for this guy, who raped three boys, between 6 and 10? Or this guy, 25, who raped a 12-year-old girl? Or this guy, 24, who raped a 10-year-old girl? Or the first two guys in this post–self-defense instructors who raped their female teenage students?
Of course not. And we shouldn’t give Letournau a pass just because she’s a sweet-looking white lady and her now-husband says he gave his consent. Victimization is victimization, even when it comes in a female (and thus non-“threatening”) package.”
Please note that the post calls the rape and victimization of a young teen, rape and victimization of a young teen, not seduction, and not sex.
I’m actually pretty okay with stuff like the Romeo and Juliet laws (in Washington state I believe a 16-year-old can legally have sex with anyone up to age 21, which is a too high imho but not horrifyingly so, and 15-year-olds can have sex with each other as well as with 16 and 17-year-olds) because within a peer group you can easily have a difference of a couple years without a severe power imbalance — especially when some kids enter kindergarten as early as 4, while others are held back until age 6, you get people at the same basic maturity level who aren’t the exact same age.
If two people are only a few years apart I find it believable (on a case-by-case basis) that they might simply like each other, and the older person is not necessarily taking advantage of the younger person (especially with older teens, where maturation rates start flattening out a bit compared to childhood.) But when there is a significant gap, or even a generational gap, then I am much more inclined to believe the “relationship” is actually predatory behavior by the older party; one doesn’t generally try to find someone so much more inexperienced and vulnerable than oneself without intending to take advantage of that inexperience and vulnerability.
“… How many MRM sites advocate for the boy victims of rape? I have not seen any at all, yet …”
When sexual predators are a bonus (September 3, 2011)
http://www.avoiceformen.com/men/boys/when-sexual-predators-are-a-bonus/
An article written THIS WEEK on “A voice for men”. Not a random post by a deranged idiot made to “Reddit” in April of last year — a full length article, written this week.
You people make up a fictitious men’s rights movement that does not exist, then make fun of it, then congratulate yourselves. Who do you think you are fooling? What purpose does this absurd policy serve?
The MRM:
Equal protection under the law
Equal protection of government
Feminism:
Hate
Brandon, it is incorrect for you to assume that if feminists don’t write enough on a topic to satisfy your arbitrary standards, then that must mean they actually are against you on the topic. I can’t find articles from feminists saying it is wrong to break peoples’ windows. That doesn’t mean feminists want people to break other peoples’ windows. It just means that it is a topic they aren’t dealing with because they already have a lot of other stuff to deal with.
Several other posters have actually given you examples of feminists condemning adult women who rape underage boys, but you have hand waved that away by saying it’s not enough. Then you ignored the many examples of MRA’s that do in fact condone adult men raping underage girls. You continue to move the goalposts, and the only reason I am bothering to respond to you is for the sake of lurkers.
Brandon’s just playing another round of “Feminists have to denounce my foes or they stand with my foes” I see.
Brandon, provide evidence we’re cool with this shit. You’ve had us tell you we don’t approve, you have been linked to folks saying otherwise.. fucking substantiate your jackassery already.
I’m actually pretty okay with stuff like the Romeo and Juliet laws (in Washington state I believe a 16-year-old can legally have sex with anyone up to age 21, which is a too high imho but not horrifyingly so, and 15-year-olds can have sex with each other as well as with 16 and 17-year-olds) because within a peer group you can easily have a difference of a couple years without a severe power imbalance — especially when some kids enter kindergarten as early as 4, while others are held back until age 6, you get people at the same basic maturity level who aren’t the exact same age.
yeah, this.
people mature at different rates. some people are ready to have sex in the their mid-teens. some people are not. deciding which one of those groups you fall into is a really tough decision to make, but not one that requires a blanket rule.
this of course means ready to have sex with somebody of a similar level of experience and maturity, not a someone significantly older.
Isn’t it cute how Anthony Zarat will pick and choose when and what things are relevant to the MRM? Oh silly Anthony, you don’t fool anyone.
Anthony Zarat, you are the same person who wants a virtual wife to replace the one you allege will leave you.
Everything David has posted, he has identified where and when it came from.
You have not identified anyone feminist who advocates the rape of young teen boys the way self identified MRAs advocate raping young teen girls.
When sexual predators are a bonus (September 3, 2011)
http://www.avoiceformen.com/men/boys/when-sexual-predators-are-a-bonus/
another lazy ‘if i arbitrarily define feminism as something if find icky then it turns out i can make feminism responsible for all the evil in the world’ screed
aka every voice for men article ever
what do you think this proves besides that you will believe just about anything as long as it paints women in a bad light?
@Bostonian: So far there has been two links posted (Jezebel and Shakesville) about that topic. Count those two against the hundreds of posts about the DSK rape trials.
Wait, what does that have to do with anything? Are you saying the head of the International Monetary Fund is a fifteen-year-old boy?
That… actually explains a lot about the economy.
All money everywhere will henceforth be invested in playing Halo.
@shaenon
every minute feminists are talking about dsk is a minute theyre not talking abut Brandons Problems. and thats… bad…
@Holly:
[quote]Obviously it wasn’t really rape, you see, because maybe it was just fondling and fondling’s not so bad and did you notice the judge was female and then he goes on to complain about not being allowed to watch a video of the assault.[/quote]
That man is disgusting. Excuse me while I go vomit.
Anthony Zarat, in the link you provided, most of the commenters blamed feminism for how female rapists are judged less harshly by the general public than male rapists. This is not the fault of feminists, though. It is an effect of the double standard that says that girls are dirty when they have sex, and boys are lucky when they have sex. This is something feminists are against. The people at A Voice for Men identified a real problem, but they are blaming the wrong people for it.
Anthony, it’s true that most MRAs don’t see age of consent as an MR issue.
But some, like the guy behind Human Stupidity, do, and these guys get very little criticism from other MRAs. Human Stupidity is linked to by a number of MR blogs — including, until recently, by the False Rape Society. In Mala FIde, a blog popular with MRAs, regularly runs pieces by him.
Another manosphere dude obsessed with age of consent and why it’s supposedly evil and “misandrist” is Jay Hammers; he’s written 16 posts for The Spearhead.
omg -_- Is MRAL rly trying to make a “I missed out on my awesome high school sex adventures!” argument? -_-;;
“What if you never got the chance to have sex with a 15 year old when you were 15?”
What does that have to do with anything, MRAL?
@MRAL
I really don’t understand what 15 years old have that women over the age of consent don’t. Except for less life experience.
edit- probably should say ‘people’ rather than ‘women’.
Apparently missing out on awkward high school sex makes statutory rape okay. Except, you know, for the part where it totally doesn’t.