A redditor called fxexular has put together an amazing compilation of fun “facts” about feminism from assorted Redditors. It’s a bit like reading the descriptions of an elephant offered by six blind men who are also drunk misogynist assholes. Among my favorites:
feminism, at best, focuses on relatively trivial female issues instead of grotesque male issues and at worst is pure man hate.
feminism. Where the most privileged people in society can whine about their “oppression of opulence.”
Feminism is about strong males using law to further marginalize weak males.
The ruling class uses feminism as a tool to keep men, young men and boy’s down
It’s like pissing in a bucket of water – piss enough, and you’ll dilute the water to mostly piss. “Feminism” is a bucket of piss these days, from all the crazy and ignorant that attached to it over the years, especially the past decade when it became a fad.
feminism destroys men’s confidence and sense of satisfaction in being male.
every feminist is a abuser or a abuser apologist or a shield for other abusers.
Feminists don’t even think of men as human.
Most women and feminists view gay men as accessories.
these feminist nut cases have only one goal: total female supremacy at the expense of men. Fuck every last one of these haggard harpies. Fuck ’em all.
I used to hold doors, I dont anymore. I just let it slam in the face of whoever is behind me b/c I have been publicly embarrassed by many a feminist for being polite.
Feminists are like witches, but this isn’t the The Land of Oz, Dorothy. There are no “good” feminists.
Brainwashed weak feminist men are a favorite of feminists. They don’t treat them very well, but they use them to great effect.
i’m mad as hell at the way men are treated by the feminist gynecocracy
The people who dismiss /mr are like abusers; they’re looking for any excuse to piss all over something they know is logical and true because they can’t handle it emotionally.
Many feminists do hate men and want to emasculate them. While I’m thankful for the few who don’t I feel that their silence allows the groups like NOW to exploit men and women alike for their own aims.
I know it sounds good to believe that feminism was always about equality but go and read up on the first wave suffragettes. They were basically domestic terrorists in many cases.
The feminism of the 60’s also lead to the vitriol hatred of men.
I suspect that the butt-ugly women who started feminism in the 60’s were confronted for the first time with an efficient mating market (after the sexual revolution), and they couldn’t stand “losing” to the pretty girls
[Feminists’] entire shtick is to repeat misinformation and when that fails bust out the unsubstantiated personal attacks
Yeah, no irony there!
I think this one is my favorite, though:
I will never socialize with feminists after I learned the darkness of their philosophy.
Most of these quotes are from the Men’s Rights subreddit. Every quote in fxexular’s list that I went to look at in context had gotten more upvotes than downvotes. So they must be true!
EDITED TO ADD: Oops! Forgot the link. I added it above. And here is is again, just in case.
Wait, so you’re saying you’re a Jamaican man, Societal Contract? Or do you prefer HINDU?
Not overly sensitive, just that different people attach different importance to things. I took SC’s comments as a passing remark, of no more significance than, say ‘people smoke less these days’.
If you’re in the mood to bite: http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2010/02/15/dear-usians-on-the-internet/
“Wait, so you’re saying you’re a Jamaican man, Societal Contract? Or do you prefer HINDU?”
Jamaican is a nationality, Snowy. Hindu is a religion. One can be both. Its not either/or.
And Jamaica has a pretty population of Hindus, by the way.
They also don’t give blow jobs 😉
You’ve also claimed direct connection to the Indian subcontinent in the past.
Oh, oops, sorry! What I meant was, do you prefer to be called HINDU rather than Societal Contract? I believe you are the same person.
“Not overly sensitive, just that different people attach different importance to things. I took SC’s comments as a passing remark, of no more significance than, say ‘people smoke less these days’.”
Oh great. I’m so glad!
“If you’re in the mood to bite: http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2010/02/15/dear-usians-on-the-internet/”
Wow, what a great link Magpie! That’s a very interesting article. Thing is, I’m pretty sure I’ve read it before. You see, I actually read other things on the internet besides Manboobz. And it doesn’t seem to have anything to do with what we’re talking about right now. But thanks!
It looks much the same from over here, Snowy.
Well, that’s nice, Magpie.
I think the fact that its false “passing comment” is a good enough reason to call her out…Why are you so defensive about this?
SC is indeed the same person who posted earlier as HINDU. Same IP address.
Magpie (and SC/HINDU), I don’t think anyone here disagrees that people in different countries have different ideas about sexuality. I think what is frustrating about SC/HINDU’s arguments is 1) that she’s asserting, based on no evidence, that essentially all women throughout history thought blowjobs were icky and immoral and didn’t do them, and 2) that she’s essentially saying American (well, North American) and European women today who like giving blowjobs have basically been brainwashed by porn.
Most of us here (as far as I can gather from the comments) think that she’s wrong on the facts here — she’s given no evidence for her various assertions other than “ask your grandma” — and that her insinuations about women being brainwashed by porn are rather insulting to women who have different ideas about sexuality than she does.
Also, SC/HINDU, I’m curious — you’ve referred to India in the past as your “native land.” I gather from your recent remarks that you live in Jamaica. Were you born in India? Do you consider yourself Jamaican, Indian, Indian-Jamaican, or what?
Yeah, I’m clearly just not getting it. I honestly took it as a casual observation, and didn’t understand the vehemence of the replies. shutting up now :]
SC is also arguing that a single text, aimed at a very select audience is normative for an entire group of co-exisiting cultures, and defined the behavioral norms of millions of people.
And mirrors those attitudes worldwide; until something changed in the early 1990s, and US themed porn took over the world.
Other works (Martial, Ovid, personal letters and diaries, wookcuts. etchings, statuary [a huge body of which can be found in Indian temples], graffitos, frescoes, etc.) don’t count. Just the Kama Sutra.
So, as this seems to be the same person who previously claimed a Ph.D in either Anthropology, or Psychology, why do you think such a thing? What supporting evidence (and we’ve already covered the whole, “my experience” thing. As a man, well over 35 I can say that women have been, enthusiastically, engaging in blowjobs; from my experience [and without any coaxing… proactively] for quite some time), have you for this claim?
Dave: SC has said she’s lived, “in lots of countries”. Apparently she’s also spoken to lots of grandparents, all of whom said blowjobs are something decent women don’t do, only prostitutes.
For which, as I said when this whole thing started, [Citation needed].
Soc K:
I know, right?, US women sure are stupid and easily led, aren’t they?
Wellllllll, that’s actually even weirder then.
I don’t know why you’d equate your experience with my grandma’s, since she hasn’t lived in many different countries across the globe and would only be acquainted with blowjob etiquette in one or two U.S. towns.
And I don’t know why you’d try to equate your experience with the experience of all the people in all the countries you haven’t lived in.
And I don’t know why you’d try to equate your experience with the experience of all the people who lived before you were alive.
(And I guess I don’t know why you’d say “What I’m saying is that blow jobs have been mainstreamed only recently in the West via porn to the point where now men EXPECT it” if what you were really talking about was “not the West but at every point on the globe,” but I guess that’s a separate point, and I don’t really care.)
Your experience is your experience. And if what you really meant was “In your experience,” that’s cool. But that’s just not what you said,
Wow. Another baseless, inaccurate, generalization. And, yeah, I already asked my grandma.
You know I’m reminded of the time, long ago, when Twisty Faster did a post all about how no woman had ever really liked giving blowjobs and that, basically, all the women who claimed that they liked it were lying to themselves or deluded by the influence of porn. And then in classic Twisty fashion, she sat back and watched the comments thread turn into a brawl.
Now, I’m not a radical feminist but I think Twisty’s a hell of a writer. And even when disagreeing with her (which I do as often as not) I can understand the nuance of her arguments. What was funny about that comment thread though, was after hundreds of posts of women defending the sexual agency of their own oral proclivities -and hundreds of other posts declaring that there was no such thing- not a single poster brought up the most obvious and relevant counter argument:
What difference does it make what a self-identified, radical feminist, lesbian thinks about giving blowjobs? I mean, it’s interesting, sure. But once you’re starting from the argument that a particular, consensual sexual act is “nasty” what the hell else is there to say? And why should I care?
Don’t like giving blow jobs? Don’t give ’em. Don’t give them out of a sense of duty and, for the love of Pete, don’t give them as “treats”. No one should do anything sexually that they don’t genuinely enjoy or at least genuinely enjoy through the pleasure of pleasing. So don’t. Date guys who don’t like getting blowjobs and everyone’s happy.
Just, you know, keep your thinly veiled, slightly hostile judgmental attitude about those who do give fellatio out of your arguments.
Nobinayamu: Point. I wasn’t (and am not) all that worried about the actual opinions of women on blowjobs. Them as likes sharing them with me are swell. Them as don’t are swell too (though they are, IME, the smaller portion, and by far).
What I was (and am) addressing is the willful denial of good argumentation, the assertion of magical knowledge; which refutes all other evidence, and the use of a single (questionable) source to support claims which are so broad it would take hordes of researchers decades to examine, all of which needs only one example to disprove. It rises to the level of being impossible to separate, for technique, from a Meller, or an Ion or a Marc.
It is almost as virtuoso as an NWO.
I just figure as long as people have had mouths, and some people have had penises, it never did take rocket science to put two and two together here.
Soc K:
Jamaican men would be in ecstacy to hear that there are regular, ordinary women out here who need to believe that [fellatio is normal].
Hereshele:
I know, right?, US women sure are stupid and easily led, aren’t they?
Whoa. “For the women, the men are part of the tourist package, and for the men, the women are part of their earnings. They can’t help but come into conflict.” Talk about an intersection of ideas about race and sex and class…
Well, by all means let’s view the prevalence of specific, consensual, heterosexual sex acts, primarily, through the lens of sexual tourism/quasi-prostitution of a small island nation that has an unusual history when it comes to the “intersection of ideas about race and sex and class…” And then, you know, we can all ask our grandparents what kind of lube they prefer.
Makes perfect sense.
In all seriousness, though, the race class sexual tourism thing in the caribbean and in some African countries is not especially new. And it is fascinating… in a way.
Pecunium, certainly I never meant to imply that there was any worry, on your part, about women’s opinions on fellatio. I was commenting, more, on the tone of the turn in discussion. And, as Hershele pointed out, the implication that American women have been tricked somehow by porn.
“the implication that American women have been tricked somehow by porn.”
Tricked by porn? No. I’m thinking more along the lines of influenced to varying degrees, much like how, or exactly like how perhaps, we are influenced by messages and images in non-porn media, which is a HUGE field of study in Feminist Theory and Womens’ Studies.
Booking my flight to Jamaica as we speak 😉
I love me some “jerk chicken”.
Interesting re-framing of your initial argument.
Whatever.
I prefer curried goat with a side of rice and pigeon peas with some coco bread. Or ackee and saltfish. But I do make a mean jerk sauce. The secret is the allspice.
“Booking my flight to Jamaica as we speak 😉
I love me some “jerk chicken”.”
Again with the winking. Do you have some kind of a nervous tick?
“I was arrested for using a 10-letter word starting with ‘c’, and I would marry no woman who wasn’t one.”
I don’t know if this proves fellatio was mainstream in the ’60s, but the fact that Lenny Bruce expected his audience to understand the reference and everything suggests it wasn’t considered the bleeding edge of sexual perversion; the idea that a man could marry a woman who was one contradicts the idea that only prostitutes did it.
But if the claim is only that it used to be unusual and now it’s common because of the spread of porn, I don’t think that’s true, but that’s not important beyond the general badness of people going around believing things that aren’t so. That’s also a much weaker claim than “fellatio isn’t common, but a lot of women do it because they think it’s common, and false consciousness makes them think they like it,” which is how I read the initial claim.
More proof that some grandmothers enjoyed the blowjobs!
An actual primary source document, courtesy of someone on Reddit:
http://i.imgur.com/ik4KRh.jpg
From here:
http://www.reddit.com/r/WTF/comments/ke73l/found_a_letter_from_my_grandma_to_my_granddad_not/