Tiny Bunny and Small Dog are trying a new look this week, or however long it’s been since the last one of these. It’s a crass attempt to appeal to space aliens.
This time the horrible misogynist quote comes from an anonymous confession on the web site Group Hug , a site devoted to anonymous confessions. In it, a Nice Guy argues that dating is all about “give and take.” Thanks to Denia for posting the link in the comments!
The full quote can be found below the video. (I did some teensy edits to it in the video.)
Mr. Anonymous 174618126 says:
You want a good guy to fall in love with you. Guys want some hot tail. That’s the game. You give and take, we give and take. It’s impossible for two people to even co-exist happily without this give and take process, let alone have a good relationship. So every time you tell me “Uh? I’m more than just a piece of ass, I’m—-” I don’t even hear the rest. I’m well aware you’re not just a piece of ass, you cunt. If I thought that, I wouldn’t talk to you and try to get your consent; I’d just take you. But to give the famous line “I’m more than just a piece of ass” is pretty much the same as saying you’re not interested in even entertaining the idea of us sleeping together. And that means you’re not worth my time or any man’s time.
I’m being fair. Women like you don’t want a man, you want a slave. Someone you can command to bark, sniff, and roll over. Something you can play fetch with. It would be the same thing if I came over to your house, forced you to give me head, and left. I don’t want to be a slave and you don’t want to be my bitch. So why is it so difficult to meet me half way?
I’m so sick of this shit. So very very sick. If you’re not interested in me then don’t fucking talk to me.
Mr. Anonymous 174618126, I feel safe in saying that no one who has read what you just wrote will ever want to talk to you.
He thinks Pecunium, of all people, is ‘flailing around in panic’. Pecunium, whose posts are always calm, factual, and rational (even pedantic). Never ‘flailing’.
He thinks I’m flailing because he called me a coward, or perhaps because his challenge is so much more scary to me, than mine is to him.
After all, Dave might say qwert’s not a misogynist… then what will I do?
Answer… nothing. Because if qwert wants me to stop calling out his misogyny, he’ll have to stop saying other misogynists are justified. If he does that I’m more than willing to stop calling him a misogynist.
He thinks Pecunium, of all people, is ‘flailing around in panic’. Pecunium, whose posts are always calm, factual, and rational (even pedantic). Never ‘flailing’.
QWERT’S GOING HIS OWN WAY
with language games
ANIMAL! ANIMAL!
(Or, whichever of Statler and Waldorf Capt. Bathrobe isn’t)
@ Pecunium
“qwert… go look at the timeline.”
The timeline as I understand it goes something like this: Pecunium makes an accusation. Pecunium is challenged to prove this accusation. Pecunium tries desperately to save face and prove his/her allegation. Pecunium fails to achieve this.
Then we get stuck in the circle of you repeating the same flawed reasoning ad nauseam and me pointing out how you are making a fool of yourself. I don’t believe for one second that you will apologise or admit you were wrong, because I understand that you have not the character to be able to do so.
“I made the accusation. I supported it.”
Pardon my profanity but this is complete horse-shit. Your ‘smoking gun’ evidence is to say that I think misogynists are justified in their thinking, when I have never written such a thing. In fact I have spelled out to everyone here on numerous occasions why I think they are not justified in their thinking. From the last time you tried this little trick:
“If a man is angry at a particular woman for whatever reason, I believe that he has the right to be angry with this particular woman, if of course, he has good reason to be angry with her i.e. she has acted or omitted to act in a way which is a reasonable cause for his anger. He is justified to be angry, at her.
However, if this anger is misplaced and aimed at all women then this is misogyny and is not justifiable. It is, however, understandable that he might feel this way, or to put it another way, I understand how easy it can be to misplace your anger. So I understand why he is being a misogynist but I don’t believe he is justified in being one. “
I know that you are capable of reading Pecunium so maybe you’d like to explain to everyone exactly how I am justifying the behaviour of misogynists here.
Let’s apply my reasoning to a different example. If a black man is harassed, abused or in anyway wronged repeatedly by white men. Then I can understand why this man may end up with a deep distrust of, or even hatred for, all white men. But I don’t think this is justifiable behaviour. He’s being a racist. We both know that you understand this Pecunium and know it to be true, but as your entire case against me in based on this misrepresentation of my words: you can’t admit it without proving your accusation false.
The reason I would like to hear David’s opinion on the matter is because he is the only one here who is writing under his own name. His reputation as a credible writer is tied to what he writes here on this blog. When you Pecunium attempt to bluff your way out of your predicament, you don’t feel any sense of embarrassment or shame in doing so. David, on the other hand, has his reputation to consider and so he will not likely be seen to make unfounded accusations against me here on his blog. He would be exposed as a fool if he did so (David I don’t think you to be a fool BTW). This would lead me to believe that David won’t be calling me a misogynist anytime soon, because as you, I and David himself know (assuming he’s read any of this of course), it can’t be proven to be the case.
I’d like to see you refute this logic, good luck!
Just think Pecunium: if you’d only just apologised at the very beginning we wouldn’t even be having this discussion and you would be spared all this embarrassing business. How very stupid you must feel.
@ Nobinayamu
“Why are you still here?”
Might it be because I’m a “Whiny ass titty-baby”?
Qwert: Do yourself a favor… pay some attention to the little links on the handles. My name is attached. You can follow it and see hundreds of thousands of words I’ve written, on subjects from cookery, to politics, to photography, to travel, to life in the Army, to discussions of torture, and others on self-defense.
You can see me when I’m angry, or when I’m happy. You can find photos of me. I’m not hiding.
So who are you qwert?
I said you are a misogynist. I say it’s because of what you say, and how you defend misogynists.
I’m not bluffing. I didn’t hedge, with statements about “explicit”, and how I would be able to disprove any such evidence provided. I said, in response to your comment asking me if I’d made any accusations stick, that I’d be glad to listen to the jury. No qualifications. I was even willing to put it in your language.
I’ll repeat it, as a poll:
Question: Do you think qwert666 is a misogynist?
1: Yes
2: No
You say… no, I’m not a misogynist, my words don’t mean what you think they mean. I read them, and they still mean what I said they mean. You say MRAs have reasons for their delusions.
Here’s where your analogy fails. It’s one thing to say that you understand why someone ends up with a prejudice, it’s another to say it’s justified.
It’s yet another when the actual effects being decried in the prejudice don’t exist.
Feminists don’t run the country. The laws aren’t stacked against men.
Blacks can’t actually be racist, in a structural sense, because they don’t have the levers of power in their hand. There are no sunset towns where being white will get you put in jail. Being white won’t get you pulled over and harrassed for driving a BMW.
So if a black person says that the cops are biased, and he doesn’t trust them. That’s not in the same category as someone saying, “women will only fuck Alphas until the Alphas won’t have anything to do with them, then they settle for Betas, but they don’t really treat them well; and all of them lie”.
But you want to equate them. You want to analogise them, which means you are granting validity to some aspect of the claim that, “all women are like that”. Which is supporting misogyny
How do I feel? Pretty good. Why? Because I didn’t say anything I didn’t mean. I don’t regret a word of it. I don’t feel stupid because you’ve not done more than repeat the same thing… “I didn’t say, explicitly that I am a misogynist, so I can’t be one.”
David K Meller says he isn’t a racist, and he loves women. Should I believe him?
I see this is getting under your skin. You were upset that I didn’t aplogise to you in moments when you first complained. You bring it up every time you see my handle.
As I said, if you stop supporting misogynists, I’ll stop saying you do.
But I won’t apologise for having said it, because you’ve been doing it.
@ Pecunium
“You can follow it and see hundreds of thousands of words I’ve written, on subjects from cookery, to politics, to photography, to travel, to life in the Army, to discussions of torture, and others on self-defense.”
Thanks, but I’d rather not.
“Here’s where your analogy fails. It’s one thing to say that you understand why someone ends up with a prejudice, it’s another to say it’s justified.”
Finally he understands what I’m saying. You can’t claim that I believe people to be justified when I haven’t. And you can’t claim I believe them to be justified when I have only ever stated that they are not justified.
Do you agree with the above statement?
I can see that we’re going to have to break this down into baby steps in order to get any truth out of you.
I’ll repeat it, as a poll:
You can’t claim that I believe people to be justified when I haven’t. And you can’t claim I believe them justified when I have only ever stated that they are not justified.
Do you agree with the above statement?
1:Yes
2: No
“Blacks can’t actually be racist, in a structural sense, because they don’t have the levers of power in their hand.”
My mind is now blown. Another question for you:
What levers of power are in my hands to “actually” be a misogynist?
“You bring it up every time you see my handle.”
I think you will find that it was you who jumped in here to bring it up again.
“As I said, if you stop supporting misogynists, I’ll stop saying you do.”
Here we go again, around and around with the same bullshit argument. How am I supporting misogynists? Where’s your evidence for this?
All your passive aggressive complaints about how we mock misogyny indicate you feel we shouldn’t mock misogyny, for some reason. You spend apparently no time actually complaining to the misogynists in the first place, who made the hateful language we now mock. I have no reason to believe you’re not just tone trolling to defend misogyny, and if you’re doing that, you’re probably a misogynist.
Here we go again, around and around with the same bullshit argument. How am I supporting misogynists? Where’s your evidence for this?
Passive aggressive whinging about mocking misogyny is a defense, however lazy. How much time do you take out of your day to this passive aggressive BS to misogynists?
Oh, are we playing the game where calling someone a “misogynist” is a really bad hurtful insult, because they aren’t a misogynist, they just hate women?
Just think Pecunium: if you’d only just apologised at the very beginning we wouldn’t even be having this discussion and you would be spared all this embarrassing business. How very stupid you must feel.
i see weve moved on to the portion of the program where you arbitrarily declare yourself the winner
@ Holly Pervocracy & Whomever else would like to respond.
A couple of questions that I’d greatly appreciate answers to.
If you show up on a blog that “mocks racism” and say:
“If a black man is harassed, abused or in anyway wronged repeatedly by white men. Then I can understand why this man may end up with a deep distrust of, or even hatred for, all white men. But I don’t think this is justifiable behaviour. He’s being a racist.”
Does it then follow that you are a racist, or are defending racists? Would It be fair for me to call you a racist and point to the quote above as my sole evidence to support my claim?
Qwert – That’s still kind of buying into the idea that women act as a group, and that holding all women responsible for the actions of a woman they probably don’t even know isn’t completely illogical.
For me, “MGTOW” makes no more sense–and I don’t mean rightness, I mean sense–than attempting to go your own way from redheads, or people with hitchhiker thumbs. I was wronged by a person with back hair! I do not hate the back-hairers, but I am forging my own path now, a path in which no back-hairy person shall tell me what to do!
Smooth-Backs Going Our Own Way!
Qwert: Are you saying that racism disproportionately harms white people? Or that misogyny disproportionately harms men? I’m getting a little confused with your parallels.
@ Holly Pervocracy
Predictably, you have skirted around the questions rather than answer them. Why don’t you try answering my questions?
Again, I’m not justifying behaviour, I’m saying that I understand how someone might come to think a certain way. I’m not saying they are right to think this way, or that they are right to come to their conclusions. I’m saying I can understand how they arrive there. This is all I have ever said on the matter. Can you explain to me what exactly is wrong with my thinking here? How does this make me any more a misogynist than it would make me a racist if I said the following:
“If a black man is harassed, abused or in anyway wronged repeatedly by white men. Then I can understand why this man may end up with a deep distrust of, or even hatred for, all white men. But I don’t think this is justifiable behaviour. He’s being a racist.”
Qwert, you’ve also identified yourself as a MGTOW.
I’m not going to have this discussion in some imaginary world where you didn’t say things that you said.
@ Holly Pervocracy
Then you refuse to answer my questions?
I refuse to answer questions that are based in a hypothetical “what if the only thing you said was these guys were understandable but wrong and not justified” universe to prove points about the actual “you are one of those guys and you’ve said it yourself” universe.
i thought she answered your question just fine. you dont get to ignore her answer because it wasnt the one you wanted.
@ Holly Pervocracy
The reason that you won’t answer my questions is because if you do, you will confirm what I have been saying all along: that Pecunium and others have no justification in calling me a misogynist. I wish I’d taken this approach to the discussion much earlier, it would have saved me a lot of time.
@ Sharculese
“i thought she answered your question just fine.”
Bullshit! She didn’t answer my questions at all. She didn’t even try.
Really? Still no answer to my questions?
I guess I’ll answer them then.
Well, gee, I dunno, Bee. I guess that racism disproportionately harms minorities, and misogyny disproportionately harms women. What a bad analogy! What was I thinking?!
qwert: Thanks, but I’d rather not.
But the world wants to know, are you going to apologise for saying I’m hiding behind a nym?
I’ll also note that I’m not the only person you seem to be confusing with your, “desire to understand the root causes”.
@ Hershele Ostropoler
“qwert, if such attribution of motives isn’t kosher, you’re going to retract your defense of him, right?”
That your mind is blown in the issue of racism (as opposed to prejudice) being a structural issue, i.e. the use of political power to keep another ethnic group in a position inferiority, tells me you’ve not really studied racism much; and implies you’ve not really done much study of sexism/misogyny. This may be why you fail to see what you are doing as justifications for.
You ask how you are able to use the “levers of power” to support misogyny.
Are you male?
That’s one. Because the culture is built to discount the actions, and opinions of women.
Are you saying there is some basis in fact for the views of misogynists?
If you are (and you do) then you are giving credence to them.
It’s not as if most racists are able to actively use the social pressure that institutional racism affords, but they benefit from it’s continuation, even if the support they give it is tepid. I confess, it’s possible to do racist things, and not be a racist. It’s why I have tempered the accusation to support misogynists.
As I said, if you say there is a reason for a black to distrust cops, it’s different from saying there is a reason for men to distrust women.
When you say that someone who is saying such a thing has reasons for it, even if they are twisted, and we need to look at those; to understand him, that’s supporting him.
What if, to turn your analogy, on it’s head, we had someone who said Blacks were capable of being good neighbors, but needed to police the other blacks, so they were all well behaved; then we could make them fully-accepted members of our society.
Would you say that person might have perfectly understandable reasons for his views, and we needed to take that into account when dealing with the issues he raised?
The thing is, the accusations the MRM/MGTOW people level as the reason for their hate… are bullshit. It doesn’t matter that some women “did them wrong”. They have taken an everyday thing (someone hurt someone else) and magnified it to a gross behavior of all women.
How they got there isn’t really relevant. That they are hateful isn’t really relevant. What matters is they are trying to persuade others to believe it too.
And you are saying we need to take their pain into account.
We don’t. Because their pain isn’t the issue. What they are doing is. If there was something which could erase their pain… maybe. But there isn’t. It’s in the past, and they have cradled it to their bosom, so they can cuddle it, and nurture it, and use it as the explanation for why they are miserable; and blame it all on women. That’s the thing to understand.
Not how they came to be unhappy, but what they are doing with that unhappiness. If I were their therapist, then the motives would matter. But I’m not, and they aren’t looking to me/us for comfort. They are looking at us as targets of hatred and scorn. To express sympathy for their root cause, is to give them jusification. They won’t listen past, “yes, she did you wrong.”
Take a look at the people who come here. Meller, and NWO, and Johnny B, and AntZ. Do you see them paying any attention to the facts? No. They just respond with, “women suck, and you know it, and you won’t admit it because you don’t want to face the truth about yourselves.”
And you are giving them cover to do that.
@ Bee
You are literally talking to yourself. And are making little sense whilst doing so. I’m glad that you understand yourself because I’m afraid that I don’t. You appear to be quite mad.
I can play this game: Just think qwert666: if you’d only just admitted you’d made an apologia for misogyny at the very beginning we wouldn’t even be having this discussion and you would be spared all this embarrassing business. How very stupid you must feel.
Mind you it’s not actually an argument…. just an assertion I am wrong, ergo you are still, as I think you put it, engaging in bullshit repetition.
Did you think that perhaps, when so many people are disagreeing with you, perhaps you aren’t being as clear about what you mean as you think.
That’s, of course, if you aren’t just, yanno, wrong.
And, predictably, someone who disagrees with you has either “not answered the question” or failed to understand you. This is the game where you explain how, if we all understood what you are saying, we’d agree with you. Since we don’t agree with you we are either wrong, or lack comprehension.
Which is what started all this. You said things which implied MGTOWs have some reason for what they do. We disagree, and say your attempt to, “understand how they got there,” is counterproductive, because there is no way to get from, “A woman hurt me” to, “All women suck”, which isn’t misogynistic, and so giving them the benefit of the doubt is providing them with justification.
But you are right, if you just say, “I am right, and can’t possibly be wrong, and anyone who think I might be is a malicious liar”, it’s a lot faster.
It’s not true, but it would have saved people who thought you were actually here to have a discussion a lot of trouble.