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A man and an old lady get in an elevator

Those "sweet" old ladies are anything but.

Another elevator joke for you all:

So Pierce Harlan of the False Rape Society blog gets into an elevator ….

Well, OK, not a joke. In his latest post, Harlan offers a reaction, of sorts, to the whole atheist elevator incident –- by relating an anecdote of a recent elevator experience of his own.

EDITED TO ADD: Harlan has now deleted the post in question. It can still be seen, at least for now, in Google’s cache of the original page, which you can find here. Grab screenshots! Back to the story:

Seems he was riding a hotel elevator with a sweet old lady. Neither one said anything to the other (Harlan apparently hates talking to sweet old ladies) but when he got off the elevator – well, let’s let him explain:

I glanced back at her and saw that … she was immobilized with fear. In fact, she was practically cowering in the corner. Her eyes couldn’t have been wider if I had whipped out my dick and lathered it up with Grey Poupon.  Hers was the face of utter, unbridled fear, and she was watching me like the scardest of scared deer. She said not a word but her demeanor practically pleaded, “Please don’t rape me, sir!”

Now, Harlan seems to have what you might call a taste for overstatement. He describes feminists as “screeching banshees” and “extremist loons allied with the sexual grievance industry.” I doubt he could describe a chicken-salad sandwich without resorting to angry hyperbole. (That was a little bit of overstatement on my part.) But let’s just assume that there is at least a kernel of truth here: this woman was creeped out by Harlan.

So what was Harlan’s response to this woman’s obvious discomfort?

 [N]o one has more empathy for his fellow human beings than I do. The first thought that came to my mind in response to the obvious fear on the face of this pathetic, sweet looking, older woman — who probably never hurt anyone in her entire life — was fuck you!

Obviously we are supposed to ask just what it was that drove Harlan – the self-described world’s most empathetic man – to say something so seemingly callous? Well, as is usually the case with those we write about here, it all comes back to man-hating ladies and their male allies, with their evil insistence on sexual assault education (sorry, “indoctrination”) and their callous demands to “’take back the night,’ although the night has always been theirs.”(I don’t quite know what that means, but it sure sounds selfish of these women to want a whole extra night just for themselves.)

Ours is, Harlan says, “a culture marked by crass, hysterical fear-mongering about male sexual predation and violence.” (Evidently some guys haven’t gotten the memo on this.)

But all this evil misandry seems to have left poor Mr. Harlan in an uncharitable mood towards, well, almost everyone — though he directs his worst opprobrium at sweet old ladies.

Fuck them all. The paranoia of the woman in the elevator is her problem, not mine. Ironically, the elevator, the hotel itself, the car she rode in and the roads she rode on to get to the hotel were all undoubtedly conceived, designed, and built by men — men she’d fear just as much as me if they were standing in that elevator with her. I felt no guilt or shame or bewilderment over the fact that she fears me because of my birth class. Let her fear me. I can’t change it, and I have too much to do to worry about it.

And maybe, just maybe, it’s good that some people fear us. Maybe we should exult in the power we wield by reason of their paranoia. One thing I know: I will never do anything to alleviate their paranoia. In fact, I’m just fine with it, thank you very much. If someday, my riding the elevator causes some old woman to have a heart attack, that, too, is not my problem.  Blame it on a culture that I don’t approve of. Blame on sweet looking, older women who give in to the paranoia.

Truly the world’s most empathetic man.

Harlan goes on to talk briefly about the Rebecca Watson elevator incident. Needless to say, he adds nothing interesting to the discussion.

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NWOslave
NWOslave
13 years ago

@mediumdave

Please don’t bother with any explanations, I was born guilty. It’s a trap I can never escape.

Raoul
13 years ago

@NWOs “@Shora, Kafka-trapping is the ideology of feminism. I was born a straight, white man. I was born guilty of privilege.”

What is really amusing is that you never make clear what Kafka-trapping has to do with the writing or ideas of Kafka.

Makes you come off as either a pretentious snot or as someone who’s never read Kafka. Maybe both.

Shora
13 years ago

I’m particularly miffed because I ANSWERED his “gotcha!” question with a blog post of mine I had written on that subject weeks ago! But I insulted him, so too bad! No debate! I’m going to go ahead and agree with Dave on the lazy, cowardly fool assessment.

NWO, having seen your comments here and on NSWATM, and reading your comment above, I can only conclude that you are willfully misunderstanding the stances of a wide variety of feminists in order to feed your already bloated martyr complex.

Fatman
Fatman
13 years ago

“Maybe we should exult in the power we wield by reason of their paranoia. One thing I know: I will never do anything to alleviate their paranoia. In fact, I’m just fine with it, thank you very much. If someday, my riding the elevator causes some old woman to have a heart attack, that, too, is not my problem.”

This is the part I found hardest to understand. If you can, with a few gestures alleviate the fears of another human being and allow that person to relax, and at the same time spare yourself the sort of anger expressed Pierce Harlan, why would you not? It seems like a win win situation.

It is not particularly difficult to diffuse tense situations like that. Why would one want to increase the tension?

NWOslave
NWOslave
13 years ago

@mediumdave

I can’t win in the Kafka-trap.

By giving one group victim status and another group privilege status, we already have a victim and an oppressor. That can never change. It’s a trap from which there is no escape. Unless the starting point is neutrality there is no way to win.

I’ve already conceded. I was born guilty of being an oppressor.

mediumdave
mediumdave
13 years ago

Why would one want to increase the tension?

That you are asking this question indicates that you’re a reasonable person, capable of empathy. If you were an arrogant bully (I’m just sayin’) who enjoys provoking fear in persons more vulnerable than yourself, you’d understand already.

OK, Slavey, I’ll make it even simpler: The Kafka bit is a red herring. There were no accusations against Mr. Harlan (or any group he belongs to) in my comment at FRS… he made a statement that I disagreed with, and I explained why I disagreed. In response, he freaked out. That is all that happened.

Holly Pervocracy
13 years ago

I’ve already conceded. I was born guilty of being an oppressor.

Don’t sell yourself short, NWO. You’ve worked damn hard at it.

(And other men haven’t. See how we don’t call them oppressors on this blog? Ain’t no one giving David, or Dave, or Kirby, or Johnny, or Pecunium… et al shit for being male.)

Pierce Harlan
13 years ago

Yes, Medium Dave, I’m a lazy, cowardly fool. And Poster I’m a great big pansy. And Shora, you’re right, I’m a screaming, flailing manchild.

Wow.

Ya know, I admitted that I might have overreacted about the woman on the elevator. I actually agreed with screeching banshee Shora. The rest of the points I couldn’t possibly debate because they made no sense. But see, I am wrong from time to time. I am removing the post because it’s a distraction to our our mission.

Next time, Mr. Futrelle, why don’t you make fun of us for our advocacy in attacking Fed.R.Evid. 413, which even Joe Biden found repugnant. Or for taking issue with the Dept. of Education’s April 4 directive. Or for posting stories that prompt men and boys to write to us telling us they didn’t commit suicide because of our site.

P.S. And you really don’t understand what “thus endeth the debate” means, Mr. Futrelle? Weren’t you a financial writer for a big magazine at one time? How the hell did you get so loony?

NWOslave
NWOslave
13 years ago

@Shora
“NWO, having seen your comments here and on NSWATM, and reading your comment above, I can only conclude that you are willfully misunderstanding the stances of a wide variety of feminists in order to feed your already bloated martyr complex.”

The ideology of feminism is blameless and correct due to my misunderstanding of the wide variety of feminists. Woot. I’m guilty. Plus i have a martyr complex, further trapping me. And round and round the circular logic goes. YAHTZEE!

speedlines
speedlines
13 years ago

Oh, Subbie, there’s a brand new thread about underage girls just waiting for your comments now. Fetch, boy!

Molly Ren
13 years ago

I think the problem NWOslave is having is what was mentioned on What About Teh Menz a few weeks back, about how a lot of people use the word “privilege” as if it meant “asshole”. I’ve also seen articles with different takes on the amount of personal responsibility involved, from about how “everyone’s a little bit racist” and others talking about how privilege/oppression should be viewed as something bigger than something an individual has, so as to avoid turning individual people into villains.

mediumdave
mediumdave
13 years ago

Yes, Medium Dave, I’m a lazy, cowardly fool. And Poster I’m a great big pansy. And Shora, you’re right, I’m a screaming, flailing manchild.

And you couldn’t stick the flounce!

Well, Mr. Harlan, if you want to change my judgement of you, then unban me and let me comment on FRS. I’m saying what I have to say here because you left me no choice.

NWOslave
NWOslave
13 years ago

@Holly Pervocracy

So the few men who agree 100% with you are good, but the legions of men who don’t are bad oppressors. Seems like you have victim status and those who disagree have oppressor status. YAHTZEE!

Dontcha just hate discordance in the echo chamber?

NWOslave
NWOslave
13 years ago

@mediumdave

Leaving without total agreement = flounce.

Guilty as charged!

Holly Pervocracy
13 years ago

So the few men who agree 100% with you are good, but the legions of men who don’t are bad oppressors. Seems like you have victim status and those who disagree have oppressor status. YAHTZEE!

It’s sad but true; I like men that are nice to me, and dislike men that are mean to me.

I’m super unfair.

Molly Ren
13 years ago

“legions of men”

I wouldn’t necessarily say men who *weren’t* feminists were the majority of men. There seems to be an awful lot of *both* feminists and non-feminists about in the world…

RobbiRobbi
RobbiRobbi
13 years ago

NWO,

For many feminists, the starting point is neutrality, most of us believe men and women really aren’t that different. Then we look at the world around us and see that all people are not treated equally, and that huge assumptions based on gender are commonplace, which is unfair. By calling out “privilege”, feminists are attempting to describe reality, the very real situations in which double standards give women the short end of the stick. We’re not saying all women are victims and all men are oppressors for ever ever ever, we’re only saying that right now, this is what’s happening and here’s what needs to change.

Which is why most feminists have some male friends or boyfriends that they care about, not because they constants apologize for being male, but just because they make some effort to be decent human beings.

I can think of a few feminists that I dislike because they the tend to take an “all women, all men, ever ever ever” approach to feminism, which is simplistic and wrong, and denies the possibility of change. So I avoid them, which is easy, because they’re pretty rare.

mediumdave
mediumdave
13 years ago

*sigh* NWOslave, It was Mr. Harlan who was flouncing, not you. Are you actually reading what I write? Slow down, dude. It isn’t all about you.

Shora
13 years ago

Pierce: You seriously invited people from a dissenting blog onto your blog for a debate, engaged in conduct unbecoming of actual, intelligent, rigorous, good-faith debate, complained when the people you insulted responded in turn, and then deleted the whole thing in a fit of pique. And then came BACK to the blog where you issued the challenge you were unable to follow through with, and insulted the commenters some more. No, that’s not childish at ALL, is it?

NWOSlave. Dude. Your name is NWOSLAVE How much more proof of your martyr complex do we really need? Also I didn’t say feminist ideology, insofar as it is a monolith (which, as many people have said many times, it is not) is blameless and correct. I only said that you misrepresented in it so flagrantly it must be willful misunderstanding on your part. Maybe I’m giving you too much credit. Maybe it’s just straight up misunderstanding.

Holly Pervocracy
13 years ago

Really, the more I think about it, the less NWO’s comment makes sense.

I can understand wanting me to change my mind (about… christ, I don’t even know. about feminism in general, anyway).

But the argument “it’s horrible that you don’t agree with guys who disagree with you” is… it’s not even bullying. It’s just a tautology.

NWOslave
NWOslave
13 years ago

@Holly Pervocracy

Disagree = mean to you.
Nice = total subservience to whatever you say.

I really must flounce now. which means I disagree. Which of course makes me mean. Being mean makes me an oppressor. Being oppressed makes you a victim. Feminist logic 101.

oldfeminist
13 years ago

“I am removing the post because it’s a distraction to our our mission.”

How can it distract from the mission if it’s such a great example of people you disagree with being wrong and incomprehensible? Wouldn’t it be a perfect display?

I suspect it’s more like the distraction Toto provided in the hall of the Wizard of Oz. “Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.”

mediumdave
mediumdave
13 years ago

So NWOslave is leaving the thread, but has left behind some big, scary-lookin’, moth-eaten scarecrows. Which are no use to us, as I haven’t seen any crows lately in these parts. (BTW, it’s not a flounce if you actually leave. FYI.)

Molly Ren
13 years ago

“Disagree = mean to you.
Nice = total subservience to whatever you say.”

I’m starting to feel like I need a NWO translator. Something like Babelfish, where “woman” is replaced with “evil” and “man” is replaced with “mule of the world”.

oldfeminist
13 years ago

NWOSlave, why do you constantly equate “I did something wrong” with “I am bad and evil”?

Most of us grow out of this when we realize that Mom and Dad aren’t actual gods and can’t condemn us to eternal damnation because we pooped in our pants that one time at school.

If you want to understand feminism, you have to understand that people are born in unequal circumstances. Along with rich or poor, healthy or sick, there’s also male and female (and others) which guide how we are treated our whole lives no matter what we are like inside.

You seem to refuse the idea that you’re treated differently and better because you were born male. You turn the advantages you have into disadvantages by pretending that anything you see or hear about or read about anywhere that you think treats women better is both universally observed and never counterbalanced or overbalanced by something that treats women worse.

In logic it’s called special pleading, where you only accept evidence in your favor and discount out of hand anything that would militate against your chosen conclusion.

Moreover, your arguments sound an awful like the “White man’s burden” arguments of racists.

Women are treated a certain way, they react, then you blame them for it rather than the society that’s treating them that way.

You can only legitimately blame women for acting as society pressures them if you stop blaming society for putting pressure on you to behave certain ways.

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