The contest for the Most Ironic Use of the Term “Nice Guy,” When Applied to Yourself –otherwise known as the MIUTNGWAY Award – is heating up. The previous front runner – the Tumblr guy who compared his inability to get laid to the Holocaust – now faces a serious challenge from a Redditor calling himself DogmaDog.
The other day Mr. Dog wandered into a discussion of the SlutWalks in the Feminisms and offered his two cents: he declared them “stupid,” and suggested that they won’t really help victims.
And then he started in on his own tale of woe.
I know I’m going to be shit on for saying what I’m about to say, but please hear me out.
Not a promising start, Dog.
I’ve never raped a woman, and I’m the ‘nice guy’ who never took advantage of a woman.
Do you want an award for this?
But a girl I was infatuated with in high school blew me off and treated me disrespectfully. She ended up being raped one night, while intoxicated. I do not know how I am supposed to feel about it.
As Don Draper would say, “what?”
How do you think you’re “supposed” to feel? Did you accidentally dislodge the part of your brain responsible for basic human empathy?
Apparently, the answer to that is “yes.”
[H]ow do you suppose I am supposed to feel about this woman I knew who got raped? I mean, I’ve never taken advantage of a woman, but I don’t understand how my ‘friend’, this girl I went to high school with, could go out and party all the time, and in turn treat me, her classmate, as though I were an inferior person for not enjoying the atmosphere of drunkenness at high school parties.
As it turns out, you’re an inferior person for an entirely different reason.
That girl was a mean girl, no? And by being disrespectful toward men, and prejudiced toward men, wasn’t she asking men to behave badly toward her? The only men she gave attention and physical affection to were the ones who hurt her back.
So let me see if I get this: she didn’t go out with you, a “nice guy,” so she was therefore “asking” to be raped?
Naturally, this being the Feminisms subreddit, and not The Spearhead, some of the regular commenters took exception to Mr. Dog’s victim-blaming and his complete lack of empathy for the victim – especially strange, since Dog, who says he is suffering from an (unspecified) mental illness, considers himself “a victim, in my own way,” of prejudice towards those with mental health issues. This experience, alas, has not given him any sympathy towards other vicitms.
Indeed, it seems that DogmaDog didn’t misplace his sense of empathy after all; rather, he threw it out of the house and got a restraining order against it. Responding to someone who suggested he show a little empathy, Dog lashed out:
Your empathy can go suck a dick. Empathy does nothing to help my situation. I suppose that is just the excuse people give themselves so that they can feel like they are actually doing something.
You basically called me an inferior human being because I can’t or won’t empathize for my friend who was raped. Well, ask yourself this, smart-ass, have you ever really wondered what good your empathy does? It does nothing. …
In reality, you are doing nothing but attacking me, and I may or may not have a ‘complex’, even though I don’t know what that is, but I can guarantee you, I HAVE NEVER RAPED ANYONE!!!
The sound you hear is me banging my head, ever so softly, on my desk. Empathy is what connects human beings to one another, what allows them to understand one another on a deep level.
When people are suffering – as you are, Dog, in dealing with your mental illness – a little bit of empathy from someone else can make all the difference in the world.
If you can’t feel even a little bit of sympathy for this woman you were once “infatuated” with, you’re not a nice guy at all; you’re an even bigger asshole than those drunken high school partiers you disdain. You may never have raped anyone — as you’ve repeatedly insisted, as if this should win you a prize – but “in your own way” you’re thinking like an abuser. Your lack of empathy for the victim, your continued bitterness towards her for turning you down, your sense of wounded narcissism; none of this is healthy, for you or for anyone who comes into contact with you.
You need help, dude. Please, please get it.
@Amused:
The thought didn’t even occur to me that could be a legitimate reason for disproportionate victory by mothers, that such a state wouldn’t be indicative of bias against men. Thanks for the perspective.
Hey kirbywarp, after I read through his blog his schtick became much more readily apparent. I was pretty disgusted. I’m sure your memory of him, however, is better and more accurate. Also, I’m guessing the possibilities of rape and murder figure fairly prominently in their apocalyptic wank fantasies.
I don’t know, I’ve just never had so much as the desire to wish bad things on someone for not wanting to date me. It seems like such a backward approach to life. Also, the complete lack of empathy? Fairly appalling.
A piece of anecdata: A friend of mine had an ex. He was deadbeat on support.
She didn’t limit his visitation, even though he was fond of dicking around with it, showing up late, or just blowing it off; running over when he did take the kids.
She met someone else (about two years after the divorce) and he has property in Georgia (he’s a flight attendant, so he was able to be bi-local, but it was a strain). She looked for a job, and moved.
The ex had gone, “off the grid” after the divorce. Sold the company, buried the assets, and was,”broke”. There wasn’t anything to go after. So, after she moves, she gets served with papers. It seems the asshole-ex had “found” $14,000 to put on retainer to an att’y to try and force her to live in Calif. until the younger child was 18.
That ate up a bunch of time, and money (not least because she had to move back to Calif. for eight months while it was being adjudicated).
He lost. But… he managed to jerk her, and the kids around. And… while this was going on, he was still be an inattentive dickhead on the subject of the actual visitation he was entitled to.
My man’s father was happy to pay child support as long as he didn’t have to really spend any time with his kids. We’ve (me an the guy, I mean) had so many discussions about his growing up without him, missing him, the promises his dad would make to come and pick him up on weekends – his disappointment when he didn’t. I didn’t realize until very recently that his father lived less than a mile from where he’d grown up in the city and has lived in the same house since his parents’ divorce. I’d just kind of presumed, with the absenteeism, that his father had lived far away.
It’s not nearly the most tragic example ever, but it’s still really, really sad. Now that he’s a grown man his father is trying to establish an adult relationship with him. I hope it works out for both their sakes.
Nobinayamu, his name is Scarecrow and he still occasionally posts although he was banned for a long time because he was a habitual violator of the rules.
I read one of his rants about the rejection he got from some hot chick at like 11 PM at night when they were in the check out line. Not once did he even consider that she simply might have been tired, having a bad day or have other reasons for being cold and distant. (Including the fact that she constantly gets hit on at 11 PM at night at the grocery store by jackasses who make bad jokes.)
See, it is about him and his needs. Not hers. Never hers. If she is not pleasant to him at the exact moment he wants her to be-well then, she deserves what is coming to her.
No sense of empathy at all, no sense that the other person is a person with their own lives. Just an expectation that “I am nice. Therefore she should want me. And she is a bitch if she does not.”
PosterformerlyknownasElizabeth, it was the lack of empathy that struck me as so extraordinary when I read the blog. Apparently, he was on a store’s video camera talking to a young women earlier in the evening on the night she was later killed. Hence, the brief period where he was a person of interest. Most people are horrified when they find out something like that.
What he was though, was pissed off that he’d been perfectly nice to her in line and she’d been rude to him. She’d snapped at him, or been brusque about not wanting to have a conversation or something of that nature. I think we’re all capable of getting “in our feelings” when we believe that we’ve been treated rudely. But most people can put it into perspective. He tried to start a conversation with her, she wasn’t having it, big friggin’ deal.
But he kept talking about how she was later killed and the cops thought it was by her ex-boyfriend. It never occured to him that if she was in fact killed by someone that she used to date that maybe when she was standing in line at the store she, at the very least, had an awful lot on her mind.
I remember he had one of those faux-inspirational posters; a photograph of a woman’s face in close up with a black eye. The caption? “To bad nice guys don’t do it for you.”
Fucking disgusting.
@Anthony Zarat “someone asked you previously what your solution would be, and you stated that your solution would be for a presumption of shared custody.”
And lots of people have pointed out that in more and more places, that is the presumption. It’s been that way here for 20 years.
Personal anecdata time: I paid child support for 8 years, totalling $48,000, to my son’s father who won custody in court. In that time I didn’t miss a single payment. Now my son lives with me (through mutual agreement). I haven’t received a payment in over a year and am owed over $6000. The father makes as much money as I do but places it in a joint bank account so it can’t be retreived. My only hope of getting money from this man is if he sells his house or dies – then the IRD can go in and get it. He will not go to jail and the debt has to climb considerably more before it’s economical for the IRD to take him to court to order him to pay.
I receive no money from the government and support my kid entirely on my own.
In my country over $6billion is owed in child support by non-custodial parents. For a country with a population of 4 million, that’s a lot of money.
Now, tell me again how you’d fix this situation so that the evil feminists aren’t carrying out hate crimes on the poor men? Or even, you know, how to get recalcitrant non-custodial parents to take responsibility for their kids? No really, you reckon you have all the answers? Start giving some.
Don’t worry, you can count on the Republican fucks to do their utmost to handwave away the Buffett article and maintain the Bush status quo.
This guy is unreal! If you had gone out with me in high school you wouldn’t have been raped??? Are you kidding me??? Thank you for shining the bright light of shame on this MEGA DB. Wow….
Lucky Star
Author, http://www.victimnomore.wordpress.com
…MRAL is a liberal?
Scarecrow was also fond of diarrhea jokes.
“Scarecrow was also fond of diarrhea jokes.”
Really? There’s another interesting tidbit… I guess.
It’s not all that interesting…just true. 🙂
Our buddy AntZ has a penchant for hyperbole, doesn’t he?
Captain, I don’t know how to tell you this but, there’s blood on your hands. It will never wash off.
“Now, tell me again how you’d fix this situation so that the evil feminists aren’t carrying out hate crimes on the poor men? Or even, you know, how to get recalcitrant non-custodial parents to take responsibility for their kids? No really, you reckon you have all the answers? Start giving some.”
Sob sob sob. Sorry, as an MRA I respect you as an equal. I will not protect or infantalize you in any way. Your cry baby tone is pointless because, unlike the White Knights who are about to pounce to your defence, I actually RESPECT YOU AS AN EQUAL.
As to your question “how you’d fix this situation”, you already know that I am speaking about the situation in the United States. Any non-custodial parent who has money and refuses to pay is subject to automatic confiscation of property and income.
Here is how you solve the problem:
TREAT UNPAID CHILD SUPPORT LIKE ANY OTHER DEBIT.
The creditor has the right to confiscate all of the debtors property, unless the debtor pays. If the debtor really cannot pay, he/she will have no property to confiscate.
Easy. But you already knew that. You are as intelligent as I am. You thought, however, that you could use “female privilege” to pretend to be wounded, vulnerable, and/or stupid. That is not going to work with me. If you want to disrespect yourself and flap around the ground like a wounded bird, go ahead. You look ridiculous.
If your nation does not have debit collection mechanisms, that is what you fix. Putting men in prison does nothing for anyone. And you know that.
Three … two …. one …
Here it comes … White Knights to the rescue!
I am going to enjoy this 🙂
So if a man actively refuses to pay child support it’s exactly the same -and should be treated exactly the same- as if he’s not paying his car note. Interesting take on parenting, especially coming from someone who seems to believe that all fathers want to be active, involved parents.
So, in the case of nonpayment of child support who, precisely is the creditor?
“So, in the case of nonpayment of child support who, precisely is the creditor?”
The child. The state collects the debit on his/her behalf, and hands it to the custodial parent. This is how it is, has been, and always will be. The custodial parent does not have to sue, go to court, or hire a lawyer. The court does it all for you.
Next.
Anthony Zarat | August 16, 2011 at 3:29 pm
Three … two …. one …
Here it comes … White Knights to the rescue!
o_O
Here come the 2/2 First Strike pro-black creatures? o_O
This process is, according to you, incredibly simple and works or will work in every case. But filling out forms to modify child support payments in the event of an involuntary loss of income is like Nazi Germany?
If the mother is receiving state assistance to supplement the costs of raising the child would any funds garnered be split by her and the State. And what would be the appropriate percentage of the split?
@Nobinayamu I know this scarecrow guy you’ve talked about! I can’t remember his name but I think I saw him on Zeta Male’s blog xD
Wow, srsly, like his reaction to a girl in line not being nice to him and was then killed by her ex b/f was that she didn’t date him so she deserved it or something? o_O As you said, shouldn’t he realize like maybe she was rude b/c she was worried about being stalked by an ex-b/f!? >:O
I’m also sick of the “nice guy”/”bad boy” dichotomy, as if life was like a fantasy story and there are only good ppl and bad ppl, and the bad ppl wear black capes and stuff >_> It’s so post-facto too… like if a woman is abused or raped or beaten up or killed by an ex or partner, therefore he was a bad boy, so therefore she should have known better, therefore she should have dated a nice guy… even tho maybe she did think she was dating a nice guy >_> (like my mom) it’s a thing that justifies itself after the fact -_-
Why do ppl compare everything to Nazi Germany? -_o
The creditor has the right to confiscate all of the debtors property, unless the debtor pays. If the debtor really cannot pay, he/she will have no property to confiscate.
you have yet to demonstrate that that is not in fact how things currently work.
Nice try dude. I do not need rescuing nor defending – as you might have noticed had you actually read my post, you’d see that ‘raising a kid with no help’ is the default for me and I’m doing just fine at it. I am not wounded, vulnerable, or stupid. What I am is pissed off that you are assuming that seeking child support from a non-paying parent is some kind of feminist plot to hurt men.
However, my post does serve to illustrate that this business where you think people who don’t pay get automatically thrown in jail is a load of bollocks (as we’ve all been telling you) and that not all custody situations are as simple as you make out. Not all non-custodial parents who don’t pay are poor, and not all custodial parents are trying to milk the other parent for all they’re worth. Not all custodial parents are women, and not all custody situations involve two parents who are both willing to take responsibility.
My own situation is not solely responsible for the $6billion owed by non-paying parents. And by making out that my story is some kind of expression of female privilege you are neither respecting my intelligence nor treating me as an equal. Now might also be a good time to point out that centring the United States as the default is annoying to those of us who don’t live there – which is most of the population of the world.
So, in order to treat unpaid child support like any other debt, I should waltz up to his home and take $6000 worth of stuff? You understand what ‘joint ownership’ means, right? It means that if I did that, I’d be a criminal, guilty of stealing the property of someone who has nothing to do with this, who is a half owner in whatever I took. Debt collection mechanisms here require the property confiscated to belong only to the person it’s being confiscated from. So, not so easy.
Try again. And don’t give me that ‘change the law’ answer you’ve been tossing off so glibly all through this thread – it’s a copout.